Why we are leaving the LDS

[Mikedavis]

My wife and I I joined the church a year ago. Before that time the missionerys would visit us every week. Since then we have had no visits of any kind.

Every Sunday we pay our tithing yet we are unable to access any church website as we need a "membership number" which along with a church handbook we are still waiting for.

Every week I attend the priesthood but have little idea what it's is all about, as such I feel very out of place. A few weeks ago I asked if was true Joseph Smith had many wife's? An Elder asked how I came accross this information? When I said I had found it on the Internet I was told it was all iies. Despite this we both researched further and have found so much information that the church has keep from us. But perhaps most upsetting was finding out that church uses tithings to build shopping malls and fund casinos. This is so wroung.

[pam]

Well for one thing, no tithing money was used to build malls or fund casinos. Not sure where you got that info. Could you provide reliable sources?

[pam]

And you can get your membership number from your ward clerk.

[Lakumi]

someone told me awhile back (while she was talking about Wicca it still applies here, abit she used the hilarious "Witchcrap")

There is so much information on the net, so many books... But you have to be careful what you read as a lot of it is crap"

Any religion is like that, I have seen people's "true stories of Mormonism!" and it is pretty silly.

There is a lot of junk out there, and when you read you have to keep that in mind, and not blindly accept everything as fact. True knowledge isn't a bad thing, but to be true knowledge, it has to be true.

[Mikedavis]

Thank you for relying.

The information about the shopping mall came from LDS.org

The info on the LDS funding casinos was via Wikipidia and can be found at History of Las Vegas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Lakumi]

Thank you for relying.

The information about the shopping mall came from LDS.org

The info on the LDS funding casinos was via Wikipidia and can be found at History of Las Vegas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

never think of Wikipedia as a reliable source

[pam]

Well for one thing the Wikipedia article states "suspected." There is no mention of truth that they in fact funded casinos. Nor do I see that any kind of citation was added to show proof of this. So take it with a grain of salt. Anyone with a bias can add to Wikipedia.

[Dravin]

Every Sunday we pay our tithing yet we are unable to access any church website as we need a "membership number" which along with a church handbook we are still waiting for.

Ask your ward clerk, he'll tell you your membership number, it was created when you became a member. When you go to create a LDS Account as a member and select the area requesting your membership record it helpfully informs you how you can obtain that information. As far as the Church Handbook, it's something intended for leadership, it isn't something shipped out to every member. One of the handbooks is available online though: Handbook 2: Administering the Church

Edited August 22, 2013 by Dravin

[Dravin]

The information about the shopping mall came from LDS.org

Would you helpfully provide a link to this information from LDS.org?

[Lakumi]

Well for one thing the Wikipedia article states "suspected." There is no mention of truth that they in fact funded casinos. Nor do I see that any kind of citation was added to show proof of this. So take it with a grain of salt. Anyone with a bias can add to Wikipedia.

anyone with any insane opinion/idea can edit it...

Right now I could go change it to say Brigham Young could fly, or the LDS church secretly worships cats.

Something where anyone, with any crazy thought, can change a record people use as a basis for debate and research, can never, ever be trusted.

[pam]

And I can't find anything on lds.org that states that tithing money is used to build malls.

Mormonism and church finances/City Creek Center - FAIRMormon

City Creek Center - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (Again from Wikipedia since you did use another as a "reliable" reference" You'll notice almost the last paragraph confirms that no tithing money was used and does have citations.

[drham3rd]

I never let my students use Wikipedia for research purposes, anyone can publish anything there without peer review!

[Leah]

My wife and I I joined the church a year ago. Before that time the missionerys would visit us every week. Since then we have had no visits of any kind.

Every Sunday we pay our tithing yet we are unable to access any church website as we need a "membership number" which along with a church handbook we are still waiting for.

Every week I attend the priesthood but have little idea what it's is all about, as such I feel very out of place. A few weeks ago I asked if was true Joseph Smith had many wife's? An Elder asked how I came accross this information? When I said I had found it on the Internet I was told it was all iies. Despite this we both researched further and have found so much information that the church has keep from us. But perhaps most upsetting was finding out that church uses tithings to build shopping malls and fund casinos. This is so wroung.

The missionaries do not continue to provide weekly lessons after baptism. However, you should have a limited series of new member lessons after your baptism, and you should be receiving monthly visits from your home teacher, and your wife should be receiving monthly visits from her visiting teachers. If you are not receiving these visits, you need to speak to the appropriate people in your ward and let them know you are not receiving these visits.

Have you stopped by the clerk's office after church to ask for your membership number? They will be happy to give it to you.

What "church handbook" are you waiting for?

The church hasn't kept any information from you. Simply because you have not encountered a particular subject of piece of church history in a class, does not mean that the church is keeping things from you. Church history is widely available via the internet, books, etc.

The church does not use tithing to fund shopping malls and casinos. Just because you read something somewhere (perhaps on an anti-Mormon site) does not make it true. This information is also readily available.

