Can men and women who are not married to each other be friends?

[Guest MormonGator]

The answer is NO!  No married man or woman has any business having friends of the opposite sex.  It is a recipe for disaster.  You can be friends with another married couple, but not friends with another man's wife.

 Sorry, but I totally disagree. 

I have wonderful female friends. I wouldn't trade anyone of them for the world. I view a few of them as literal sisters. 

Cool story-once I was having lunch with a female friend. Someone walked up and said "Does she know you are married?" It was very accusatory and very insulting. I called LadyGator on the spot, and LadyGator tore a new one into the accusing party. Both myself, the lovely LadyGator, my friends husband and my bff of course, still laugh about it. 

Edited December 17, 2015 by MormonGator

[omegaseamaster75]

 Sorry, but I totally disagree. 

I have wonderful female friends. I wouldn't trade anyone of them for the world. I view a few of them as literal sisters. 

Cool story-once I was having lunch with a female friend. Someone walked up and said "Does she know you are married?" It was very accusatory and very insulting. I called LadyGator on the spot, and LadyGator tore a new one into the accusing party. Both myself, the lovely LadyGator, my friends husband and my bff of course, still laugh about it. 

Exception not the rule, and a slippery slope

[Guest MormonGator]

Exception not the rule, and a slippery slope

No it isn't. Since I view them as literal sisters, I'm not attracted to them. It's not a slippery slope in the least. My BFF (her name is Jennifer) and I know that we're "not going there". So it's like hanging out with family. 

[Guest MormonGator]

Covet is something in your heart.

 

 

 Exactly. 

It's also a different kind of love. I love my wife in a totally different way than I love my sisters and brother, but in the end, it's still love. 

Read "The Four Loves" by CS Lewis. It's a great book, and I think it would explain a lot better than I can! 

Edited December 17, 2015 by MormonGator

[Jane_Doe]

Why is this even a question????   Of course men and women can be friends!  If you're not mature enough to have a polite platonic relationship with a member of the opposite sex... you have some major issues to work on.

 

I work in a male dominated work place, and hence most of my work friends are male: never a problem.  I go to ward activities, but truth be told a points I prefer hanging out with the guys more than the girls (usually due to shared interests).  If I've had a bad day and need to vent, and if my husband is unavailable for some reason, I'll call a friend whom is frequently a guy.  My best friend right now (excluding husband) is my husband's best friend (who was the best man at our wedding).  My husband's second best friend is the best man's wife (whom was one of my bride's maids).  

 

There's nothing secret abut this.  My husband knows all my friends and I tell him about what we do, and vise versa.  Nothing more than platonic relationships.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Jane_Doe

[Guest MormonGator]

Why is this even a question????   Of course men and women can be friends!  If you're not mature enough to have a polite platonic relationship with a member of the opposite sex... you have some major issues to work on.

 

I work in a male dominated work place, and hence most of my work friends are male: never a problem.  I go to ward activities, but truth be told a points I prefer hanging out with the guys more than the girls (usually due to shared interests).  If I've had a bad day and need to vent, and if my husband is unavailable for some reason, I'll call a friend whom is frequently a guy.  My best friend right now (excluding husband) is my husband's best friend (who was the best man at our wedding).  My husband's second best friend is the best man's wife (whom was one of my bride's maids).  

 

There's nothing secret abut this.  My husband knows all my friends and I tell him about what we do, and vise versa.  Nothing more than platonic relationships.

 Exactly. 

It's all about communication. I tell the lovely LadyGator "Hey, were going out to lunch" (Sadly, my BFF lives several states away) and I'm sure Jen tells her husband "MG and I are going out to lunch". So it's not like we are hiding anything. The four of us are also friends on FB. That helps. 

[Guest]

Well, Gator, you are probably an exception.  But as a rule, no, it doesn't happen that way.

 

Here's an interesting anecdote that talks about such an exception:

 

My Patriarch about three wards ago had an occasion to visit with several other patriarch's at the house of Pres. Hinckley.  It was supposed to be a "weekend retreat" type setting.  They did various recreational activities as well as the "team building" type exercises that have been popularized in recent decades.

 

They finally settled one evening in the hot tub.  (Yeah, we all raised an eyebrow as well.)  As they were there, a young woman approached and joined them.  Of course she was wearing a bathing suit.  I zoned out during intro of the story, so I may have some of this wrong, and I don't know who she was (probably a granddaughter of the prophet or something).  

 

My patriarch said that it caused some discomfort (as in: it was "inappropriate" for a bunch of older men to be hot tubbing with a young woman).  But he looked at Pres. Hinckley's reaction.  He was a glacial.  He spoke with her casually as he would anyone else.  The Patriarch, then putting his hand to his chin said,"He kept his eyes up here -- neck up.  Because all he saw was a daughter of God."

