What to say to a friend who has issue with an individual mentioned in a conference talk?

[Backroads]

So... hanging out with a friend yesterday, and we get to talking about conference. She mentioned that while she generally loved and appreciated conference, she had trouble with one in particular that told a charming and heartwarming story... about someone who seriously bullied and belittled her and a few other friends all through through childhood until my friend moved away during high school. Her husband thinks she needs to get over it. My husband is actually one of her friends who was bullied, but he has long been over it. My friend logically knows she needs to forgive, but hearing this person practically celebrated during church-wide conference apparently brought up some horrible memories.

What's the best thing to say to her?

[Just_A_Guy]

Frankly, it's hard for me to fully grasp the situation without knowing what the story is or exactly what it praises about the person. A couple of potential responses, depending on circumstances:

1) Isn't it nice to know that since high school, this person has apparently reformed and become the kind of person who would do something worth mentioning in conference?

2) Even if the person hasn't reformed, sometimes jerks do pretty well for themselves in the LDS Church--in the short run. Think of John C. Bennett. Or most of the AP's in my mission. Or Judas Iscariot. Or Vaughn J. Featherstone's former bishop. All we can do is step back, try to protect ourselves and our loved ones from the effects of such toxic personalities, and live the Gospel as the Lord wants us to do.

[Backroads]

I thought about being more specific, but I decided it would be inappropriate to identify the individual.

[Uhura]

Are there situations where you have had to forgive people? One idea might be to say how you did it. For me, I often have to ask Heavenly Father for forgiveness and then give it to the person.

In The Hiding Place book, she says thinks in her mind that she can raise her hand but that is it. She think that she needs Heavenly Father's love because she doesn't have it. I have adapted that in only being able to want to forgive. I haven't read it in a while so know I am not quoting.

But time and patience are the only two things that will really work. Let her vent, be there for her, and pray to know what to say.

[Vort]

So... hanging out with a friend yesterday, and we get to talking about conference. She mentioned that while she generally loved and appreciated conference, she had trouble with one in particular that told a charming and heartwarming story... about someone who seriously bullied and belittled her and a few other friends all through through childhood until my friend moved away during high school. Her husband thinks she needs to get over it. My husband is actually one of her friends who was bullied, but he has long been over it. My friend logically knows she needs to forgive, but hearing this person practically celebrated during church-wide conference apparently brought up some horrible memories.

What's the best thing to say to her?

Probably nothing. Your friend needs to learn to forgive. A hard, hard lesson in many situations, I know, and I can't think of much you can say to help. Just give her space and don't bring it up.

As for the bully she remembers, we can hope that that individual is no longer a bully and has repented in sorrow for his/her ugly actions. But whether s/he has or has not is irrelevant. I can remember apostles using examples during General Conference that are demonstrably untrue. I remember President Monson and others using, just in the last few years, the story of Elder and Sister Marsh falling away from the gospel and apostatizing from the truth of Jesus Christ based on an argument over milk strippings -- which apparently is not the case, probably simply false and at best a vast oversimplification of the actual history.

Doesn't matter. The story is not the point; the POINT is the point. If the apostles were consciously using a false example, that would be uncomfortable, but more likely they heard the story and either didn't or couldn't investigate all the ins and outs of it to check its validity. So the bully is glorified -- so what? Justice is not realized in this sphere. We need to learn to do as the Prophet Joseph Smith advised Parley P. Pratt: "Walk these things under your feet."

I speak as one struggling to implement this counsel, so don't think I'm lecturing. But your friend really does need somehow to get past this.

[guast]

The story is not the point; the POINT is the point. If the apostles were consciously using a false example, that would be uncomfortable, but more likely they heard the story and either didn't or couldn't investigate all the ins and outs of it to check its validity. So the bully is glorified -- so what? Justice is not realized in this sphere. We need to learn to do as the Prophet Joseph Smith advised Parley P. Pratt: "Walk these things under your feet."

I was going to say essentially this but Vort beat me to it. The person isn't being "celebrated" as much as being used as an example to make a point. It's not about the person, the story has nothing to do with the person beyond providing an example of how one person has demonstrated a particular gospel doctrine. Without knowing exactly which talk you are referring to but knowing the general pattern of conference talks my guess is the speaker didn't even reference the person's name. If the point was to celebrate the person, isn't it kind of silly to refer to something a person did but not mention him or her by name??

