Anddenex

This is one of the most interesting aspects (at least to me) regarding the creation of Adam and Eve before they partook of the fruit. They could not have had children, at least according to the Book of Mormon, until they partook of the fruit even though they were commanded to multiply and replenish the earth. Without this commandment though, Adam may have never partaken of the fruit, leaving him a lone man in the garden.
True, the story we have now of Adam and Eve is vague. I wonder how the posterity of Adam and Eve were told about Adam and Eve's creation and experience in the garden. I wonder how different our story is to the story they received. Anything outside of scripture requires "speculation" or "theory" in order to learn more. I think the important part is that we are, ourselves, will to admit our own speculation. This is why I really like these scriptures:
We are to be instructed more perfectly "in theory" as well as principle, doctrine, and law; however, I truly wish God would provide a more accurate explanation via our prophets regarding the Fall. BUT, as he (God) is more wise than myself he obviously has his purpose (which I know not). Imagine if our gospel doctrine classes also allowed more perfect instruction in theory (possibilities that are not as yet confirmed by the Spirit of Truth), and that we as members could enjoy these without taking it too far.
I was once told that Joseph Smith could have provided a full Doctrine and Covenants size book on Doctrine and Covenants section 76 (I would like to read this quote myself but have never found it), and if so, why was it not revealed? I wonder if it has to do with the current faith of God's children, and it is better that certain things are not revealed so that people do not turn away from the gospel because they can't handle meat.
EDIT: Quote was given in a different topic, "Both Joseph and Sidney gazed into heaven for “about an hour.” Furthermore, it is apparent that Joseph did not impart all that he saw in vision, for he later said, "I could explain a hundred fold more than I ever have of the glories of the kingdoms manifested to me in the vision, were I permitted, and were the people prepared to receive them." (Source: TPJS, p. 305)."

I read and interpret this verse the same way you do. My mind believes these verses correlate with this verse, 2 Peter 1: 3-8 and Moses 6:60. If an individual is purifying themselves, this means they are exercising their faith unto repentance. This means they are continually reconciling themselves unto God.
This also reminds me of these two verses in Mormon chapter 9:
Well, I will raise my hand if the question was, "If you haven't experienced this yet"? This vision was my hope since I returned from my mission and when I first understood the principle of our calling and election made sure. I have sought it; however, sadly, I think my heart currently falls within "consuming it on my own lusts" rather than with a firmness unshaken. I wanted to tell all those damn dang anti-Mormons, "Screw you I know and you're wrong"! Fortunately, I have grown away from that mentality. I would still love this, but I am not sure I have yet accomplished what Omni said here, "offer your whole souls as an offering unto him." I think the world offers some luring things that I still love (i.e. a good worldly movie (Caveat: Marvel, DC, Lord of Rings, Van Damme pre-mission, and many more)).
I believe as with all of God's other promises that if we have the faith, the consistent actions to prove it, that God is bound to open the way. I struggle in the consistent actions to prove it though.

Since I have been investigating the LDS church, members (and you lot!) keep telling me that something will happen and I will feel the spirit and things will change.
As most of you know I like things to make sense, I like to study things and gain knowledge and understanding of truth that way.  I know that is not how most LDS members come to find the truth of the Book of Mormon.
Anyway, for all of you who know someone like me, PLEASE get them to read this very simple article currently featured on this website.
https://mormonhub.com/blog/faith/defending-the-faith/book-of-mormon-hoax/ 
I actually cried while reading it.  I don't know if I have a complete testimony for the church or all its teachings, but I know one thing.
Joseph Smith was a prophet of God and the Book of Mormon is true.
Thank you all so much for helping (and putting up with) me.  I feel very happy and full of hope.
Now I just have to save my husband!

Lesson two down!  Loving all I am learning  

Thank you all so much, I feel much better about it now, I was worried about being excluded from the temple

As @zil stated it should not be a problem.  Your situation is not unheard of so should not be a problem.
For the temple you should be able to go do baptisms right away.   The rest of the temple ordinances are available a year after baptism.  I say this because I do not know if you have been told this or not and I don't want you to have any unpleasant surprises as things draw closer
 

If your increase is $0, the tithing on that is determined by multiplying 0 by .1.  0 * .1 = 0.  Therefore, you are a full tithe payer by paying $0.  I'm confident your bishop will understand.  You won't be the first person in this scenario - should it happen.

