Now That Trump Has Won...

[Carborendum]

52 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

The one in the middle though - well, I really don't hear much from woke folks on them.    Depending on the particular brand of progressive, they can get rather uncomfortable talking about Asian Americans.  They tend to be ignorant of the past abuses, and sort of hold Asians in their brains as similar to the privileged whites. 

Killing of Vincent Chin - Wikipedia

I have not seen anything in my life that was anywhere near this ^ ^ bad.  It was shocking to hear about this.  Most people have this idea that "well, Asians don't really feel much racism..."

Yeah...  We do...

So, I figure if people are going to do stuff.  I'll "lean into it."  I'm a freaking Asian Engineer for Pete's sake. Duh-uh.  Can I BE any more of a stereotype?

Edited December 5, 2024 by Carborendum

[LDSGator]

2 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Killing of Vincent Chin - Wikipedia

I have not seen anything in my life that was anywhere near this ^ ^ bad.  It was shocking to hear about this.  Most people have this idea that "well, Asians don't really feel much racism..."

Yeah...  We do...

Yup, all my TKD instructors are Asian and they’ve experienced some racism too. It’s incredibly sad. 

[Vort]

13 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

I legitimately can't tell if he's pro-diversity or anti-diversity from this clip.

Vintage leftist viewpoint. SMH.

[Vort]

16 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

You voted for the guy who cheated on his wife with a p0rn star, right?

Hmmmm. Vote for a guy who committed adultery for cheap thrills (basically 98% of everyone in DC) or vote for someone who lies about her ancestry expressly for political gain. Tough, tough call.

Oh, wait. No, it's not.

16 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

Or was it the guy who was tweeting about his disappointment in his VP while there was literally an angry mob looking for said VP in the nation's Capitol?

Bull crap. The liars in the media, along with the liar AOC, claimed ten dead. In fact, four people died, all Trump supporters. Two died from heart failure. One died from drug misusage/overdose. One died from being shot by Capitol police while trying to enter through a window, an event that I remember exactly zero conservatives or Republicans decrying.

Your narrative of an "angry mob" seeking to overthrow the Constitution is a lie. The fact that the lie is promulgated by mainstream media doesn't make it any truer. Pointing this out just in case objective truth is important to you.

16 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

I'm aware of Warren's skeletons just as I am Trump's. I'll take the fake Indian.

Have you ever stopped to consider why you will "take the fake Indian"—or for that matter anyone else—over Trump? You're an atheist, so adultery per se can be of no moral consequence to someone like you. Yet you cite that as a motivating factor behind your blind hatred of Trump. You should go someplace quiet for a few days and look into your soul (or the atheist equivalent thereof) to find out why you jump so willingly onto the antiTrump bandwagon. (Spoiler: I suspect it has little to do with sexual morality, personal liberty, or national security, and everything to do with a social agenda you want to further.)

[SilentOne]

Both of my parents have taken DNA tests that showed no Native American DNA, but I tried the View Relationship thing with Pocahontas anyway.

[LDSGator]

9 minutes ago, SilentOne said:

Both of my parents have taken DNA tests that showed no Native American DNA, but I tried the View Relationship thing with Pocahontas anyway.

When I was in 8th grade we had to do a report on our biological family and their nationality. I’m adopted and at that time did now know my biological family . I also have blonde hair, blue eyes, and I am the whitest white guy you’ve ever seen.

With a complete straight face, I did my report on a local native american tribe.  I didn’t claim membership-but I dared anyone to call me out on it. 

 

[zil2]

1 hour ago, SilentOne said:

Both of my parents have taken DNA tests that showed no Native American DNA, but I tried the View Relationship thing with Pocahontas anyway.

Awww.  I was hoping we were all related.  Of course, maybe we still are and you just need more folks added to your tree!

[Phoenix_person]

8 hours ago, JohnsonJones said:

3.  They didn't give voice to everyone.  It was our way or the higway.  I don't agree with the pro-palestinian/anti-Israel movement in the Democrat party, but they should have at least had a spot at the table and be allowed to speak their minds.  If we want freedom of speech and freedom of choice, they should have been allowed to at least voice their concerns rather than be shoved into a corner.  It's a small matter, but when you've lost so many due to the other issues above, any small amount counts.  This applies to many of the smaller matters that were ignored as well (not as big media voice among young men, etc) which I feel didn't have as big an impact as the two items above, but also made the loss far worse.

