Dealing with betrayal

[taralynnsing]

I haven't joined a chat group for more than ten years. I joined this morning because I want to read and write about my struggle with others who are going through or have gone through the same thing. I was married in 1992 in the Denver temple to a returned missionary. I have five children aged 1-11. In January I found out that my husband has been having an affair for about two years. I asked him to move out and we've been living seperately since then.

I have lots of love and support around me, but a concerning number of people really wish I would just divorce him. I would if I could! My prayers have not been answered that way. I have no problem forgiving him, but what he is doing now is just as hurtful as the affair. He is obsessed about the cleanliness of the house and spends little time focusing on the children when he's visiting because he cannot overlook any messes. He believes that I have wronged him, hurt him, rejected him, and he is waiting for me to convince him that things can be better. He is not ready to move back in because he can't stand the messes and he doesn't think we can get along. I am ready to get along and clean like crazy and forgive him and go on dates and cultivate lost trust and love. But he just can't bring himself to have faith in him, me, or us. He will not initiate the needed church disciplinary council. He is on bad terms with a member of the stake presidency (along with many other ward members who are innocent and wonderful).

I am trying to be patient and have faith in the promptings I've been given over and over to stay with him while dealing with single parenthood, some health problems, a special needs baby, and the regular insults added to injuries coming from my husband. I feel like I know what to do and that I can do it. Knowing what to do is not my problem. Just making it from day to day is my problem. Putting up with his coldness and disdain, giving good for evil over and over again, telling him the hard truth from time to time and enduring his anger and defensiveness--that's what I'm struggling with. I think I would benefit from hearing someone else's story. I need girl power. I guess comments and stories from guys is OK too.

[skippy740]

I'm going to ask a clarifying question: How obsessed is he about the cleanliness of the house?

Is it toys on the floor? That usually gets me to "hide out in my mancave" (ie. computer desk) because I couldn't walk in the house with so much clutter.

Or does your house look like it belongs on an episode of Hoarders?

Or does he have such a high level of OCD that every spec of dust and lack of vacuuming cause him issues?

Are his expectations reasonable given the workload of 5 young children?

Everyone's definition of cleanliness can be different, so I'm just curious how demanding he is. (Not that being 'demanding' is a good thing.)

***

I know I'm completely avoiding the topic of the affair & divorce considerations... but if you're more worried about getting through the day-to-day, then starting with the cleanliness and organization of your home might be a good beginning place. Your mind will be clearer and you'll feel a better spirit there - regardless of whether he is there or not.

[jmpcs]