Hi guys, I'm strongly of the belief that I will be joining this church (I have to give my husband the 18 months study I promised him so he will support my conversion and baptism)
Of course I am hoping my husband joins with me, but in the case that he doesn't choose this faith I have a worry about my obtaining a recommend to go to the temple.
I don't work, I am a stay at home wife and mother.  I make no income whatsoever.  I'm worried this will stop me getting a temple recommend, I know one of the requirements of the church is tithing.  I can't tithe what I don't have, and I can't expect my husband to give 10% of his income to a church he is not a member of.
Has this every happened to anyone you know?
Any support is appreciated.

Acute, feminine angles are far cuter that male. An obtuse angle is not acute angle 

Obtuse or acute?

Okay, but does it glow when Orc are near?
"One sword to rule them all, one sword to bind them..."
Sorry, just having some fun. Feel free to ignore.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-
 
 

At this moment, according to what I have read and studied, I believe our relationship with God is exactly as scriptures testify -- Father and son. We are informed in scripture that all things were spiritual before they were physical, and that the physical is patterned after that which is spiritual. My spirit takes this literally.
As pertaining to this concept, "plucked us out from somewhere...," really doesn't seem to jive with scripture nor prophetic teachings, which may be the reason you are having trouble with this notion of relationship. As all things are in the likeness of that which is spiritual, I keep things rather simple. God is the Father of our spirits (our spirit bodies) in the same way I am the father of my children and their physical bodies, which are in my likeness, and I am in the likeness/image of God the Father.
We have the following from scripture and modern prophets:
The statement regarding God's "praiseworthy" actions causes me to ponder whether or not your heart has received witness from the Spirit that you are a "child of God." This testimony alone will give added confidence in who God is, and what God has done, and that his actions are something to praise and rejoice over. As seen in modern visions and as in scripture provided, "the saints rejoiced in their redemption, and bowed the knee and acknowledged the Son of God." I have every reason, upon the witness I received long ago that I was a child of God, to know his actions were praiseworthy.
That last paragraph conflates two ideas that do not depend on each other and will only deepen confusion rather than enlightenment. The atonement isn't a "cosmic law." The atonement is a spiritual -- Celestial -- law that allows God's heir's to become as he is, and to receive all that he has. What we need is to understand the core of these doctrines, and then allow God to reveal more when we can accept what already has been revealed. The Book of Mormon is very clear on why an atonement was needed, which provide the basics. If you understand these -- the religious explanation -- then the question regarding "cosmic law" wouldn't exist.
The atonement actually becomes more clear when you seek to understand the basic principles taught in scripture. What I see is that you don't understand yet the "religious" answer, and are now trying to conflate a scientific answer "cosmic" with that which is spiritual. Isn't going to happen.
As @zil, already pointed out, I recommend these words from President Hinckley, "If there is any one thing that you and I need, to help us find success and fulfillment in this world, it is faith—that dynamic, powerful, marvelous element by which, as Paul declared, the very worlds were framed (see Hebrews 11:3). I refer not to some ethereal concept but to a practical, pragmatic, working faith—the kind of faith that moves us to get on our knees and plead with the Lord for guidance, and then, having a measure of divine confidence, get on our feet and go to work to help bring the desired results to pass. Such faith is an asset beyond compare. Such faith is, when all is said and done, our only genuine and lasting hope."
Sin is the driving factor that causes requires us to have a Savior. Remember, Christ did not need a Savior, so a Savior isn't required for them which are perfect -- without spot. A Savior is required for us who have chose to sin, to remove ourselves from the presence of the Father, by which we can not ourselves make corruption into perfection. How do you make yourself whole? We can't. Thus a Savior was provided, merging the distance, filling the gap, allowing us the opportunity to be perfected through him.
EDIT - And is why these are some of my favorite scriptures regarding Christ, his relationship to the Father, and our redemption:
 

