Will Men In The Church Be Upset If Women Held The Priesthood?

[shanstress70]

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Nope, but I wouldn't hold your breath. That would make women vastly superior to us men, and they would no longer have any use for us...:)

We already are vastly superior to you men. You go right ahead and carry a child inside your body and then give birth to said child. If men had that capability there would be far fewer children in the world because men can not tolerate pain like women can. Men can in no way multi task with the skill, accuracy and speed that women do naturally. There is no way Man alone will enter into the Celestial Kingdom - he HAS to be sealed to his wife.

In my opinion if man are not walking in tandem with their wife then they are not in a righteous union.

And here is the underlying problem, isn't it? Women are superior to men, or at least I hear this crap rolled out every once in a while. 'If men had to give birth, the species would have died off' like women have done something so wonderful that only they can do. Give me a flippin' break! As for tolerating pain: men, how often have you cut yourself badly while working on the car, playing a sport, working on the house, etc., sucked on it a little so that you wouldn't get blood everywhere and then gone on with what you were doing? How many women can do that? I have 3 girls, all of whom I did the 'manly' things with, and they were out of commission. Period. So don't throw that old feminist crap out as if it were fact. Because it ain't.

As for multi-tasking, yes, men do a wonderful job of that. We are forced to in our jobs.

Just for the record, as one of the women who thinks that women should share the priesthood in any church, I do not think women are superior to men. I think we are of equal importance, but that there are things women can do better than men and vice versa. I just happen to think women do a good job in positions of religious leadership, as I've been to a few churches who have them.

I think one of the things women are not cut out for is war. They do not have the physical strength that men have, in general, and may put men in jeopardy in the battlefield when men feel they need to protect the women there.

I think one of the things men would not do as well as women is early childhood development (working in a daycare). My husband stayed home with our child until he was three, but it was a challenge for him to take care of one all day... no way he could take care of a class full of them and give them the care and nurturing they need.

I too tire of hearing the 'superior' thing coming from women. Why can't 'as good as' be enough?

[tiancum]

I have no idea whether it will happen or not but I'd be completely fine with it.

Just to be clear - when Christ himself called his own 12 disciples - how many women did he call?

you tell us Snow, it looks like you know something we dont.

[sixpacktr]

CK,

Right back at ya!

There are several here whose posts are really enjoy: You, Pale Rider, Prison Chaplain, Snow, Shanstress, Traveler, even Jason, with whom I disagree most of the time, to name a few. And I haven't always agreed with everyone's posts in that group, but there is a great understanding there of the Gospel and Christianity that I admire.

I just read Bro Nibley's book "Brother Brigham Challenges the Saints" and I realized something that JS originally said and BY reiterated time and time again. To paraphrase: our conversations, our councils, our lives are too mean, too low, too common for us as Saints of the Most High God.

We should be looking to build each other up, but there are too many that seek to tear down. And I'm not talking of the sarcastic remark or even the angry retort. I'm speaking of those that look to confuse, to divert, to destroy others by casting doubt on the truthfulness of the Gospel. This thread is an excellent example, as have been several others...

[shanstress70]

There are several here whose posts are really enjoy: You, Pale Rider, Prison Chaplain, Snow, Shanstress, Traveler, even Jason, with whom I disagree most of the time, to name a few.

Thanks! I enjoy your posts too. It's one thing to disagree, but we should be able to discuss them without insulting each other or take offense too easily... otherwise, why are you coming to a forum such as this?

[Snow]

I have no idea whether it will happen or not but I'd be completely fine with it.

Just to be clear - when Christ himself called his own 12 disciples - how many women did he call?

you tell us Snow, it looks like you know something we dont.

No, I don't have any special knowledge.

The point is that he, God, who could have done anything, choose 12 men as his key disciples. That's a pretty decent indicator of His intent.

Could God seemingly change His intent and extend the call to women? I think so but obvioiusly he hasn't choose to do so yet.

Just for the record, as one of the women who thinks that women should share the priesthood in any church, I do not think women are superior to men.

Shantress,

As such a woman, why do you think Christ did not agree with you historically and that to date has not, at minimum, agreed with you enough to act on it?

Do you suppose that in the future God might agree with you more?

[tiancum]

honestly, i think A big reason that women don't have it, is that men need the trial more.... We simply need to overcome things that women don't need to as much.