If you have questions about the priesthood or anything else....ask. Ask in class. Ask other members. Make an appointment with the bishop. No one is going to know you have questions if you don't speak up.

[Dravin]

If you have questions about the priesthood or anything else....ask. Ask in class. Ask other members. Make an appointment with the bishop. No one is going to know you have questions if you don't speak up.

Or even ask here.

[panacea]

My wife and I I joined the church a year ago. Before that time the missionerys would visit us every week. Since then we have had no visits of any kind.

Sadly, sometimes members aren't very diligent with Home Teaching or Visiting Teaching for Sisters. Are you assigned as a Home Teacher and do you visit other members? Is your wife assigned and does she visit?

Do you hold the Priesthood? Are you an endowed member of the Church? Any callings? Do you attend or did you attend Gospel Principles?

Every Sunday we pay our tithing yet we are unable to access any church website as we need a "membership number" which along with a church handbook we are still waiting for.

I often misplace my membership record, but the Ward Clerk can provide it for you....just ask and the Handbook of Instructions is on LDS.org.

Every week I attend the priesthood but have little idea what it's is all about, as such I feel very out of place.

Odd...it is teachings of past Prophets and the teachings are usually about being clean and worthy, or having gratitude, serving others, faith etc. Pretty basic concepts...

A few weeks ago I asked if was true Joseph Smith had many wife's? An Elder asked how I came accross this information?

Joseph Smith did have many wives as did many others...ordained and commanded by the Lord. It was a principle based in righteousness and perhaps difficult to understand for some today.

When I said I had found it on the Internet I was told it was all iies. Despite this we both researched further and have found so much information that the church has keep from us. But perhaps most upsetting was finding out that church uses tithings to build shopping malls and fund casinos. This is so wroung.

The church doesn't keep or hide anything from anyone. There are volumes of history available to anyone that wishes to read it. That said, church history is often misinterpreted and really has little or nothing to do with the Gospel. there are some that would seek to have you focus on why JS had multiple wives or (insert whatever bothers you) and while history is both riveting and sometimes confusing it is not as important as the Atonement and learning who we are and who we have the potential of becoming.

Before you allow these things to derail you, schedule an appointment with your Bishop and discuss what troubles you with him.

Spiritual things are discerned by the Spirit.....

[skippy740]

Missionary lessons are for teaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ... not for a history lesson or biographical sketch on early LDS pioneers and practices.

[TalkativeIntrovert]

I am sorry you have had such a bad experience in your first year. It is horrible feeling left out and not welcomed

Can I suggest that you hang in there for a bit after doing a few of the following

- get your membership number from the ward clerk

- all of the manuals are accessible on line, I read the scriptures on line as well as the young women's handbook, gospel principals book and the current lesson books. I have the Gospel library app on my phone.

- talk to your Bishop about how you are feeling, I am sure he would be horrified to find out you have completely dropped through the cracks

- talk to the missionaries, you should have had some follow up lessons after your baptism, arrange for them.

- attend the investigator classes rather than regular classes, I found the much more useful when I first joined

- For the moment, stop reading about the negative aspects of the church, yes, they are out there, and yes some of them are true (Joseph Smith did practice polygamy). You can always go back and read them later, but coming from a better spiritual place.

Do you have callings? That is a great way to become involved, talk to Bishop about that.

Again, I am really sorry you are feeling like this and I can somewhat relate as I felt similar in the beginning

[Just_A_Guy]

Thank you for relying.

The information about the shopping mall came from LDS.org

LDS.org is the domain for many thousands of pages; so I'd be grateful for a specific link. The LDS Church segregates its funds pretty rigidly, and they've been adamant that no tithing went into City Creek. I'd be surprised if, on their own website, they stated to the contrary--but let's see what your source is.

The info on the LDS funding casinos was via Wikipidia and can be found at History of Las Vegas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wikipedia says it was done by Mormons (i.e. "individuals who happened to be Mormons"), not by the LDS Church institutionally. Conflating the two is an understandable error--but people who persist in it are going to be pretty disappointed, pretty quickly.

As for Joseph Smith having multiple wives: IMHO, you should have been briefed on that much more thoroughly and I'm highly disappointed at your missionary's reaction. As a Mormon myself, I would respectfully request that--whether you go through with your decision to leave, or reconsider--you provide the details of this discussion to your local mission president so that that error does not get repeated.

[pam]

Excellent thought JAG on the Mormon thing in Vegas. There are many offshoot branches of the LDS church that call themselves Mormons.

[dahlia]

For some strange reason, I have been watching documentaries about the mob and was surprised to learn that Howard Hughes had a 'Mormon mafia' to advise him when he was building in Las Vegas. Perhaps this is what the OP was talking about.

Obviously, these people were not in the mafia, nor were they running their own criminal enterprise. As nonsmokers and nondrinkers, living clean lives, Hughes felt he could trust them when he couldn't trust anyone else. I don't consider this as Mormons 'building casinos.'