I have recently ran across two separate articles concerning ancient mettle artifacts – in particular weapons of war that may have implications concerning the Sword of Laban.  One article was about a sword and the other about a dagger found buried with its owner.  The problem is that the grade of iron was far beyond the metallurgy of the time and even with modern capabilities impossible to duplicate.
Electronic scans at the molecular level reveals that the mettle was likely not smelted on earth but created in an environment very alien to earth then brought to earth via a meteor.  Then forged by the ancients.  The hardness of the mettle is far superior to any found-on earth and when shaped the sword from such mettle will not tarnish, rust or break in battle.  Anciently there are legends of “divine” swords from heaven with “powers”.  Excalibur is one such sword.
It is possible that Laban possessed such a sword and that there is an explanation of why this particular sword was so special and likely intact and without rust.  Not just symbolically but actual alien to earth sent from the heavens.
 
The Traveler

I read and interpret this verse the same way you do. My mind believes these verses correlate with this verse, 2 Peter 1: 3-8 and Moses 6:60. If an individual is purifying themselves, this means they are exercising their faith unto repentance. This means they are continually reconciling themselves unto God.
This also reminds me of these two verses in Mormon chapter 9:
Well, I will raise my hand if the question was, "If you haven't experienced this yet"? This vision was my hope since I returned from my mission and when I first understood the principle of our calling and election made sure. I have sought it; however, sadly, I think my heart currently falls within "consuming it on my own lusts" rather than with a firmness unshaken. I wanted to tell all those damn dang anti-Mormons, "Screw you I know and you're wrong"! Fortunately, I have grown away from that mentality. I would still love this, but I am not sure I have yet accomplished what Omni said here, "offer your whole souls as an offering unto him." I think the world offers some luring things that I still love (i.e. a good worldly movie (Caveat: Marvel, DC, Lord of Rings, Van Damme pre-mission, and many more)).
I believe as with all of God's other promises that if we have the faith, the consistent actions to prove it, that God is bound to open the way. I struggle in the consistent actions to prove it though.

Well, Im not sure about this particular vision but around the time of my sons birth 22 years ago I had several heavenly dreams and what could be described as visions of heaven. My vision was more along the lines of the traditional "heaven" and "hell" as taught by Christ. I do recall that time when my heart went through a mighty change. I also felt it had something to do with my son coming into tge world.
Im not sure if everyone saw a vision of heaven if they would all describe it the same. . 

This vision of glories happened after Joseph and Sidney moved to the John Johnson home in Hiram, Ohio, on September 12, 1831 to prepare texts of Joseph's translation of the Bible and had begun laboring with the Gospel of John. Upon examining John 5:29, they were shown a multifaceted vision beginning with a vision of the Father and the Son in the highest glory. One witness, Philo Dibble, present in the room recalled that the two men sat motionless for about an hour. One would say, "What do I see," and describe it, and the other would say, "I see the same" (Source: Juvenile Instructor 27 [May 15, 1892]:303-304).
Both Joseph and Sidney gazed into heaven for “about an hour.” Furthermore, it is apparent that Joseph did not impart all that he saw in vision, for he later said, "I could explain a hundred fold more than I ever have of the glories of the kingdoms manifested to me in the vision, were I permitted, and were the people prepared to receive them." (Source: TPJS, p. 305). He also said, “Could you gaze into heaven five minutes, you would know more than you would by reading all that ever was written on the subject.” (Source: TPJS, p. 324)  If one could know more than all that was ever written on the subject by just gazing into heaven five minutes, what kind of knowledge, then, did Joseph and Sidney possess after gazing into heaven “for about an hour?” Certainly more than has ever been written on the subject by students and scholars.

The mysteries that God showed Joseph were only to be recorded afterwards while they were not in the Spirit, seemingly to ensure proper boundaries and that we get the portion of the mysteries we are ready for.

