Traveler

What in the nature of G-d inspires you to worship him? Would you worship anyone with such a nature? The Traveler

Your thinking is very linear. Here is a link to help you in thinking outside the “box”. It is a little introduction to Chaos theory and fractals: World of Fractals - Fractals and Chaos Theory in the Real World The Traveler

Different things mean different things to different people. To those that insist that the LDS are not Christian - I have responded that according to what they define as Christina (belief in the Trinity) is not how I define my belief in Christ. If that excludes me from being a Christian then I am not what they define as a Christian. The Traveler

At the last supper when Jesus said in essence - one of you will be ashamed of me. Did Peter turn to John and say - "I'll bet it's Judas, he has been acting so strange lately." I think a saint would say, "L-rd is it I". I know for me it is never the big sutff. I have weathered great storms. For me it is the little things - when no one is looking or when someone cuts me off and runs me off the road on my bicycle that I have thought that lack love and compassion. I really let my dark lights be seen when someone lies about LDS doctrine or make fun of sacred things that I act more like I am ashamed of loving my neighbor. The Traveler

There are really two questions: One question: Are the majority of the climates of earth changing in the same similar pattern? Second question: The climates of earth that are changing – how much of the change is caused by human pollution. Our friend JBS does not want to admit that there is any climate change or that man contributes. I have attempted to open discussion about what is changing and why but for the most part that does not seem to interest anyone. There is a possibility that air pollution is lower now than at any time since man learned to use fire. Another thought is that solar power converted to electrical power is the least polluting source of energy. But such thinking is short sided. Solar panels are silicon or polymer based manufacturing that is highly reliant on chemicals that are not environmentally friendly. There are trade offs – one point that many environmentalist miss is that there is a possibility that we can intelligently manage even our wild resources. Mother Nature left to herself is seldom as beneficial as some advertise. We need to be honest (politically and publicly) with what we are attempting to accomplish and not have hidden agendas. I would try harder to agree with our friend JBS but I believe they have a hidden agenda. The Traveler

I find that study with a particular point of view is also interesting. For example as you read the scriptures use the point of view of what the particular scripture you are reading has to do with the time and era in which you live. Another example is to use the view of what your are reading related to covenants. The Traveler

2 thousand years before Christ (almost 1000 years after the Biblical flood) there were ancient Egyptians that knew the earth was round. The ancient Mayan of the Classic era not only knew that the earth was round but they knew the curvature of the earth - something that most people today do not know nor do they knew how to go about figuring it out. I am posting this just because so many people today think they are smarter than the ancients. The Traveler

In essence tithing is a progressive income tax commanded by the L-rd (the more you have the more you pay) and if you believe in the admonishments of Jesus Christ who indicated that the wealthier should be more generous with their offerings then you should not fear progressive contributions based on wealth - even if the hard core communist agree. The evil communist believe in a strong military (one of their most important tenants) so should we have a weak or non-existent military just so we are not anything like the evil communist? Is this you only reasoning? The Traveler

I very much regret that you dislike progressive income tax – it is one of the least regressive of government taxes. I support and champion income tax because every citizen gets to see every year what they are paying in taxes because of their income. I am very much disturbed with those that strain at a nat to swallow a camel when it comes to taxes. Many complain about income taxes because they are so visible. If you are going to complain about government taking advantage let’s not go after income taxes – let’s go after the hidden taxes like the corporate tax. Few Americans realize that they pay close to 60% of their income in taxes. This is because when you go and buy a loaf of bread for a dollar you will pay close to 45 percent of the cost you pay in taxes and this is before you even consider paying the state food tax – if there is any. You pay even more in what are called big ticket items, as high as 80% in some cases. Very few realize that as the price of gas drops that the tax per gallon does not decrease one red cent. Very few realize that the percent markup over 8% counted as profit by the oil companies goes to pay the oil companies taxes. I am glad you are passionate about taxes – I just wish you were not stuck with a political bias and agenda. I believe every citizen has a right to know how much money their government is taking from them and I know of no better way of them knowing than when they fill out their income tax in April. The only tax, should be the income tax – if we want to get rid of any taxes by priority let’s make income tax the very last tax to be cut --- not the first. The Traveler