We tend to use unrighteous dominion a lot. I am not saying that women don't use it, it is just more easily enforced by men....and so we do.

Women ain't perfect either, I even knew a woman who would tell her husband what to say in blessings. It was horrible. (but thats besides the point)

[shanstress70]

Shantress,

As such a woman, why do you think Christ did not agree with you historically and that to date has not, at minimum, agreed with you enough to act on it?

Do you suppose that in the future God might agree with you more?

I'm one of those who doesn't agree with everything in the Bible. I have a hard time believing that everyone (mostly men) that has had a part in writing/translating the Bible have been honest. As we all know, everyone is imperfect and sometimes people have their own agendas.

I think there so little that we know about any of this stuff.

[MaidservantX]

if you can get sealed to another man. Won't happen.

I know it won't. I didn't say it would. :) That is why my statement was thus: 'IF I have the opportunity . . .'

I am perfectly aware of what the policy is for living women as to their sealings. This is personally hurtful to me because of the shape of my life; but I am perfectly willing to live within the rules and laws as they stand now and to seek my understanding to bend to the Lord's.

But I still don't see that IF (big if, apparently) the Lord were to allow me to covenant with more than one man, how He would withdraw His promise unless I transgressed. That is all the hope I have at the moment.

[StrawberryFields]

Bandwagon huh?

Isaac, Do you really think it is the PH, which keeps men on a level playing field?

I need my husband; he is the testosterone and my estrogen filled life. He is the yin for my yang or visa versa. He helps to keep me balanced and it doesn't have anything to do with the priesthood

P.S. I know this question was for men... I just couldn't help myself :)

As you will see I see my husband as my equal regardless of the PH he holds. :)

[snipe123]

honestly, i think A big reason that women don't have it, is that men need the trial more.... We simply need to overcome things that women don't need to as much.

We tend to use unrighteous dominion a lot. I am not saying that women don't use it, it is just more easily enforced by men....and so we do.

Women ain't perfect either, I even knew a woman who would tell her husband what to say in blessings. It was horrible. (but thats besides the point)

Over and over, as I have read all the posts on the now three threads on this subject, I have wanted to share a story about the priesthood from my life in the hopes that it would shed some light on the subject here...I have hesitated to do so, since for me, it is one of those "pearls" we are cautioned to not cast about so freely...Not that any of you are pigs...haha...In fact after spending a short period on the posts, I feel that I have gotten to know some of you due to your comments on various issues...so I would like to share the story and hope that none of you will disrespect what I am about to share, and that it will be instructive in some way...The story I am about to share is not a rumor, or something that happened to someone else...It is absolutely true.

I had been on a mission for about 7 months and I was sitting at the dinner table with my companion and a family that was reletively inactive in Longview, Texas. The parents had an young (maybe 21or 22)inactive daughter and her non-member husband living with them. Through the course of the conversation at the table she asked if one of us (Elders) would give her a blessing. She looked perfectly healthy, so I asked her what was wrong.

Looking sad, she said: "I'm 2 and a half months pregnant."

"So what's wrong with that?" I smiled.

"Well, I have been pregnant three times before and all of them ended in miscarriage by the 3rd or 4th month." She said. "The doctors say it is not likely that this one will end any different since the last one was not very long ago, and the others were within the last year or so."

Try to imagine for a moment what that was like to hear. Here we are, 19 and 20 year old, cocky, young (handsome...:)) Elders going about our daily, naive, missionary life...Each of us had been called upon to give blessings a handful of times for various things like illnesses, or to comfort or give someone council, but never something like this...This was bigtime huge...The responsibility and implications were enormous...What do you say? I was absolutely terrified but somehow felt she would ask me to do it, and at the same time I was hoping she wouldn't...all this flashed through my mind quickly and then, sure enough she turns to me and says:"I'd like you to do it Elder...after dinner?"

"Sure." I said.

"I have had blessings before, so I would really like you to think about what your going to say." She advised.

"No." I said. "This is not something I can do on my own."