The beginning of the vision says basically the same thing as the last verse: “For thus saith the Lord—I, the Lord, am merciful and gracious unto those who fear me, and delight to honor those who serve me in righteousness and in truth unto the end. Great shall be their reward and eternal shall be their glory. And to them will I reveal all mysteries, yea, all the hidden mysteries of my kingdom from days of old, and for ages to come, will I make known unto them the good pleasure of my will concerning all things pertaining to my kingdom.Yea, even the wonders of eternity shall they know, and things to come will I show them, even the things of many generations. And their wisdom shall be great, and their understanding reach to heaven; and before them the wisdom of the wise shall perish, and the understanding of the prudent shall come to naught. For by my Spirit will I enlighten them, and by my power will I make known unto them the secrets of my will—yea, even those things which eye has not seen, nor ear heard, nor yet entered into the heart of man.” (verses 5-10)

So I think it is a matter of "all in good time." I think that we can still, to an extent, see and understand these mysteries by the power of the Holy Spirit, and we can still love God, and purify ourselves before Him, and have granted this privilege of seeing and knowing these same things for ourselves, if only to an extent. So, I think the promise can be fulfilled by degrees. I think a lot is determined by what the Lords sees fit that we need, which is enough to keep going and magnify our stewardships as Joseph was given.

The end of Section 76 reads:
I interpret the above, specifically the part in bolded italic, as meaning that all those who love God and purify themselves through the power of the Holy Ghost (which presupposes baptism) are granted this same vision that Joseph Smith experienced in Section 76. Am I wrong?
If you think I am wrong, what exactly (or even approximately) do you think the promise means instead?
If you think I am not wrong...well, at the risk of shaming myself, to this point in my life I have not been granted this vision. Now I haven't specifically sought for it, which might be part of the problem; but I rather suppose that I'm simply not spiritually mature enough yet. I also suspect that those who have seen this vision probably don't talk openly about it, so I'm not expecting anyone to raise his/her hand. But does anyone have thoughts as to how this promise is fulfilled among men and women today?

At this moment, according to what I have read and studied, I believe our relationship with God is exactly as scriptures testify -- Father and son. We are informed in scripture that all things were spiritual before they were physical, and that the physical is patterned after that which is spiritual. My spirit takes this literally.
As pertaining to this concept, "plucked us out from somewhere...," really doesn't seem to jive with scripture nor prophetic teachings, which may be the reason you are having trouble with this notion of relationship. As all things are in the likeness of that which is spiritual, I keep things rather simple. God is the Father of our spirits (our spirit bodies) in the same way I am the father of my children and their physical bodies, which are in my likeness, and I am in the likeness/image of God the Father.
We have the following from scripture and modern prophets:
The statement regarding God's "praiseworthy" actions causes me to ponder whether or not your heart has received witness from the Spirit that you are a "child of God." This testimony alone will give added confidence in who God is, and what God has done, and that his actions are something to praise and rejoice over. As seen in modern visions and as in scripture provided, "the saints rejoiced in their redemption, and bowed the knee and acknowledged the Son of God." I have every reason, upon the witness I received long ago that I was a child of God, to know his actions were praiseworthy.
That last paragraph conflates two ideas that do not depend on each other and will only deepen confusion rather than enlightenment. The atonement isn't a "cosmic law." The atonement is a spiritual -- Celestial -- law that allows God's heir's to become as he is, and to receive all that he has. What we need is to understand the core of these doctrines, and then allow God to reveal more when we can accept what already has been revealed. The Book of Mormon is very clear on why an atonement was needed, which provide the basics. If you understand these -- the religious explanation -- then the question regarding "cosmic law" wouldn't exist.
The atonement actually becomes more clear when you seek to understand the basic principles taught in scripture. What I see is that you don't understand yet the "religious" answer, and are now trying to conflate a scientific answer "cosmic" with that which is spiritual. Isn't going to happen.
As @zil, already pointed out, I recommend these words from President Hinckley, "If there is any one thing that you and I need, to help us find success and fulfillment in this world, it is faith—that dynamic, powerful, marvelous element by which, as Paul declared, the very worlds were framed (see Hebrews 11:3). I refer not to some ethereal concept but to a practical, pragmatic, working faith—the kind of faith that moves us to get on our knees and plead with the Lord for guidance, and then, having a measure of divine confidence, get on our feet and go to work to help bring the desired results to pass. Such faith is an asset beyond compare. Such faith is, when all is said and done, our only genuine and lasting hope."
Sin is the driving factor that causes requires us to have a Savior. Remember, Christ did not need a Savior, so a Savior isn't required for them which are perfect -- without spot. A Savior is required for us who have chose to sin, to remove ourselves from the presence of the Father, by which we can not ourselves make corruption into perfection. How do you make yourself whole? We can't. Thus a Savior was provided, merging the distance, filling the gap, allowing us the opportunity to be perfected through him.
EDIT - And is why these are some of my favorite scriptures regarding Christ, his relationship to the Father, and our redemption:
 