I believe it depends on what one intends or hopes to accomplish in life. The Traveler

Welcome - If it were not for the LDS I would be Buddhist – From my studies I prefer a form a Buddhism that has roots in Tibet. Some things you might find interesting about LDS and Buddhist relations: The highest ranking Zen master outside of Asia lives in Salt Lake City, Utah and is on good relations with the LDS. Our sacred temples are in part to honor our dead in every nation and many sacred symbols used in our temples are similar to symbols Buddhist use in their cemeteries. I personally have a good friend that is a Buddhist monk of European decent. I am also familiar with the writings of Ken Wilber and his integration theory of modern religious thinking. The Traveler

Just a side note: I know of no where in the Book of Mormon where the native hourses were used for ridding or heavy domestic labor like plowing. It does not appear to me that the modern version of hourses existed in the Classic Era of the Ancient Americas. The Traveler

I did not know there was a debate about the needs of children. It appears to me that the very best that society can offer children is an atmosphere where all agree and understand that the ideal family is where the genetic father and genetic mother love and care for their offspring in a stable marriage. I see nothing wrong with society giving favor and support to the ideal family and marriage. I would love to have a deep and open discussion about what constitutes holy matrimony and why some feel the desire and deed to change it. However, I have discovered that when personal pleasures, passions and desires are involved that reason is freely discarded and resentment and hate are use to blame any opposition. Can we have a discussion about how we can improve the current social supports for children? I have never heard that those that oppose Prop 8 in California are doing so for the sake and improvement of how society treats and cares for innocent children. The Traveler

I believe evolution goes far beyond the creation of life - I believe that even death is a type of evolution, as is growing and ageing. I also believe that being born again begins a type of spiritual evolution. The Traveler

I do not believe that we can forgive without the Holy Spirit guiding us. Once I was ridding my bicycle when I was run of the road by a pickup truck with laughing occupants. I did not get the license plate but for several minutes as I had picked myself up and continued my ride (with blood dripping) I was thinking of how I might find the pickup and get even. My mind was full of dark thoughts. Then I thought of how I enjoy ridding and being outdoors. I thought how my time alone riding gives me time to ponder spiritual things. Then a thought came to me. They had hurt me and stolen some of my time to think of pleasant things – Why should I allow them to steal more of my thoughts and time even after they are gone. Within a few moments I had let the whole thing pass and then a said a little prayer suggesting that they be forgiven and the whole incident forgotten – I asked that this thing not be considered at the Day of Judgment. The rest of my ride became one of my most enjoyable and of all my thousands of rides it is still one that I remember as being a good worthwhile spiritual ride. The Traveler

I think you ought to provide a link to a "real" Climate Scientist – like this one: Jules' klimaatblog: Steven Goddard & The Register I would also suggest that you consider research outside of political publications. The Traveler

1. There are 3 major forest areas on the earth, the northern ring, southern ring and the tropical rain forests. Never in the history of man have we seen the depletion of these forests -ever. We do not know at what point the damage to these woodlands will affect the global climate. We do know from history what localized deforestation has done to local climates. A rain forest can be changed to a desert by deforestation. In addition the USA is having difficulties with Kudzu destroying our Eastern forests and the pine beetle is causing havoc in western forests. The population of man is the largest it has ever been – please do not underestimate the damage that stupidity and ignorance can cause. 2. Nuclear energy plants may be safe (for now) but nuclear waste disposal is not safe. There is no country in the world that will accept nuclear waste from any other country regardless of the financial benefits – that alone should tell you something. 3. Here is a link to the raw data concerning the polar Ice cap data from NOAA. NOAA Paleoclimatology World Data Centers Polar Region Ice Core Data The ice cap is melting. The Traveler