I am probably one of the very few people in the church who understand completely what you are going through. My husband and I were married in December of 1991 and have five children, ages 7 to 16. Three years ago I found out he had become emotionally involved with some different women over the years. The first one was the Relief Society President and my closest friend at the time. There was some physical action as well, but with each person that action grew to be more. The next two women were non-member co-workers. Each of these led to oral sex. When I found out I was devastated. He loves the gospel...was constantly reading and studying the scriptures and other church resources. I thought he was strong in the gospel and I was the weak one. I always relied on him spiritually. We were able to work through it and I thought we were in a good place, but then last fall things started to deteriorate again and I discovered in December that he had "fallen in love" with someone new. I made him leave after Christmas and after about six weeks he wanted to come back. The woman had showed her true colors and was very manipulative and controlling. She didn't like him seeing his kids and she didn't want him anywhere near me. She claimed to be pregnant so he would stay with her. I was so broken...could hardly even get out of bed. I had to ask my sister to fly across the country to be with me and help me take care of my children. My kids didn't know all the details...just that dad had left and was trying to work some things out. We prayed and fasted constantly that he would come home. Looking back, I'm not sure why. I often think that maybe that was my chance to be free. I, too, have felt prompted to stay with him, even though at times every bone in my body screams RUN. I know that nothing is impossible to overcome, but it is so very difficult. I don't really have a problem trusting him because I don't want to be constantly checking up on him. I have better things to do honestly. My problem right now is my lack of respect for him. I crave leadership in our home, but he is so weak right now. I think the common thread of these situations is that they usually blame us. They have to in order to justify what they have done. On top of all that, we are in the process of moving. Again, I hear that voice in my head saying, why would you uproot your kids to go with this man?! It certainly isn't because of some overwhelming love for him. I have to pray each day to be able to love him just for today, then I do the same thing the next day. Honestly, I don't know why I'm still here. I am just really trying to follow the Spirit and for some reason this is where I'm supposed to be now. I really wish this weren't so taboo in the church. I could use some support other than over the computer. My husband went through a disciplinary court three years ago and received several months probation. This time I have no doubt he will be excommunicated, but he won't talk to the bishop. It is frustrating because I have to let him do things in his own time. Right now he is here and wanting to be a father and husband, but its like he doesn't really know how. He never had the example at home growing up and he is just really lost. He is searching for answers outside of the gospel and he keeps coming up feeling empty. I feel really sorry for him, but I also know that he has a strong side. I saw that the first few years of marriage. I could go on and on...just know that you are not alone. I just finished a really good book (although somewhat depressing since their struggle went on for 38 years) by a man who had been a bishop who was excommunicated called The Worth of Every Soul. My husband had a book written by the same author called Putting on the Armor of God which helped me through the weeks my husband was gone. I was shocked a few months ago to find out that this same man...Stephen Cramer (real name Gerald Curtis) had done the same thing my husband did...and came back. Look for this book. It may help. Good luck.

[yjacket]

I'm in a posting mood (working from home . . . waiting for my experiments to finish running . . . .). I'm a guy so I apologize in advance for any stupidness :-).

This struck me as a little odd " I have no problem forgiving him, but what he is doing now is just as hurtful as the affair."

While I am a stanch proponent of making marriages work, not much gets me riled up more than, woman abusers and womanizers. I have very, very little sympathy for either. Yes we all make mistakes, but adultery is 2nd only to murder in sin. A person doesn't just go and kill someone and then say "sorry, my bad . . . ". It takes years, decades or even a whole lifetime for one to pay the consequences for murder. Adultery is one of those things you just don't do and should take years to pay consequences. The more prolonged and premeditated the adultery, the harder the consequences.

So I find the above quote odd. How is the griping over a clean house, not spending time with kids, him believing you've wronged him (all things that can and do occur in marriages at one time or another) worse--edited--as bad as adultery (which does not)?

If anything this man should be groveling and begging to get back in your good graces. And is that what hurts, that he isn't?

I have no answers, but several questions.

Did he intend to commit adultery to sabotage his marriage b/c he lacked the courage to fix whatever was wrong with his marriage?

Is he trying to get you to divorce him, or does he believe that he can act with impunity and that it doesn't matter?

I will never understand how a husband/father can commit adultery with all that they stand to lose. How could I look at my son knowing that I committed the ultimate betrayal . . .

I hope you are able to come out of this better, no one should go through this type of betrayal.

Or maybe I'm old-school and just believe a commitment is a commitment and to be a man is to honor that commitment.

[taralynnsing]

Thanks for all the responses. I feel a little overwhelmed about responding to every detail of all of them right now. But I'm glad I got this thread started because I just found out he is physically active again with his mistress and is also working on a new one at the same time. He has been seen kissing in public (a restaurant). The kids and I all did a whole bunch of stuff for him for father's day--I repainted a room because he didn't like the color. I made him dinner and my daughter made him desert. He was just acting so weird about everything. Now I know why.

And I REALLY want to divorce him now. I have to figure out if that is still not approved in my prayers. I have prayed already but I'm too emotional to get a clear answer right now. If I have to stay with him it's about to get a lot harder than it already was.

