Justice Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 There are many contributors of LDS.net that are not members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Some are tolerant and in all sincerity give us the benefit of doubt that we believe what we believe for a reason. Others feel we are deceived, and some even feel moved to show us where they believe we are wrong.Every single member of the LDS Church will tell you that the foundation for our belief in Jesus Christ is the Book of Mormon. We believe we have another written witness of Jesus Christ... another testament. So, if this additional witness is proven wrong then it, and everything else built off of it, will fall.So, here is the challenge. To those who have made comment that the Book of Mormon teaches incorrect doctrine, or that it contradicts Biblical teachings, I want to see the specific words or doctrine that are contradicted. And, not just you, I'll make it very easy for you...People have been looking for a way to disprove the Book of Mormon for almost 200 years now. This should be plenty of time to come up with something. So, use Google, MSN Search or whatever your favorite method is, and present anything that has been written or discovered that proves the Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible.State your contradiction briefly, showing the contradicting scriptures from both the Bible and Book of Mormon, and state only one at a time.If it has been done in 200 years, it will be easy to find and post here.The downside to participating for you is that if there isn't anything found in 200 years that contradicts the Bible, then you have a lot to think about. Quote
skalenfehl Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 While this invites anti-mormon posts, isn't there something in the terms & conditions about copying and pasting anti-material from other sites? I'd advise caution. I am interested and curious about replies, though by now I'm quite sure I've heard it all. Quote
Justice Posted June 15, 2009 Author Report Posted June 15, 2009 My intention is to see the cut and pasted text from the Bible and the Book of Mormon that contradict.Someone can paraphrase the description of the discrepency they have seen somewhere else, or I thought it OK to copy the text if they saw it somewhere else. I'm not interested in a debate of theology or doctrine unless it is copied and pasted from the Book of Mormon and Bible.If their comments do show a discrepency in Book of Mormon text verse Bible text I will not view that as "anti stuff," but a legitimate discrepency that we have to find an answer for.If "anti stuff" is posted here without Book of Mormon and Bible texts I will view that as a failure to find a discrepency.I want to see what others believe are contradictions. Quote
prisonchaplain Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 I'm not sure this counts, but FWIW, over a year ago I posted a string comparing the Articles of Faith with the Statement of Fundamental Truths, from my church. Since I believe the latter is strongly based in the Bible, I'd simply point out that there was very little overlapping between the two statements. It's amazing how much we agree about ethical and godly behavior, how it is we are to please Jesus, and even who would should vote for, but on these doctrinal matters there is such variance. Of course, I'm not offering a verse by verse, side by side comparison, and I certainly have not/am not attempting to prove the BoM is wrong. But, there is little doubt but that the Triple has led to a vastly different set of foundational doctrines for your church vs. Protestant and Catholic Christianity. BTW--LOL--I thought the OP would simply ask me to read the BoM. :-) Quote
pam Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 PC I simply ask you to read the Book of Mormon. Quote
prisonchaplain Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 Primary sources and all that, right Pam? Quote
BenRaines Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 I believe PC has read the Book of Mormon, at least I know he was reading it at one time Ben Raines Quote
pam Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 He thought he was being asked to read it. I didn't want to disappoint him in anyway by not asking him to. Quote
Traveler Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 (edited) I'm not sure this counts, but FWIW, over a year ago I posted a string comparing the Articles of Faith with the Statement of Fundamental Truths, from my church. Since I believe the latter is strongly based in the Bible, I'd simply point out that there was very little overlapping between the two statements. It's amazing how much we agree about ethical and godly behavior, how it is we are to please Jesus, and even who would should vote for, but on these doctrinal matters there is such variance.Of course, I'm not offering a verse by verse, side by side comparison, and I certainly have not/am not attempting to prove the BoM is wrong. But, there is little doubt but that the Triple has led to a vastly different set of foundational doctrines for your church vs. Protestant and Catholic Christianity.BTW--LOL--I thought the OP would simply ask me to read the BoM. :-) I really like having the opportunity of reading your post and your insights to LDS doctrines. I have studied the differences and I believe the beginning of divergences in doctrine begins with our views of the fall. Because the fall defines and connects to so many other doctrines - the logic we try to use to explain things to each other does not transfer well. I have tried to explain that with our understanding of the fall that the trinity, Jesus as the mediator, the atonement and understanding of faith and works can look at the very same things and have difficulty finding common ground.But I do feel we are much more alike than what it appears that we are.The Traveler Edited June 15, 2009 by Traveler Quote
YellowLight Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 Ok, here is my take on this. There is absolutely no possible way to “prove” that the Book of Mormon is not true. I believe this to be true in regard to the Bible, Koran, Kojiki, and every other holy book you can find of every religion. If it were so, no one would belong and the religion would self destruct. Even with strong evidence against these books, there will always be people who will say, “there is a possibility and I have seen miracles, so it must be true.” So, do I think that one can prove away any religion…no. But I do think that we should always examine and re-examine the evidence for and against in order to make an objective opinion. It seems that we are unable to do this with our religion of choice, but are able to pick away at EVERY other religion out there. It is simply the cognitive dissonance that keeps us from really looking at ourselves from the outside in. That is why I am here…not to pick a fight as an ex-LDS member, but because I am still looking at everything on both sides. Quote
