Taxes (BLECH!)

[skalenfehl]

Well I'll don't agree with that decision...

I so much liked the old site.

I hope I haven't said anything to offend you. If there is something I did or said, or any reason you don't like me, I would be happy to hear what you have to say so that I can make it right.

Please pm me, though. We're going off topic.

[miztrniceguy]

my wife is starting her 3rd home business, and we are thinking of making an umbrella company as an llc, and have all 3 under them...we were just talking about that tonight.

btw skal...congrats, i think you'll do a fine job

[skalenfehl]

my wife is starting her 3rd home business, and we are thinking of making an umbrella company as an llc, and have all 3 under them...we were just talking about that tonight.

btw skal...congrats, i think you'll do a fine job

That's awesome!

And thank you.

[RachelleDrew]

For this reason, I love my local H & R Block.

When I was in high school I just did all of my taxes online. But I was also only getting back $600 refunds then too so I wasn't so worried if they didn't come out perfect.

Now that I get back bigger refunds, I let somebody else do the math and paperwork. I don't want those numbers getting fudged either in my favor or against my favor. Hehe.

[Traveler]

So I was working on my taxes today (finally) and I filled in my info, put my W-2 and 1099 safely back into the drawer I had them in, and later when I wanted to ask my husband a question about his salary, they were gone. I hadn't moved from this seat, there wasn't any clutter around me, they hadn't fallen behind the desk, I hadn't stacked them on top of anything, so I started tearing through the drawer I had them in, looked in all the other ones even though I knew I didn't put them in there, dug through a nearby box even though I knew I didn't put them in there, and then I looked through all the drawers again and found them in the very, very back of the bottom drawer. They had fallen through the back of the top drawer all the way to the bottom. Ugh! It was good to know I put them where I thought I did.

That's just the beginning of my tax joy. I so hate taxes. I don't hate paying them as much as I hate filing them. One of my worst fears is being audited. I'm just afraid of making a boo boo and not realizing it. Luckily one year there was a boo boo and it was in my favor (actually, I think it was the Air Force finance office's boo boo) and the IRS sent us a letter saying they owed us over $500. We were terrified to cash it in case they were wrong, but we went over the numbers over and over again and finally realized that there was an error. Yay!

Misery loves company. Who else hates doing taxes? On a scale of 1 to 10, 1 being not hating it at all and 10 meaning you really, really, really hate it, how much do you hate it?

Following the example of my father I have invisted a part of my earnings since I was 8 years old. I have worked most of my adult life as an engineer but for the past 20 years my invistments have paid me more than my profession. It is most interesting to me that our government is intent on punishing me for this effort. Unlike the story of the ant and the grasshopper - in real life, foolish people believe they are entitled to require that my savings be given to them. In the last 50 years taxes for payments to those those in our society that are not mentiallly or physically disabled has increased over 2000 percent.

I do not mind helping others - but I would like to do so on intelligent terms and not on the terms of those that cannot manage their own finances.

This year I will pay 8 times in taxes what my earnings were my first year out of college. I am not really complaining - just that I really do not think it helps. I believe government has become the major problem.

The Traveler

[WANDERER]

I'm beginning to get a bit more canny about tax deductions...I've been a bit of an idiot in the past about it. There's a lot to be said for business deductions.

Skalenfehl, usually the mod job goes to someone who already does it. Wise pick I'd say : )

[Hemidakota]

T

The beauty of living in America is being able to start a small business, any kind, incorporate and write off your expenses. If you love photography, you can build a small studio in your home or landscape your yard for outdoor wedding pictures, etc. The rich use all these tax strategies and the tax strategies are there for a reason. You can go into partnership with your spouse and make it a side business. Your kids can be corporate officers in your company when they're old enough to work. All that wonderful company revenue stays in your household and much of what you needed to do (like landscape your home) became an expense. These principles can be applied to most kinds of businesses. The more small businesses that flourish the stronger our economy becomes.

If you are planning for such a venture, but do it soon before the money dries up.

