One Global Faith -- Is It Possible?

[candyprpl]

In 1907 the First Presidency presented to the general conference a declaration which includes this statement: "Our motives are not selfish; our purposes not petty and earth-bound; we contimplate the human race, past, present and yet to come, as immortal beings, for whose salvation it is our mission to labor; and to this work, broad as eternity and deep as the love of God, we devote ourselves, now, and forever." (In Conference Report, Apr. 1907)

As members of the Church of Jesus Christ, we seek to bring all truth together. We seek to enlarge the circle of love and understanding among all the people of the earth. Thus we strive to establish peace and happiness, not only with Christianity but among all mankind.

In the message of the gospel, the entire human race is one family descended from a single God. All men and women have not only a physical lineage leading back to Adam and Eve, their first earthly parents, but also a spiritual heritage leading back to God the Eternal Father. Thus, all persons on earth are literally brothers and sisters in the family of God.

It is in understanding and accepting this universal fatherhood of God that all human beings can best appreciate God's concern for them and their relationship to each other. This is a message of life and love that strikes squarely against all stifling traditions based on race, language, economic or political standing, educational rank, or cultural background...

Mormonism, so-called, is a world religion, not simply because its members are now found throughout the world, but chiefly because it has a comprehensive and inclusive message based upon the acceptance of all truth, restored to meet the needs of all mankind.

All men share an inheritance of divine light. God operates among his children in all nations, and those who seek God are entitled to further light and knowledge, regardless of their race, nationality, or cultural traditions. (President Howard W. Hunter, President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles.)

Elder Orson F. Whitney, in a conference address, explained that many great religious leaders were inspired. He said: "[God] is using not only his covenant people, but other peoples as well, to consummate a work, stupendous, magnificent, and altogether too arduous for this little handful of Saints to accomplish by and of themselves....

"All down the ages men bearing the authority of the Holy Priesthood -- patriarchs, prophets, apostles and others, have officiated in the name of the Lord, doing the things that he required of them; and outside the pale of their activities other good and great men, not bearing the Priesthood, but possessing profundity of thought, great wisdom, and a desire to uplift their fellows, have been sent by the Almighty into many nations, to give them, not the fulness of the Gospel, but that portion of truth that they were able to receive and wisely use." (Conference Report, Apr. 1921, pp. 32-33.)

Decades ago, Elder Orson F. Whitney, of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, became well acquainted with a renowned Catholic scholar, versed in law, literature, science, and philosophy, and conversant in a dozen languages. This erudite friend commented to the aposle one day: "You Mormons are all ingnoramuses. You don't even know the strength of your own position. It is so strong that there is only one other poistion tenable in the whole Christian world, and that is the position of the Roman Catholic Church. The issue is between Mormonism and Catholicism. If you are right, we are wrong. If we are right, you are wrong. And that's all there is to it. These Protestant sects haven't a leg to stand on; for if we are right, we cut them off long ago as apostates; and if we are wrong, they are wrong with us, for they were part of us and came out of us. If we have the apostolic succession, from St. Peter as we claim, there was no need of Joseph Smith and Mormonism; but if we have not that succession, such a man as Joseph Smith was necessary and Mormonism's position is the only consistent one. It is either the perptuation of the gospel from ancient times, or the restoration of the gospel in latter days" (Conference Report, Oct. 1924, 19-20.)

My question -- Can we agree to disagree and be of one world faith -- each following our own understanding and hopefully ending up in the same place?

Any thoughts on this discussion?

Edited October 13, 2008 by candyprpl

[BenRaines]

How can you agree to disagree and be one of of one world faith?

That would be like The Father, The Son and The Holy Ghost being one but we don't agree on everything. You are either one or you are in disagreement.

Husbands and Wives are commanded to be as one flesh. Does it mean we are? Most likely not. Most likely we are still trying to learn what it means to be like the Father and the Son.

My vote is no.

Ben Raines

[Hemidakota]

Not at this time...but eventually after the Lord has return will all nations, cultures, and people be part of one faith.

[NeuroTypical]

Can we agree to disagree and be of one world faith -- each following our own understanding and hopefully ending up in the same place?

Well, we'll all end up at the same place, but the folks who have an incorrect understanding about what that place is, may have a hard time adjusting.

LM

[DigitalShadow]

I don't believe that any of the current religions are correct and as such I think in another few hundred years religion will be phased out almost entirely and we will look back at current religions as we now look back on ancient mythology.

If I am wrong (which is entirely possible) and one religion is correct out of the ones that exist now, I don't think we (as a planet) will ever agree on it since religions are faith based and inherently tied to the personal subjective experience which is different for everyone. Even within the same religion, there is a tendency for disagreement and breaking up into sects. I find it hard to believe the entire planet could ever agree on a single faith, even under apocalyptic conditions, every religion would try to claim the events as proof of their own faith.