It's not really significant now, but I gotta answer the house question. It's number three: OCD. One time he came over and had a melt down because there were some crumbs on the couch (from one muffin eaten by a 3-year-old). I clean every day and the kids all have jobs and I have a cleaning professional coming twice a week and it still isn't good enough. His mom has 8 children and I know that her house wasn't as clean as he is wanting our house to be--he didn't pick up after himself as a kid the way he thinks our kids should. The house he's living in now isn't kept as clean as he wants our house. Now that I know that he's juggling a wife, five kids, and two girlfriends while still going to church and making nice with the Bishop, it's clear that he is very disturbed in just about every way.

I know divorce is not easy and is sometimes worse than the bad marriage. I admit that the reason I yearn for divorce is to not have to deal with his garbage any more and I know that's not true because of the children. I also want to divorce because I want a good marriage to a good person. Maybe that's naieve to wish for at this point. The other thing that would be wonderful about being divorced is that I won't have to try to please him anymore and live up to his expectations that can never be met. I also want it because I want to show him that I am worth something and I will not be waiting here while he dates various women around town in a public manner. I can make it on my own. I want to take this control so badly, to claim this freedom, but I know that my understanding and perspective are irrelevant if it is not God's will. He can see the end and knows what would be best. Oh, how I hope I don't have to keep my life subject to his evil ways year after year.

When we first got married I told him I would forgive him one time for cheating on me and leave him on the second. I am three times past my promise at this point.

[Jennarator]

Sorry, this must be so hard for you! Many on this site know how it feels to be cheated on. (me included.)

Talk to your bishop. I know he might have been decived by your husband "making nice" to him, but I would think the spirit will tell him that you are telling the truth. The bishop can get you some counsleing, and if your husband won't join you, go alone.

It's not too late for help, if he really wants to change he can. The hard part is "if" he wants it. Either way counseling can help you look at the big picture and your faith and prayers will help you see what you need to do.

Good luck! I will pray for you, as well.

[yjacket]

I don't even think the words I'm sorry can bring anything.

Man, if I ever did anything remotely close, my dad would beat the living tar out of me (he put me against the wall once for disrespecting mom, but besides spankings no physical violence). In my family, I'd be disowned and taken behind the woodshed. My parents would take my wife and kids in as their own and leave me out--just the way it is.

As a missionary, I saw so much of junk like this in Argentina. Truly a very, very sad situation. Back then one of the scriptures that gave much comfort was D&C 121. Hopefully, it will provide comfort, hope, and the answers you're looking for in these difficult times.

[yjacket]

I would also add that whatever your decision, one thing is certain; consequences must be had. One can not be allowed to make such a mockery of marriage vows; otherwise the very meaning of marriage (commitment to one another) has no meaning.

[Jennarator]

I would also add that whatever your decision, one thing is certain; consequences must be had. One can not be allowed to make such a mockery of marriage vows; otherwise the very meaning of marriage (commitment to one another) has no meaning.

Thank goodness for repentance! Remember, we are also taught to forgive.

I realize you can forgive and still get out of the situation and that forgivness doesn't mean you have to stay in a bad place.

Just keep in mind divorce is not always the right answer, and only the person that is in the situation that can make that choice. For her it might be to stay. :)

[Vort]

I think we would do well to keep our words sweet and our judgments merciful and tentative. We do not know the entire situation, nor is it our place to condemn.

Some months back, a friend confided to me that he was leaving his wife. He did not give me detailed specifics (nor would I have wanted such), but he gave me a general outline of how his and his children's lives had been over the past decade. He also told me (without any prompting from me) that he has been counseled by his bishop and stake president that, while they could never suggest divorce, they personally found plenty of justification for his action. A few days later, he took his kids and left.

His wife immediately announced her husband's actions and requested support. The support came, much of it in the form of vilification of the husband. (In contrast, the husband's only announcement was, "Many of you have heard that <wife> and I are having some problems. I would ask that you give us the privacy and space to figure this out and reserve your judgment." No public detailing of any part of the abuse he felt he had suffered.)

