NeedleinA

Members
  • Content Count

    3247
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    46

Reputation Activity

  1. Love
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    What you say above sounds good, NT, but IMO it misses the central point.
    Sister Liv has urges to fornicate (with members of her own sex). This is how she casually defines herself—sister, YW leader, queer, daughter of God, likes long hikes and camping, etc. Just another morally neutral descriptor.
    So replace "fornicate (with members of her own sex)" with any other carnal urge toward sin, and tell me how people would respond to its usage as a morally neutral descriptor. Try "fornicate with her neighbor's husband", or "molest young children", or "abuse small animals", or "embezzle funds from her employer", or "curse at loved ones when she's not feeling well". None of them really work.
    Now, factor in that large swaths of society, including those who call themselves Saints, even on this list, openly advocate for the Church's acceptance of homosexuality. Rather than standing firmly against such agitators and making it clear that we reject all sin in any form, even sin that's currently popular, we instead take a mealy-mouthed approach that doesn't exactly say that homosexuality is okay, but simply avoids the issue of morality and proclaims that homosexuals are people, too!
    Duh.
    Can you see that being done with those who are sexually attracted to children? With those who have a terrible temper and a propensity toward physical abuse? With those who are prone to lying and deceiving incessantly? With those who struggle with pimping out their daughters? With those who enjoy kicking puppies and are constantly tempted to do so?
    The teaching "Homosexually inclined people are children of God and heirs to salvation if they accept Christ" is, I daresay, perfectly fine with and accepted by 98% of Latter-day Saints. Few would argue with it. But it is assumed that the next sentence clarifies, "To accept Christ means to follow his teachings, put off the natural man, and reject carnal actions such as homosexual activity or nurturing homosexual attractions." That latter sentence is missing, and the silence is deafening.
    Many young Latter-day Saints are being influenced and deceived by the lies of the political Left. At or near the front of this pack of lies is the lie that homosexuality is morally acceptable, a wonderful expression of human love to be nurtured and encouraged in anyone who claims to feel that way, and that anyone who claims otherwise is a "homophobe" and should be shunned from all polite society (and from all economic participation, as far as possible). Our children are hearing these lies, and many of those precious young people are buying into them. We are literally seeing our children being taken from the truth before our eyes.
    So what is our response? Is it to stand firm as an example to our children, to fight the good fight, to reject evil in all its guises? Or is it rather to talk about love and acceptance and tolerance and all the other buzzwords that sound so good but that the political Left has perverted over the last two full generations as shibboleths of political correctness?
    Please show me how Sister Liv's open proclamation of her "queerness" and Sister Eubank's subsequent thanks to her make sense in the context of any temptation toward moral perversion, especially sexual perversion, other than homosexuality. If we're talking about a propensity toward sex with little children, are we going to thank people for their bravery in admitting such—especially when their "admission" is really more of a laundry list of personal identifiers? "I'm a son, a brother, a Young Men's president, a man who dreams about sex with little boys, a son of God, and a program manager at work"? How's that going to go over? "Thanks so much for that inspiring introduction, Brother Lyle!" I don't buy it.
  2. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Carborendum in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    JJ, I don't know if you intended this,  but the take-away from such an experience is that 
    1) We all have disabilities of some sort.
    B) It would probably be better if we all just did our best to deal with it as much as possible.
    Finally) We should be very discriminating when we decide with whom to share our difficulties.
    Yet the tone of your post seemed to try to argue that we SHOULD be open with whom we share our difficulties.  Did I misread you?
  3. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Just_A_Guy in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    1.  Good.  And of course, heterosexual  LDS members have the advantage that there has not been a broadly publicized, well-funded movement with support in academia and the mental health professions that has specifically targeted LDS youth and insisted that heterosexual Church members will never find fulfillment and meaning within the confines of the law of chastity.