 

Then someone else chimed in,"I'm still getting past the image of several Patriarch in a hot tub with President Hinckley."

Edited December 17, 2015 by Guest

[Guest MormonGator]

Well, Gator, you are probably an exception.  But as a rule, no, it doesn't happen that way.

 

Here's an interesting anecdote:

 

My Patriarch about three wards ago had an occasion to visit with several other patriarch's at the house of Pres. Hinckley.  It was supposed to be a "weekend retreat" type setting.  They did various recreational activities as well as the "team building" type exercises that have been popularized in recent decades.

 

They finally settled one evening in the hot tub.  (Yeah, we all raised an eyebrow as well.)  As they were there, a young woman approached and joined them.  Of course she was wearing a bathing suit.  I zoned out during this part of the story, so I don't know who she was (probably a granddaughter of the prophet or something).  

 

My patriarch said that it caused some discomfort (as in: it was "inappropriate" for a bunch of older men to be hot tubbing with a young woman).  But he looked at Pres. Hinckley's reaction.  He was a glacial.  He spoke with her casually as he would anyone else.  The Patriarch, then putting his hand to his chin said,"He kept his eyes up here -- neck up.  Because all he saw was a daughter of God."

 

Then someone else chimed in,"I'm still getting past the image of several Patriarch in a hot tub with President Hinckley."

 Well, I certainly do agree on that. We don't do anything like that because it would lead to questions. I would never go into a hot tub or anything with her, that is 100% true. You are right about that .

 

Edited December 17, 2015 by MormonGator

[omegaseamaster75]

Why is this even a question????   Of course men and women can be friends!  If you're not mature enough to have a polite platonic relationship with a member of the opposite sex... you have some major issues to work on.

 

I work in a male dominated work place, and hence most of my work friends are male: never a problem.  I go to ward activities, but truth be told a points I prefer hanging out with the guys more than the girls (usually due to shared interests).  If I've had a bad day and need to vent, and if my husband is unavailable for some reason, I'll call a friend whom is frequently a guy.  My best friend right now (excluding husband) is my husband's best friend (who was the best man at our wedding).  My husband's second best friend is the best man's wife (whom was one of my bride's maids).  

 

There's nothing secret abut this.  My husband knows all my friends and I tell him about what we do, and vise versa.  Nothing more than platonic relationships.

Work friends are not friends.

 

Would you go to the movies with your male friends? Shopping for sexy lingerie? Talk about intimacy issues with your husband with them? go Bra shopping? have a night out? (like a girls night out) Be alone in a car or hotel room on vacation?

 

The answer is likely no to all of the above

 

Venting to an acquaintance over the phone does not a friend make, not if you wouldn't do any of the other stuff with him. 

[Guest]

I'd also say it's a question of how close a relationship we are talking about.  As Jane said, I've got many female "friends" at work.  But is there ever any heart-to-heart conversation there?  No.  We talk, we joke, and we work.  And we do know each other on some personal level.  But to share the things of the heart, have a shoulder to cry on... these are much more emotional things that it is difficult to separate the platonic from the romantic.

 

And I'll say it since no one else will.  It is much more possible when there is no physical attraction.  There are several women I know whom I have zero physical attraction for.  Yet, they're just such fantastic people that I can't help but want to be friends.  To do that with a much more attractive woman, and keep my emotional distance?  That's walking a little too close to the edge of the cliff.

 

The main reason the physical attraction is an issue is the way that men and women's brains work.  If you're familiar with Laura Brotherson's And They Were Not Ashamed, she outlines the pattern: (I hope I'm not going too far with this or violating board rules.  I'm trying to be as technical as I can).

 

Men: Arousal, physical response, decision.

Women: Decision, physical response, then arousal.

 

I hope I got that right.  It's been a while.  The point is that often times, men are involuntarily aroused.  Then they have the difficulty of making a decision AFTER they are already aroused.  Whereas, women more often make the decision for some other reason.  Then they are aroused after the decision to be aroused is made.

 

That is why NeuroTypical's link to Scientific American makes so much sense.

[omegaseamaster75]

 Well, I certainly do agree on that. We don't do anything like that because it would lead to questions. I would never go into a hot tub or anything with her, that is 100% true. You are right about that .

 

Come on Mormon Gator, your just friends, you would hang out in a hot tub if it were a bunch of dudes......

[Guest MormonGator]

As long as you set up boundaries, there isn't a problem. 

Edited December 17, 2015 by MormonGator

[Guest MormonGator]

Come on Mormon Gator, your just friends, you would hang out in a hot tub if it were a bunch of dudes......

Let's just agree to disagree. No point in going around in circles. 

