estradling75

Here are the stats I used U.S. divorce rates: for various faith groups, age groups and geographical areas In summary the commonly bantered 50% USA divorce rate is not entirely accurate. But that is the way it is trending. It later list several denominational groups who have rate varying between 29% to 21% depending on the denomination. This difference between the in faith marriages and the total divorce rate, is why I say the odds are against it. Clearly your mother wishes you had married a nice Catholic boy. :) I was meaning losing faith as in going inactive, but that has to be from God's perspective, and he doesn't hand out numbers. Neither do the various churches (that I am aware), so we have no stats on that trend. But we can learn what these groups, (including God) who know the numbers, say on the matter. The scriptures are pretty clear against it. The LDS church is against it, to the point that as a strongly family oriented Church, they tell the single woman not to compromise in the search for a worthy man even if it means remaining single for their entire life. You are in a better position to give the official Catholic position, but I would guess that your mom's reaction is pretty typical, and mirrors the official position?

The tools are the same... But people's capacity is finite. The basic day to day of keeping a marriage running pulls out alot of that capacity. Which means you have to choose your battles. Many of the issues to be faced in marriages are going to come up unexpectedly, so there is wisdom in minimizing the known risks if at all possible. In addition matters of Faith touch on matters of eternities. Losing a marriage is bad, losing your place in Heaven is worst. In mixed faith marriages the chance of losing faith is increased. And I know people like to point to themselves and say but I did it. And to them I say "Congratulations, Well done. You beat the odds." But that doesn't change the fact that the odds are against it.

There is also an all to human tendency to want to feel superior and better then others. This shows up in everything. And lets face it if someone tells you that God thinks you are better then everyone else for whatever reason, well that is a powerful stroke to the old ego.

Yeah I remember it too.. My bishop taught the Sunday lesson out of it once..

Here is another thought I had directly for this. How were you train/taught to forgive? Most likely you were taught as a child with a simple pattern. Someone did wrong, an adult made them say 'sorry' once they said sorry you were told to forgive and play nice. And you did. It worked. As you got older it became a pattern. They say sorry so you offer an olive branch. Which encourages even more sincerity on the part of the repenter, which triggers more feeling of forgiveness. Until you are both reconciled. Its a very good pattern that helps both party's get where they need to be. The problem is that it only works when you can trust that the other side means it or is trying. Also the Lord's commandments aren't to Repent or Forgive only if the other side does there part, it is a flat always. Its possible that by simply appearing to try to repent he is triggering a deeply ingrained habit of you extending the olive branch to match. It is not a bad habit in and of itself, just not good for this situation. And by not doing so you are getting a disconnected between what you 'feel' you should do, (A feeling trained into you) and what logic, reason, and common sense is telling you.

I think in many ways fulfilling the command to forgive is harder then fulfilling the command to repent. After all you don't have the guilt of your wrong doing to help motivate you. The fact that you are having doubts on if you have fully forgiven is normal. Continue to work on it, but don't beat yourself up over it. I would also advise you not to take stupid risks to prove that you have forgiven him, but it sound like you got that. As for not believing him, just remember we are also told by their fruits you shall know then and sinner must both Confess and Forsake the sins. Given how bitter his fruit was, it is entirely reasonable for you to expect to see serious Forsaking on his part before believing that he is truly repenting. Which is totally different then forgiving the actions. (although that line can appear blurry at times)

Hehe... I am glad we helped if only a little... I think it more of a miracle that we had a 100% agreement in the posts. (so far) I mean this is a discussion forum on the internet that should be impossible...:)

Sigh... You said I then I asked you to back up that interpretation explain why. Where anywhere in that post you parsed out 'every little thing'. You did not... you fell back to 'its my interpretation.' Calling it your opinion is more accurate. Logically you did a variation of the straw man fallacy. You reduced a complex issue (mixed marriages) to a overtly simple one (Every little thing) and then dismissed the simple one, trying to drag the complex one with it. Thus logical fallacy. As for thoughless... Here is the post And I asked you to show where anyone expressed that we should be thoughtless about it... You have not provided. Until you provide we can't be sure who you are calling thoughtless... You left it wide open to interpretation. Instead you jump back to the same post and claim interpretation again. Which means at the very least you are implying that poster was thoughtless... Versus what I think is most likely.. That he cut to the highlights. See this is another time I disagree with what your understanding of what is posted. And I know this one for a fact that you are wrong on. If I was upset I would accept your apology. But I am not upset so I say , "Thanks??" I know its not always an easy thing to say.