And as for the issue of that person specifically - to be blunt, your friend needs to let go of it. If we are condemned by wrongs we've done in the past or even those we do now that we try to overcome then we are ALL going to be damned. Not to beat a doctrinal point to death, but if we can't forgive AND forget (that whole "I'll forgive but I'll never forget" isn't forgiveness and that concept is absolute garbage) then we have no place whatsoever asking for forgiveness from anyone else, let alone God, no matter how much we feel we have been wronged. The whole gospel program falls apart if we don't forgive. Carrying around the poison of a grudge in the end only poisons ourselves and can end up destroying us.

And just to be clear, I don't want anyone to misunderstand what I'm saying as to mean that forgiveness, particularly for horrible things, is an instantaneous thing or that we are required be able to have that forgiveness immediately. But I absolutely believe we are expected to be trying to forgive and working towards it and making every effort to acquire that forgiveness.

Edited April 8, 2012 by guast

[Blackmarch]

So... hanging out with a friend yesterday, and we get to talking about conference. She mentioned that while she generally loved and appreciated conference, she had trouble with one in particular that told a charming and heartwarming story... about someone who seriously bullied and belittled her and a few other friends all through through childhood until my friend moved away during high school. Her husband thinks she needs to get over it. My husband is actually one of her friends who was bullied, but he has long been over it. My friend logically knows she needs to forgive, but hearing this person practically celebrated during church-wide conference apparently brought up some horrible memories.

What's the best thing to say to her?

the only thing you can do is forgive and get rid of burden or be vindictive about what had happened and lose the spirit.

People change... And on the offchance that they dont, you can change.

There has been a couple times where ive becone friends to people who were bullies earlier.

[Backroads]

Thanks, y'all. Love this girl dearly (she set me up with my husband) but she does have a tendency to sulk... for years...

[annewandering]

When I was growing up there was a girl on our very small class that was a pure bully. I really hated her. Our class had huge fights with everyone, girls only, lined up on one of two sides in the battles. She was always the leader of the bullies.

When I was older, I was walking at the country fair. She stopped me and was so glad to see me. We talked, and yes I was suspicious, for quite a long time. After that till her death we chatted when we met and were in good friendship. Now I would never have guessed that in grade school or even high school. She had truly changed. Since then I have never doubted a person can change. When she died she was greatly, and sincerely, mourned.

[Backroads]

I had an old boyfriend who for years was bitter against a bully. He finally came across the guy in a ward. The bully chatted him up, old bf being very suspicious. Finally, old bf reminds the guy of their history. The guy admitted he didn't remember bullying him but sincerely apologized. Guy had changed.

Perhaps I'll share that story and annewandering's...

[annewandering]

I had an old boyfriend who for years was bitter against a bully. He finally came across the guy in a ward. The bully chatted him up, old bf being very suspicious. Finally, old bf reminds the guy of their history. The guy admitted he didn't remember bullying him but sincerely apologized. Guy had changed.

Perhaps I'll share that story and annewandering's...

any time!

[slamjet]

Remember Lot's Wife by Elder Holland (text version, video version) is one of my favorite talks on forgiveness. Maybe because he comes at it from both ends of the spectrum.

[applepansy]

Remember Lot's Wife by Elder Holland (text version, video version) is one of my favorite talks on forgiveness. Maybe because he comes at it from both ends of the spectrum.

Thank you. I hadn't heard this talk. Its very very good. Elder Holland has a wonderful way of removing all the fluff and pretty words about all subjects and make what we need to do crystal clear.

[ruthiechan]

I had an old boyfriend who for years was bitter against a bully. He finally came across the guy in a ward. The bully chatted him up, old bf being very suspicious. Finally, old bf reminds the guy of their history. The guy admitted he didn't remember bullying him but sincerely apologized. Guy had changed.

Perhaps I'll share that story and annewandering's...

Change happens. This is why we shouldn't gossip because airing out other people's dirty laundry makes it harder for change to happen.

It sounds to me that this girl might benefit from some counseling. It brought up old memories and it sounds like she may not have worked through it all yet.

[NeuroTypical]

"Love thy neighbor" can be difficult sometimes. It means that you wish people the best, and sincerely hope that they have moved forward with their lives and no longer are off doing dumb stuff that makes folks miserable. When you love thy neighbor, you rejoice at indications that someone is better or more than they used to be. "They used him in a conference talk? How cool is that! I knew him back before he was someone you'd use in conference. Glad he didn't make a life out of that garbage." It's not easy, but it can be done.

Another way to look at it - if you can't for the life of you imagine sharing the celestial kingdom with someone, then you won't need to worry about it - because you won't be there. Lack of forgiveness is a greater sin than whatever you're not forgiving someone for.