lagarthaaz

I so hear what you are saying...it can be VERY annoying, but I've learned to ignore it because it's just not going to change. I just deleted my long whiney post about the abuse of our church building by four different wards... Best not to even get me started on the subject :)

Our Stake have insisted we use the terms 'Singing Time and Gospel Instruction' as part of what constitutes the session called 'Sharing Time'. Up until recently I assumed 'Sharing Time' was the lesson time given by the Presidency, but they are right, the Handbook states that it consists of both Singing Time and Gospel Instruction. The way we structure our Primary is as follows: Opening Exercises (Talk, Scripture, Article of Faith, Announcements) - All Primary for first 10-15 mins.Junior Singing Time and Gospel Instruction/aka Sharing Time - (Seniors go to their classes)Senior Singing and Gospel Instruction - (Juniors go to their classes)It works well, the kids are happy, and having the Singing Time first gives them some time to move around and have fun.

Try explaining this one to your children when their father is not a member of the church.

That's what I thought, and I was a litte surprised when I was 'encouraged' to 'read the handbook' and 'align' our practices with it. As far as I knew, that's what we were doing! Not much response to this question here unfortunately, as I am genuinely interested in how Sharing Time is structured elsewhere and am more than happy to alter our routine if it's meant to be a certain way. Much of the Primary chapter in the Handbook is all about flexibility depending on the needs of each unit...so I have always interpreted the instructions for Sharing Time in much the same way. Thanks for your response :)

A recent talk by Elder Ballard on this very topic: 'There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking questions' "Let me make sure that you are hearing my epistle and that you understand this important point. There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking questions or investigating our history, doctrine, and practices. The Restoration began when Joseph Smith sought answers to his sincere questions... When someone comes to you with a question or a concern, please do not brush the question off—do not tell him or her to not worry about the question. Please do not doubt the person’s dedication to the Lord or His work. Instead, help the person find the answers to their questions... We have heard stories where someone asking honest questions about our history, doctrine, or practice were treated as though they were faithless. This is not the Lord’s way. As Peter said, “Be ready always to give an answer to every man [or woman] that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you... We need to do better in responding to honest questions. Although we may not be able to answer every question about the cosmos or about our history, practices, or doctrine, we can provide many answers to those who are sincere. Help those with questions to realize that the Lord does not require His Saints to have advanced degrees in history and Church doctrine... The Church is blessed with trained scholars and those who have devoted a lifetime of study, who have come to know our history and the scriptures. These thoughtful men and women provide context and background so we can better understand our sacred past and our current practices." Russell M. Ballard (September 13, 2015).

Yes I thought it was fine to do it that way too, maybe this is a case of taking the Handbook too literally...eg. if the 'elements' of Sharing Time are numbered 1, 2, 3 and 4 - then she is assuming they should happen in that order. She's a wonderful woman who prides herself on 'knowing' the Handbook, but I read it as allowing for more flexibility than what she's suggesting. I'm willing to change if I've got it wrong though! It just makes sense to me to break things up with the Singing Time straight after Opening Excercises as it also helps to re-energise the children. If the kids have been sitting through 70 mins of Sacrament meeting (even though they have time for a break they all literally come running down to the Primary room), then 10 or more minutes of Opening Exercises...it's a long time for little ones especially to be sitting still if we then add on another 15 mins of Gospel Instruction. Thanks for sharing, it'll be interesting to see what others are doing too :)

Just wondering if anyone can tell me how you organise your Sharing Time? After looking at the Handbook, and Section 11.4.2, I have taken the 'order' there to be reasonably flexible in that it "normally includes the following elements" but does not specify that they should necessarily be in the order stated on the page (Opening Exercises, Gospel Instruction, Singing Time). The 'elements' are numbered 1 through to 4. Because we meet late in the day and the children are tired and hungry after being in Sacrament Meeting for 70 minutes, we have opted to have Opening Exercises followed by Singing Time to break the monotony for them, and then do Gospel Instruction. The children are still getting the full elements of the program, just not in the order of 1-4 in the Handbook. I have recently been advised by the Stake Primary Secretary that we should follow the order stated in the Handbook, but my understanding has always been that the order is up to the Primary Presidency as long as all the elements are being covered. The pattern I'm following was also set by the previous Primary Presidency for many years - but have we been doing it wrong all this time? Any suggestions would be appreciated - thanks!

Forget about the ponies - I want the David Bowie 'Labyrinth' poster :)

I am from Australia too, and have had similar experiences both here and in Utah, so I don't think the problem is universal to 'Utah Mormons'. People just get busy and set in their routines and the 'busy-ness' of Sundays, and I think sometimes we don't take time to stop and really 'see' who is new to the ward and welcome them. When I was in Utah, I did find that eventually I did get to know some really lovely people as friends - but it just took time to settle in. You said "There are a few other families that have moved in during the past couple years and they, too, are ignored." - just wondering how you know that if you've only recently moved there? If this is the case - can you reach out to these families, something easy like a playdate for kids or something - then you'll get to know the parents and start to forge relationships in the ward. Can you also seek out the EQ Pres, Bishop, RS Pres and Primary Pres...make sure they all know who you are (with the new focus on ward councils you'll hopefully get a mention by at least one of them). Having said all that, I do understand the challenge of being in a ward dominated by major family or cultural groups. It can feel isolating for those of us on the 'outside' to see large families in the church socialising together to the exclusion of others, but we need to remember that they are simply nurturing their own family relationships. It will take time, but don't worry, you will make friends in your new ward...just keep reaching out to others and try not to be discouraged in the meantime. :)