You appear to assume we had no choice in the matter.  I assume we were willing, perhaps anxious participants.
Perhaps it would be useful to explore what "worship" and "praise" mean to you, exactly.  Perhaps drop the movie-version of prostration and flowery speech.  Even things described in vision may be more symbolic than literal.  Perhaps consider what we are asked to do with our mortality.  Are those worth doing?  Might doing them be a form of worship and praise?
Perhaps it's wise to withhold criticism until such time as you have acquired more knowledge.
The only answers we have to these questions are the revealed word of God.  Reject or mistrust said word, and you have even less - exactly nothing, to be exact.  Mankind is clueless as to our prior existence without what God has told us.  So, you can either trust God, or side with complete and total ignorance on the topic.
I see this similar to your question about the title of the Book of Mormon.  You can worry about something you are powerless to alter - as in: it's too late now, dude - you've got a body, your intelligence is eternally merged with a spirit, and you're resurrection-bound.  Or you can make the most of what you've got.  You can either trust that the previous you knew what he was doing, and as described in scripture, you sided with the Lord in defending God's plan, and chose to become mortal in hopes of a glorious resurrection; or you can lament something you're powerless to change - or perhaps hope that there will be a chance in the future, prior to (or even after) the resurrection when, if you want, you can opt to return to intelligence-hood.  But we have nothing whatsoever to add any validity to such a hope or expectation, so it's probably better to make the best of what you've got.
I don't think I can explain this to your satisfaction.  I think what you are looking for is something which has not yet been fully, publicly revealed.  I can tell you that I instinctively know beyond doubt that we do indeed need a Savior, and that there is perfect logic to the plan and its execution.  I also think that your understanding of that, and perhaps discovery of things not fully, publicly revealed will come from (a) accepting the word of God in faith, and (b) studying that word as it relates to the Atonement on the assumption that it is true and that it does indeed make sense even if you don't understand it yet.  I would expect such study to take a lifetime, though a few years should be enough to build sufficient understanding and confidence to go on.
Some of the posts by @brlenox may interest you - he has a different way of explaining the need for Christ's Atonement than what we usually hear.  The posts are more than long, and you'll have to read through many of them, and in one case, past a bit of a fight between posters.  I think the following threads have posts on the topic:
And:
That said, I still recommend personal, prayerful scripture study as the best starting point, especially when a testimony of the need for a Christ's Atonement is lacking.

Some of us are still in our premarital existence. And the bride and groom at all the weddings I've been to already had physical bodies long before the ceremony started.