So dinner went on, and the entire time I'm asking myself if I have the faith to do this...I received the distinct impression that before the blessing, I should ask her Father (inactive) who was the patriarch in this home, if he would mind offering a prayer to ask for the Lords Spirit to be here. He agreed. So we assembled in the livingroom and placed a diningroom chair in the center of the room where the young woman sat...My nerves are shot, I'm feeling a bit emotional, and inadaquate to the task...Her Father begins to pray and asks for The Lords Spirit to be with me...in an instant The calming influence of The Holy Spirit of God settled upon me like warm water...from head to toe...my mind became very focussed, doubt was gone, feelings were in control, and I absolutely knew that God was with me...My companion annointed, and as I layed my hands upon her head and stated my authority(MP) etc...I could feel energy flowing through my hands as they connected to her head... the words just flooded my mind...I don't want to say I was compelled to speak the words...that would not be quite right...The only way I can explain it is that I felt "empowered" to say the words. I told her she would carry her child to term, and HE would be a healthy and strong child...gave her some general council about going back to church and studying scriptures etc... 15 years later, I still remember the exact words that concluded the blessing...they were: "Be assured that THE LORD will fulfill the words which he has spoken through his servants this day. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen."

I almost passed out at its conclusion...I was physically exhausted, but extremely happy...The collective feeling in the room was simply stunned amazement. She told me that when she recieved her blessings before, they were always blessings that comforted her, and said nothing about the baby...perhaps it was not the Lords will that her previous pregnancies complete, but that she knew this one would...

As we left that night, my companion kept asking me if I realized what I had said, and thought I was completely insane...as the days progressed I wondered the same thing, despite the overpowering experience and so I prayed every night for the next 6 months or so that the blessing would be fulfilled and it was...She sent me a letter recounting the birth in graphic detail (Yuck...to a 19 year old) and said that Billy Williams Jr. was born with ten fingers ten toes etc etc etc...I Had occasion to go on splits with some elders back to that area just before I went home, and stopped by to say hello...I have a picture of me feeding young Billy Williams Junior a bowl of rice cereal...:)

So I wanted to share this story because it illustrates what I think to be the nuts and bolts of what the Priesthood is all about and it was this experience that has shaped my attitude with regard to the priesthood, and blessings in particular...To an outsider it might seem like I shared the story to make myself look good or high and mighty, but in reality, it is experiences like this one that cause a priesthood holder to feel quite the opposite. Think about that for a moment. The great and powerful ALL MIGHTY GOD, creator of everything took a moment to bless the life of a young inactive woman in crisis...I was just the instrument...or even a puppet in a way...Very humbling...

Amen to the Priesthood of any man who uses priesthood authority to exorcise "unrighteous dominion". What does that mean exactly? It's not just talking about leadership roles, but dominion in general. Dominance is not what the priesthood is about, in fact it is just the opposite...It is the authority to act in The name of God...this is not a small thing...to act in his name we must act within the confines of his perfect will...To speak what he would speak if he were in your place...In the example above and many times since, I have been able to speak what he would have me speak...not because of any particular wisdom or knowledge that I possess, but because for whatever reason on that occasion, God wanted to teach a young, arrogant missionary what could be done through him when he submits himself to God's will and allows himself to be an instrument in God's hands through faith...

I joked in earlier posts about man needing the priesthood so women will have use for them and someone asked if I felt that I needed the Priesthood in order to feel equal to my wife...all I know is that in moments where I give a blessings or use my priesthood in service that I feel like it is bringing out my brightest potential as a man...In those moments I am teachable, humble, filled with faith and love...qualities my wife seems to possess naturally. I do believe without the Priesthood it would be much more difficult (not impossible) to develop these qualities on my own...so I am greatful that I have it.

The argument about women and the priesthood here has taken on many different dimensions, but the point I wanted to make is that the priesthood when exorcised righteously in its purest form is not about power or authority, but service. All those "old white men" In SLC wear out their lives serving us, and their fellow men, not lording over us. They bless our lives with their council, concern and love...and whether or not the priesthood is ever bestowed on a woman by the laying on of hands to allow her to administer in all the saving ordinances of the gospel is not my place to say, nor is it anyone elses but those chosen to lead his church...If God can inspire a feeble, naive missionary, surely he can inspire those who are responsible for so many...Surely he can inspire the men responsible for the protection and care of the church to insure that it is going in the direction that HE wills...

[sixpacktr]

Over and over, as I have read all the posts on the now three threads on this subject, I have wanted to share a story about the priesthood from my life in the hopes that it would shed some light on the subject here...I have hesitated to do so, since for me, it is one of those "pearls" we are cautioned to not cast about so freely...Not that any of you are pigs...haha...In fact after spending a short period on the posts, I feel that I have gotten to know some of you due to your comments on various issues...so I would like to share the story and hope that none of you will disrespect what I am about to share, and that it will be instructive in some way...The story I am about to share is not a rumor, or something that happened to someone else...It is absolutely true.