Hemidakota Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 There are many contributors of LDS.net that are not members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Some are tolerant and in all sincerity give us the benefit of doubt that we believe what we believe for a reason. Others feel we are deceived, and some even feel moved to show us where they believe we are wrong.Every single member of the LDS Church will tell you that the foundation for our belief in Jesus Christ is the Book of Mormon. We believe we have another written witness of Jesus Christ... another testament. So, if this additional witness is proven wrong then it, and everything else built off of it, will fall.So, here is the challenge. To those who have made comment that the Book of Mormon teaches incorrect doctrine, or that it contradicts Biblical teachings, I want to see the specific words or doctrine that are contradicted. And, not just you, I'll make it very easy for you...People have been looking for a way to disprove the Book of Mormon for almost 200 years now. This should be plenty of time to come up with something. So, use Google, MSN Search or whatever your favorite method is, and present anything that has been written or discovered that proves the Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible.State your contradiction briefly, showing the contradicting scriptures from both the Bible and Book of Mormon, and state only one at a time.If it has been done in 200 years, it will be easy to find and post here.The downside to participating for you is that if there isn't anything found in 200 years that contradicts the Bible, then you have a lot to think about.I cannot imagine what will occur or their thought process will be, when they oppose TRUTH, they will find in the next life when they are left-hand of GOD... Quote
martybess Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 There are many contributors of LDS.net that are not members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Some are tolerant and in all sincerity give us the benefit of doubt that we believe what we believe for a reason. Others feel we are deceived, and some even feel moved to show us where they believe we are wrong.Every single member of the LDS Church will tell you that the foundation for our belief in Jesus Christ is the Book of Mormon. We believe we have another written witness of Jesus Christ... another testament. So, if this additional witness is proven wrong then it, and everything else built off of it, will fall.So, here is the challenge. To those who have made comment that the Book of Mormon teaches incorrect doctrine, or that it contradicts Biblical teachings, I want to see the specific words or doctrine that are contradicted. And, not just you, I'll make it very easy for you...People have been looking for a way to disprove the Book of Mormon for almost 200 years now. This should be plenty of time to come up with something. So, use Google, MSN Search or whatever your favorite method is, and present anything that has been written or discovered that proves the Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible.State your contradiction briefly, showing the contradicting scriptures from both the Bible and Book of Mormon, and state only one at a time.If it has been done in 200 years, it will be easy to find and post here.The downside to participating for you is that if there isn't anything found in 200 years that contradicts the Bible, then you have a lot to think about.You do realize Justice that if they anti's show up for your challenge this thread could get long! LOL Is your intention to convert them when proven wrong? Can there be any other good reason to cause yourself pain. LOL Quote
dnc76v22 Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 You do realize Justice that if they anti's show up for your challenge this thread could get long! LOL Is your intention to convert them when proven wrong? Can there be any other good reason to cause yourself pain. LOLI suppose there is a danger of Quote
mountthepavement Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 I cannot imagine what will occur or their thought process will be, when they oppose TRUTH, they will find in the next life when they are left-hand of GOD...I hope the left hand of god isn't used for what people used it for in the olden days, i.e., why people made it customary to shake with the right hand. Quote
Justice Posted June 15, 2009 Author Report Posted June 15, 2009 I've been involved in so many discussions over the years where "he said she said" seems the norm. I'd like to see a discussion controlled to only what's in the Book of Mormon, and not what anyone said. I thought it would be refreshing to actually SEE the Book of Mormon verse that is in question with an explanation using Biblical text that they believe contradicts. If, for no other reason, to get the person who disagrees to actually read the verse they disagree with. And, yes, you're right PC. That means you will at least have to read one verse to know it contradicts. :) Quote
prisonchaplain Posted June 15, 2009 Report Posted June 15, 2009 Traveler says that a key area of difference is our views of the Fall. I might add to that God's nature, human nature, and premortal existence. But most of these teachings are not found in the BoM, are they? That's why I wonder it's the foundation of LDS theology, rather than, say the D&C? Quote
Justice Posted June 16, 2009 Author Report Posted June 16, 2009 The Fall is disscussed at length in the Book of Mormon. All of the topics you mentioned are discussed in the Book of Mormon. I'd like to focus on one topic at a time. Would you like me to start a thread with some scriptures from the Book of Mormon about the Fall? Quote
prisonchaplain Posted June 16, 2009 Report Posted June 16, 2009 Justice--you can either do so as a string, or on a "What I believe" blog. If you choose the latter, please send me a PM with link or directions. If you start a string I should catch it--but sometimes new strings can get buried. I'd appreciate the BoM and the Fall lesson, though. Quote
TheAngelPalmoni Posted June 16, 2009 Report Posted June 16, 2009 (edited) Hmmm... This is my first post from my iPod touch. It's pretty amazing the feeling of unlimited info in the palm of your hand. I bought it for study use, all the scriptures, books, websites I could ever want to read. The book of Mormon is not going anywhere and soon the entire Christian world will come into the church because of shifting sands and the solid truth that is here. The dragon will make up many lies but the world will not believe them. Fun times ahead. Angel Palmoni web.me.com/angelpalmoni Edited June 16, 2009 by TheAngelPalmoni Forgot Quote
Justice Posted June 16, 2009 Author Report Posted June 16, 2009 OK, PC, coming up when I get home from work. Quote
martybess Posted June 16, 2009 Report Posted June 16, 2009 OK, PC, coming up when I get home from work.This is going to be interesting! If you do a blog in order to control comments please post the link or pm me so I can follow!!!! Quote
beefche Posted June 16, 2009 Report Posted June 16, 2009 Justice, will you post a link here? Otherwise I think you'll be PMing a lot of people! Quote
Justice Posted June 16, 2009 Author Report Posted June 16, 2009 I'll just start a new thread. But, I believe the most common reason that discussions fail is because too much is discussed at once. So, I'll try to discuss only a few things at a time. New thread coming... Quote
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