Global Warming-is it for real???


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Pah. Both sides of the global warming argument are so full of pseudoscientific political garbage that I've given up any efforts at understanding it (the farthest I've gotten is that there are natural climate cycles, but we're making them worse at both ends).

I say if we really care about the environment, we should focus on the simple and effective things. What happened to turning off the lights, taking shorter showers, and turning the heat down a degree or two? These are simple things anybody can do that don't cost a dime. Now we're obsessed with carbon credits, energy star appliances (which, according to a contractor I know, amounts to charging more for an appliance with a cheaper/weaker motor), and unplugging our cellphone chargers.

/rant

Sorry.

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My point – cars that burn fossil fuels do not emit greenhouse gasses; carbon monoxide is not a greenhouse gas.

Anyone that believes global warming is manmade that cannot explain the reaction in nature whereby carbon monoxide becomes carbon dioxide (including if the reaction is endothermic or exothermic) is part of a great deception that begins with what they do to themselves in order that they can passionately contribute to and justify their own deception.

The Traveler

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What the heck, I'm just going to re-post.

5.1 Exhaust composition and exposure data

Internal combustion engines have been used in cars, trucks, locomotives and other motorized machinery for about 100 years. Engine exhausts contain thousands of gaseous and particulate substances. The major gaseous products of both diesel- and gasoline-fuelled engines are carbon dioxide and water, but lower percentages of carbon monoxide, sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxides as well as low molecular weight hydrocarbons and their derivatives are also formed. Submicron-size particles are present in the exhaust emissions of internal combustion engines. The particles present in diesel engine exhaust are composed mainly of elemental carbon, adsorbed organic material and traces of metallic compounds. The particles emitted from gasoline engines are composed primarily of metallic compounds (especially lead, if present in the fuel), elemental carbon and adsorbed organic material. Soluble organic fractions of the particles contain primarily polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, heterocyclic compounds, phenols, nitroarenes and other oxygen- and nitrogen-containing derivatives.

The composition and quantity of the emissions from an engine depend mainly on the type and condition of the engine, fuel composition and additives, operating conditions and emission control devices. Particles emitted from engines operating with gasoline are different from diesel engine exhaust particles in terms of their size distribution and surface properties. Emissions of organic compounds from gasoline (leaded and unleaded) and diesel engines are qualitatively similar, but there are quantitative differences: diesel engines produce two to 40 times more particulate emissions and 20-30 times more nitroarenes than gasoline engines with a catalytic converter in the exhaust system when the engines have similar power output. Gasoline engines without catalytic converters and diesel engines of similar power output produce similar quantities of polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons per kilometre; catalytic converters of the type used with gasoline vehicles reduce emissions of polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons by more than ten times. Lead and halogenated compounds are also typically found in emissions from engines using leaded gasoline.

source: Diesel and Gasoline Engine Exhausts (IARC Summary & Evaluation, Volume 46, 1989)

definition of adsorbed from Wikipedia : ''Adsorption''' is a process that occurs when a gas or liquid [[solute]] accumulates on the surface of a solid or a liquid (adsorbent), forming a film of molecules or atoms (the adsorbate). It is different from absorption, in which a substance diffuses into a liquid or solid to form a solution. The term sorption encompasses both processes, while desorption is the reverse process.

Carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas. Water vapour is a greenhouse gas, and those are the two primary components of exhaust. Water vapour staus in the atmosphere for about 9 days, Carbon Dioxide, a lot longer. For a good read, see Wapedia - Wiki: Greenhouse gas - mobile version of Wikipedia, good when wikipedia is slow. Of greatest importance to this discussion is section 3. Anthropogenic greenhouse gases

Carbon Monoxide is NOT the only thing that comes out the tailpipe of a car. If you think it is, you need to take a look at the complex hydrocarbon chains and other chemicals that make up petroleum and diesel, as well as the composition of the air we breathe.

Where is the source that states that CO turns into CO2? Peer review? I may have missed it. There is a lot of money on both sides of the Global Warming (Climate change is a better term) debate. There is misinformation on both sides. No matter what way you cut it, we are taking out billions of barrels worth of oil every year that contain chemicals that haven't been in the ecosystem for millions of years. We don't know how that will affect our climate. There is no independent research into it, all is funded by one side or another.

AllI know, is that smog really sucks and aint good for us.

