NeuroTypical

The notion of "I've done x and y, that's good enough. The z I did shouldn't matter because of the x and y" is a red flag, depending on the severity of the z.

Yeah...no. In 2016, the whole noise from the entire left was a coronation of Queen Hillary as The Woman Who Shattered The Glass Ceiling. I can only contribute an anecdote. So to make sure the 3 of us are talking the same language: The bell curve of non-right political thought looked like this in 2016: At the top of the bell curve are the center left folks and democrats. Moving down the bell curve are the liberals. The remaining 20% are mostly progressives. The far far left end of things, the tail of the bell curve, the last 1-2% are leftists, marxists, communists. Yeah? I mean here in 2024 that bell curve has been flattening out on the left end of things, and that extreme far end has maybe grown to 5-15%. But in 2016 that's what I was seeing. And yes, those first 3 standard deviations of left-leaning folks were all singing Hillary's praises. But the tail of the bell curve existed, and you could find anti-Hillary voices in their small numbers. Anyway, my anarchist buddy from high school and I were facebook arguing buddies in '16. Dude and PP have a lot in common, with the interest in community organizing, and when both of 'em walk down the street, from their perspective the entire world walks to the right of them. My buddy co-authored the anarchist.faq back in high school. You can still find it online. Dude was expressing loathing for Hillary and the establishment democrats since before her campaign for president. And when I'd go into his facebook areas, his fellow 1-2% hard-core lefties were all expressing the same hatred. It was revolutionary talk, absolutely in the minority of left-of-center politics, but it was there. Fast forward 8 years, and it's increasingly common to find leftists hating on democrats. But it's been a thing that has been growing for a while. (As a fun last thing, Facebook told me that both Vort and my anarchist buddy lived in the same city for a while. For years I've been entertained with the thought that they pass each other on the street daily, or might even be vaguely acquainted with each other in a way that has them never knowing anything about the other's politics.)

I'd like to suggest you give mormondialogue.org a try. They welcome debate and criticism.

Huh. I always knew you were a fating a father of 11, but I'm blown away at learning are also bein6 a orthoderic masse on!

Forgive the bad paraphrase of Robert Burns' poem "To a Louse", but I think Elon just gave X users this power. If you have an X account, open the app, go to Grok, and have it draw a picture of you. It'll look through your X/Twitter posts, and come up with 4 guesses. My X account is basically used to argue and post snarky comments, so I was glad to see this:

*sigh* We might start handing out bans instead of just closing threads. Site rules 3 and 4: 3. Personal attacks, name calling, flaming, and judgments against other members will not be tolerated. 4. No bickering and nit-picking toward others. Realize that sometimes it is very difficult to be able to express how one feels through written words. Please be courteous and ask for a further explanation, rather then trying to attack and find holes in someone else's post.

If you want to, I guess nobody can stop you. And you don't need scripture or religion to be in this boat. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/humans-are-all-more-closely-related-than-we-commonly-think/

I'm guessing a bunch of Numenorians came across from their end of the ocean somewhere in the 2nd age before the island fell. (And anyone who says they came across in the 3rd age after the island fell, are obviously racist, not only not guided by Eru, but also incapable of telling the difference between a primary source and a random drunkard.)

They asked Trump about them, he poo-pooed the idea that they're foreign infiltrators, and said "the government's doing something with 'em, and they're not saying what. It'll probably come out at some point." Then they asked Trump if he had been briefed on them, and he said "I'm not gonna answer that." So yep, proof of aliens.

I believe that's true, but only because there has been a sea change in the position of Democrats on various issues. "JFK was a dittohead" - Rush Limbaugh in the '90's. Rush was observing this leftening of the Democrats and telling us about it way back then.

Same. But my question still remains: Assuming that's true, what does it matter if God instituted it with Brigham or with Joseph? I mean, I don't care what people think or what state of reality makes it harder or easier for them to think it. Elder Oaks talk on the difference between righteous and unrighteous judgment saved me from caring about any of that. When you're forced to pick between competing 2ndhand accounts, and guess at what it's more likely someone meant by what they said, it would seem that principle 4 applies.

Honestly, this is the sanest thing I've seen on the topic since the discussion began. It sort of begs the question - does it really matter? I've never understood why anyone would NEED the ban to have begun with one prophet or the other. Since we like to argue - here's a question: Why should I care whether Joseph or Brigham instituted the ban? Is my testimony supposed to be bolstered or attacked if it's one and not the other?

I'm not exactly expecting it, but I wouldn't be too surprised if Zelynski and Putin announced a deal and a date sometime this month. I've also seen two different news reports of migrant convoys not entering Mexico to travel into America. Reminds me of compared Thanksgiving tweets in 2020.