Among our group of friends and acquaintances, of course, this news spread fast. One lady suggested by email everyone support the beleaguered wife against the unjust actions of her husband. My wife felt she should respond to this, so sent a rather neutral email saying simply, "We don't know the specifics of this, and <husband> is our friend, too, so I think it would be better to support our friends without choosing sides." The lady who sent the initial email apparently took great offense at this, because shortly afterward, she made a "private" comment to my wife, phrased as a sincere comment for self-betterment, that was extremely cruel (and, by the way, untrue) and clearly designed to cause offense. She and her husband have long been friends of ours; I admit that, to this day, many months later, I can still hardly look at her without feeling anger and resentment for her passive aggressive nastiness and cruelty toward my wife, who had done her no harm and had only tried to help the situation by offering some general advice.

This forum is different, I realize. Most of us don't really know each other except as silly names on a discussion list. But we are all real people with real issues. We should remember that the issues brought up here are, for the most part, real life problems involving real live people and not Sunday School discussion examples. We would also do well to keep in mind that we don't have all the facts at hand. We should keep our words sweet, lest we find them bitter when forced to eat them.

[applepansy]

I think its possible to discuss and support without condemnation. I do agree with Vort though. Sometimes these threads get really one-sided.

[Jennarator]

I appoligize, I didn't mean anything negitive! For me the right choice was to divorce and cetianly there is a time and palce for it. It was a very hard choice and took many years of living in a horrible situation before I finally did it.

I am just saying that it is up to the OP to make that choice and either way she will be able to make that choice with help from her bishop and counsling. I just didn't want her to thing divorce was the only choice.

Edited June 20, 2011 by Jennarator

[Vort]

For the record, mine was a general comment, not targeted at anyone in particular.

[MorningStar]

I think we would do well to keep our words sweet and our judgments merciful and tentative. We do not know the entire situation, nor is it our place to condemn.

Some months back, a friend confided to me that he was leaving his wife. He did not give me detailed specifics (nor would I have wanted such), but he gave me a general outline of how his and his children's lives had been over the past decade. He also told me (without any prompting from me) that he has been counseled by his bishop and stake president that, while they could never suggest divorce, they personally found plenty of justification for his action. A few days later, he took his kids and left.

His wife immediately announced her husband's actions and requested support. The support came, much of it in the form of vilification of the husband. (In contrast, the husband's only announcement was, "Many of you have heard that <wife> and I are having some problems. I would ask that you give us the privacy and space to figure this out and reserve your judgment." No public detailing of any part of the abuse he felt he had suffered.)

Among our group of friends and acquaintances, of course, this news spread fast. One lady suggested by email everyone support the beleaguered wife against the unjust actions of her husband. My wife felt she should respond to this, so sent a rather neutral email saying simply, "We don't know the specifics of this, and <husband> is our friend, too, so I think it would be better to support our friends without choosing sides." The lady who sent the initial email apparently took great offense at this, because shortly afterward, she made a "private" comment to my wife, phrased as a sincere comment for self-betterment, that was extremely cruel (and, by the way, untrue) and clearly designed to cause offense. She and her husband have long been friends of ours; I admit that, to this day, many months later, I can still hardly look at her without feeling anger and resentment for her passive aggressive nastiness and cruelty toward my wife, who had done her no harm and had only tried to help the situation by offering some general advice.

This forum is different, I realize. Most of us don't really know each other except as silly names on a discussion list. But we are all real people with real issues. We should remember that the issues brought up here are, for the most part, real life problems involving real live people and not Sunday School discussion examples. We would also do well to keep in mind that we don't have all the facts at hand. We should keep our words sweet, lest we find them bitter when forced to eat them.

I also offended someone in my ward by not telling her what she wanted to hear. She gave me the silent treatment for 3 months. It was the most relaxing 3 months of my life. It was followed by an "apology" (not a real apology). It sounded more like she wanted me to know for sure that she was giving me the silent treatment.