Your entire post, but this part in particular is why folks up here in South Canada are riding HARD for Ken Martin. You essentially just outlined all of the best traits of Minnesota's DFL.

6 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

Lol yep - Folks of Korean descent are a minority in the US, but apparently not a "historically marginalized minority".   I hear the acronym NAAPI from my progressive buddies - Native American, Asian, Pacific Islander.  The first and last are brown people who have suffered from institutionalized racism.  The one in the middle though - well, I really don't hear much from woke folks on them.    Depending on the particular brand of progressive, they can get rather uncomfortable talking about Asian Americans.  They tend to be ignorant of the past abuses, and sort of hold Asians in their brains as similar to the privileged whites.  But "Asian privilege" sounds like they're being mean to minorities.  Best to not talk or think too much about them. 

There was literally an entire "Stop Asian Hate" movement on the left during COVID, but sure. And I'm pretty sure plenty of people have drawn comparisons between Trump's immigration policy and the Japanese internment camps of the '40s. We have a better memory than you give us credit for.

3 hours ago, Vort said:

Your narrative of an "angry mob" seeking to overthrow the Constitution is a lie. The fact that the lie is promulgated by mainstream media doesn't make it any truer. Pointing this out just in case objective truth is important to you.

In your own words, what happened at the Capitol on January 6th?

And keep in mind, I was in traction during the bulk of the J6 hearings, so I've seen the case against Trump. Full disclusure, I don't think Trump was legally guilty of anything more than being a buffoon. But the raw footage paints a somewhat different picture of the "peaceful tourists" themselves than the one you're trying to draw. 

I'm sure you'd be equally unbothered if the roles were switched and these were Democrats in the video, right?

3 hours ago, Vort said:

Have you ever stopped to consider why you will "take the fake Indian"—or for that matter anyone else—over Trump?

It's kind if a no-brainer for me, really.

3 hours ago, Vort said:

You're an atheist, so adultery per se can be of no moral consequence to someone like you.

Correct, it's not. I truly do not care who's sleeping with who, and I generally assume that most people in DC politics are deviants of some sort, regardless of party affiliation 

3 hours ago, Vort said:

Yet you cite that as a motivating factor behind your blind hatred of Trump.

Nope. I'm just continuously shocked and puzzled by the fact that the Religious Right suddenly stopped caring about moral fiber the exact moment one of the least moral people ever to seek government office became their (your) nominee. For most of my life, Republicans were bastions of conservative family values and prided themselves on being America's moral compass. You abandoned that for cheaper eggs and a few SCOTUS picks. And no, I'm not going to let you forget it. I may not have agreed with some of the things the GOP used to stand for, but I at least respected you guys for standing for something. 

3 hours ago, Vort said:

You should go someplace quiet for a few days and look into your soul (or the atheist equivalent thereof) to find out why you jump so willingly onto the antiTrump bandwagon.

Yesterday was my first time looking at this forum in almost a month. It was great. I might have to take a more permanent break. In that time, I attended meetings with both the DFL and the non-profit group I do organizing work for to talk about what went wrong federally, what went right locally, and what's next (I think I addressed that in a different post: listening). 

3 hours ago, Vort said:

(Spoiler: I suspect it has little to do with sexual morality, personal liberty, or national security, and everything to do with a social agenda you want to further.)

It has everything to with the fact that, as I recently said in a different thread, I am pro-people, not pro-governments. That means I'm not pro-politician beyond a given politician's ability and willingness to help people. I think Trump might honestly believe that his economic policies will save American workers. I think, on some level, the willingness is there. Maybe in a self-serving "look at the awesome thing I did" way, but I'll still give him credit. The problem is, I don't think his economic plans (tariffs) will work, now or ever. And I think a lot of people weren't read up on that before they cast their vote. They just wanted cheaper eggs and gas without realizing how many things could potentially get WAY more expensive if Trump follows through.

Edited December 5, 2024 by Phoenix_person

[Vort]

3 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

But the raw footage paints a somewhat different picture of the "peaceful tourists" themselves than the one you're trying to draw.

You're putting words in my mouth. I said it was not an insurrection; I didn't say it was a PTA picnic.