    2.  How is a propensity to any sort of behavior a “choice”?  I’ll agree that dispositions or predilections can be reinforced by the consequences of prior behavior—but this is also true to some degree in matters of sexual predisposition; which is one reason that the number of youth identifying as LGBTQ has (IIRC) doubled or tripled over the past fifteen years.  (And also why we’ve seen numerous reports of transgender teens who, once removed from their school peer groups due to COVID, decided that they were actually cisgender after all.) 
    Anyone who says “I am this way and I have no need to change, and you need to acknowledge that I have no need to change”, is practically by definition seeking validation.
    3.  “Brainwashed”?  There was something wrong with them (and with all of us).  They (and we) want to sin.
    And . . . is the modern trend of them just committing suicide, supposed to be better than whatever we had decades ago?  “Better dead than closeted”—is that the mantra now?
    And, we’re just going to give a pass to the LGBTQ advocates (and the rest of the proponents of the sexual revolution) who for decades said “your life will never be truly fulfilling or meaningful or worthwhile unless you’re getting laid, when you want, with whoever you want”?  We’re going to rewrite history and pretend that LGBTQ advocates were just fine, all along, with the Church’s insistence on celibacy for gay members; and that it was the big bad Mormon Church telling chaste LGBTQ members that they had no place among us?
    4.  The same as the rest of us.  Our hearts.  Our desires.
    2 Nephi 4:31-32.  Mosiah 3:19.  Mosiah 5:2.  Alma 5:12-14.
    I don’t deny that, especially in matters of sexual orientation, it can be gut-wrenchingly hard (in some cases, impossible in mortality) to completely get there.
    But if we don’t want that change, we’re not saints.  And I think the Church membership generally is entitled to know that any given nominal member at least wants it—Mosiah 18:10, and all that.
  4. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Just_A_Guy in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    1.  I was referring specifically to the parts of your post that I had quoted.  I hope many LGBTQ members are enjoying happy, fulfilling lives by seeking to be disciples of Christ and earnestly striving to follow all His commandments, not excluding (and of course, not limited to) the Law of Chastity.  
    2.  The thing is, while I acknowledge that their situations are unique—they are not the only people who struggle with some kind of propensity for sin.  What other group of people in the Church who are afflicted with a common weakness, have ever sought validation for the weakness itself and affirmed a hope that the weakness—even if not acted upon—remain a part of their mortal identity?  Porn users like myself, don’t.  Habitual cussers (also like myself), don’t.  Bad spouses and inadequate parents (also like myself), don’t.  Drug users, don’t.  People who are attracted to children, don’t.  Where is the theological or ecclesiastical precedent for this?
    3.  Yes, but teenagers have walked this road through time immemorial; including in the 1970s and 1980s when Church leaders and institutions were saying and doing some very shocking things.  Yet the suicide epidemic came, not in 1975 or 1985; but in the early 2000s as the gay rights movement caught fire.
    The trauma isn’t in being taught sound doctrine or being held to the behavioral norms that logically flow from that doctrine.  The trauma is in the tension between sound doctrine on the one hand, versus distorted definitions of self-worth and self-fulfillment and the meaning of life on the other hand.
    4.  I didn’t think we needed to debate the question of whether lifelong fulfillment can be found in celibacy, because your last post seemed to acknowledge—indeed, seemed premised upon—the idea that this is something that is indeed happening in the Church on a widespread basis. 
    To the extent that a truly committed, obedient, chaste person finds ostracism in the LDS community upon announcing themselves as LGBTQ and insisting that they have no inclination to have that change—the result, I think, isn’t a factor of cultural homophobia.  It’s a factor of the generalized LDS belief that it is both possible and imperative to use the Atonement to at least try to change one’s sinful nature; in conjunction with a sense of bewilderment as to why someone wouldn’t even try to use the Atonement to at least hope for a purification of their nature, while still demanding the privilege of acceptance in a community that is under covenant to do just that. 
     