[skippy740]

Thanks for all the responses. I feel a little overwhelmed about responding to every detail of all of them right now. But I'm glad I got this thread started because I just found out he is physically active again with his mistress and is also working on a new one at the same time. He has been seen kissing in public (a restaurant). The kids and I all did a whole bunch of stuff for him for father's day--I repainted a room because he didn't like the color. I made him dinner and my daughter made him desert. He was just acting so weird about everything. Now I know why.

And I REALLY want to divorce him now. I have to figure out if that is still not approved in my prayers. I have prayed already but I'm too emotional to get a clear answer right now. If I have to stay with him it's about to get a lot harder than it already was.

He is so far off the path of being an honorable husband and father (based solely on this post) that divorce is a worthy consideration.

It's not really significant now, but I gotta answer the house question. It's number three: OCD. One time he came over and had a melt down because there were some crumbs on the couch (from one muffin eaten by a 3-year-old). I clean every day and the kids all have jobs and I have a cleaning professional coming twice a week and it still isn't good enough. His mom has 8 children and I know that her house wasn't as clean as he is wanting our house to be--he didn't pick up after himself as a kid the way he thinks our kids should. The house he's living in now isn't kept as clean as he wants our house. Now that I know that he's juggling a wife, five kids, and two girlfriends while still going to church and making nice with the Bishop, it's clear that he is very disturbed in just about every way.

You're right - it doesn't matter now. But you can see how when someone isn't living their life according to the gospel, they show irrational irritation over certain things rather easily. (I know because I was like this at certain times in my own life.)

I know divorce is not easy and is sometimes worse than the bad marriage. I admit that the reason I yearn for divorce is to not have to deal with his garbage any more and I know that's not true because of the children. I also want to divorce because I want a good marriage to a good person. Maybe that's naieve to wish for at this point. The other thing that would be wonderful about being divorced is that I won't have to try to please him anymore and live up to his expectations that can never be met. I also want it because I want to show him that I am worth something and I will not be waiting here while he dates various women around town in a public manner. I can make it on my own. I want to take this control so badly, to claim this freedom, but I know that my understanding and perspective are irrelevant if it is not God's will. He can see the end and knows what would be best. Oh, how I hope I don't have to keep my life subject to his evil ways year after year.

He has publicly humiliated you. (Again, based solely on the post you wrote.)

When we first got married I told him I would forgive him one time for cheating on me and leave him on the second. I am three times past my promise at this point.

Uh... I'm not sure what to say about that? I think for any future relationships, I would keep your "forgiveness threshold" to yourself. You didn't mean to, but you may have (inadvertantly) given him permission to cheat?

Some people will skate as close to the edge that they are given. Covenant-honoring men will strive to keep as far away from at edge as they can. Those who skate the edge, need a clearly defined "edge".

Your posting sounds much more resolute and you're begining to feel confidence and inner strength. Continue to pray for strength, wisdom and guidance. Seek counsel from your Bishop and personal counseling.

Your husband may not be receptive at all to counseling, but you may want to offer it. If there's going to be a reconciliation, you'll want to reconcile under the guidance of a counselor.

[MorningStar]

I haven't joined a chat group for more than ten years. I joined this morning because I want to read and write about my struggle with others who are going through or have gone through the same thing. I was married in 1992 in the Denver temple to a returned missionary. I have five children aged 1-11. In January I found out that my husband has been having an affair for about two years. I asked him to move out and we've been living seperately since then.

I have lots of love and support around me, but a concerning number of people really wish I would just divorce him. I would if I could! My prayers have not been answered that way. I have no problem forgiving him, but what he is doing now is just as hurtful as the affair. He is obsessed about the cleanliness of the house and spends little time focusing on the children when he's visiting because he cannot overlook any messes. He believes that I have wronged him, hurt him, rejected him, and he is waiting for me to convince him that things can be better. He is not ready to move back in because he can't stand the messes and he doesn't think we can get along. I am ready to get along and clean like crazy and forgive him and go on dates and cultivate lost trust and love. But he just can't bring himself to have faith in him, me, or us. He will not initiate the needed church disciplinary council. He is on bad terms with a member of the stake presidency (along with many other ward members who are innocent and wonderful).

