andypg Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 Last night I read half of the King Follett discourse. So far there are things I finds beautiful and things I need to research and pray about more. And I have to read the second half. Anyways, one part I had a question on was when he began talking about the beginning of Genesis. The Hebrew Bible, the OT, begins "BERESHITH" translated "In the beginning." The Prophet then says that was a later addition. In reality the Hebrew is "ROSHITH" which, according to the Prophet Joseph means “The Head One of the Gods brought forth the Gods.” He then expounds on this and discusses the council of the gods.So after reading this, these are my questions: Is there any evidence that BERESHITH was originally ROSHITH? And does ROSHITH really mean “The Head One of the Gods brought forth the Gods"?If this really is the case, why isn't this corrected in the Joseph Smith Translation? The JST says:1 And it came to pass, that the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, Behold, I reveal unto you concerning this heaven and this earth; write the words which I speak.2 I am the Beginning and the End; the Almighty God. By mine Only Begotten I created these things.3 Yea, in the beginning I created the heaven, and the earth upon which thou standest.Wouldn't this be reflected in the Joseph Smith Translation? The JST also implies that God is not one among a council of gods, but THE only God from all eternity to all eternity.Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted May 30, 2014 Report Share Posted May 30, 2014 I'm an ignoramus on the Hebrew language, but here's Strong's Concordance/Lexicon's entry on rosh and here's the Hebrew breakdown of Genesis 1:1. Joseph Smith completed the bulk of the JST by 1833--he tinkered with the text after that, but never made a systematic overhaul of his earlier work (which was never published in his lifetime, anyways). The questions as to whether it was ever truly "finished" and whether it could theoretically be improved upon, are major reasons why the LDS Church has officially retained the KJV rather than pronouncing the JST as canonical. And here's the first half of the King Follett Discourse as published in the Ensign back in the 1970s. Pertinent quote: I shall comment on the very first Hebrew word in the Bible; I will make a comment on the very first sentence of the history of creation in the Bible—Berosheit. I want to analyze the word. Baith—in, by, through, and everything else. Rosh—the head, Sheit—grammatical termination. When the inspired man wrote it, he did not put the baith there. An old Jew without any authority added the word; he thought it too bad to begin to talk about the head! It read first, “The head one of the Gods brought forth the Gods.” That is the true meaning of the words. Baurau signifies to bring forth. If you do not believe it, you do not believe the learned man of God. Learned men can teach you no more than what I have told you. Thus the head God brought forth the Gods in the grand council. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andypg Posted June 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 Thanks so much! I was looking at the new version of the KFD that combines all three of the transcripts so when I looked up roshith the only thing that came up was the KFD. I'm going to have to do more research, but from what the Hebrew breakdown says is "The head God created heaven and earth." I'd be interested in doing more research on "council of the Gods." The JST is interesting from what I've read from it. I'd be interested in using that as a supplement the next time I study the Bible. Just_A_Guy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 Just FYI, the combined KFD is not entirely reliable. Some of the things taught therein are currently taught by the church and clearly doctrinal. Some of the things are not. The various reports differ. The day was windy and it was difficult for all to hear. It is a very interesting read, but you'll come across a few ideas that will likely make you think, "What on earth?" :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted June 1, 2014 Report Share Posted June 1, 2014 Andy, I think Rameumptom has made some posts here about the "council of the Gods" concept as it was understood by the early Hebrews. He draws quite a bit on the scholarship of Margaret Barker, as I recall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lakumi Posted June 4, 2014 Report Share Posted June 4, 2014 Is his translations only in the quad's or are there solo bibles with them in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 Is his translations only in the quad's or are there solo bibles with them in it?I believe the solo bibles that have them as the actual text are owned by the community of christ (formerly RLDS). don't know if thats still the case or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mordorbund Posted June 10, 2014 Report Share Posted June 10, 2014 You can find standalone bibles that carry the Joseph Smith Translation. Some of them compare the Inspired Version with the King James Version. (follow the linkys if you're interested, you can also get them as ebooks). Blackmarch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onethatislazy Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 Just FYI, the combined KFD is not entirely reliable. Some of the things taught therein are currently taught by the church and clearly doctrinal. Some of the things are not. The various reports differ. The day was windy and it was difficult for all to hear. It is a very interesting read, but you'll come across a few ideas that will likely make you think, "What on earth?" :) its posted in the Ensign and quoted in Conference and in the TPJS, so it must be doctrine The KFD is one of my favorite lectures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted June 11, 2014 Report Share Posted June 11, 2014 its posted in the Ensign and quoted in Conference and in the TPJS, so it must be doctrine The KFD is one of my favorite lectures. It is partially posted in the Ensign and quoted in Conference, etc.... Please note the "combined" word in my description of the KFD. The combined version is where they took all the different handwritten notes and parsed them together to make one complete sermon. This is not the version printed in the Ensign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latter Days Guy Posted June 14, 2014 Report Share Posted June 14, 2014 It is partially posted in the Ensign and quoted in Conference, etc.... Please note the "combined" word in my description of the KFD. The combined version is where they took all the different handwritten notes and parsed them together to make one complete sermon. This is not the version printed in the Ensign. Where can you find this version and how does it differ from the ensign version? I've only ever heard of this on here and a brief mention of it in the work and the glory books. I've printed off the ensign articles to read but would like to compare it to other versions as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted June 14, 2014 Report Share Posted June 14, 2014 https://byustudies.byu.edu/PDFViewer.aspx?title=5321&linkURL=18.2LarsonKingFollett-788e0c92-f320-42a3-bccc-7bf232ab8432.pdf Latter Days Guy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted June 14, 2014 Report Share Posted June 14, 2014 Can a moderator fix the title of this thread? Every time I see it a giant gorilla comes to mind. M. Latter Days Guy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latter Days Guy Posted June 15, 2014 Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 Can a moderator fix the title of this thread? Every time I see it a giant gorilla comes to mind. M. I hadn't even noticed it until you pointed it out! Kong Follet!! Maureen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pam Posted June 15, 2014 Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 Fixed Maureen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palerider Posted June 15, 2014 Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 I liked Kong Follett better......Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maureen Posted June 15, 2014 Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 I liked Kong Follett better......LolYou would. :) M. Palerider 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palerider Posted June 15, 2014 Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 You would. :) M.My warped sense of humor......Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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