4 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

I'm sure you'd be equally unbothered if the roles were switched and these were Democrats in the video, right?

Oh, I'm not unbothered. That was disorderly conduct for sure, and presented at least the appearance of danger. (I think it was more than just the appearance of danger. I think there was a real threat, and I think we're lucky things didn't go much more drastically south.)

I have no problem having such drunken idiots and fools locked up and charged with disorderly conduct. I have a lot more problem with them being charged for insurrection, which is beyond the pale. I have a whole lot of problem with leftists pretending that Donald Trump (a) staged the event, (b) encouraged the event, and/or (c) refused to try to ameliorate the event.

8 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

I'm just continuously shocked and puzzled by the fact that the Religious Right suddenly stopped caring about moral fiber the exact moment one of the least moral people ever to seek government office became their (your) nominee.

Seriously? You haven't noticed that what you call the "Religious Right" has not been a major player in Republican circles for at least 20 years now? How can you possibly be surprised by what has been stupefyingly obvious for decades?

10 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

For most of my life, Republicans were bastions of conservative family values and prided themselves on being America's moral compass. You abandoned that for cheaper eggs and a few SCOTUS picks.

This is not merely wrong, PP. It's dishonest. You must know full well that this is a complete misdirection.

11 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

I may not have agreed with some of the things the GOP used to stand for, but I at least respected you guys for standing for something. 

Us guys? So you think I'm a Republican, then? Interesting.

11 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

Yesterday was my first time looking at this forum in almost a month. It was great. I might have to take a more permanent break.

Yes, I have noticed the same. Perhaps we would both do well to engage in better activities than squabbling on a discussion forum. I take that advice to heart, for a while at least, but keep coming back. As Robert Plant famously crooned, "I can't quit you, babe."

[Carborendum]

47 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

I'm just continuously shocked and puzzled by the fact that the Religious Right suddenly stopped caring about moral fiber 

Your timing is off by about 30 years.

We cared.  Then Clinton happened.  You won.  We lost.  We conceded.  The issue died forever.

We didn't kill it.  You did.  The media did.  We'd all given up on that as a political football a long time ago because YOU wanted it that way.  You demanded it that way.  Character doesn't matter, you said.  We fought.  But we realized the war over character was over.  We lost.

And now that you won, you're wondering why we're not fighting anymore?

How many politicians (right or left) actually care about family values?  I'd say that about 90% don't live those values themselves.  But only Republicans understand that the citizenry wants to live our lives in peace without having to fear losing our jobs because we called a trans person the wrong pronoun. 

We want to be able to keep our children without fear of having the state take them away because we didn't approve of their sex change operations that their teacher insisted that they needed.

We want our daughters to go to school without worrying if a boy decided he wanted to go to the girls room wearing a wig to ogle her.

We don't think it fair that a man competes in sports with women taking away titles and scholarships from them.

We don't want the government making us all so poor every year that eventually we'll all have to be dependent on the dole.

We don't want the government to take away our right to self defense so a criminal who doesn't care whether he obeys a law or not can come into our house and have their way with our lives and our property.

We want the rule of law, not mob rule of Antifa and other brownshirt organizations and continue let them go without any indictments -- even after arrest.

We don't want to be arrested for attending church in our cars with the windows rolled up because we violated COVID restrictions that were not enforced on anyone but church-goers.

We want to be able to peacefully protest the things we disagree with, and not fear the FBI breaking down our doors to arrest us in front of our children for doing so.

We want to be able to speak our political beliefs without being deplatformed or demonetized for simply speaking our opinions.

We want to have politicians who don't need to have Presidential pardons to clear their record after they leave office.

Is that enough for me to want to vote for the guy that I find morally repugnant, but will allow me to act as I please?  Heck ya.

Edited December 5, 2024 by Carborendum

[Phoenix_person]

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

And now that you won, you're wondering why we're not fighting anymore?

Just disappointed, mostly. I understand what you and @Vort are saying, but some conservative politicians still pretend they have some sort of moral high ground and that's just not true. Look at what happened with Hunter Biden. I'm not saying a pre-Trump Dem president wouldn't have done the same, but I imagine it would have raised some heck. But now? With the guy you guys voted into office? How are we supposed to take any outrage over Biden seriously when we're about to get 4 more years of the 🐱grabbing adulterer who pardoned Jared Kuschner's dad (and HOOOO BOY you should read what *he* got in trouble for).