I am trying to be patient and have faith in the promptings I've been given over and over to stay with him while dealing with single parenthood, some health problems, a special needs baby, and the regular insults added to injuries coming from my husband. I feel like I know what to do and that I can do it. Knowing what to do is not my problem. Just making it from day to day is my problem. Putting up with his coldness and disdain, giving good for evil over and over again, telling him the hard truth from time to time and enduring his anger and defensiveness--that's what I'm struggling with. I think I would benefit from hearing someone else's story. I need girl power. I guess comments and stories from guys is OK too.

I'm sorry to hear you're going through such a hard trial. I'll keep you in my prayers. Good for you for following the prompting to stay when it might be easier to leave.

[Vort]

The strongest people I know are all women.

That is sad. You ought perhaps to get to know more men, or maybe just a different class of men.

Just look at the stats of who comes to church - it's mostly women who come to church.

Yet somehow, we find enough Priesthood holders to staff our leadership positions and still have men left over to serve elsewhere. Methinks you underestimate men.

For the most part, it seems like it is women who carry the weight of the world on their shoulders because we don't walk away when everyone else does.

When you define "everyone else" as "men", then your statement is a tautology. I could equally well claim, "Men don't run away screaming when everyone else does."

You might reconsider how you view men.

[taralynnsing]

Mostly I have benefited from the comments to my situation but I have wondered why a few comments have been a little insensitive. I am going through hell and have a lot of pain to deal with while trying to keep life normal and happy for my children. I think maybe if someone has an opinion critical of me in some way they could share it somewhere else. I certainly don't need to come here and read some statement that requires me to defend my feelings or thoughts. My purpose for posting is to find others who have shared some of what I'm going through so I don't feel so alone.

I have talked to my Bishop lots--he's my neighbor and he's on the case, as is every one else in my ward, always asking how I'm doing and how they can help. I have so much support and comfort. I have the gospel and the temple and the Holy Ghost to comfort me. The only thing I don't have is my best friend, lover, and companion of eighteen years. I feel confident and faithful and determined, but I'm also mourning that loss.

[Jennarator]

Mostly I have benefited from the comments to my situation but I have wondered why a few comments have been a little insensitive. I am going through hell and have a lot of pain to deal with while trying to keep life normal and happy for my children. I think maybe if someone has an opinion critical of me in some way they could share it somewhere else. I certainly don't need to come here and read some statement that requires me to defend my feelings or thoughts. My purpose for posting is to find others who have shared some of what I'm going through so I don't feel so alone.

I have talked to my Bishop lots--he's my neighbor and he's on the case, as is every one else in my ward, always asking how I'm doing and how they can help. I have so much support and comfort. I have the gospel and the temple and the Holy Ghost to comfort me. The only thing I don't have is my best friend, lover, and companion of eighteen years. I feel confident and faithful and determined, but I'm also mourning that loss.

I agee it's is mourning. Some people dont realizing it's like death, but not all at the same time. Good luck!

[Vort]

do you condemn me for "eating with publicans and sinners"?

No. I suggest that if all of the best people you know are women, you need to get to know a different class of men than you apparently do.

Sorry vort, I am a member of the church too, a convert - the only member in my fam - but I am a member... I did not mean to insult all the good guys out there.

I don't know that you insulted anyone. If you did, I don't think you insulted me. I'm not sure I qualify as one of "the good guys" in any case.

I have known some truly great men, not perfect, but men I look up to, including my father, my father-in-law, my mission president, and other Priesthood leaders. When I look at them, I see some semblance of my Savior. Apparently, you know no such men. I am sorry for you.

as a guy I'm sure you know more guys and know more about what they go through.