[Guest Godless]

I don't believe that any of the current religions are correct and as such I think in another few hundred years religion will be phased out almost entirely and we will look back at current religions as we now look back on ancient mythology.

If I am wrong (which is entirely possible) and one religion is correct out of the ones that exist now, I don't think we (as a planet) will ever agree on it since religions are faith based and inherently tied to the personal subjective experience which is different for everyone. Even within the same religion, there is a tendency for disagreement and breaking up into sects. I find it hard to believe the entire planet could ever agree on a single faith, even under apocalyptic conditions, every religion would try to claim the events as proof of their own faith.

Agreed. The world has never been able to adhere to a single religion, and I doubt that it ever will. I, too, would not be surprised if religion became obsolete over the next few centuries, though none of us will be around to see that happen. It is also possible that religion could ultimately be the bane of mankind, though probably not in our lifetimes. Either way, I don't see anyone ever uniting around religion on a global scale.

[Maya]

I liked what you wrote, but did not like the question...

"The issue is between Mormonism and Catholicism. If you are right, we are wrong.! I think that was really well put of him.

As an answer.... I think He needs to come here first so everyone will know... and YET after 1000 years, it will happen again!

We as LDS also have to become more one than what we are. Language barriers are stil huge. Conflicts with cultures are stil too big. I think we need to first consentrate on making us one people before inviting others in.

[candyprpl]

Okay, well it seems as all have agreed that we can't become one faith.

(Playing devil's advocate) Why have any faith? If we can't agree and no one is right -- why play (in other words)?

[DigitalShadow]

Why have any faith?

Because the alternative is unpleasant. People want there to be more to life and for there to be judgement and accountability. Whether any of the current religions are correct or not, I don't think anyone can dispute that at least the vast majority of religions are man-made and are born out of those basic desires.

Edited October 13, 2008 by DigitalShadow

[Palerider]

How can you agree to disagree and be one of of one world faith?

That would be like The Father, The Son and The Holy Ghost being one but we don't agree on everything. You are either one or you are in disagreement.

Husbands and Wives are commanded to be as one flesh. Does it mean we are? Most likely not. Most likely we are still trying to learn what it means to be like the Father and the Son.

My vote is no.

Ben Raines

Ditto to what he said....:)

[a-train]

I don't believe that any of the current religions are correct and as such I think in another few hundred years religion will be phased out almost entirely and we will look back at current religions as we now look back on ancient mythology.

Do you really believe that the Jews who have suffered these many centuries for their faith will suddenly give up on their heritage? Do you honestly think that the Muslims are nearing a universal denial of the administration of Gabriel to Muhammad (God's peace be upon him)? Do you really think that Christians who have so ardently defended their position against all philosophy these many centuries are about to drop the subject? Are we Mormons who find the prophecies of our scriptures fulfilled before us so vividly on the brink of dismissing it all to coincidence?

What startling and spectacular event is coming upon the whole earth that will cause billions to simultaneously deny Providence? This must surely be a massive event! What fantastic and tremendous change in all history is about to take place! Hollywood in all its imagery and escapism cannot portray an event of such enormous and universal effect!

Tell me, I pray, what is it, what gigantic event will bring about this great change?

-a-train

[Palerider]

If it takes place I want a reduction in tithing.....at least 8%...:)

[jadams_4040]

In 1907 the First Presidency presented to the general conference a declaration which includes this statement: "Our motives are not selfish; our purposes not petty and earth-bound; we contimplate the human race, past, present and yet to come, as immortal beings, for whose salvation it is our mission to labor; and to this work, broad as eternity and deep as the love of God, we devote ourselves, now, and forever." (In Conference Report, Apr. 1907)

As members of the Church of Jesus Christ, we seek to bring all truth together. We seek to enlarge the circle of love and understanding among all the people of the earth. Thus we strive to establish peace and happiness, not only with Christianity but among all mankind.

In the message of the gospel, the entire human race is one family descended from a single God. All men and women have not only a physical lineage leading back to Adam and Eve, their first earthly parents, but also a spiritual heritage leading back to God the Eternal Father. Thus, all persons on earth are literally brothers and sisters in the family of God.

It is in understanding and accepting this universal fatherhood of God that all human beings can best appreciate God's concern for them and their relationship to each other. This is a message of life and love that strikes squarely against all stifling traditions based on race, language, economic or political standing, educational rank, or cultural background...

Mormonism, so-called, is a world religion, not simply because its members are now found throughout the world, but chiefly because it has a comprehensive and inclusive message based upon the acceptance of all truth, restored to meet the needs of all mankind.

All men share an inheritance of divine light. God operates among his children in all nations, and those who seek God are entitled to further light and knowledge, regardless of their race, nationality, or cultural traditions. (President Howard W. Hunter, President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles.)

