Am I breaking church rules

[paw722]

My husband chews and drinks beer. On occassion when I am in town he calls and asks me to purchase these items for him. I was just wondering if purchasing these items for my husband is breaking any rules. PS....Don't tell me to have him buy it.

[Wingnut]

PS....Don't tell me to have him buy it.

That's exactly what I was going to say.

You're not breaking "church rules" by simply purchasing these items, but you're enabling him to do so, and you're enabling unhealthy habits. If he wants it, he can buy it himself.

[paw722]

He is not a member of the church and he usually purchases it but on occasion he asks me to. So I was just wondering if I was breaking any rules. Granted I could tell him no you do it BUT I believe in having peace in my home and this battle is not one worth fighting and YES I know it is enabling him to keep up unhealthy habits but whether I buy it or he makes an extra trip to town to buy it at this point he is not even thinking about stopping. UGH

[paw722]

I left the church at 16 and I have been back in the church now for almost 1 year...The church was out of my life for 27 years and I have been married to my husband for 25 of those years. He has been very supportive of me attending church. He has do desire to attend.

[mnn727]

No, you are not breaking any rules and since he is a non-member he is not either. (although 'chewing' is disgusting to me - tried it once in high school - YUCK!)

[applepansy]

He is not a member of the church and he usually purchases it but on occasion he asks me to. So I was just wondering if I was breaking any rules. Granted I could tell him no you do it BUT I believe in having peace in my home and this battle is not one worth fighting and YES I know it is enabling him to keep up unhealthy habits but whether I buy it or he makes an extra trip to town to buy it at this point he is not even thinking about stopping. UGH

Explain your feelings about the beer and chewing tobacco. Then explain that you'd rather he buy them if he is going to continue the habits. Also. explain that just because you'd rather he not drink beer or chew, and you'd rather not buy it if he chooses to continue, you are a partnership and you'll continue to help him when he has a need the same way you expect him to help you when you have a need.

No you're not breaking any rules.

Peace in the family is very important. There are probably just as many conference talks on that subject than there are on the Word of Wisdom.

I wish you the best as you work through this issue.

[EarlJibbs]

That's exactly what I was going to say.

You're not breaking "church rules" by simply purchasing these items, but you're enabling him to do so, and you're enabling unhealthy habits. If he wants it, he can buy it himself.

I am not so sure that she would be enabling him. Would he be able to without her? Sure. Would he still have these unhealthy habits if she says she wont buy it for him? Of course. Unless you have some sort of control over the situation I am doubtful a decision not to buy the items would help.

I think you are doing okay Paw. Maybe it will get to the point that he understands what you are doing at church and no longer asks you. Maybe it could even help him change some habits in the future. But I see no reasons to make waves. It is not like he just started to smoke and drink out of the blue, that would be totally different.

I am glad to hear that you have been attending. Stay strong!

[missionary0204]

I agree with EarlJibbs. Making waves is not necessary. This is a pattern he has been used to for many years and there is no rule in the church that says you can't do this. We are taught to avoid the appearance of evil and sometimes other people overreact if they see a member doing it. If it bothers you, then explaining to him that you are uncomfortable doing it because of the commitments you are making to obey your Father-in-Heaven might be a good approach. You should know him well enough by now to know if he is going to accept your concern or blow up on you. Hopfully he isn't the type that blows up over little things. Good luck!

[Guest gopecon]

No, you are not breaking any rules and since he is a non-member he is not either. (although 'chewing' is disgusting to me - tried it once in high school - YUCK!)

While he is not under the same level of commitment to the WofW, I don't think it is accurate to say that he is not breaking any rules/commandments with regard to the WofW. That said, I'm with the keep family harmony crowd. Go ahead and pick it up for him if it doesn't make you too uncomfortable.

[mikbone]

Brother Marriott purchases quite a lot of alcohol.

Heck, I buy alcohol for cooking.

[Bini]

I agree that no rule has been broken but making life easier for someone to pursue a poor lifestyle is enablement. You can be an alcoholic and buy your own booze but if your spouse is willing to do it for you - that's enablement.