So now we add mind reading to you list of 'interpretations'... Seriously I was pointing out logical failures of your understanding of the post and later comments. Then you go and paint yourself all white and pure and cast me as blackguard. Well if that make you feel better about it go ahead.

When your interpretations don't fit the facts presented. You are the one that took the post to say that mixed marriages were simple little things. And you were the one to accuse others taking 'thoughtless positions' So who is the one really demeaning people here?

And where do you get the info that people are abandoning the possibility thoughtlessly? Or is that another one of your 'interpretations'? From what I see on this thread there has been alot of thought going on. Just because a position is different from yours doesn't mean it wasn't thought out

And thus we repeat

No do not... Words are just that... Actions will speak louder then anything and you have seen no real actions yet. If he starts paying child support (and if you don't want it, put it in to a saving [college/mission] account for your son) and then if he goes through the legal process to get the visitations allowed, to see your son. Then let him do so for a length of time, before you even start considering about considering it.

Indeed that is what I took from his statement.. A simple declaration that mix marriages were too much effort and to likely to fail to be worth it in his opinion Which you responded with Please note that at this point you are the one equaling mix faith marriages and the struggles that come with it as 'single little things' Not mrmarklin. No where in his post can that exaggeration be supported.

Are we even talking the same language here? "Don't do it" is a perfectly valid opinion. You don't like it and don't agree with it which is also perfectly fine. But if you are going to argue against it you need to target what was said. Not an Exaggerated, blown out of all reasonable recognition, mockery of what was said.

Right it does cause friction... but it is entirely unfair to assume that mrmarklin was equating the friction that comes from fundamental differences in religion as the same friction as liking different flavors of ice cream. As for what makes one ok over another the other. It comes down to personal preferences. When it comes to choosing a marriage partners people have different things that are deal breakers. Some might require being of the same faith, some might require same understanding of having children. Others will not care. So one person saying 'don't do it' is just as valid of an opinion 'sure go ahead' or 'make sure you talk about it first.' Personally I think mine is best, 'Ask God' but you know that is just an opinion like everyone elses

Which when looking at the potential issues is a valid opinion to have. Hardly fair to equate it to needing to agree on every little thing like you did.

Wow that is quite a reach off what he said. The subject is Mixed Faith marriages and a good number of the issues that brings up are hardly little things. Given that the church strongly encourages people to marry within the faith, its clear these issues are anything but trivial

Which evades the question that you were asked. And that is why are you asking? It sounds like you already have your answers.. Which means you are not looking for advice...(which is the board you are in) If you are looking to discuss various aspects and differences between believers and non believers, then that should be in the discussion forums.

Right but in the case of the OP, according to her own posts it appears that she did something to shatter his trust in church related things. Therefore to me it seems very unlikely that he will take her desires to be active and raise kids in the church seriously. Worse case is that he will humor her until it comes right down to the wire thinking she'll back off when pushed on it.

Anatess you are making the primal mistake of thinking that everyone one lives like you and your husband. They do not. All you have to do is listen to the stories of people that where blindsided by the actions of there spouse to know this. While I agree with you in that it should happen I think the 50% divorce rate speaks pretty loudly that many times it does not.

At that level I have no idea....It is bridge I hope to never have to cross. I prefer to keep my relationship adjustments to the trivial annoyances

While I think you have been given alot of good advice and things to look for. I am kind of surprised that the hands down best advice has not really been given. And that is have you prayed about it? Who we marry is easily one of the most important choices we will ever make. I can only think of maybe one or two other choices that could possibly top it for how much of an impact it will have in your life. Marriage is full of unexpected and unforeseen challenges on top of the ones we expect. Yet time an time again people get married simply because they are 'In Love..' and other related emotions and ideas. Without talking to the Guy that sees how everything fits together and knows the best path for them personally. Take it to God in prayer, fasting, and humbleness. One you have your answer then you can follow the advice given that relates to whatever path you are to follow

Its not always about trust... Its about people being alive and growing (and therefore changing) He could be perfectly honest and trustworthy and still reach a point were he comes to you and says, 'you know that agreement we have... I doesn't match my interests anymore, and I wish to renegotiate'

Given that you called the other missionary smart... and imply that you wish you would have done so yourself... Makes it a valid point. You don't really get credit for obeying the law if you would have clearly broken it if you had thought of it first.