Elder Orson F. Whitney, in a conference address, explained that many great religious leaders were inspired. He said: "[God] is using not only his covenant people, but other peoples as well, to consummate a work, stupendous, magnificent, and altogether too arduous for this little handful of Saints to accomplish by and of themselves....

"All down the ages men bearing the authority of the Holy Priesthood -- patriarchs, prophets, apostles and others, have officiated in the name of the Lord, doing the things that he required of them; and outside the pale of their activities other good and great men, not bearing the Priesthood, but possessing profundity of thought, great wisdom, and a desire to uplift their fellows, have been sent by the Almighty into many nations, to give them, not the fulness of the Gospel, but that portion of truth that they were able to receive and wisely use." (Conference Report, Apr. 1921, pp. 32-33.)

Decades ago, Elder Orson F. Whitney, of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, became well acquainted with a renowned Catholic scholar, versed in law, literature, science, and philosophy, and conversant in a dozen languages. This erudite friend commented to the aposle one day: "You Mormons are all ingnoramuses. You don't even know the strength of your own position. It is so strong that there is only one other poistion tenable in the whole Christian world, and that is the position of the Roman Catholic Church. The issue is between Mormonism and Catholicism. If you are right, we are wrong. If we are right, you are wrong. And that's all there is to it. These Protestant sects haven't a leg to stand on; for if we are right, we cut them off long ago as apostates; and if we are wrong, they are wrong with us, for they were part of us and came out of us. If we have the apostolic succession, from St. Peter as we claim, there was no need of Joseph Smith and Mormonism; but if we have not that succession, such a man as Joseph Smith was necessary and Mormonism's position is the only consistent one. It is either the perptuation of the gospel from ancient times, or the restoration of the gospel in latter days" (Conference Report, Oct. 1924, 19-20.)

My question -- Can we agree to disagree and be of one world faith -- each following our own understanding and hopefully ending up in the same place?

Any thoughts on this discussion?

Very wonderfull and caring motivation on yer part. and it would be nice if this were to happen on a world wide basis. but unfortunatly prophecy and common sense tells a differant story; this does not mean we need not continue to do our best, as then many more converts will be brought to wonderfull and essential truths of familyButthe only time we will ever be together in one faith of unity; will be after the millenium reigen.satan has been loosed from his captivity, does his work for the final time then is brought to complete death along with all other evil spirits. then we will have no need for temples anymore, and life will be in complete unity of all.:)

[Guest Godless]

Do you really believe that the Jews who have suffered these many centuries for their faith will suddenly give up on their heritage? Do you honestly think that the Muslims are nearing a universal denial of the administration of Gabriel to Muhammad (God's peace be upon him)? Do you really think that Christians who have so ardently defended their position against all philosophy these many centuries are about to drop the subject? Are we Mormons who find the prophecies of our scriptures fulfilled before us so vividly on the brink of dismissing it all to coincidence?

What startling and spectacular event is coming upon the whole earth that will cause billions to simultaneously deny Providence? This must surely be a massive event! What fantastic and tremendous change in all history is about to take place! Hollywood in all its imagery and escapism cannot portray an event of such enormous and universal effect!

Tell me, I pray, what is it, what gigantic event will bring about this great change?

-a-train

I highly doubt that he is referencing a singular event that will suddenly change the religious landscape, nor do I believe that he's implying that this abandonment of religion will happen anytime soon (I believe the words he used were "a few centuries from now"). IF this abandonment of religion ever happens, it will be a very gradual process. Heck, some people might argue that it's already started, albeit on a very small scale.

[KTMxer_250f]

The abandonment of religion will never happen.

It's already started?

The LDS church is one of the fastest growing churches in existence.... and I'll bet it's growing faster than atheism is.

People will never abandon their religious beliefs.

[StallionMcBeastly]

I highly doubt that he is referencing a singular event that will suddenly change the religious landscape, nor do I believe that he's implying that this abandonment of religion will happen anytime soon (I believe the words he used were "a few centuries from now"). IF this abandonment of religion ever happens, it will be a very gradual process. Heck, some people might argue that it's already started, albeit on a very small scale.

The abandonment of religion will never happen.

It's already started?

The LDS church is one of the fastest growing churches in existence.... and I'll bet it's growing faster than atheism is.

I'm going to have to disagree with you. People will never completely abandon their religious beliefs.

[Guest Godless]

The abandonment of religion will never happen.

It's already started?

The LDS church is one of the fastest growing churches in existence.... and I'll bet it's growing faster than atheism is.

But what do your retention numbers look like? Last I checked, you're numbers only reflected general membership, not active membership, but please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.. Heck, I'm probably still counted in the yearly numbers considering that I haven't yet bothered with the resignation process.

I'm going to have to disagree with you. People will never completely abandon their religious beliefs.