     
  5. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Just_A_Guy in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    Suzie, I hope what you say is true.  
    But the thing is, for the last thirty years the party line has been that what you describe—a LGBTQ individual finding contented fulfillment in a lifelong commitment to celibacy—is emotionally, psychologically, neurologically, evolutionarily impossible. 
    And a lot of us are kinda wondering why it’s so desperately important for us to know that a person is deeply tempted to commit a sin he has sworn never to commit, unless he indeed characterizes the issue as a “struggle” and wants third parties to support him in that struggle. 
  6. Like
    NeedleinA got a reaction from Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    Gallup Poll -  2/24/21

    QUESTION: I know what some Church leaders think, but I wonder what you think...
    is this self-identification a learned behavior, perpetuated by people trying to 'normalize' it OR is God simply sending more non-heterosexual individuals to earth in these latter generations?
    SIDE NOTE: 
    Currently Gallup says 1 in 6 adults of Generation Z identify as LGBT now. 

    If it is a learned behavior, what will the percentage be of LGBT for Generation Alpha, Beta, etc. at this pace?
    If it is a learned behavior, what happens to the LDS % of LGBT every time someone in authority in the Church tries to cast it in a positive light or normalize it?
  7. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to scottyg in Celestial Room   
    Although this is off topic, I was in a meeting once with the Presiding Bishop of the church. He made the remark that the real reason for 401k/retirement plans being introduced in the world was so that in "retirement" individuals and couples would be able to serve in temples and as missionaries while still relatively young. The Lord was providing His servants with additional opportunities to help each other. Church leaders feel sorrow that so few choose to serve missions in retirement, and instead choose to travel the world, go on cruises, buy new cars for no reason, and waste their wealth in riotous living. So may aspects of our lives are so easy compared to the tens of billions of people who lived on the earth before us, and even billions more currently living on it. How do we choose to thank the Lord for what He has given us? Do we freely give of ourselves, or just build bigger barns?
  8. Haha
    NeedleinA reacted to NeuroTypical in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    Y'all are on to me.   This is actually me:

  9. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    Sure. That doesn't mean it's always wrong to feel like you've been bad. Sometimes you have been bad. That should be recognized and acknowledged.
    I realize my attempts at silly humor don't always come across as such. My comment above was meant humorously, not cuttingly.
    The "extreme examples" are there because I want to point out a fundamental flaw in the thinking. If you just redefine away problems and state that thus-and-such condition does not exist because you refuse to acknowledge the wording, you haven't actually solved any problems. You're just playing word games.
    If "bad man" has no meaning, then what we're really doing is reassigning the meaning of "bad man" to something else, like "man who makes bad choices and ends up doing horrific things" or "poor, messed-up guy who takes pleasure in inflicting pain". How is that any better than simply saying "bad man"?
  10. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to scottyg in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    In our ward and stake we actually don't have this problem, but the opposite (at least as far as youth/parents report it to their Bishops). Pre-marital sex is way down amongst heterosexual youth. The only ones that seem to be engaging in sex are those that claim to be gay. Our straight boys have 2 main problems - pornography, and slothfulness. All they do is watch anime and porn, and play video games. Zero ambition to do anything with their lives. The girls have more problems surrounding mental health and abuse of various kinds - depression, anxiety, alcohol, drugs, cutting, etc... Porn use amongst young women is also rising.
    The number of youth in our stake/area going on dates, and even interacting with the opposite sex, is falling. A counselor in our Stake Presidency is a High School principal, and he has said over the last 5-6 years that attendance at school dances has dropped off significantly. Our priests quorum has 14 relatively active boys, and only 2 of them have ever been on a date. The world is not teaching our youth the proper fundamentals of interacting with the opposite sex...it is teaching the exact opposite of what should be done. Women are taught that men and the patriarchy are dangerous and abusive, and will hold them back; and men are taught that women are a useless waste of time and money.
  11. Haha
    NeedleinA got a reaction from Carborendum in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    I figured it was so a Covid mask fit on more securely??
    brilliant beard = check!
    magnificent mane = check, check!
    Pre-covid NT...

  12. Haha
    NeedleinA got a reaction from Carborendum in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    I figured it was so a Covid mask fit on more securely??
    brilliant beard = check!
    magnificent mane = check, check!
    Pre-covid NT...

  13. Like
    NeedleinA got a reaction from JohnsonJones in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    A somber warning given by Elder Quentin L. Cook back in 2008 as the Church actively fought to keep marriage between a man and a woman - only. 
    Welcome to 2021 my friends.
    A time where members of the Church, a mere 13 years later, now label other members of Church who don't cater to the LGBTQ community as being intolerant, behind the times and unloving to all of "God's children". 

     
  14. Haha
    NeedleinA got a reaction from Carborendum in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    I figured it was so a Covid mask fit on more securely??
    brilliant beard = check!
    magnificent mane = check, check!
    Pre-covid NT...

  15. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to mirkwood in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    They absolutely exist.  I have looked them in the eye on a number of occasions.
     