[Wingnut]

While he is not under the same level of commitment to the WofW, I don't think it is accurate to say that he is not breaking any rules/commandments with regard to the WofW. That said, I'm with the keep family harmony crowd. Go ahead and pick it up for him if it doesn't make you too uncomfortable.

If he hasn't covenanted to obey the Word of Wisdom, how can he be breaking that commandment?

[Vort]

If he hasn't covenanted to obey the Word of Wisdom, how can he be breaking that commandment?

The commandments are specific implementations of eternal law. One who breaks the eternal laws upon which the Word of Wisdom is based will inevitably suffer the consequences of that broken law, whether or not he has covenanted to live it. Perhaps this is what gopecon meant.

[Guest gopecon]

If he hasn't covenanted to obey the Word of Wisdom, how can he be breaking that commandment?

Commandments are not only applicable for people who have made covenants to keep them. Once you affirmatively commit to obedience (via baptism or temple covenants, etc.) you are then under a higher obligation to keep them. For example, there are scriptural examples of murderers being forgiven (King Lamoni for one). The Doctrine and Covenants tells us that people in the Church will not be forgiven of murder. Lamoni and his people had to repent and were forgiven.

Do I think that violations of the WofW are terribly evil? No I don't - not necessarily even for members of the Church. But if sin is a violation of what God has commanded us to do, then it is wrong for members or non-members to do that act.

[Backroads]

Part of me sees this as just running errands for the spouse, and I see that as no big deal.

However, if you are so uncomfortable with it, say something to him about how you feel.

[mnn727]

While he is not under the same level of commitment to the WofW, I don't think it is accurate to say that he is not breaking any rules/commandments with regard to the WofW.

Since he is not a member he has no level of commitment to the WoW. We members have made a Covenant to obey it when we were baptized.

Now if you want to say chewing is a health hazard, I'd agree with you. He may end up paying for that with cancer, which might have been avoided.

Edited February 14, 2013 by mnn727

[NeuroTypical]

The church was out of my life for 27 years and I have been married to my husband for 25 of those years. He has been very supportive of me attending church. He has do desire to attend.

Paw, that's a wonderful story. Welcome back. Your hubby supports you going to church? That's wonderful. The next time, show up with beer and a big smooch and thank him for being supportive.

My wife occasionally works with folks trying to get off drugs. One kid was trying to come down off meth, and he was using cigarettes as a step-down drug. He and my wife would set goals, and she'd spring for a pack of smokes if he met the goals. Go a week without meth, here's a pack. Attend five AA meetings, a pack. Get a job and hold it for a month, heck, that's good for a carton. You can work on kicking the smoking habit later - let's learn how to not wreck your life and die first. She had some doubts about the church's stand on what she was doing, so she met with our bishop, who thanked her for taking time to work with one of God's children that so often fall through the cracks, and sent her on her way with his blessing.

[paw722]

Thank you Loudmouth_Mormon. That was an awesome story. I love my husband dearly and I don't think that by me saying go buy it yourself would make him drink or chew any less. I think by settting a good example and living the life that I know heavenly father wants me to live and prayer will make a difference. He has to be the one that wants to change and I know as of right now he doesn't want to. I am greatful that he has been supportive of my decision because when I first came back to the church he asked "why that church" I told him that it was the church I was raised in and where I feel most comfortable and nothing else has been said. He doesn't complain that I am gone on sundays for almost 4 hours. He doesn't complain when I want to attend RS work meeting or go to the RS conference meetings in SLC. I just don't want to start a fight that isn't necessary so that is why I asked the question. If I were doing something wrong then I would have needed to rethink how to deal with him asking but because no "church laws" are being broken I will continue to occasionally purchase his bad habits. Thanks for all the advice.

[skippy740]

Paw722,

I want you to be careful with your marriage relationship.

Joining/re-establishing your relationship in the Church is changing the dynamics of your relationship with your husband.

For 25 years you were a certain woman. Now, you are "changing it up" on him. This wasn't what he signed on to 25 years ago.

Your husband will probably not think that it's fair that you are changing these things on him... in your desire to follow Christ.

If you never had an issue before being an active member of the Church... why would you have an issue now?