You may be right. You may be wrong. I'm sure that the Inquisition ringleaders of ~800 years ago never saw the Reformation coming.

[a-train]

Besides, an atheistic world paradigm is just as faith based as is a theistic one.

-a-train

[prisonchaplain]

But what do your retention numbers look like? Last I checked, you're numbers only reflected general membership, not active membership, but please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.. Heck, I'm probably still counted in the yearly numbers considering that I haven't yet bothered with the resignation process.

Since this is a God/no-God discussion, I'll throw my church into the mix. YES, our #s have stagnated in the West. However, worldwide, we're exploding. The Assemblies of God started out with maybe a few thousand in 1914, and today is well over 50-million worldwide (roughly 3 million adherents in the U.S.).

Since most of us live in the West we have this sense that religion in general is becoming lax, and that our #s are flat or declining. However, worldwide, it just ain't so. Oh, and spare me the argument that education and wealth cause religion to decline, because now we're smarter...I'm thinking that the last couple of weeks have proven just how feeble our smarts are.

You may be right. You may be wrong. I'm sure that the Inquisition ringleaders of ~800 years ago never saw the Reformation coming.

I'll call your Inquistion, and raise you Mao's Great Leap Forward. Or, what of Joseph Stalin's purges, in the name of the Greater Man? Atheist ideologies killed more people in the last century (and mostly the killings were internal, not through warfare) then theistic dispute did in the 2000 years preceeding. When it comes to evil deeds, religion is nuetral. Great leaders use religious fervor to inspire greatness, evil leaders twist the same to inspire great evil.

[DigitalShadow]

Do you really believe that the Jews who have suffered these many centuries for their faith will suddenly give up on their heritage? Do you honestly think that the Muslims are nearing a universal denial of the administration of Gabriel to Muhammad (God's peace be upon him)? Do you really think that Christians who have so ardently defended their position against all philosophy these many centuries are about to drop the subject? Are we Mormons who find the prophecies of our scriptures fulfilled before us so vividly on the brink of dismissing it all to coincidence?

What startling and spectacular event is coming upon the whole earth that will cause billions to simultaneously deny Providence? This must surely be a massive event! What fantastic and tremendous change in all history is about to take place! Hollywood in all its imagery and escapism cannot portray an event of such enormous and universal effect!

Tell me, I pray, what is it, what gigantic event will bring about this great change?

-a-train

I never said that there would be a sudden massive world wide event, in fact I said quite the opposite of that.

In any case, I can't see the future, I can only present my personal opinion. My thought is that hundreds of years from now (between 300-1000) as science progresses and superstition fades away, less and less people will subscribe to any particular religion. I don't imagine some global faith changing event, or that the change to happen quickly by any sense of the word, and even thousands of years from now there will probably be small sects of various religions, but I think the majority of the people will not be religious.

I'm sure there are many religious wars yet to come and plenty of people dying for their faith along with people dying to be free from those people's faith and it will probably be a long bloody ordeal that may ultimately end in the destruction of the human race. I do however think that current religions will fade into history in the long run, one way or another.

[DigitalShadow]

Besides, an atheistic world paradigm is just as faith based as is a theistic one.

-a-train

I never said atheistic or paradigm. I simply said that I think people would eventually outgrow faith, not dogmatically disbelieve. There is a distinct difference.

[BenRaines]

I seem to recall that the Jewish faith has a history of about 6,000 years, give or take 1,000.

I am sure that the intellectuals think that they will be able to disprove religion sooner or later. Strength in the arm of man and the wisdom of man. They don't need any God to tell them what to do.

Ben Raines

[DigitalShadow]

I seem to recall that the Jewish faith has a history of about 6,000 years, give or take 1,000.

I am sure that the intellectuals think that they will be able to disprove religion sooner or later. Strength in the arm of man and the wisdom of man. They don't need any God to tell them what to do.

Ben Raines

I follow all of your perceived commandments of God. For me and many other atheists and agnostics it has nothing to do with whether not we want God "telling us what to do", it is about the pursuit of truth.

[DigitalShadow]

The abandonment of religion will never happen.

It's already started?

The LDS church is one of the fastest growing churches in existence.... and I'll bet it's growing faster than atheism is.

I'm going to have to disagree with you. People will never completely abandon their religious beliefs.

I would be curious to see some statistics. I would be willing to bet that the rate of growth of non-religion (not necessarily atheism) is much larger than you think.

[BenRaines]

Mine is a pursuit of good karma. Golden Rule, if you have faith or not, is the way to live.

And to that end I agree to let all believe or not believe as they wish. I offer to share what I believe to others but do not compel anyone to believe as I do nor punish them if they don't. I do not tell them either that it is the foolish traditions of their fathers. Let each believe and practice as they see fit as long as it does not restrict my freedom to do the same.

Ben Raines