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soulgiver36

Denying Temple Recommend

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My wife went to get temple recommend last night but denied. She has a limited use recommend. Well, during the interview the bishop told my wife that he remembered she is on probation and that she shouldn't of even gotten the limited use recommend. Now this is civil probation for something that happened back in 2011 and she finally went to court in 2014 and has been on probation since then and it ends in 2016. Isn't that adding to the temple recommend requirements and going against what it says in section 3.3.3 in the handbook? My wife is so torn she had people coming in from out of town and everything. It's really weird she's gone through the temple prep classes to how can the bishop be like oops I forgot and pull this on her? Please give us some insight and is the handbook section 3.3.3 when it refers to following whats in the temple recommend handbook talking about a separate temple recommend book?

Thanks,

Frank

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Hi Frank -

As I understand it, bishops do have some latitude in spiritual matters; and (speaking as a lawyer myself) I think a major reason that the Church doesn't make Handbook 1 publicly available is so that the members don't start trying to out-lawyer their bishops. :)

If a person thinks their bishop is treating them unfairly, I think it's best to set an appointment with the stake president to review the matter.

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Posted · Hidden by estradling75, September 26, 2015 - opps
Hidden by estradling75, September 26, 2015 - opps

Unfortunately Gramps was never a lawyer and it states in the About Gramps that he was a scientist...so I can't really add that part in.

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I'm not concerned about the handbook 1. It's available online. I just read another topic and they stated that section 3.3.3 states to not add other questions. The real question is why are they saying if your on probation you can't get a temple recommend. Where does it say that and where are they interpreting that? I just don't get it.

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I'm not concerned about the handbook 1. It's available online. I just read another topic and they stated that section 3.3.3 states to not add other questions. The real question is why are they saying if your on probation you can't get a temple recommend. Where does it say that and where are they interpreting that? I just don't get it.

 

Well that seems rather obvious to me.  If you are on probation you have broken some of your covenants and therefore aren't eligible for a temple recommend.

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Well that seems rather obvious to me.  If you are on probation you have broken some of your covenants and therefore aren't eligible for a temple recommend.

 

Note that this is speaking of legal probation, not Church probation. I could easily believe that an innocent and otherwise temple-worthy individual might be on legal probation. It is reasonable to me that the Church might have a policy of no temple recommends to those on legal probation, but it is not obvious to me that it must (or should) be that way.

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Note that this is speaking of legal probation, not Church probation. I could easily believe that an innocent and otherwise temple-worthy individual might be on legal probation. It is reasonable to me that the Church might have a policy of no temple recommends to those on legal probation, but it is not obvious to me that it must (or should) be that way.

 

Yes I realized that after I posted.  Of course we don't know what she is on probation for and it's possible it could fall within one of the temple recommend questions.

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Remember that denying a temple recommend isn't based in the bishop being a jerk. He genuinely cares about your wife and doesn't want to lead her astray. If your wife is doing something anti-LDS (smoking? Drinking coffee?) it's in her best interest to stop and rethink. I am NOT saying your wife is a bad person, we are all sinful-but this could be a wake up call for her in the best way possible. 
 

Edited by MormonGator

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We don't know what your wife did to get on probation (and we don't need to know).. Which means we can only speak generically.  Part of the repentance process is going through the legal process (assuming such sin also broke the law) and finishing that up.

 

Therefore, jail time has to be served, probation has to be served, fees/fines have to be payed etc.  Whatever it is the law requires before recommends are normally issued.

 

This of course can result in a disconnect.  A bishop generally has no way of knowing a persons legal status until they tell him.  So sometimes people can slip through.  It is also possible that a person can have the whole change of heart that a bishop would be looking for as a sign of sincere repentance, and so he would be ready to allow it, only to have the legal system to have years and years left before letting them go.

 

People make the system imperfect, but it would seem that the error in this case was not in the denial, but in the issuance of the recommend prior.  An error that the bishop became aware of and is now trying to correct. (as he should)  as much as such actions suck for your wife. 

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I'm not concerned about the handbook 1. It's available online. I just read another topic and they stated that section 3.3.3 states to not add other questions. The real question is why are they saying if your on probation you can't get a temple recommend. Where does it say that and where are they interpreting that? I just don't get it.

 

I'm afraid you have missed my point.

 

The point is that you can't approach a temple recommend as if it's an entitlement that the bishop is bound to dole out to anyone who can argue that they've jumped through all the right hoops.  If it were, there'd be no need to have bishops do the initial interviews, or for stake presidents to do the second interviews.  My goodness, if we're just looking for someone to give "the right answers" to a third party--in this age, you could farm the whole business out to a computer.

 

Your bishop (think he) has received revelation saying that your wife isn't ready for a temple recommend.  If you think he's made the wrong call, you can take it up with the Stake President.  But don't think you're going to force anyone's hand by quoting the right section of the (illicitly obtained) Church Handbook of Instructions.  Because "worthiness" really boils down to having a broken heart and a contrite spirit--in other words, humility.  And, like "power" or "respectability" or "virtue"--if you find yourself having to explain why you have humility; you probably don't really have it at all.

Edited by Just_A_Guy

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