And fwiw, a lot of folks on the left HATE that Biden pardoned Hunter. Yes, Trump lowered several bars of decency. It's clear that there is no longer a moral compass in Washington in either party, and that's a very bad thing, especially when we're about to get a second-term loose cannon of a president with executive privilege outlined heavily in his favor by SCOTUS. What could go wrong?

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

But only Republicans understand that the citizenry wants to live our lives in peace without having to fear losing our jobs because we called a trans person the wrong pronoun. 

If the ability to call a masculine woman in a dress "sir" is more important to you than your job, then I think you have some reflecting to do. 

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We want our daughters to go to school without worrying if a boy decided he wanted to go to the girls room wearing a wig to ogle her.

Funny how you never hear about the flip side of that particular coin.

 

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We don't want the government making us all so poor every year that eventually we'll all have to be dependent on the dole.

The biggest lie corporate America ever told is that it's the government that's keeping Americans in poverty.

https://www.manufacturing.net/labor/news/21203842/report-millions-of-full-time-workers-still-need-govt-aid

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We don't want the government to take away our right to self defense so a criminal who doesn't care whether he obeys a law or not can come into our house and have their way with our lives and our property.

Speaking of political talking points that should have been put to pasture years ago. Republicans have spent most of my life fear-mongering about Dems taking our guns. What are they waiting for?

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We want to be able to peacefully protest the things we disagree with, and not fear the FBI breaking down our doors to arrest us in front of our children for doing so.

Is this a widespread problem? Because it sounds like it might be cherry-picking, but I don't want to assume just because I don't know what you're talking about. I'd be interested to see exampleS of this.

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We want to be able to speak our political beliefs without being deplatformed or demonetized for simply speaking our opinions.

Then create a platform where your ideas are welcome. Free speech doesn’t apply to social media. For legal purposes, a for-profit company like Facebook or X has no more obligation to allow certain types of speech than a non-profit like 3H (whose rules are far more strict than anywhere else I lurk). It also begs the question of what sorts of opinions you feel are under attack. If it's that trans women are actually men, that box ain't shutting anytime soon. Have fun on X and/or Gab, I guess. Watch out for Nazis, though. They LOVE all that free speech.

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

We want to have politicians who don't need to have Presidential pardons to clear their record after they leave office.

Trump almost needed a pardon BEFORE starting his second term. What are we even talking about here?

54 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Is that enough for me to want to vote for the guy that I find morally repugnant, but will allow me to act as I please?  Heck ya.

Have fun with that I guess.

Edited December 5, 2024 by Phoenix_person

[Carborendum]

27 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

Have fun with that I guess.

By blaming it all on Trump and completely ignoring our fears like that is why Kamala lost.

Maybe your side should think about that for the next four years, or you'll lose again.

[LDSGator]

2 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

blaming it all on Trump and completely ignoring our fears like that is why Kamala lost.

Maybe your side should think about that for the next four years, or you'll lose again.

Before the right opens champagne and starts the party, remember that a lot can change in four years. 

This was more a “throw the bums out” election” than a red wave.  

[Phoenix_person]

13 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

By blaming it all on Trump and completely ignoring our fears like that is why Kamala lost.

I'm aware, which is why I save the spicy stuff for the internet. Time and place.

13 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Maybe your side should think about that for the next four years, or you'll lose again.

We are, believe me.

Edited December 5, 2024 by Phoenix_person

[LDSGator]

I’ve heard some on the right compare this to the 80’s Reagan landslides. Uh, no. Those were iconic and Reagan slapped Carter and Mondale around. Trump won-but it was not a landslide. 
 

Now, that said, in politics a win is still a win. The right should be happy, but not arrogant 

[LDSGator]

3 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

We are, believe me.

Democrats this cycle are doing what republicans usually can’t do-looking inward and asking “Are we wrong? Are we out of touch?”
 

That alone should terrify the right. If the democrats get it together and moderate themselves, 2026 will be 2006 all over again.  

[Ironhold]

19 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

Conservatives of old fought the civil rights movement tooth-and-nail, and Reaganomics played no small role in creating today's gaping wealth disparity. Your message definitely needs some tweaking, especially at a time when Reagan himself would barely recognize what his party has turned into.