I enjoyed reading this from the lds.org Newsroom: To him there was no conflict between religion and science, but a perfect harmony that further strengthened his testimony of a Supreme Being. “Science is completely compatible with the teachings of why we’re here. And while there are some things that I don’t fully understand, I know I will. ... I just marvel at how the scientific approach has allowed us to understand a lot of things about Father in Heaven’s universe and His work and people that are complementary to the religious principles.”... Elder Scott spent his life in the pursuit of truth. He had the mind of a scientist but the soul of an apostle of God. He bore testimony that while scientific truths are relative, God’s truths are absolute and will ultimately bring joy to those who follow them. “I think [with] a life centered in truth, with values that are held and kept, and a recognition that we are not all alone, we can receive guidance from the Lord through the Holy Ghost. That is the core of happiness.” The photo montage the Newsroom put up is lovely - I shed a few tears.

Just wondering what anyone thinks of eternal family bonds - for the millions of children born to in a mostly unplanned manner to unwed mothers and who may never even know who their biological father is. Or those who are born to evil predators devoid of real love for their children. Do you also believe that these children 'knew' their parents in pre-mortal life?

Well, once upon a time if I'd been called to Primary I would have felt physically sick at the thought of being 'stuck' with a bunch of kids for 2 hours every Sunday. My needs were different back then - so I do get where you are coming from. Having said that, in recent years I've been in Primary pretty much non-stop and strangely enough it's become my absolute favourite place to be. It's also turned out to be the place where I get to connect on a more personal level with members of my ward. There's nothing wrong with taking the initiative - talk to your bishop about your talents and interests and desire to serve. Yes he does have inspiration on his side, but he's not a clairvoyant and would probably appreciate getting to know you a little better so he can find the best way to help you as one of his flock. A visit with you may even be an answer to the bishop's prayers about a certain calling in the ward. And for what it's worth, I don't give a razz about 'lds culture' - there's nothing wrong with you telling your bishop how you feel and what your needs are - is there a rule that says you shouldn't do this?

Oh yes, pretty much any of the auxiliaries need people to help out in various ways. As a Primary Pres I am always short of a teacher or two every Sunday and often end up taking classes myself while a counsellor does Sharing Time. If I had a willing helper to fill in regularly, I would shower them with eternal gratitude, praise and occasional chocolate :)

Interesting that it's so different depending on where people live. Looks like splitting the classes just depends on the culture and needs of the ward. If we combined our two classes we could have up to ten pre-teens in one room, and I hear you about the boys JAG, our boys are all great kids but they are definitely playing up for the girls (and the other boys!). Thanks for the responses everyone! :)

Just wondering if anyone can tell me if in your ward they separate the 10/11 year old Valiant classes by gender? I can't see anywhere in the handbook where this is mandated - or maybe I'm not looking properly? We simply can't get enough teachers for all of our Primary so I'm looking at possibly combining some classes. I received a fairly strong reaction to the suggestion of combining the Valiant girls and boys, and have been told 'we've always split the boys and girls for that age group because they are going into YW/YM soon, and the boys have their priesthood preview this year, etc.'. I know the church traditionally used to have the MerrieMiss and Blazer classes, but I was under the impression those were done away with years ago. Anyone here with experience in this area? I'd appreciate some insight from others. Thanks!

Here are three references that I found...the talk by President Uchtdorf was wonderful. Sorry for the mad copy/paste job I've done, I'm too tired to figure out how to do it all properly :) Are we on autopilot, going through the motions, attending our meetings, yawning through Gospel Doctrine class, and perhaps checking our cell phones during sacrament service?By President Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Second Counselor in the First Presidency url: https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2015/04/the-gift-of-grace?lang=eng Habit Number 3: Make Time to Set Aside Your Mobile DevicesIt is refreshing to put aside our electronic devices for a while and instead turn the pages of the scriptures or take time to converse with family and friends. Especially on the Lord’s day, experience the peace of participating in a sacrament meeting without the constant urge to see if you have a new message or a new post. The habit of setting aside your mobile device for a time will enrich and broaden your view of life, for life is not confined to a four-inch (10 cm) screen. By Elder José A. Teixeira, Of the Seventy url: https://www.lds.org/ensign/2015/05/sunday-morning-session/seeking-the-lord.p1?lang=eng In many ways the world today is more challenging than it was 13 years ago. Our young men and young women have many more distractions to sidetrack them in their preparations for both a mission and a future happy life. Technology has expanded, and almost everyone has access to handheld devices that can capture the attention of the human family of God for both great good and unconscionable ill....Are you careful with your time—avoiding inappropriate technology and social media, including video games, which can dull your spiritual sensitivity? By Elder M. Russell Ballard, of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles url: https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2015/04/the-greatest-generation-of-young-adults?lang=eng