Edited December 17, 2015 by MormonGator

[omegaseamaster75]

 Like I said my friend, let's just agree to disagree. No point in going around in circles. 

I agree, I guess my overriding point is that men and women can't be friends like two guys or two women are friends. There  have to be boundaries and lines that are not to be crossed and topics that are not discussed. I would argue that, that is not a true friendship

[Guest MormonGator]

I agree, I guess my overriding point is that men and women can't be friends like two guys or two women are friends. There  have to be boundaries and lines that are not to be crossed and topics that are not discussed. I would argue that, that is not a true friendship

 I hear you. 

I have wonderful guy friends too, so that helps. 

[Guest Godless]

I agree, I guess my overriding point is that men and women can't be friends like two guys or two women are friends. There  have to be boundaries and lines that are not to be crossed and topics that are not discussed. I would argue that, that is not a true friendship

 

It's a different kind of friendship, but it doesn't mean that it isn't a true friendship. True friends respect boundaries, after all. 

 

FWIW, some of my closest friends are women (and my wife is 100% okay with that). I have never and will never thought of them as anything other than friends. Do I interact with them differently from my guy friends? Sure. But I also tend to be more open with them, and if that isn't friendship then I don't know what is. 

[Backroads]

No, not in the chummy sense. My friendships with my pre-marriage guy friends are different than they once were. I'll grant exceptions, but in general, no.

[Guest MormonGator]

It's a different kind of friendship, but it doesn't mean that it isn't a true friendship. True friends respect boundaries, after all. 

 

FWIW, some of my closest friends are women (and my wife is 100% okay with that). I have never and will never thought of them as anything other than friends. Do I interact with them differently from my guy friends? Sure. But I also tend to be more open with them, and if that isn't friendship then I don't know what is. 

 You said what I thought, but much better than I could say it. 

[David13]

Just seeing someone in Church is not friendship.  It's fellowship.  And acquaintance.

I think it is totally improper for me to have dinner as a single male with a married woman, unless her husband is present and has invited me.

It's a question of appearance.  I don't want the husband to think I'm trying to move in on his wife.

When I again get married, I will not want some man going out to dinner with my wife, either, unless he wife is present.

I don't think it's right.

According to what I get from the Scientific American article, and from my own knowledge of men, including myself, men start thinking.

Women, yes, I agree, they can seem all friendly and all, and are not posturing into a sexual anything.  Men, maybe due to hormones, or primal urge or dna or something, I don't think can do that.

So I'll talk alone to the married women at church, so they can assess me for introduction to the right single friend or relative, but no, I will not date them.

Going out to dinner with someone else's wife is a ... DATE.

dc

 

It's easy to be friends with guys, because we as heterosexuals are not thinking of anything else.  We are thinking of the hobbies, the interests, all those things.

And I suppose it's easy for the ladies to go out for things together with the 'girls' and 'girl talk' or whatever.

But I do not want some woman tempted into even thinking of adultery, or having lust in her heart because she's hanging around me too much.

I figure, and I hope I'm correct, they can't do that at church.

Edited December 18, 2015 by David13

[Vort]

If I've had a bad day and need to vent, and if my husband is unavailable for some reason, I'll call a friend whom is frequently a guy.

 

Do you ever call him when he's female? I imagine the conversations are subtly different.

[Palerider]

Well there you have it Palerider. We can no longer be friends. Even after 16 years.

Ok .....no more being friends ...... Lol

[Palerider]

We also have those memebers who feel that a male and female riding in a car together isn't allowed.

[Guest]

My next door neighbor won't come in the house unless my husband is home, and won't let me through his door unless his wife is home. I think it's a good rule, except that he's more than old enough to be my father and in fact has acted as a father figure when I needed one lately. 

[Palerider]

My next door neighbor won't come in the house unless my husband is home, and won't let me through his door unless his wife is home. I think it's a good rule, except that he's more than old enough to be my father and in fact has acted as a father figure when I needed one lately.

Like I say with some things in regards to the church .....if someone doesn't think they should do something for whatever reason....then don't do it.

[Guest]

Personally I think that keeping distance from women other than my wife and family members is a way of showing respect for their husbands and my own wife.  Yeah, I will occasionally small talk with another woman at work or at church or whatever.  I will also be nice to my wife's friends and small talk with them.  I will do the hand shaking thing with women at church.  But that is it.  I have no close independent friendships with other women, and that is the way I like it.

 

I also expect other men to show me respect by keeping distance from my wife.  I would find it to be an act of active disrespect to me personally if some other guy was trying to go to dinner with my wife, "just friends" or not.  I don't take kindly to such disrespect, and let's just say I'm a very big guy and would make sure that such a man regretted the day he ever met my wife.

Edited December 18, 2015 by DoctorLemon