True enough. But I also have been privileged to know some truly great, Christlike women. I would certainly never suppose that all the best people I know are and have been men.

(Pearl of Great Price | JS-Matthew 1:30)

30 And again, because iniquity shall abound, the love of men shall wax cold;

Other scriptures give this as "many" (e.g. Matthew 24:12). I think the word "men" in this passage refers to the sex-neutral "mankind", and not specifically to the male of the species.

the last GC was filled with talks about men avoiding marriage…

And at least one comment that the young women, too, should quit wasting their time and their lives and commit to a good man.

it appears "good men" are becoming a rare commodity...

Perhaps, though probably no moreso than "good women".

yes, there are the few women who hit the jackpot, and then there are others of us who marry someone who is imperfect...

Even those women who "hit the jackpot" married imperfect men. Interestingly, all the married men I know foolishly married imperfect women. What were they thinking?

my mom works in social services… guess who it is that almost always takes the kids after a divorce – why is that?

Perhaps because the courts through the past decades have consistently refused to acknowledge the father as anything more than an ATM?

first step in AA... first step in dealing with anything... admit the problem... the role of nurturing has been given to women, which means there are a lot of men out there who do not understand how to nurture, how to take care of those around them in this capacity, do not understand how to bond to others like women do - it's in the fam proclamation what women are blessed with, and what men are blessed with, you can read it for yourself...

Indeed, I have read the Proclamation on the Family numerous times. I recall nowhere that it said that men do not understand how to nurture, to take care of those around them in a nurturing capacity, or to bond with others like women do.

I'm not trying to rag on you. Just pointing out that your disappointing experiences with men don't generalize to everyone else. Men are not lesser beings of inferior spirituality, whatever you may have heard to the contrary.

[Guest mirancs8]

He believes that I have wronged him, hurt him, rejected him, and he is waiting for me to convince him that things can be better. He is not ready to move back in because he can't stand the messes and he doesn't think we can get along.

Ah yes the "you did me wrong" phase. Lived through it and let me tell you as time passes it will look more nuts to you with each day. My ex was screwing around and he some how successfully made me feel like I was to blame. It's not your fault and don't you let him talk to you that way. You know what, if he doesn't like coming into your house then with a stern voice tell him to stay out! Let him take the kids from the front door. Don't let him push you around like that and treat you like you don't live up to some false standard he seems to compare you to.

Remember HE DID YOU WRONG and he obviously isn't doing what he should be to make things right. Instead he's acting like a child. You be the bigger person and you dictate your life. He's only trying to mess with your head because he knows you well enough to do that. Don't allow it.

You can't change him... you can only change yourself!!

Hang in there.

[taralynnsing]

Amen. You obviously know the territory. He actually mentioned that I haven't lost weight as one of the reasons he's justified in cheating. He himself is not exactly a greek specimen. Would you please share with me how your divorce went and how everything is working with children and visitation, how long you've been divorced and if there are certain stages you've gone through emotionally. How do you feel about being alone?

Some have told me that then you get divorced is when the real misery starts. I don't feel like I have much of a choice but at least I'd like to know what I'm getting into.

[JudoMinja]

Some have told me that then you get divorced is when the real misery starts. I don't feel like I have much of a choice but at least I'd like to know what I'm getting into.

I am divorced, and I am MUCH happier than I was married. Of course, I went through a grieving period. When you "give up" on a marriage, it is the death of a future you had envisioned for yourself. It is going to be sad. It is going to be hard. But whether or not you end up being truly happier as a divorced person or just miserable as a divorced person depends on whether or not your situation truly merited a divorce. If you had a marriage that could have been "fixed", you will probably be miserable as a divorcee. But if your marriage was nothing but destructive, divorce brings a new sense of freedom and relief.