I think you missed the point - if logic is not a part of the order in the universe then the use of logic to understand the universe is counter productive. Therefore, if you do not believe in order by logic - why use logic to try to understand an assumed order - this plays to an event horizon or what follows. Even Chaos Theory implies that the introduction of logic to a system that is not order by logic will skew the results. As I said before - I am not willing to abandon logic. Why would you employ ordered logic to a system you believe is not ordered by logic? I just do not see the logic in that. The Traveler

My point is very simple - no matter where you begin or how you define the initial conditions of the universe we are left to wonder what caused the beginning with those particular initial conditions. Stephen Hawkins referred to this as the "event horizon". The LDS concept is that if you know the initial conditions you are more likely to be able to someday be able to recreate them than if you attempt to do so by random chance or do not think you are capable of thinking of such things. If intelligence is not part of the initial conditions then it could not be replicated – ever – with intelligence. I just prefer to believe that it is more probable that intelligence will someday solve the problem. Pardon my logic but it does appear to me that looking for a logical conclusion and bases to the universe is the only logical way to consider the possibilities. I do not think that the assumption that there is no possible logic based on intelligence to the universe is a logical possibility. The Traveler

I would like to address: Let us start with the moral and philosophical issue. Should the government decide for you what is moral? Should the government decide for you where to shop and what to buy? And, if it does, is that free trade? My answer is that governments not only should decide what is moral - it is in fact the only real decision that the governments of man are capable of making. Governments cannot decide that the earth is the center of the universe (we know they have tried), they cannot decide to change the universal gravitational constant or that pi ought to be 3. It would also make no sense to determine a universal moral – the only moral the makes sense for a government to decide by the power of law is a moral that is not universally accepted – in other words a moral that some segment of the population does not agree with. If everyone agreed there would be no purpose or need for a law or government intervention. The only reason for governments or law is for one segment of the population to impose their morals (laws) by the force of law on the rest of the population. Let me expand your Mexican shoe salesman analogy: Let us say that the person selling you the shoes murdered your brother last week and took his brand new shoes and is now selling them to you. Would you want your government to do something to restrict the trade? Okay perhaps that is a little harsh – let us say that he just stole the shoes from your brother – should the government still do something to restrict the trade? Still perhaps a little harsh – let us say that he stole the leather to make the shoes from your brother – should the government still do something to restrict the trade? Still a little harsh – let us say he had a contract to purchase the leather from your brother but never paid the contract after the leather was delivered and your brother lost his business – should the government still do something to restrict the trade? Still harsh – let us say that he had a company that competed with your brother and they said that their country would no longer sale rubber to the USA unless they cut off all leather to your brother – should the government still do something to restrict the trade? Where do you draw the line for government to do something - when it hurts someone in your family? Does it become okay if it does not hurt anyone that you know? Let me give another example: Let us suppose that a great big software company sold an operating system for personal computers called DOS. Suppose that a very small software company developed a software compression program that would allow a lot more data to be stored to disk. Suppose the big company wanted that compression software but the little company would not sell it because they did not feel that the big company offered enough. So let a suppose that the very big company stole the software from the little company and sold it as part of their system and that they became the biggest software operating system provider and that the president of the very big company became one of the richest men in the whole world. The other company went out of business and 150 software programmers that had done such a wonderful job were put out of business and lost their jobs. And suppose that after 10 years in the courts the president of the little company was awarded $250,000 IS THIS WHAT YOU MEAN BY NO OR LITTLE GOVERNMENT INTERVENTION FREE TRADE? The Traveler