    It absolutely exists.  I have looked it in the eye on a number of occasions.
  16. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    No, because the word "agree" has no meaning. There is no such thing as agreement. Also, "something" doesn't really exist.
  17. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    Then conversation is pretty much impossible. You refuse to acknowledge the existence of people of ill intent. You have bought into the idea that no one is really bad, just misguided. Evil doesn't really exist. And no one should ever, ever, ever feel bad about himself, not for any reason. He just murdered his girlfriend and ate her? Just some bad choices.
    Shame is, by definition, what a healthy person feels when he does something shameful. So unless you're saying that nothing is shameful, your rejection of shame makes no sense. Word games and shifting definitions do not change the reality of things.
  18. Like
    NeedleinA got a reaction from Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    Gallup Poll -  2/24/21

    QUESTION: I know what some Church leaders think, but I wonder what you think...
    is this self-identification a learned behavior, perpetuated by people trying to 'normalize' it OR is God simply sending more non-heterosexual individuals to earth in these latter generations?
    SIDE NOTE: 
    Currently Gallup says 1 in 6 adults of Generation Z identify as LGBT now. 

    If it is a learned behavior, what will the percentage be of LGBT for Generation Alpha, Beta, etc. at this pace?
    If it is a learned behavior, what happens to the LDS % of LGBT every time someone in authority in the Church tries to cast it in a positive light or normalize it?
  19. Like
  20. Haha
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in In ten years I'll look back and laugh. (Or not.)   
    For the record: Not.
  21. Haha
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in In ten years I'll look back and laugh. (Or not.)   
    My workplace provides shower rooms in many of its buildings so that employees who bike into work (or for whatever other reason) can use the shower. About an hour ago, I availed myself of this small luxury. I put my clothes in a locker, which is equipped with an electronic, PIN-activated lock. But this being a place of business, filled with fellow adults, and with other lockers standing open with stuff in them, I felt no need to bother with locking it for the ten minutes or so I'd be in the shower.
    Oops.
    When I came back to the locker, toweling off, lo and behold, the locker was locked. And since I didn't know the PIN that whoever locked it used, I couldn't get in. To, you know, get my clothes. Or underwear.
    Or cell phone.
    So there goes Vort, parading through the office building in the nude, with only a towel wrapped around his loins, to the receptionist at the front desk, who burst out laughing and said she'd call physical facilities. Back to the locker room, head down, towel firmly in place, while others in the building try hard not to be obvious in looking at the strange naked guy walking through the place. (Fortunately, I only "squat" in this building rather than work here permanently, so I don't actually know anyone.)
    An eternity later (actually about 20 or 30 minutes -- not sure, seeing as how my watch was locked in the locker, but it sure seemed like an eternity), the physical facilities guy showed up to let me in my locker. Keys, phone, wallet with credit cards still in place.
    Ha, ha! What a great joke! I'm sure I'll be laughing about it sometime in the 2020s.
  22. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    You may be right. I have thought about this topic quite a bit over the years. I have often wondered if maybe we should be willing to openly discuss anything and everything that we struggle with. But somehow, I can't make sense of the idea. "I have some weaknesses that I'm trying to overcome:"
    "I'm really attracted to Doug's wife. She's totally hot. I think constantly about undressing her." "I'm really attracted to Doug's daughter, even though she's only six years old. [etc]" "I hate conservatives/homosexuals/black people/white men/Mormons. I just can't stand them. If I could, I would like to destroy them all." "I'm just so jealous of Bob and Sue and their rich house and cars. I'd love to burn that stuff to the ground, with them inside." "Truth is, I think my wife is a harridan. Not only would I not marry her if I could do it over again, I would secretly campaign against her so that her life would be as miserable as I think it ought to be." What do you suppose the societal response would be to such proclamations? What SHOULD the societal response be? "Thank you for sharing! That's so brave of you!"?
    Do you think that shame about such impulses is appropriate? Do you think people feeling ashamed of such thoughts and feelings might be a motivator for them NOT to act on those ideas?
    If we did away with the shame attached to such ideas, what do you think would be the result?
    On rational analysis, I always conclude that we're much, much better off with shame than we would be without. If you have a counterargument, I'd love to hear it.
  23. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to Vort in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    So it's about time and place. Sure, there is a time and a place to discuss our weaknesses. Advertising them publicly during a Church-sponsored Women's Conference, and then being praised for how wonderful you are for having discussed them, seems overtly wrong.
    Shame exists for a purpose. If we do shameful things, we should be ashamed. As with any other emotion, there are times when shame is an inappropriate and even harmful response. But don't think that means shame itself is bad. A world without shame is called the jungle, and it's a place you do not want to live in.
  24. Like
    NeedleinA reacted to mirkwood in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    @LDSGator is the pink one in his right hand.
     
  25. Haha
    NeedleinA got a reaction from mirkwood in No more taxes for $400k and under   
    Which one is you?