Just based on what you have posted, I would think that divorce would be a good idea for you. I am glad to see you have mentioned praying about it and relying on the answer you get from prayer, even if it seems to go against what you might prefer. Keep doing that. While divorce may seem like the right path to me, I only have the information you provided about your situation. The Lord sees all and knows better than I do. Maybe there is a reason for you to maintain your marriage. Maybe it is still salvagable. I don't know. Stay in tune with the Spirit and rely on His counsel.

Also, no matter how outlandish or horrid your husband's behavior may seem, it might help to try to understand things from his point of view. Really try to get inside his head and make sense of his decisions. If nothing else, it will make it easier for you to forgive him.

[Dove]

Hi,

I empathize and can only try to imagine the pain of what you're dealing with right now.

I'm married and have such a wonderful spouse, who loves me so well; so, I can't pretend to even know what you're going through.

Some ideas have come to my mind about this though. If it helps, great. If not, just know I'm rooting for you.

First off, as has been said, you are not the problem or cause of your husband's infidelity. It has nothing to do with you as much as it does with your husband's own problems and willingness to do this. This is just not your fault.

Secondly, I'm thinking of something of a parable that came to mind. There was a man who was in a flood so bad that the waters forced him to get on his roof to avoid being drowned. Being a spiritual man, he prayed and felt sure that God would rescue him from this flood. Before long a person in a canoe came by and offered that the man on the roof get in~ The man said, "oh no, I"m waiting for the Lord to come down and rescue me." So the man in the canoe left....This happened two more times with a boat and a helicopter. Each time the man said, "no, I'll wait for the Lord to rescue me." Finally the man drowned and his Spirit ended up at the pearly gates, where he saw the Lord. He was very surprised and disappointed that the Lord had not come to rescue him and said, so. "Lord, why didn't you rescue me from the flood?! The Lord responded, "I sent you a canoe, boat and helicopter. What more could I have done for you to be rescued?"

What I"m trying to say is that sometimes, when there are so many indicators given concerning a situation, God will allow us to see it and act for ourselves as to what the best thing is to do.....He'll give us all the tools, but we must use them.

I"m not trying to minimalize what you're going through. You were not the one to break your marital covenants, he was.....several times. He's the one walking away from this, not you. It might relieve you a great deal of your burden to let him clean up his own mess in destroying the marriage you and him have rather than you trying to pick up the pieces he's created. Maybe the only way he will value what he had with you and become a faithful husband, is if he takes accountability for what he did in this. Regardless, this is not your problem. Perhaps what is yours to take care of is your own well being and the well being of your children.

[FunkyTown]

my mom works in social services… guess who it is that almost always takes the kids after a divorce – why is that? Not always the case, but the general trend is for men to run off to their "man cave" and isolate themselves while women deal with taking care of all the issues - this is a societal norm...

first step in AA... first step in dealing with anything... admit the problem... the role of nurturing has been given to women, which means there are a lot of men out there who do not understand how to nurture, how to take care of those around them in this capacity, do not understand how to bond to others like women do - it's in the fam proclamation what women are blessed with, and what men are blessed with, you can read it for yourself...

Changed? I have to bring this up delicately, because I don't feel victimized by your comments and it's clear that you hold very dearly to this particular view.

Let's reverse your words almost exactly and tell me how you feel this portrays women in general:

The role of providing has been given to men, which means there are a lot of women out there who do not know how to work, how to take care of others in this capacity, do not understand how to prioritize and achieve goals as men do. It's in the fam proclamation what men are blessed with, and what women are blessed with. You can read it for yourself.

Now that you've read the exact words, only applying to women in general and you in specific, do you understand why some might find it insulting? I don't personally find it insulting, but I do find it worrying that thoughts such as yours still exist.

Yes, fathers should provide.

Yes, mothers should nurture.

That doesn't diminish or demean the capacity of either sex to serve in those roles. It is thinking like that - Your thinking - That has caused fathers to feel like second class citizens when their families break up. It is thinking like that that has caused women to be paid less for doing the same job as a man.

I think it is dangerous to encourage that thinking.

Edited June 24, 2011 by FunkyTown