[AKinPA]

10

I'm self-employed, too, but we have a lot of debt. We've paid off gobs of it over the last few years, but have been in a holding pattern for a little over a year while we recover from a nearly-dead period of work a year ago. Anyway, I didn't keep up with my estimated payments and we're "paying" for that now.

I have faith it will all work out, but maybe not before many more changes.

[a-train]

Alright, I have to admit I wanted to see the reaction. I do have some tax protesting firends, they don't make enough money to get caught anyway. By the way, Snipes was acquitted, he only has to pay back taxes.

Anyways, Social Security will bust soon and a new social liberal in the white house will speed our government funds into insolvency. Then, with the reality that it just isn't working, we'll get our reform. I just hope we can get this before the North American Union is full blown.

One day, America will be free again...

-a-train

[skalenfehl]

From what I understand, Social Security was put into the General Fund during the Vietnam War. We have no SS fund. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

[JohnBirchSociety]

At this point, we are told to sustained the law of the land. Yes! No matter if the IRS laws are not constitutional. We have wait until the Lord to say differently. As presented in the 12th Article of Faith:

The Supreme "Law" in the United States, at the Federal level is the Constitution.

Since the personal income tax is unconstitutional in more than on respect, we are not under obligation to the 12th Article of Faith in the matter.

It is absolutely vital that American LDS people learn what the term "Law" means in our nation.

I recommend reading Frederick Bastiat's excellent treatise "The Law" as a primer.

Again, if something is not constitutional, the 12th Article of Faith doesn't apply.

[NeuroTypical]

Again, if something is not constitutional, the 12th Article of Faith doesn't apply.

Just want to state the obvious here. JohnBirchSociety's claim is one held by, well, the John Birch Society. It is not held by or taught authoritatively by the church.

LM

[JohnBirchSociety]

Just want to state the obvious here. JohnBirchSociety's claim is one held by, well, the John Birch Society. It is not held by or taught authoritatively by the church.

LM

Ah, but it is, it is.

There's a ton of statements by the apostles / presidents of the Church saying that in the US the Constitution is to be followed, and that which is not according to the Constitution is not valid as law.

I think the best manner in getting rid of improper "law" (for lack of a better term) is through legislative action. We should elect reps, that will uphold the Constitution, not violate it at nearly every opportunity.

For those who don't pay income tax because it is unconstitutional:

You are right, it is unconstitutional. Be warned, that not a single person or group has ever won a case on those grounds in court. If you are caught not paying, you'll be made to pay, or you'll find yourself in jail. So if you chose to not pay, be ready for the consequences (even though your premise is correct)...

Let's strike the 16th "amendment" from the books, and get rid of the IRS, and return to a sound money system, with legitimate jury actions, etc...

That is the means to change, NOT just ignoring bad, unconstitutional "laws"...

[a-train]

Hmmm.. So should Rosa Parks have sat at the back of the bus? It was the law of the land you know.

-a-train

[Hemidakota]

You mean city ordinance, or perhaps those 'FEW' states who were in violation of civic rights guaranteed by the constitution. Is this correct?

[JohnBirchSociety]

Hmmm.. So should Rosa Parks have sat at the back of the bus? It was the law of the land you know.

-a-train

Please don't divert this discussion through the use of pristine, irrefutable logic.

Good point...another, perhaps better one, would involve the Founding Fathers, who were traitors to the British Crown...I'm glad they did not submit to tyranny.

And let us not forget the best one, the "extermination order"....

[JohnBirchSociety]

You mean city ordinance, or perhaps those 'FEW' states who were in violation of civic rights guaranteed by the constitution. Is this correct?

What about when (well actually it happens all the time now) the Federal Government violates the inalienable rights, some of which are written in the Bill of Rights? Are we to submit to these steps towards tyranny?

You see, I think the vast majority of LDS people make a mistake in the use of the 12 AofF. We believe in being subject to government when the government acts in its' proper role. When it doesn't, we certainly don't support it.

For example, if a LDS person found themselves in China during the communist revolution, should they have submitted to the communist murderers who gained control of the government?