During the early 80’s I was working on a classified government program that involved the global effects of massive solar induced currents that flow through our planate creating magnetic variations (false compass readings). Such studies show that the prime factor effecting climate is without doubt the sun. Most of this study concerned careful annalists of solar cycles. We knew then that recent variations in the sun’s cycles were mild on the extreme side and that we are approaching an era of greater variations that could result in some very extreme changes including a possible reversal of the magnetic poles. I am also an environmentalist that quit the Serra Club because it became more political than scientific or rational – I have never been a member of green peace. I have also commuted by bicycle for most of my life. With this in mind I would like to respond. 1) Our climate is effected by the activities of man. Without question this is true but it is not about greenhouse gases – it is about the depletion of our forests on a global scale. 2) Nuclear power is unsafe. Do not kid yourself – the people that know about nuclear power do not live down wind. There is however, a bigger problem with deposing of nuclear waste. 3) Oil spills like the Exxon Valdez pose grave environmental disasters. They are expensive to clean up – from the standpoint of cost alone it is a grave disaster. 4) We make too much green-house gases. The truth is that we do not make hardly any green house gases – vast herds of grazing animals create more greenhouse gases than humans. The primary carbon gas produced from burning fuels is carbon monoxide which is not a greenhouse gas. Converting carbon monoxide (which is not a greenhouse gas) to carbon dioxide (which is a greenhouse gas) is a process in nature that has little to do with anything humans are doing and there is no proof that the carbon monoxide levels will change significantly the aggregate amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. 5) We're polluting the oceans of the world. We are. Some are more polluted than others. 6) The polar ice-caps are melting at an alarming rate. This is true – however the reason appears to be volcanic activity. But that is not politically popular and there is nothing we can do about it. It is a lot more fun to blame somebody. 7) The ozone layer is depleting / depleted by man. We do not know if the ozone is in decline or if we are experiencing some kind of cycle. Freon will destroy ozone but Freon has a great alibi – it is too heavy – 6 times heaver than water and there is no water that high in the atmosphere. The Traveler

Snowflakes are not evolving - a snowflake is no more complex and intricate today than they were 12 billion years ago. Because of my background and training in math and physics I consider myself knowledgably and capable of using Chaos theory to model complex systems. I am aware that Chaos theory utilizes probabilities within ranges based on parameters within defined ratios to predict possible outcomes of complex systems. Even in Chaos theory a parameter(s) must change beyond defined ratios before the probable outputs can be redefined. Since the parameters of a snowflake are very limited within the range of the crystallization of water there will never be evolution of snowflakes thus Chaos Theory is incapable of telling us anymore about a snowflake than what we already know. Since Chaos theory deals with initial parameters within defined ranges the outcomes are given as probabilities. I contend that if you can know all the parameters precisely enough you could predict the outcome exactly – even in a snowflake. The Traveler

I have taken all this into account. Some species lived and evolved for over 100 million years and are now extinct and did not evolve the intelligence of humans (evolution less than 100,000 years) even though they evolved a vast array of other complex traits. The shark preceded the dinosaurs and yet live today with very little evolutionary differences despite the fact that their food sources have evolved and changed greatly over hundreds of millions of years. The bat had to evolve 4 extremely diverse and complex traits simultaneously and relatively instantly to survive that are so complex that their existence is a mathematical impossibility. The point is that complexity comes from order not chaos. Chaos produces singularity over time. I have never found an exception. I think it is kind of humorous that anyone that has ever attempted to produce anything complex would have any other opinion and think it logical. The Traveler

If you look in the topical guide you will not find any reference to being possessed – by any spirit, good or evil. I prefer to think in terms of spiritual influence with concepts of being influenced by the Holy Ghost or the influence of unclean spirits. I find it most difficult to believe that anyone has difficulty in determining if they or others are being influenced by the Holy Ghost or by an unclean spirit. I believe it is given to all men to know the difference between good and evil. I do not think this is rocket science or some big mystery. The Traveler

I cannot answer for all - only myself. My wife and I eat out 2 or three times a week. We almost never say a prayer at restaurants but rather have our prayer before we go or in the privacy of our car before we enter the restaurant. I consider prayer a very sacred form of worship and I do not like to cast my perils before swine. I do not necessarily know that there are religious swine but rather than push that envelop I error on the side of caution. The Traveler