This is one of the most interesting aspects (at least to me) regarding the creation of Adam and Eve before they partook of the fruit. They could not have had children, at least according to the Book of Mormon, until they partook of the fruit even though they were commanded to multiply and replenish the earth. Without this commandment though, Adam may have never partaken of the fruit, leaving him a lone man in the garden.
True, the story we have now of Adam and Eve is vague. I wonder how the posterity of Adam and Eve were told about Adam and Eve's creation and experience in the garden. I wonder how different our story is to the story they received. Anything outside of scripture requires "speculation" or "theory" in order to learn more. I think the important part is that we are, ourselves, will to admit our own speculation. This is why I really like these scriptures:
We are to be instructed more perfectly "in theory" as well as principle, doctrine, and law; however, I truly wish God would provide a more accurate explanation via our prophets regarding the Fall. BUT, as he (God) is more wise than myself he obviously has his purpose (which I know not). Imagine if our gospel doctrine classes also allowed more perfect instruction in theory (possibilities that are not as yet confirmed by the Spirit of Truth), and that we as members could enjoy these without taking it too far.
I was once told that Joseph Smith could have provided a full Doctrine and Covenants size book on Doctrine and Covenants section 76 (I would like to read this quote myself but have never found it), and if so, why was it not revealed? I wonder if it has to do with the current faith of God's children, and it is better that certain things are not revealed so that people do not turn away from the gospel because they can't handle meat.
EDIT: Quote was given in a different topic, "Both Joseph and Sidney gazed into heaven for “about an hour.” Furthermore, it is apparent that Joseph did not impart all that he saw in vision, for he later said, "I could explain a hundred fold more than I ever have of the glories of the kingdoms manifested to me in the vision, were I permitted, and were the people prepared to receive them." (Source: TPJS, p. 305)."

I would whole heartily recommend Elder David A Bednar's three series books:
1) Increase in Learning
2) Act in Doctrine
3) The Power to Become
These books provide some great thoughts.

I would whole heartily recommend Elder David A Bednar's three series books:
1) Increase in Learning
2) Act in Doctrine
3) The Power to Become
These books provide some great thoughts.

For perhaps 12 or so years Cleon Skousen's version of the atonement, which he claims was taught him by Apostle Widstoe, was the best thing I had ever run into on the atonement. It was infinitely better than the average members response of "we just can't understand the atonement". I applaud Cleon for at least acknowledging that there is so much more that we can understand about the atonement and setting an example of making the effort to go beyond the no fly zone.
That said, few people will ever put the effort into the process to understand where Cleon misses the mark.  You actually are at the root of the issue now as Cleon mis-emphasizes the role of God's creations in the narrative giving them far too much "power" in the process of God remaining God. His emphasis places God at the mercy of all of the intelligences and it simply is not that way.  And in fact properly understood that part of Cleon's narrative fades away into obscurity.
Nonetheless, there is not much information out there that really delves into the Atonement and I consider it a doctrine that has so many moving parts that it is purely the exhausting efforts of years of study that provides the necessary fodder for the spirit to teach you of these things.  When I study, I write in a Thesis sort of format. I have been working on my atonement document for, I think it is going on ten years now and it is over 600 pages long. The challenge becomes that even after you learn the material there is very little opportunity to share as without building on the line upon line foundation others cannot grasp the fascinating intricacies that becomes the greatest event to ever take place.
I can give you the benefit of some of the questions to ask that must be understood before you can work your way through the process.
You must grasp the material of the Fall.
1.) Who is the law Giver in the Garden.  Who is the judge in the Garden?
2.) Why was a death sentence an appropriate judgement for Adam and Eve?  Why was Satan cast out, when Adam and Eve were allowed a Savior. What kind of people dwell in a telestial state.  Why is that state an appropriate place for fallen mankind?
3.) What does Alma 12 provide us in understanding about who becomes the lawgiver and the second set of laws we must now conform to. Why is this significant
4.)What does the story of Cain and Able teach us about the privilege accorded to those who have shed innocent blood? 
5.) What really is Alma 34:11-16 saying. You'll have to make a paradigm shift just to grasp it.
6.) What prevents God the Father from exercising mercy without Christ shedding his blood? Why can't he just say, "Never mind Son, just pick the friends you like and bring them on home"?
7.) If mercy cannot rob justice, but justice requires a specific breach be rectified then the only way for justice to not be robbed is for justice to demand mercy.  Otherwise mercy cannot fulfill the demands of justice because justice has its specific requirements. It is not a substitution program. How is that accomplished?
8.) Why would God cease to be God if mercy robbed justice?
9.) The best quote I have ever found which indicates that Elder Eyring clearly understands a key element of the atonement is this one:
Most will read it and not see anything of significance. Expand on this quote for what it is really saying and one of the key elements of the atonement will be manifest - this is related to number 5 above.  I could go on with more questions but this is enough for your first five years of study...