Rob Osborn

The problem with you asking is that it doesn't solve anything for me. It's not the proper means to receive confirmation. Besides that, the question you propose is fairly generic and lacks substance. In order to establish the correct dialogue and meaning would take many many papers of going through the details of the subject. Otherwise you just never see eye to eye because semantics and connotation in regards to doctrine and truth have a Paramount importance in the overall discussion. For instance, take the word "damnation", without a proper understanding of even this one word with the correct semantics, context, and connotation, other questions such as what you propose really mean nothing. Why? Because most of my beliefs regarding heaven and hell and our doctrine revolve around the incorrect use of simple words and terms. When I use them I mean something different than when our doctrine uses it. Without establishing a common ground and correct understanding of key principles, questions regarding kingdoms don't mean a lot- doesn't lead to change. I've been working on this for several years, it's not something that is simply asked. This is the type of question that takes 30 pages at minimum to ask.

You are free to ask him any question you like. You don't have my personal permission to ask for me though. I will ask for confirmation myself when I feel the time is right and with the right spirit. You assume I propagate "false doctrine". That's why I don't give permission to you.

I personally believe Joseph Fielding Smith's statement is all opinion with no revealed truth on the matter. We can pray for confirmation on anything anyone says and I receive no confirmation his statement is true. It runs counter to our creation and purpose I think it brings up a very relevant point- when a prophet speaks his opinion on various things people regard it in the area of "doctrine" whereas when you or anyone of us give well thought opinion no one seems to care, has no weight. I think modern prophets living now in our day are way more cautious as to what they say because they know people tend to take everything they say as "doctrine" and so they don't offer up opinions very often in the public's eye.

Except isn't our spirit made in the likeness of our bodies? I'm curious as to why people think sex organs aren't a part of everyone's resurrected bodies? Where does this idea come from?

Thanks for the satire...

Yes, given before Christ and thus before the prison doors were opened for the work for the dead in the which labors of repentance and forgiveness of sins are enabled for the dead.

We all seem to forget that there is a millennium, a 1000 year period where we will work towards being perfected. In comparison, this life is just a blink. We shouldn't think this life is the big test.

Well, the gospel of Christ, which is repentance and baptism and gift of the Holy Ghost, is the "preparatory" gospel.

The scriptures teach the doctrine that in the end, all of the saved will be righteous because of their own choice.

Thanks for your defense. I do believe it was a pile on. I quote a lot of scripture, it's my usual source. People seem enamored with manuals and opinions of prophets over scripture. This past week, as I have contemplated while in purgatory, I have come to a better understanding of truth and how it's separate from "doctrine" as doctrine is merely "that which is taught". But thanks for the defense.

For those following, one can clearly see my case has been the same since my very first post. Please look past those infantile posters who can't understand simple concepts and attack others because they lack understanding themselves, they genuinely mean no harm, they are just insincere and we love them anyway.

In reality, everyone of us who come to earth are potential members. We may not remember now but all of us have the knowledge of Christ. In time, after we are dead there won't be even one of us who will not know, without any doubt, of Christ and his mission.

Forget it, just forget it. Not even worth my time.

I suppose at times it may be the case where we act and do almost mindlessly because it's what we are supposed to do and we aren't thinking of "reward". But, as we move towards godliness I am of the opinion that our definition of "rewards" changes and as we see the bigger picture of things the end goal or "plan" leading to the result becomes what may be defined, more or less, as "rewards". It's just a different and less selfish way of looking at and using the word. For example, I work with youth and we do a lot of service. Their ideas of rewards, as young youth just coming in, is seen more as some refreshments after, or a pat on the back and recognition, etc. One day, moving a heavy couch down some stairs, some of the youth were complaining. I jumped in and after a bit we wrangled the thing into place. I said "that, my boys, is what it's all about". They looked at me like I was crazy. I said- "isn't it a great blessing to have health and the ability to solve problems and serve others". They said-."...uhhhh...sure.". They didn't quite get it. But after a few years that idea of rewards in that light started setting in with them. Now, some of my youth really look forward to serving work because that new perception of the reward not being recognition, a pat on the back, or even refreshments, but rather the gift of having strong muscles, the ability to serve others and help out and what a blessing that is. They see that now as a reward. It's about changing our perception of rewards and what motivates us and why. There's always a reward for actions. But that reward is different for everyone. It's about bringing our thoughts in line with God and seeing the right reward and being blessed for it. As applied in our homes, we serve our spouse because we look forward to the godly reward of easing another's burden, bringing joy to someone else, etc, and that through their peace and joy we gain it to and over time that peace and joy we gain for ourselves and others becomes our motivating force and cause for action. That is the godly reward. I think too often we look at "rewards" as a type of selfish pay for doing a deed. But, this is not how God uses "rewards". We must change our minds to to look at rewards as the effects of actions and how those affect us. It's about seeing the whole picture. Take tithing for example- one could mindlessly pay thinking of no reward. The bigger picture though is recognizing that tithing going to help the poor and hungry, that easing another's burden monetarily is a great feeling of peace and that in that process of understanding we gain the reward of that peace and knowledge.

And thus why I brought up the revised BD entries- seems like doctrine is a changin ☺️

Let me rephrase- those who are saved, in the end, will all be righteous.

I would assume that sexual reproductive organs do in fact make up a persons gender identity in eternity.

What kind of answer is that? What specifically are you addressing?

I dont think its possible to not keep the end goal in mind and that in and of itself is the primary motivating factor.

Correcting false or untrue doctrines is part of the restoration.

Hum...In my opinion I dont think thats possible.

I think we think of the word "reward" kind of in the wrong sense sometimes. One definition of reward is- "The fruit of men's labor or works." For instance, if I plant an apple tree and nourish it and take care of it for several years what is my reward or "fruits of my labor" that I have in mind from the start? That it will bear delicious fruit. If one properly looks at it with the end goal in mind- the fruits of ones labor, that itself is the reward. Why did Christ do all that he did? Not only to obey, as that is a reward in and of itself, but to glorify God in bringing to pass His goal of the salvation of mankind. Is that joy not a reward?

I think your progression of thinking is getting more clear. Im curious what you think the "three" kinds of laws are? You see, in my understanding theres just one set of laws but within that set there are degrees or steps of the law.

My belief is that there is no law God has instituted that, through obedience to, leads anywhere but back to him. As such, every law, ordinance and covenant we make not only has the power to save us but also has the power to lead us back to his very presence. Each law, line upon line, is tied in to the next and obedience to one leads to the next until eventually we become perfect just as our Father and Jesus Christ are perfect. That's why I can't find sound reasoning in someone who is saved but not saved into the kingdom of heaven. It defies the entire work and reward system

There is always a reward for an action. But, it depends on the person in how and what they view as the reward that either blesses them or leads to their condemnation. We should seek after the good reward for actions.