As a self-appointed spokesperson for the plethora of people who heard that stuff and exited the church over how little help such things were, lemme just opine that perhaps God has numerous paths his unique and diverse children can take to avail themselves of the simple miracle of the atonement. I recognized the holy ghost for the first time when I was 25. By that time I had already been inactive for years, leaving at 18 after being buried under the shameful insufficiency revealed in myself through such opinions. It sucks to be surrounded by people who all nod their head in agreement at such things, then look at you like there's something wrong with you. I've got decades of growth and maturity and testimony behind me now, but back then my response was "Fine, screw all of you then. Enjoy the blessings that are apparently for all of you, but not for me." May the Lord preserve his children from the good people in his church. Anyway, turning down the emotional tone, I had to figure out a few things. First, I'm not as bright as the next person over. Whatever combination of nature and nurture brought me here, I'm thick-skulled, not a good student, often struggling and failing to hear or read things and comprehend them, much less evaluate or accept or internalize them. That chapter gave me what I needed - small, bite sized principles that I could think about one chunk at a time. There was stuff I needed to be rid of in order to be a disciple of Christ, someone who brought a broken heart and contrite spirit, someone worthy and able to avail myself of the atonement and let it work in me. At the bottom of it all, I climbed up out of it like this: Recognize: Do I even have a grasp on what I did wrong? Trauma-impacted memory issues made it impossible to even think about such things. Feel Sorrow: I didn't learn how to actually feel my own emotions until my mid-'40's. Before then was nothing but fear and dread. Forsake: Had this one nailed. For all the people who struggle with addictions and habits and whatnot, I found it the easiest thing in the world to just stand there with a dumb look on my face and not commit sin. It was hard to do anything or take a risk, out of fear that I'd somehow screw things up out of sheer stupidity. Confess: It took years before I could even say the words out loud, much less pray them out or confess them to a human. Years. Years of effort. Make Restitution: Had to deeply delve into this one over time. Maybe a dozen specific individuals. Half of them I couldn't even remember their names, much less know where they lived. Forgive Others: Had to fight for a healthy perspective here. It's not about forgiving others when you deeply believe you are a net evil to humanity, and deserve whatever bad treatment you get. Keep the Commandments: The Mikbones of the world yelling about how simple things are, and the fretful handwringers who show up to their talk with a 30 page stack of papers listing all the commandments, and everyone in between. Every one of them convinced of their own correctness. I doubt I would have survived in the church were it not for the Gospel Principles manual, and a bishop who figured I could learn best by giving the calling of instructor. Anyway, that checklist, coupled with soul searching, scripture reading, some counseling, learning lessons on how to human years after everyone else, coupled with intentional effort across a lot of years, and eventually it finally got as simple as Mikbone said it always was. Hindsight tends to be 20/20, and I still see no shorter path I could have taken to transformation in Christ that I love as much as Still_Small_Voice. If it's ok with 'yall, I'll remain a fan of that chapter.

Don't believe me, take it directly from Mr "No Marxism, no Communism, just Representative Democracy and Social Justice in a Well Planned economy" himself: FidelCastroSocialJustice.MP4

It's my favorite chapter in the Gospel Principles book. And the scriptural citations for each point are perhaps not too obvious, but they are there: Recognize: Alma 42:29–30, Luke 16:15–16 Feel Sorrow: D&C 20:37, 2 Corinthians 7:9–10, Mormon 2:10–14 Forsake: D&C 58:43 Confess: D&C 61:2 Make Restitution: Ezekiel 33:15–16 Forgive Others: Nephi 13:14–15, D&C 64:9 Keep the Commandments: D&C 1:32 I hear from lots of people that they don't like reducing repentance down to a checklist. Some folks feel it cheapens or ignores or distracts from the atonement. I hear from other people, about how they have struggled mightily under the crushing burden of sin, and following this roadmap was what actually allowed them to avail themselves of the atonement. That's me. I'm "other people". Plus, the first three steps are easy to memorize - you just have to know the country/western song by Tracy Bird called The Truth About Men. A case study on the unrepentant soul. Just sing the chorus and do the opposite, and you're on your way to avail yourself of the atonement of Christ. And no matter what line we hand you, when we come dragging in, We ain't wrong, we ain't sorry, and it's probably gonna happen again.

This post will be of low value for most people. I'm always looking for new ways to explain what's going on with you humans. Here's an attempt to explain how cultural "vibes" are changing. Studying and quantifying culture is rarely life-changingly important, but thinking about how it evolves can occasionally help explain what's happening. Remember, we're talking cultural vibes. This isn't peak science. Hipster/Indie: "kill whitey", blackface jesus, messy hair, apathy, & lethargy. Vibe seized by Dems to elect Obama. Post-internet/Techno: Cancel culture, #metoo movement, occupy wall street. Gen Y thinks Jerry Seinfeld is part of the problem. Hypebeast/Woke: Protests, rise of occupy democrats, white privilege, gender theory and the rise of the TQIA+, we all enter lockdown to watch our children fail and the cities burn and hope someone ends Jordan Peterson before it's too late. Pilled/Scene: "Pilled" refers to the choice offered to Neo in the Matrix. Evolved into Red Pill (up with truth, down with gender theory), Blue Pill (whatever, man, I got a lot going on), Black Pill (nihilism, incels, bored doomscrolling), Green Pill (environmentally on-board), and Pink pill (choosing the bear, only fans is respectable now). Scene: Influencer life, touching grass, gaining your stupid serotonin boost for the week, Beluga, brainrot and the word "sus". What good is all of this? Maybe not much, but at least it shows the TQIA+ folks aren't revamping culture much any more. And you'll hear less and less about white privilege. And corporate America will be less invested in DEI. Folks who yell 'genocide' don't really bother every one else any more.

