Fether

Members
  • Content Count

    3146
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    20

Everything posted by Fether

  1. Fether

    Beware your “Mormon Therapist”

    I honestly don’t see a problem taking a week off of the Book of Mormon if it is causing immense amounts of stress to read. The answer isn’t “read fluffy stuff”. The answer is “let’s figure out why you feel this way by reading talks specific to the issue.” It’s a close example, but not tender. I am fine talking freely about it and on with hear people talking negatively about (though attacks on her directly I won’t stand for). Overall, I too agree with the vast majority of what you say. I think my biggest frustration comes not from the claims being made (though I agree that once a line has been drawn on your expectations concerning your faith, it should not be crossed), but rather the whole situation. A “Mormon” therapist has to essentially be Bishop and therapist and that has to be difficult. but ya... my thoughts are either too complex or incomplete to express. Maybe some time around 2am I may be able to put it into words and I’ll post something.
  2. @Vort Not sure what system you are using to play, but this may also be a joy for you
  3. Fether

    Beware your “Mormon Therapist”

    I have personally seen 6 in my life time. 1 was phenomenal, 1 was good, 3 were essentially useless, 1 was just awful. The two good ones were the first two I saw. The last 4 pretty much turned me off to the whole thing. To be honest, it was a lot like taking the same institute class from 5 different teachers. The first time you take it, there is some cool new stuff that really opens your eyes to concepts. The second time, there may be different insights. Every time after that, the same info is just being rehashed over and over. Each teacher expects you to say “aha! That makes sense!”... but instead your say “well... ya... is this the extent of what you have to teach?”. Of course the true success in a therapy session comes from the decisions of the person who is visiting the therapist, not the info shared by the therapist. It’s just not a very deep field. I imagine e the help becomes better and better the more money you spend on different therapists... but again, it isn’t like a doctor where there is a medicine for this and a surgery for that... like mentioned above, it’s relies almost entirely on life style choices.
  4. Fether

    Beware your “Mormon Therapist”

    I didn’t read the article in detail but in the past I have done a bit of study about therapists and their relationship with religious orthodoxy and how they approach it. From what I understand, the role of a therapist is to help those struggling emotionally, mentally and spiritually come to terms with their feelings, develop a healthy mindset toward and cope with issues in their life. When a person of an heavily orthodox / covenantal religion sees a therapist, I can see it being difficult to suggest things, particularly when you are a member of the same religion. For the majority of the time, a therapist is not a doctor (though they may have a doctorate degree). Most of what they are saying is just probing and trying to understand. They offer solutions to the feelings they feel. From what I have experienced, they will offer a solution or task to do, if I didn’t feel comfortable doing it, they never pushed it further, but moved in to other solutions and approaches. In the initial example, I would say it is well within the therapists means to suggest not reading scriptures. If someone came to me, a person who is not a therapist, and says reading scriptures gave them a large amount of anxiety, I may suggest taking a Hiatus from reading scriptures. Maybe I would suggest specific talks to read instead. Focus on reading talks from Eyring, Holland, and Suarez. And for the time being, avoid Oaks, Bednar, Renlund, packer, and McConkie. And perhaps focus on strengthening their prayer and try to understand how God true Lely sees them, the role sin plays in our life and how repentance, guilt and shame all play together. In more difficult situations, where homosexuality and transgender is played, I think it is healthy to at least admit such feelings aloud to one’s self. Then have a conversation about sharing them with family members and others. I remember my brother (now sister) experiencing intense amounts of social anxiety, depression, and feeling he was actually a she. He went to go see a therapist of the Latter-day Saint faith about the whole thing and the therapist helped him come to the conclusion that he does indeed see himself as a she. That step right there took a HUGE wait off her back. The therapist, from what I understand, never suggest to transition, leave the church, or any of the like. However, once my sister made the decision to no longer attend church and socially transition, the therapist was there as a tool for her to cope with the anxieties and stresses that came with it. When you go see a therapist, there must be a dialogue at some point about what religious steps you are uncomfortable taking. It’s not their job to make sure you continue living and orthodoxy life and obeying all the letter and spirit of the law commandments, particularly when you do t even want to be active. The role of a therapist is to help people cope with their feelings, and in some cases, keep you from killing yourself. Unless steps have been made the clarify how important your religious life is, it is not inappropriate for a therapist to say things like this.
  5. I have heard a bit of a stir about this over the last week from a couple different sources. They are complain about the lack of women speaking in General conference. I was curious to hear from a couple women from the forum. Do you wish this as well? Or is this just an anti-patriarchy /feminist type wish? Is hearing a woman talk about Christ different than hearing a man talk about Christ? I won’t tag anyone out of fear of forgetting someone and / or mis gendering a brother as being female, I’ll just hope this reaches the female part of the forum.
  6. Fether

    Are we there yet?