I personally believe that the best way for society to move forward is to consistently test the old and new against each other in order to determine which is best and why. 

Sometimes the old ways lasted for a reason. 

Sometimes the newer is better. 

Sometimes old and new can coexist. 

Sometimes old and new can fuse together and bring about something better. 

Sometimes both are bad ideas and it's time to come up with something else. 

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Phoenix_person said:

If the ability to call a masculine woman in a dress "sir" is more important to you than your job, then I think you have some reflecting to do.

The point is that your job should not be at stake. That's immoral, far more immoral than calling a man a man, even when he's pretending to be a woman.

[LDSGator]

6 minutes ago, Vort said:

The point is that your job should not be at stake. That's immoral, far more immoral than calling a man a man, even when he's pretending to be a woman.

That’s a legit concern, and a problem that I don’t know how to solve. You’ll be unjustly fired for calling a transgender person the wrong name/gender. That is wrong. 
 

But, on the other side of the coin, if you go to work with a chip on your shoulder and pester the transgender person who is also doing their job and leaving everyone alone, then you should be fired. 

[Vort]

26 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

But, on the other side of the coin, if you go to work with a chip on your shoulder and pester the transgender person who is also doing their job and leaving everyone alone, then you should be fired.

I don't think anyone here argues that point. But it's not a parallel with transsexualism fad (or the anti-anti-transsexualism fad, as the case may be).

[LDSGator]

5 minutes ago, Vort said:

I don't think anyone here argues that point. But it's not a parallel with transsexualism fad (or the anti-anti-transsexualism fad, as the case may be).

It’s not a fad, it’s a legit concern. We’re pumping kids with drugs and letting them make choices before they have any clue what they are doing to themselves. You don’t need to be a Maga hatter to be concerned. 
 

As for adults, knock yourself out. I’ll call you whatever you want, and I expect the same respect in return.  

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Phoenix_person said:

Republicans have spent most of my life fear-mongering about Dems taking our guns. What are they waiting for?

Leftist antigun playbook:

1. Insist on draconian measures to spare the children. Refer to them as common-sense laws.

2. Demonize anyone who disagrees with you. Respond that they want the children to be killed, or at least that they don't care enough to save the children.

3. When it becomes clear that your draconian measures can't (yet) pass, agree to "compromise" in that you only demand that, say, half of your "common-sense" measures be made into law.

4. Never, ever, ever, EVER, under ANY circumstance, agree to a withdrawal of antigun legislation. Because that would be regressive, and children would die.

5. Rinse and repeat, paying special attention to #4.

The Democrats have indeed tried, time and again, to pass legislation contrary to the Second Amendment. If the Dems had their way, the guns would be gone (at least from the homes of law-abiding citizens). The Democrats are not waiting; they just have not (yet) been successful in their efforts.

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

Maybe your side should think about that for the next four years, or you'll lose again.

We can only hope.

I find myself literally laughing out loud at the Democrat/Leftist cries from women (womyn? Uterused people?) talking about 4B! No sex with men! Permanent birth control! Get sterilized!

By all means, do so. That will show us. Then we'll be sorry.

[LDSGator]

42 minutes ago, Vort said:

We can only hope.

I find myself literally laughing out loud at the Democrat/Leftist cries from women (womyn? Uterused people?) talking about 4B! No sex with men! Permanent birth control! Get sterilized!

By all means, do so. That will show us. Then we'll be sorry.

The women doing this fail to comprehend that there are other options for 80% of men, and these girls will just be ignored. It shows they have no understanding of anything past sex, and can’t provide any value to a man other than their bodies. 

I say they should continue their strike. I support them fully. I don’t want my single guy friends to date ANY of these girls! 

Edited December 6, 2024 by LDSGator

[Phoenix_person]

4 hours ago, Vort said:

The Democrats are not waiting; they just have not (yet) been successful in their efforts.

I think you underestimate how many leftists (who were already pretty gun-friendly) and even some liberals have been looking into gun ownership over the past month. My leftist FB groups have been flooded by gun ownership tips (muzzle awareness, chamber awareness, safety resources, etc). The left is shifting further left. And if you go far enough left, you get to keep your guns.