Or should LDS people have followed the "law" as given by Hitler? Some did, and I don't believe Christ is going to hold them blameless behind the excuse that it was the "law"....

[NeuroTypical]

Again, if something is not constitutional, the 12th Article of Faith doesn't apply.

Just want to state the obvious here. JohnBirchSociety's claim is one held by, well, the John Birch Society. It is not held by or taught authoritatively by the church.

Ah, but it is, it is.

There's a ton of statements by the apostles / presidents of the Church saying that in the US the Constitution is to be followed, and that which is not according to the Constitution is not valid as law.

Get to quotin', son. The key word would seem to be 'authoritative' - let's see what you've got.

It would seem a false claim on it's face, especially now, with over half of the mormons in the world living outside of the US. I seriously doubt any statement made by any church member was ever intended to give the saints in China, for example, free reign to ignore all laws of their land. Or Britain. Or Mexico. Or Canada.

I think the best manner in getting rid of improper "law" (for lack of a better term) is through legislative action. We should elect reps, that will uphold the Constitution, not violate it at nearly every opportunity.

Sounds good to me.

LM

[Hemidakota]

The day will come, when the righteous of the land may have to defend our constitution against our own government. :<

[skalenfehl]

The day will come, when the righteous of the land may have to defend our constitution against our own government. :<

I believe that is happening now.

I listen to various conservative radio talk shows and watch several political talk shows on national news channels on the cutting edge. I never watch my local network news channels anymore. They're always behind with the news and conveniently leave out some points of a story.

[a-train]

Rosa Parks, and so many of her people were subjected to laws that were discriminatory. This is the most vile sort of legislated iniquity: the sort that protects the rights of or grants privileges to one group and denies another.

Taxes that are placed only on lower incomes are discriminatory. Today, 12.5% of every American's income up to $97,500 is taken for Social Security. A person making exactly that amount will pay just over $12,000 to this tax. Someone making 10 times the income ($1 Million) will pay that same amount, and so will everyone making millions more. Does this seem like a fair law? Is it indiscriminate?

The most repugnant form of discrimination is slavery. Under slavery, the slaves are disallowed the labor of their own hands while it is considered the property of their owners. The slaves are cared for and fed as the owners see fit, but they are not allowed anymore regardless of their productivity.

The most awful part about slavery is that the children of slaves are forced to work their whole lives for the benefit of others only to give their children to do the same.

Should we be concerned about legislation that empowers the federal government to place the burden of our retirement funding on the unborn? I certainly am. I don't like any function of government that allows us to live beyond our means and places the burden on our posterity.

I was not allowed to vote on whether or not 15% of my income throughout my whole life would be taken from me to benefit those who voted 'yes' on this plan. Taxation without representation?

I don't want my child to have her wages garnished for life so that I and my generation can afford to live beyond our means. The very notion of social security is discriminatory and akin to slavery.

I do not look upon the civil disobedience of those who aim to tear this system of injustice down with indignation. I view them as friends of my children.

-a-train

[kona0197]

Nothing you can do about it a-tain so why bother complaining? No one will listen. You are a slave to the system.

[skalenfehl]

Sean Hannity, Glenn Beck, Bill O'Reilley, Keith Olbermann and others beg to differ. Political views aside, their voices are being heard and I've seen the impact in the liberal media.

[kona0197]

People can talk all they like. That still will not stop them from taking money out of my paycheck.

[JohnBirchSociety]

Nothing you can do about it a-tain so why bother complaining? No one will listen. You are a slave to the system.

So how exactly are we to save the Constitution?

Joseph Smith seemed to think there was something we could do about the American collapse.

What can we do? Elect representatives that will follow their oaths to defend the Constitution without exception. Get rid of those who don't. Educate ourselves and our neighbors on the Constitution. Speak up where ever we may be about liberty (forums such as this are a good start). Open our minds and learn what the Founding Father really did (ain't democracy, friends)...

We can stem the tide of tyranny. And we can save the Constitution.

It won't be by remaining silent.