Keep loving him and supporting him in the marriage just as he is supporting you.

If a "member" has a problem with it, let's hope that they will ask you about it directly instead of gossiping about "Sister So-in-So was in the liquor store buying junk!".

[paw722]

Thank you Skippy740 I do know that things are going to be different in fact a lot has changed in the last year. We are now empty nester also. I come from a HUGE LDS family and I have always been somewhat religious. I attended the Lutheran Church and raised my kids Lutheran (partly because that is what my husband was raised and partly because of my issues at that time with the church. Mostly because my mother in law went and I didn't want to go to church alone) I had attended the Lutheran church for the better part of our marriage and my husband never went to church unless it was Christmas, kids communion, graduation ect. I have not always lived by the W of W but I don't believe that I have changed who I am that much. I had attended church meetings when a niece or nephew was baptised and if one of my relatives talked in church in my town. Our family reunions were held at the LDS church a lot. so its not something super new just 4 hours on sunday compaired to 1 1/2....I live 15 miles from town so add driving time in...lol

[HiJolly]

The commandments are specific implementations of eternal law. One who breaks the eternal laws upon which the Word of Wisdom is based will inevitably suffer the consequences of that broken law, whether or not he has covenanted to live it. Perhaps this is what gopecon meant.

Maybe that's what gopecon meant. But abstaining from beer or wine is NOT a "specific implementation" of "eternal law", in and of itself. Other than perhaps respecting and obeying a priesthood leader's implementation of a 'good or inspired idea' as policy, for a potential myriad of reasons. But not eternal law.

Why, Vort, do I always feel like I'm getting drawn into an argument when I comment on a post of yours? sheesh.

HJ

[annewandering]

Isnt it wonderful having a husband that is not critical of you restarting your activity in the church? Many are. You have overcome a huge hurdle already and he made it a smooth road! Does he know much about the church? From his response when you told him you were going back to church, it sounds like he may not know and might have some misconceptions. You might find time to find out what he knows, or thinks, if you havent already. :)

I think you have things sorted out pretty good.

[Sharky]

I probly have a different perspective then most:

My #1 question is ...

He calls you when you are in town & asks you to pick it up for him, so if you said "NO" would he get in his truck & make the drive to town & get it himself?

How far is "town"?

In my parts, the closest store is 30-minutes of graveled roads away, the closest place to get alcoholic beverages is an additional 20-minutes of paved roads ...... so in my parts, buying it for him while you are in town would simply be saving a whole lot of gas money by eliminating his trip to the store, money that I am sure can be put a much greater need.

Being an EMT I have too many times responded on accident calls where someone just couldn't make that 40+ minute drive home without opening a couple of cans, so again, buying it for him while you are in town eliminates him from making that trip & the possible risks to both him & others who might be traveling the roads around him.

On top of that you are keeping the Harmony in the home & that is worth an awful lot!

[BrendaM]

My husband chews and drinks beer. On occassion when I am in town he calls and asks me to purchase these items for him. I was just wondering if purchasing these items for my husband is breaking any rules. PS....Don't tell me to have him buy it.

I would say that you are not breaking any rules by purchasing these items. But after saying that; I think being committed to your repentance process and living the commandments would demand that you not purchase these items.

It seems like you love your husband and he loves you as well, could you not possibly have a discussion and let him know that you are trying to draw closer to the Lord, and you feel that purchasing these items is a hinderance in that process (unless this is not true?). I know it certainly maintains peace in your home for you to continue this, but is there peace in your heart, and with the Lord. I think that is more important.

Although I am not married, I have 7 less active brothers and sisters. I love them all, with all my heart. Most of them smoke, all of them drink...they would never ask me to pick up cigarettes or a case of beer for them. It's about respect for my beliefs. Even when we go through a Timmys drive through and I'm driving, they would never have me order their coffees, they shout it from where they are sitting. It's quite funny sometimes. But they love me that much.

[paw722]

We live 15 miles out of town and yes he would get in his car and drive to town. When our town was out of chew (all but one gas station) he threatened to drive 55 miles to the next town to get a can. He would pop open a beer and drink on the way home.