I'm also surprised that, after a year, you don't have a number, etc. You should have gotten that long ago. Also since it's been a year, have you been to a settlement session with the bishop? Surely you could have brought up the no number issue at that point, as well as issues you are having with the lack of fellowship.

[mirkwood]

[NeuroTypical]

The information about the shopping mall came from LDS.org

Link, please. I'm thinking you've been misinformed or misinterpreted something you read.

Look Mike, it's a shame that nobody has visited you since your baptism, when it looks like you want visits. Your wording was a bit vague about who told you what was all lies, the early Saints did practice polygamy, and there's plenty of sources. If you want to read up on Joseph Smith and stuff he did, give Bushman's Rough Stone Rolling a read - it's hailed by both believers and critics as a good, honest, bio of Joseph Smith.

Whether you're a convert, or born in the church, or something in between like me, it's important to know what you believe, and why you believe it. Do you believe in God? Do you believe God and Jesus appeared to Joseph Smith and he restored the church? If yes, read history to your heart's content, and learn the history of our church. If no, well, what do you want to accomplish here?

[tubaloth]

My wife and I I joined the church a year ago. Before that time the missionerys would visit us every week. Since then we have had no visits of any kind.

The Missionaries are off teaching other people. But you can always have them over for Dinner.

It now becomes the wards responsibility... which as you can see can be good or bad.

Every Sunday we pay our tithing yet we are unable to access any church website as we need a "membership number" which along with a church handbook we are still waiting for.

Is this why you pay tithing? I hope not. I do hope you pay tithing because you know this is the Lords Church. That you know Joseph Smith Did see Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. That the Book of Mormon is true, and the Gospel of Jesus Christ has been restored. And that Heavenly Father asks us to give a little back to Him.

Have you been reading your scriptures and praying?

Every week I attend the priesthood but have little idea what it's is all about, as such I feel very out of place.

This does take time. Do you ask questions in class? I assume you have the President Snow Manual (that your tithing paid for). I would say most members probably don't read the lesson before hand. But you can always do this and if you have questions ask them. You and your wife can read it together.

Also, do you have a Gospel Principles manual?

https://www.lds.org/manual/gospel-principles?lang=eng

I suggest as you are trying to get your Membership number to see if the ward has one. They might and might not. But see if they can get you one. At the very least there is probably one (older one) in the Library you maybe could borrow (with a bunch of other stuff).

But perhaps most upsetting was finding out that church uses tithing's to build shopping malls

The City Creak Center in SLC UT (If you haven't seen this is really did Help Downtown SLC). I assume you know that the LDS church is based in SLC. (Came here in 1847). The church being really the government at the time pretty much owns a lot of land in SLC.

The Church also owns many companies (some they started, some they invested in).

Temple Square is maybe still the biggest tourist attraction in SLC. All free, but also all to help the Church spread its message.

Downtown SLC needed help to bring new businesses in. The Church felt with the resources it had, and because it owned most of the land. To build a new mall.

I can't remember the total cost, but the church will make more money with all the stores over time, and probably not that long.

You have to realize Satan is as real as Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ are. Satan wants to confuse you. He wants you to feel out of place and question the choices you have made. Don't let him! Remember why you joined the church, what it teaches that help you understand who you are, and where you are going.

I would hope as you get close to your year mark you are now striving to go to the temple. You might even be able to do baptisms for the Dead of some of your ancestors.

You can do it!

Edited August 22, 2013 by tubaloth

[Jamie123]

anyone with any insane opinion/idea can edit it...

Right now I could go change it to say Brigham Young could fly, or the LDS church secretly worships cats.

True, but if you looked again an hour later you'd probably find your edits deleted as "vandalism". There's quite an army of Wiki-geeks standing guard over Wikipedia.

I never let my students use Wikipedia for research purposes, anyone can publish anything there without peer review!

I disagree. I encourage my students to use Wikipedia for general information searching, just so long as they back up their information with something more reliable at a later stage. I do have a problem when students cite Wikipedia as a source in their papers.

[Mikedavis]

Thank you to everyone who took the time to reach out and reply to my questions. Never have I felt such warmth and caring from people I have never met.

You know, the Internet is a wonderful thing, but in many ways it's also like the door of a public toilet, anyone can post anything on it and all to often the stuff you read there is not that pleasant. Perhaps if I want to find the answers to life the universe and everything I should step out of the bathroom :)

It's strange, but tonight while I was driving to work my car stalled. As I tried to push the car clear of the crossing two guys from the car behind got out and helped by pushing the back of my car. After we had moved my car clear they both came around to the front and asked "is their anything else we can do to help" it was only then I noticed the badges on their jackets. They were both LDS missionary's. Coincidence? Perhaps, but it's what happened next that shook me up. After they had gone (BTW we have arranged to meet for lunch tomorrow:) I got into my car and before calling for a tow truck turned the key one last time, my car started as if nothing had ever been wrong with it.