I had been on a mission for about 7 months and I was sitting at the dinner table with my companion and a family that was reletively inactive in Longview, Texas. The parents had an young (maybe 21or 22)inactive daughter and her non-member husband living with them. Through the course of the conversation at the table she asked if one of us (Elders) would give her a blessing. She looked perfectly healthy, so I asked her what was wrong.

Looking sad, she said: "I'm 2 and a half months pregnant."

"So what's wrong with that?" I smiled.

"Well, I have been pregnant three times before and all of them ended in miscarriage by the 3rd or 4th month." She said. "The doctors say it is not likely that this one will end any different since the last one was not very long ago, and the others were within the last year or so."

Try to imagine for a moment what that was like to hear. Here we are, 19 and 20 year old, cocky, young (handsome...:)) Elders going about our daily, naive, missionary life...Each of us had been called upon to give blessings a handful of times for various things like illnesses, or to comfort or give someone council, but never something like this...This was bigtime huge...The responsibility and implications were enormous...What do you say? I was absolutely terrified but somehow felt she would ask me to do it, and at the same time I was hoping she wouldn't...all this flashed through my mind quickly and then, sure enough she turns to me and says:"I'd like you to do it Elder...after dinner?"

"Sure." I said.

"I have had blessings before, so I would really like you to think about what your going to say." She advised.

"No." I said. "This is not something I can do on my own."

So dinner went on, and the entire time I'm asking myself if I have the faith to do this...I received the distinct impression that before the blessing, I should ask her Father (inactive) who was the patriarch in this home, if he would mind offering a prayer to ask for the Lords Spirit to be here. He agreed. So we assembled in the livingroom and placed a diningroom chair in the center of the room where the young woman sat...My nerves are shot, I'm feeling a bit emotional, and inadaquate to the task...Her Father begins to pray and asks for The Lords Spirit to be with me...in an instant The calming influence of The Holy Spirit of God settled upon me like warm water...from head to toe...my mind became very focussed, doubt was gone, feelings were in control, and I absolutely knew that God was with me...My companion annointed, and as I layed my hands upon her head and stated my authority(MP) etc...I could feel energy flowing through my hands as they connected to her head... the words just flooded my mind...I don't want to say I was compelled to speak the words...that would not be quite right...The only way I can explain it is that I felt "empowered" to say the words. I told her she would carry her child to term, and HE would be a healthy and strong child...gave her some general council about going back to church and studying scriptures etc... 15 years later, I still remember the exact words that concluded the blessing...they were: "Be assured that THE LORD will fulfill the words which he has spoken through his servants this day. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen."

I almost passed out at its conclusion...I was physically exhausted, but extremely happy...The collective feeling in the room was simply stunned amazement. She told me that when she recieved her blessings before, they were always blessings that comforted her, and said nothing about the baby...perhaps it was not the Lords will that her previous pregnancies complete, but that she knew this one would...

As we left that night, my companion kept asking me if I realized what I had said, and thought I was completely insane...as the days progressed I wondered the same thing, despite the overpowering experience and so I prayed every night for the next 6 months or so that the blessing would be fulfilled and it was...She sent me a letter recounting the birth in graphic detail (Yuck...to a 19 year old) and said that Billy Williams Jr. was born with ten fingers ten toes etc etc etc...I Had occasion to go on splits with some elders back to that area just before I went home, and stopped by to say hello...I have a picture of me feeding young Billy Williams Junior a bowl of rice cereal...:)

So I wanted to share this story because it illustrates what I think to be the nuts and bolts of what the Priesthood is all about and it was this experience that has shaped my attitude with regard to the priesthood, and blessings in particular...To an outsider it might seem like I shared the story to make myself look good or high and mighty, but in reality, it is experiences like this one that cause a priesthood holder to feel quite the opposite. Think about that for a moment. The great and powerful ALL MIGHTY GOD, creator of everything took a moment to bless the life of a young inactive woman in crisis...I was just the instrument...or even a puppet in a way...Very humbling...