    I’ve entertained the idea that there is no “end” when comes to human kind as a whole. Signs of the times are there to remind us that there is an end. But that end isn’t the second coming, the end is whenever we leave this life. ”this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God; yea, behold the day of this life is the day for men to perform their labors.” Alma 34:32. I believe this is primarily why people of every generation have been saying “the end is nigh!”. They are both right and wrong. They are wrong in their intention, that the end of the world and the second coming is within the next 20 years or so. They are right in that the true end, the only end that matters, is indeed close. If I stand on a street corner and shout “the end is near!” Within the next 90 years. That statement will have been fulfilled for everyone in earshot. Now, I do believe there to be an ultimate “end” when it comes to this world. However, I am not so sure that end, the one no one can seem to time correctly, is not nearly as important as the end that is much more easy to time, our own death.
  7. I asked asked my wife and she immediately said “oh... I don’t care”
  8. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    I have been pondering this for a while, but I wonder of cinema, and before that literature, has spoiled us to good and decent men and women. There are so many great hero with imperfections, but those imperfections are rooted in some sort of righteousness or injustice done to them. Harry Potter: ignorance of how magic works (his parental guardians were evil and kept him from it). he fell to anger (but only to bad guys) Frodo: Self doubt (faux humility). temptation to an object that was putting a curse on him (not his fault). These imperfections are extremely superficial and carefully done to not skew with the characters moral standing with the audience. If Harry Potter ended with a scene of him getting annoyed with his son and yelling at him, we would all be thinking “where is the sequel trilogy where Harry becomes the villain? Only terrible bad guys yell at their children” The rare occasion that cinema and literature does show this side of heros is when they also grab your attention long enough to show their redemption arc. That isn’t how the real world works. You read about a mistake someone made in the past and you have to actively go look for more information on Them before you find what kind of person they really were
  9. You have been successfully click-bated... sort of. I may be late to the party, but I discovered Jim Bennett the other day through a newish online Latter-day Saint podcast “Midnight Mormons”. He is an “apologist” and has some amazing insights and rarely take. Opinions when it comes to the gospel. Since then I have been looking up other podcasts and talks from him and discovered a series of long form podcasts 2+ hours where he and John Dehlin (popular anti-Mormon advocate). I started watching them and they have been extremely entertaining in that Bennett exposes many preconceptions we have when we talk about the gospel. He also does a an incredible job of faithfully expanding the conversation that prophets are not perfect. Anyway, I wanted to share this with some family members and friends, but I also did t want to expose them to John Dehlin had they not discovered him yet. That leads me to my question. What is the best way to introduce and teach these topics? Should it be done? Is it worthwhile to continue teaching our children that all our previous leaders were void of big mistakes and prejudices? Is it worth while to teach them our leaders were somehow mythically pure, nigh unto the purity of Christ?
  10. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    I agree, I don’t think a focus on the bad is great. My concern is that the surface picture the church paints of our leaders is that they are near perfect. That the mistakes they make are inconsequential and painted in such a way that we sympathize with them in their mistakes. As mentioned before, the Nathan Mitchell approach to Joseph Smith seems to be a huge departure from how Joseph Smith really was. But I suppose the simple Antidote (or perhaps “vaccine”) to seeing this as problematic is encouraging study and making gospel discussion a daily and regular occurrence, and not strictly Sunday at church event. I was not raised in this type of environment, instead, I sought it in my own. That may be why I am so concerned about it When your only encounter with gospel topics is through church, then ya, your only exposure to JSjr would be the Nathan Mitchell approach. 30 years of only seeing that may be difficult if you then come across things not mentioned in Prophet of the Restoration.
  11. Is this the entertainment I get to look forward to when I’m old?
  12. Fether

    The Duke of Edinburgh

    The prior revolt in Ireland he created after losing the election didn’t help his case much
  13. Fether