I also think about the notion of sanctification, which is the act of taking something that isn't holy, and making it holy. We sanctify bread and water for the sacrament. It doesn't really matter what we start with - MRE cracker, any type of bread, gluten free cracker for folks with dietary needs. When we sanctify it, it is now a worthy symbol of the flesh of Christ. When we sanctify ourselves or our actions, we show up fallen sinful humans. We go through the process of sanctification, whatever it might be, and we or our actions become sanctified, holy, worthy. Closely related to having our garments washed white through the blood of the lamb. We engage in intentional acts or behavior or thoughts, and the absolving/removing power is provided by the atonement. Still a fan of this painting, called "sanctification". It seems to really capture the notion of becoming holy and pure as a process, even though some consequences or scars or character traits may remain. https://history.churchofjesuschrist.org/media/jan-fisher?lang=eng&fbclid=IwY2xjawHJUZhleHRuA2FlbQIxMAABHQMQyHLhZpWDWZwQDI7UmOYpvTW8wRa-pAEuLKVyqYRW3uGJXsAj9dZZGg_aem_R2GwS18fWkk5DPplFBRCmw#1

Again, you're absolutely correct, and yet, it's hard to hear you over the screams of history where so many leftist movements turned into murderous nationalist fascist totalitarian things. Nobody starts out wanting to turn into Stalin or Hitler or Pol Pot or whoever wrecked Venezuela or Argentina. They all start out like you. Again, it's a difference in understanding how humans work. Your collectivist and socialist notions will all work just fine, as long as everyone does their part to make them work. And those who don't need to be handled somehow. And the more power you and yours gain, the more tempting it is to put scary scare quotes around the word "handled", because the handling gets more and more scary. Already you're realizing how difficult your utopian dream of single payer healthcare will be. You think it won't happen in your lifetime. And yet, should some strong movement from the left show up with enough support to force it, I'm thinking you'd jump on board. Even though some of the tactics might not be to your liking. Even though some of the methods might be a tad harsh or distasteful to you. Government force becomes a distasteful and rare thing, then a necessary thing, then the norm. Over and over and over again. Throughout history. Lots of places. Because it's human nature. And should your dream turn into a dystopian nightmare, and need to be overthrown, then folks like Johnson Jones will describe what happened by copying and pasting a bunch of stuff with the word "socialism" in it, in order to claim it wasn't really socialism.

If you watched the same ABC interview I did, I came away with a very different understanding. The whole thing about deporting legal immigrants appeared to be one of offering a choice. Zero forced separation. But if a family has a mix of legal and illegal people, the illegal people must go whereas the legal folks can chose to go or stay, depending on what makes sense for their family. The reporter tried every way under the sun to spin this in a controversial or negative way. He noted many of the dreamers have grown up to be responsible productive citizens, and he'd gladly work with Dems to figure something out for them besides deportation.

I have a solution, but not sure if it's a good one. On your computer, not your phone, start here: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/bofm?lang=eng Upper right corner of screen, click the three little dots, then select Download: That lets you download a PDF file. Nooks are supposedly able to read PDF files, but the only online discussion I can find from 2010 said it might be problematic. Here's hoping things have improved in 14 years. (Yes, that's a picture of me and my wife's pet rooster Doctor Who.)

They were gonna go with a red dot and I said "no way, it's gotta be green!" (Actually, I have no clue. Never would have noticed if Vort hadn't pointed it out.)

Gotcha. So, my point stands. You've already got a socialized government run option, and you picked the one administered through the for-profit company. You have only one choice. You can't afford one, and you can afford the other. So you pick the other. Because one isn't viable and the other is. The socialized government run one is the not-viable one. The one administered through the for-profit company is the viable one. And your solution is to get rid of the for profit one, and make socialized government run one the only option for everybody. Existing socialized government-run option: Not viable. VA administered through UHC: Viable. Right?

Alrighty folks, this thread has run its course. Just a reminder of the site rules. Y'all agreed to them when you signed up. You can find the link at the top of every page.

I think I buddied up with you on Facebook as you were going through a round of surgeries. First and foremost, thank you for your service. My family's decades of travails with healthcare doesn't make for such impactful pictures, but I have plenty of stories also. I remember at one point with 3 of the 4 of us having some hefty medical things happening, I was averaging half a dozen hours a week on the phone with providers and insurance, trying to keep approvals flowing and care paid for. I think that year I probably averaged at least 2 hours a month of just me, taking notes, following up, staying on hold, re-submitting lost paperwork, and educating people who answered the phone on their jobs. That said, I'm confused. I need a bit of help understanding whether Tricare was available to you if you paid in, or whether it wasn't.