Amen to the Priesthood of any man who uses priesthood authority to exorcise "unrighteous dominion". What does that mean exactly? It's not just talking about leadership roles, but dominion in general. Dominance is not what the priesthood is about, in fact it is just the opposite...It is the authority to act in The name of God...this is not a small thing...to act in his name we must act within the confines of his perfect will...To speak what he would speak if he were in your place...In the example above and many times since, I have been able to speak what he would have me speak...not because of any particular wisdom or knowledge that I possess, but because for whatever reason on that occasion, God wanted to teach a young, arrogant missionary what could be done through him when he submits himself to God's will and allows himself to be an instrument in God's hands through faith...

I joked in earlier posts about man needing the priesthood so women will have use for them and someone asked if I felt that I needed the Priesthood in order to feel equal to my wife...all I know is that in moments where I give a blessings or use my priesthood in service that I feel like it is bringing out my brightest potential as a man...In those moments I am teachable, humble, filled with faith and love...qualities my wife seems to possess naturally. I do believe without the Priesthood it would be much more difficult (not impossible) to develop these qualities on my own...so I am greatful that I have it.

The argument about women and the priesthood here has taken on many different dimensions, but the point I wanted to make is that the priesthood when exorcised righteously in its purest form is not about power or authority, but service. All those "old white men" In SLC wear out their lives serving us, and their fellow men, not lording over us. They bless our lives with their council, concern and love...and whether or not the priesthood is ever bestowed on a woman by the laying on of hands to allow her to administer in all the saving ordinances of the gospel is not my place to say, nor is it anyone elses but those chosen to lead his church...If God can inspire a feeble, naive missionary, surely he can inspire those who are responsible for so many...Surely he can inspire the men responsible for the protection and care of the church to insure that it is going in the direction that HE wills...

Amen and amen Isaac. To say anything else would take away from it...

[a-train]

Beautiful. Precisely.

-a-train

[shanstress70]

Thanks for sharing that beautiful story, Isaac.

[MadHatter]

Thanks for sharing that beautiful story, Isaac.

Men recieving the Priesthood is brining them up to the same level as women naturally are.

Motherhood is inherent to all women nomatter what. this is an extremely important gift, because without it there would be no body for spirits who are patiently waiting for thier turn to recieve one. This is just as important to the eternal plan of happiness that the Priesthood is. women who are married to a worthy Priesthood holder have access to all of the blessings the Priesthood has to offer.

Men and women's roles are naturally different. Men are designed to do different things than women. Women and Men's roles should be different, but they should complement eachother.

This is in no way bigotry or sexism, this does not allow for "Inequality" either. If two peopel are happily married, they will do things for eachother because they like to do nice things for the one they love. It's that simple. My wife stays home and takes care of the house, I work and make the money. It works out great because we both liek takign care of eachother and we are both very appreciative for eachother.

the only way women will ever hold the priesthood is by a very big revelation. But I know it will not happen that way. all throughout time, Men are to protect thier families, they are the head of the household, but they are to lead in Righteousness and not Unrighteous dominion.

LDS women are prompted to listen to thier husbands and support them in thier decisions as long as they are in harmony with Church principals and with respect. Men are propmted to alwasy consult with thier wives, they are to be thier confidant and coucil.

[MaidservantX]

Thank you, Isaac.

[CrimsonKairos]

But I still don't see that IF (big if, apparently) the Lord were to allow me to covenant with more than one man, how He would withdraw His promise unless I transgressed. That is all the hope I have at the moment.

Then I don't get the point of your post. You were posting as if the current policy accomodated more than one man being sealed to one woman. So was your point that you hope the Church allows in the future for you to get sealed to another man? I'm totally lost now.

[MaidservantX]

CK,

My post also played off of the idea that women are sealed to more than one man genealogically (i.e. "current policy"). I then hear people say that the (dead) woman must choose. I am in a process of learning about this. I am curious as to what the authoritative statement is that the woman must choose between her good faith covenants, even a dead woman. Someone in this thread, don't remember if it was you or not (or if it was this thread), gave an explanation about 'accepting' work done for them, equating it with baptisms done for the dead but that must still be 'accepted'. Or something. I don't really care exactly; only to state that I did read it, doesn't need to be restated. I appreciate any one's attempt to make sense of eternal family unions. Multiple genealogical sealings do give me hope that in the eternities I might hope to be sealed to all the men I might love as husband. There are other things in the church and gospel that also give me this hope.

Yes, in the eternities, I do hope to be sealed to more than one man if my heavenly Father has the power to grant that and it seems wisdom in him. It would be incredibly wonderful if this opportunity were afforded me in 'time' also, but I'm not holding my breath.