    The Duke of Edinburgh

    Who? My exact thoughts haha
  14. Alternative question: Why does Mexican food at restaurants taste so much better than homemade Mexican food? It’s almost as if they are completely different genres of food what is the solution? I absolutely LOVE Mexican food bought at every restaurant (I even enjoy some Taco Bell stuff). But I can’t stand homemade Mexican food.
  15. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    They definitely don’t like it. But it’s the truth. I. Perplexed whenever I see Christian vs Mormon debates. In such debates, the Bible is the only common denominator that is a reliable source. It’s like having someone wanting to debate you on the theory of relativity, but he only accepts the works of Darwin as scientific.
  16. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    It truly is amazing that we still have revelation today. However, traditional Christian beliefs still creep into our lives. I remember a few friends in high school voicing to me their wrestle with the fact that certain gospel teaching aren’t found in The Bible
  17. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    That is exactly the point. We say “they aren’t perfect” out loud, but that isn’t the picture we focus on painting when we speak of them. To more perfectly explain my point, I’ll share my experience. Growing up, I learned about Joseph smith through Sunday school classes, church made media, and general conference talks. Everywhere I looked, they spoke of Joseph Smith was such reference, respect and admiration (with good reason, save Christ, he did more for humankind than anyone else in history). Occasionally we would read or hear that he wasn’t perfect, but that wasn’t a shock. I’m sure he got grumpy sometimes. Later in Life, I read “Mormon Enigma”, “Rough Stone Rolling”, read through the CES letter (which I did see right through as I read it). The historical documents and in depth stories about him did not match the picture that was painted for me growing up. I knew he wasn’t perfect, but I thought that meant he got grumpy some times, that maybe he made an occasional inconsequential rash decision. But not that he hid his initial plural marriages from the church and even his own wife, and him shouting hosanna to a call for the death of the Missourians was a long way from the Nathan Mitchell portrayal I was use to seeing. So my question is this. Do we teach other and our children in depth about Joseph smith and some of the concerning things he did? Or do we play “Prophet if the Restoration” on repeat and hope they never come across the CES letter, or if they do, hope they know how to respond to it? When we confront an enemy of the church or a fool on this forum, it is easy to say “ya... we don’t teach that, we have been saying they are imperfect for a LONG time... since the beginning even.” And walk away knowing we won an argument. But when it comes to our own children, The words we say and the things we teach are important... but just as important, we need to paint the correct picture. If those pictures don’t match historical records and they find that out, it may cause issues. That particular illy happened with my sister
  18. Fether

    When do I teach my kids anti?

    Thanks for the insights. I, personally, am not a fan of secular explanations for “anti”. It is sometimes interesting, but that’s it. Rather, the responses that I have had the biggest effect on me have been those that point out fallacies in my own thinking and traditional church cultural beliefs that aren’t necessarily supported by the church itself. ie Comparing current church teachings to the Bible. A lot of times people will ask members to show them where in the Bible a certain principle is taught (word of wisdom, becoming like God, degrees of glory, temple ordinances, etc.). If they can’t find it, they will count that as a point against the church. Antis and active members themselves often times wonder “why isn’t this in the Bible?” And have a difficult time with it. Instead of trying to use some vague reference of Christ saying “ye are gods”, or Paul being caught up in the third heaven, realize that we don’t believe everything is built on the Bible. Our teachings don’t need to be found in the Bible because we actively teach and believe that all truth is found in many different sources. The Bible is just one source. There are answers like this for almost every “anti” question out there. Almost every question people have can be answered by gaining a stronger understanding of the basics of the gospel. Often times it is met with a “oh duh... I was taught that in primary” (at least that is how it is for me when I have such realizations). What I will likely do is teach the principles the best I can. Once they reach an age where they can start reading seriously (like 10), I’ll start suggesting books to read and Why I suggest them. I will encourage them to read “rough stone rolling” as one of the books to check out. From there, IF they show more interest, that will open opportunities for further conversation. Though I do understand not everyone cares the least bit about it all
  19. Fether

    Boring General Conference

    One thing I do not love is the unreasonably long prayers. the person giving the closing prayer in This previous session spoke extremely slow and used as many words as he could to ask for very ordinary blessing and giving thanks. I am all for spending hours on your knees in personal prayer to wrestle with the spirit, and even thoughtful and drawn out prayers among groups when seeking to overcome and issue. but opening and closing prayers during meetings and conferences should be fervent, specific, and to the point. This isn’t an opinion either... definitely doctrine.
  20. Fether

    I do not think this quote is doctrine is it?

    Not an accepted teaching today, though I know during Brigham Young’s era, it was somewhat understood that plural marriage was a requirement for exaltation. But is it true? Maybe. we are taught that if we are sealed to multiple women throughout our lives due to death, we would still be sealed to them in the afterlife. We also don’t know the nature of sealings in the celestial kingdom. Why would God not have been subject to similar laws as us? This is not a doctrine I would teach. I give room for it to be possible, but I wouldn’t teach it.
  21. Fether

    Boring General Conference

    Which is quite clear haha cause I didn’t relate very well to Holland’s talk.
  22. Fether

    Boring General Conference

    Just an observation, maybe you currently have too high of a view of yourself. Maybe you don’t value talks about faith, hope, charity, temples, family, etc. because you feel you are “good enough” and there is no need for future growth. The talks I find most boring are the talks on topics that I feel I am good enough on. Even excel in. If I humbled myself a little more, I may find more benefit in them
  23. Fether

    Boring General Conference

    I really enjoyed the first few talks. Felt inspired on way I could better teach my kids. I have felt bored during sessions before... this was not one of them for me
  24. To specify, I would eat the same amount that I normally do, just all of it in a 6 hour period. I did a longer fast once every two weeks
  25. I have only ever done “long fasting” as a health benefit. I actually had dedicated daily fasting and occasional long fast with minimal exercise and I lost 15 lbs in a few months. It felt great. That being said, I never considered I could use this sort of fast as a spiritual fast. I always assumed a spiritual fast included abstaining from water as well. I really appreciate these insights.