Or maybe I should say 'Lehi's dream comes to Australia'. 26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth. 27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit. ...33...And after they did enter into that building they did point the finger of scorn at me and those that were partaking of the fruit also; but we heeded them not. (1 Nephi 8:26,33) I came home from work today and my husband flicked on a current affairs program that just happened to show an interview with the actors from the Book of Mormon musical. They were mocking the missionaries and laughing hysterically about comments they were making about the church that were unbelievably ignorant and ill-informed. I have read about the musical on American news websites and lds forums like this one, and thought I was ok with just ignoring its existence ('heeding it not' as Lehi said). But, I was totally unprepared for how it made my heart stop cold when I realized it was coming right here to my own community. To see people on a popular television show openly mocking my religion was really quite confronting. We have such a small population of LDS in this largely secular country where Mormons are mostly known as stereotypes (missionaries on bikes, pushy missionaries who 'put their foot in the door', polygamy, and I've even heard that Mormon women are not allowed to cut their hair!). I can imagine how much worse it's going to be when the musical arrives here and mocking Mormonism becomes part of regular conversation. I suppose the church has the next 18 months or so to figure out how to deal with the possible effects of this musical in Australia...the missionaries in this article have the right idea, but I don't know how their plan would go over here. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/danielle-tumminio/dont-judge-a-book-of-mormon-by-its-cover-how-mormons-are-discovering-the-musical-as-a-conversion-tool_b_3267252.html Has anyone here seen the musical or dealt with the effects of being made a laughing stock in the community because of it? And why the heck is it ok to bash us for our religion on a current affairs program - would anyone be brave enough to discuss a musical about Jews, Buddhists, Hindus or Muslims whilst chortling with hilarity? There would be discrimination lawsuits galore!

I'm curious, so are you saying that God will not sometimes reveal his existence to an individual who is not actively seeking him? I suppose Paul is not a perfect example of this, since in a way he did believe he was serving God by persecuting the followers of Jesus, but God did definitely reach out to him in a dramatic way to bring about his change of heart when he was least expecting it. In the Book of Mormon, Alma the younger had a similar experience where an angel appeared to him and asked him why he was persecuting the church of God.

I second what Palerider said, have a sit-down with your bishop. You don't have to feel so different or unworthy - most of us in the church have had our challenges to overcome, and nobody is ever as 'perfect' as they may come across. Remember church is a hospital for sinners, as well as a haven for saints. Just start going to meetings and eventually some faces will become familiar, you'll catch each other's eye and smile and nod and you will start to feel less alone there. Also give your RS President a call and ask if there are any mother's groups where you can meet other young mothers with children. In my ward the mums with young children take turns meeting at each other's houses once a week for playdates. It's an opportunity to socialize and share with women of a similar age with young children. Have you thought about having the missionaries over for a meal or to give a family home evening lesson? They can bring a special spirit into your home that may touch you and your husband and motivate you to continue striving to return to activity in the church. Good luck, let us know what happens!

I don't see anything wrong with having refreshments after a baptismal service at church. People often have other places to go on Saturday mornings (when most of our baptisms happen) so it's nice to keep the service and the refreshments at the same place. My ward often has refreshments for after the baptism - usually just some cake, sandwiches and juice. People who are attending just bring a small plate of food, or the family provide it. They set a table up just outside the baptism room and the refreshments aren't brought out until after the baptismal service is over. If it's for a child, they often receive gift bags from various people and congratulations. It's a lovely way to end the service, particularly for children and adults who don't have family members in the church. Some families do choose to have their refreshments at their home instead. The RS President sounds like a refreshment Grinch...I'd have food anyway (she doesn't run the building!), too bad if she doesn't like it. As long as it's cleaned up afterwards there shouldn't be a problem.

I just hate facebook for the most part... :)

I saw a facebook post a couple of months ago where someone had recorded a storm that was going on outside our local temple. The recording was taken from inside the temple, looking out through a window at the wind and chaos going on outdoors. I also wonder if the phone ban in temples might be a reaction to the social media obsessed generation we have become. So many people now feel the need to record absolutely everything, even what should be the most private and sacred moments of their lives (eg. births, precious moments with children, intimate moments with lovers and friends or sick relatives, funerals, etc). If there wasn't a specific prohibition on speaking of sacred things outside of the temple (let alone recording them), I imagine we'd be seeing 'my first endowment session' recorded in glorious technicolour detail on facebook the second it happened.

Now that's dedication - I am super-impressed with how you manage to do that! Do you skim through parts or listen to it all? How do you do work and concentrate on the scriptures at the same time? I tried listening to scriptures on mp3 during my drive to and from work (a total of about an hour) but found it distracted me too much from driving as I kept wanting to replay certain bits to understand them better. For safety's sake I stopped listening to scriptures in the car, which is sad since it's pretty much the only time I get alone during the day and can concentrate on spiritual rather than temporal things.

Thanks again for your responses everyone - there's obviously several ways to approach the subject and appreciate the alternative perspectives (although I'm still in disagreement with some views expressed here) :)