Alternatively and/ or along with that, I hope to continue to increase my understanding of the doctrine (etc) of sealings so that I can understand how the details of my situation might reach their best, redeemed potential.

Third alternative and/ or also -- I am willing that it is more than possible that the relationship between myself and the man I am now sealed to may be repaired/ raised from the dead; so that I can be satisfied on a personal level as to what eternity with him might be like for me -- I am willing that God can change us both to a celestial condition if we each are obedient and endure. But then in other moments, I despair of this possibility . . . so then I go about pondering among the other two.

[CrimsonKairos]

If you want to learn about sealings and the rules that govern them, ask your stake pres. or when you're at the temple, ask to speak to a member of the temple presidency or the temple recorder.

Now, I'm still confused as to what you're really saying so I'll just be as direct as I can:

Are you saying that you did not have a good relationship with your husband who's passed on? And that you're worried that you might have to be "stuck" with him? And that you want to be sealed to another man? That's kinda' the vibe I'm getting, but I don't know if that's what you're saying.

[MaidservantX]

I do want to remain sealed to my husband. We have children together, and I want to keep that family union intact. I have no desire to 'break' the family in this manner. In fact, I would rather remain a servant to my husband and children forever, if I eschewed 'queen', than to have absolutely nothing to do with them. And perhaps that is exactly the future I face. I've done enough evil in this world I sometimes wonder if I haven't counted myself out anyhow.

However, despite the deep and sacred value I place on our family sealings, I don't really see myself enjoying my hubby's company 24/7 for a million years (and I"m sure it is vice versa). But like I said, I think there is possibility there, if we both continue to grow until the day we meet again.

But even more than that -- even if I loved my first husband with all of my heart (which I am fond of my husband), and then married a second husband (so far, fat chance of that that, so) and loved him with all of my heart (all here on earth) -- I should be deeply hurt to 'lose' either one of them in the eternities. But see, I have to believe there is a little more to understand for the eternities.

We'll see won't we.

In the end the thing that will matter most to me will be doing my Father's will, and allow him to give me the gifts he would like to give me, and place me in the perfect order he would like to place me in. He has my petition and he will do with it as he will.

[Snow]

<div class='quotemain'>

Shantress,

As such a woman, why do you think Christ did not agree with you historically and that to date has not, at minimum, agreed with you enough to act on it?

Do you suppose that in the future God might agree with you more?

I'm one of those who doesn't agree with everything in the Bible. I have a hard time believing that everyone (mostly men) that has had a part in writing/translating the Bible have been honest. As we all know, everyone is imperfect and sometimes people have their own agendas.

I think there so little that we know about any of this stuff.

So you think that Christ called female apostles and then the authors of the New Testament lied about it?

[Elphaba]

So dinner went on, and the entire time I'm asking myself if I have the faith to do this...I received the distinct impression that before the blessing, I should ask her Father (inactive) who was the patriarch in this home, if he would mind offering a prayer to ask for the Lords Spirit to be here. He agreed. So we assembled in the livingroom and placed a diningroom chair in the center of the room where the young woman sat...My nerves are shot, I'm feeling a bit emotional, and inadaquate to the task...Her Father begins to pray and asks for The Lords Spirit to be with me...in an instant The calming influence of The Holy Spirit of God settled upon me like warm water...from head to toe...my mind became very focussed, doubt was gone, feelings were in control, and I absolutely knew that God was with me...My companion annointed, and as I layed my hands upon her head and stated my authority(MP) etc...I could feel energy flowing through my hands as they connected to her head... the words just flooded my mind...I don't want to say I was compelled to speak the words...that would not be quite right...The only way I can explain it is that I felt "empowered" to say the words. I told her she would carry her child to term, and HE would be a healthy and strong child...gave her some general council about going back to church and studying scriptures etc... 15 years later, I still remember the exact words that concluded the blessing...they were: "Be assured that THE LORD will fulfill the words which he has spoken through his servants this day. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen."

I was very moved by your experience. To me, it personifies the true, exquisite meaning of beauty, and I think your fear before the blessing, and them ultimate calm, must have been a profound experience. It was all so loving and intimate and, best of all, a new life was born into a human cradle of comfort, safety and unconditional adoration. Without you, I suspect the baby still mght have been born, but it wouldn't have been the same. You gave the whole experience a gift of surety, a connection with your belief in God, with God, and what a powerful thing for everyone to rely on while waiting for your little one to arrive. What joy you gave!