Edited by gabelpa
picking out points
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Yes, we are terrible stewards of the earth. We multiply but forget to replenish.

REPLENISH

1 a: to fill with persons or animals : stock barchaic : to supply fully : perfect c: to fill with inspiration or power : nourish

2 a: to fill or build up again <replenished his glass> b: to make good : replace

Global warming refers to temperature increases in the troposphere which can cause climate change.

Global climate change refers to ANY changes, aspects, of the earth's climate from temperature, precipitation and storm intensity and patterns.

Okay, here are seven reasons why there is a 90-99% probability that the troposphere, the lowest densest part of the earth's atmosphere in which most weather changes occur - aka the stuff we breathe, is getting warmer.

1: The 20th century was the hottest century in the last 1000 years.

2: Since 1861 the average global temperature of the troposphere near the earth's surface has risen 1.1 degrees Fahrenheit over the entire globe, and 1.4 degrees Fahrenheit over the continents. Most of this increase has taken place since 1980.

Please note the bolded word average. I hope we all know what that means. . .

3: The ten warmest years since 1861 have occurred since 1990.

4: Over the past fifty years Arctic tempratures have risen almost twice as fast as those in the rest of the world.

5: Glaciers and floating sea ice in some parts of the world are melting and shrinking at increasing rates.

6: Warmer temperatures in Alaska and in other parts of the Arctic are melting permafrost, releasing more CO2 and CH4 into the troposphere, which may accelerate tropospheric warming.

7: During the last century the world's average sea level rose by4-8 inches, mostly because of the runoff from melting land-based ice and the expansion of ocean water as its temperature increases.

Source: Sustaining the Earth, 8th Ed, G. Tyler Miller, Jr. Pgs. 267-268

Something I would also like to point out. What happens when you take a piece of ice and put it in your cup of room temperature water? The ice melts. Why? Because of the temperature increase. However, what happens to the surrounding area, the water? It cools. Then what happens if you set it down and leave it there for a few hours? It's warm again.

So, just because we're having some serious cold fronts acomin' does not mean that global warming is a sham. It means that all the cold things are melting, thusly cooling off the surrounding area for a time.

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I don't know or care if global warming is real or not. We, as a species, are terrible stewards of the earth we've been given.

I don't mind trying to take care of the earth.....I just don't want knuckleheads like Al Gore and Ted Danson and a host of others....running around telling me how I have 7yrs to live or we will burn up...etc....

Lets just take care of what we got.....:)

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Where is the source that states that CO turns into CO2? Peer review? I may have missed it.

If I remember correctly, CO can turn into CO2 by this reaction:

2CO + O2 --> 2CO2

This reaction, however, proceeds quite slowly, however it can be sped up using a catalyst such as palladium (this is how catalytic converters work). As for whether it's exothermic or endothermic... based on how I picture the bonds rearranging I think it's exothermic, but I'd have to find my enthalpy tables again to make sure.

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What a fantastically geeky reply, LittleWyvern! And I totally mean that in a good way!

It's the second time I've done that today...

EDIT: about the above reaction, it's a spontaneous reaction so I guess it would have to be exothermic because of entropy laws.

EDIT2: ohdangsomebodymakemestop :(

Edited by LittleWyvern
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I was surprised that no one mentioned two interesting facts about the whole manmade global warming thing.

1) In the last 10 years, global temperatures have leveled off and actually decreased somewhat. If it was manmade, then temperatures would have continued to increase.

2) Much of the rise in global temperatures occurred alongside a rise in solar activity. Now for a no duh statement. Scientific evidence seems to agree that higher temperatures accompany high solar activity and lower temperatures accompany lower solar activity. Not a year to year scale, but reduction in solar for longer periods of time can affect temperatures.

3) Let's toss in a third one. We are in period extremely low solar activity.

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Guest Godless

These are simple things anybody can do that don't cost a dime. Now we're obsessed with carbon credits, energy star appliances (which, according to a contractor I know, amounts to charging more for an appliance with a cheaper/weaker motor), and unplugging our cellphone chargers.

Holy crap, I'm supposed to unplug that thing??? :o

I'm kinda on the fence in regard to global warming. Real or not though, it's definitely brought attention to the state of our planet. There's more that we can be doing both to preserve natural ecosystems and reduce pollution.

And finally, now that we've addressed the environmental issues of our time, we need to address the very real issue of stopping manbearpig.

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