Elphaba

[Snow]

<div class='quotemain'>So dinner went on, and the entire time I'm asking myself if I have the faith to do this...I received the distinct impression that before the blessing, I should ask her Father (inactive) who was the patriarch in this home, if he would mind offering a prayer to ask for the Lords Spirit to be here. He agreed. So we assembled in the livingroom and placed a diningroom chair in the center of the room where the young woman sat...My nerves are shot, I'm feeling a bit emotional, and inadaquate to the task...Her Father begins to pray and asks for The Lords Spirit to be with me...in an instant The calming influence of The Holy Spirit of God settled upon me like warm water...from head to toe...my mind became very focussed, doubt was gone, feelings were in control, and I absolutely knew that God was with me...My companion annointed, and as I layed my hands upon her head and stated my authority(MP) etc...I could feel energy flowing through my hands as they connected to her head... the words just flooded my mind...I don't want to say I was compelled to speak the words...that would not be quite right...The only way I can explain it is that I felt "empowered" to say the words. I told her she would carry her child to term, and HE would be a healthy and strong child...gave her some general council about going back to church and studying scriptures etc... 15 years later, I still remember the exact words that concluded the blessing...they were: "Be assured that THE LORD will fulfill the words which he has spoken through his servants this day. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen."

I was very moved by your experience. To me, it personifies the true, exquisite meaning of beauty, and I think your fear before the blessing, and them ultimate calm, must have been a profound experience. It was all so loving and intimate and, best of all, a new life was born into a human cradle of comfort, safety and unconditional adoration. Without you, I suspect the baby still mght have been born, but it wouldn't have been the same. You gave the whole experience a gift of surety, a connection with your belief in God, with God, and what a powerful thing for everyone to rely on while waiting for your little one to arrive. What joy you gave!

Elphaba

Man - you really lay it on thick. You're an ATHEIST. You beleive there is no God and that believers in God believe in a fantasy.

[pushka]

<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'>So dinner went on, and the entire time I'm asking myself if I have the faith to do this...I received the distinct impression that before the blessing, I should ask her Father (inactive) who was the patriarch in this home, if he would mind offering a prayer to ask for the Lords Spirit to be here. He agreed. So we assembled in the livingroom and placed a diningroom chair in the center of the room where the young woman sat...My nerves are shot, I'm feeling a bit emotional, and inadaquate to the task...Her Father begins to pray and asks for The Lords Spirit to be with me...in an instant The calming influence of The Holy Spirit of God settled upon me like warm water...from head to toe...my mind became very focussed, doubt was gone, feelings were in control, and I absolutely knew that God was with me...My companion annointed, and as I layed my hands upon her head and stated my authority(MP) etc...I could feel energy flowing through my hands as they connected to her head... the words just flooded my mind...I don't want to say I was compelled to speak the words...that would not be quite right...The only way I can explain it is that I felt "empowered" to say the words. I told her she would carry her child to term, and HE would be a healthy and strong child...gave her some general council about going back to church and studying scriptures etc... 15 years later, I still remember the exact words that concluded the blessing...they were: "Be assured that THE LORD will fulfill the words which he has spoken through his servants this day. In the name of Jesus Christ, amen."

I was very moved by your experience. To me, it personifies the true, exquisite meaning of beauty, and I think your fear before the blessing, and them ultimate calm, must have been a profound experience. It was all so loving and intimate and, best of all, a new life was born into a human cradle of comfort, safety and unconditional adoration. Without you, I suspect the baby still mght have been born, but it wouldn't have been the same. You gave the whole experience a gift of surety, a connection with your belief in God, with God, and what a powerful thing for everyone to rely on while waiting for your little one to arrive. What joy you gave!

Elphaba

Man - you really lay it on thick. You're an ATHEIST. You beleive there is no God and that believers in God believe in a fantasy.

So that means that she's not allowed to express compassion for somebody who does believe in God and the power of PH blessings? She's also not allowed to be moved by a very touching story?

Why don't you leave Elphie alone now Snow, it's getting tiresome...

[CrimsonKairos]

And pushka rushes to Elphaba's defense, right on cue.

[pushka]

I know, I know...lol...if anyone else wants my support, just PM me! :)