Breast Implants

[MichaelCraig]

I saw a bumper sticker the other day that said "Body piercing saved my life." I wasn't close enough to see the picture above the text so the words struck me as pretty weird.....until the picture came into view and it was the arm/hand of Jesus Christ with the huge nails in them. I get the point and agree with the meaning but it still was a little weird wording it this way. I've wanting to get ink for a while now but can't decide on the art or text, OR where on my body to put it. Any suggestions????

WHOOPS! sorry about changing the main discussion topic. Disregard if you'd like.

[MormonMama]

I just think it's sad that this world is such a place where so many of us are ridiculed for what God has given us, to the point that we feel a need to alter those God-given attributes in order to stop the abuse (and yes, I consider ridiculing someone for their natural body structures to be a form of abuse). It's so easy to say, "Oh, you shouldn't care what others think," but it's a lot harder to put that into practice when you are the one being ridiculed day after day.

[dash77]

I am opposed to cosmetic surgery in general, but especially to breast implants. Although I am going to take a very strong position on this subject, I look forward to Christian/LDS -dialog, including those that think differently (we can all learn from those who think differently).

I oppose breast implants on both spiritual and health grounds.

However, I want to clarify the difference between cosmetic surgery (which I strongly oppose) and reconstructive surgery (which I strongly support). Just by way of information, I am a male in his later 30’s.

Reconstructive surgery repairs body parts due to illness, accident, and medical abnormalities. As such I support breast reconstructive surgery and all other reconstructive surgeries when women have had a mastectomy or facial surgery if someone is burned or was born disfigured. Cosmetic surgery is the augmentation of functioning body parts, such as a woman with smaller breasts that wants larger ones or a man with a perfectly functioning nose who wants a different shaped nose.

I also want to make it perfectly clear that I know there are good women who have been ridiculed their entire life for being smaller on top. I do not pretend to know what this is like and do not brush off the ridicule – I know it exists and is emotionally painful. I have real dislike for men who make fun of women with smaller breasts (and although do not support can understand women who are wanting to turn the table on men). Although I oppose breast implants, I do not brush of the pain that thoughtless people make when a woman has smaller breasts.

In regard to opposing breast implants from a spiritual perceptive, I think breast implants/augmentation is connected to coveting, and the scriptures are very clear about the harm of coveting. It might be a woman coveting another figure, such as a neighbor, sister, or Hollywood movie star, or coveting her old body before having children. To covet is to desire enviously and is at the heart of pride and the natural man.

The Savior taught people to see the insides of others, not the outside. I believe the very act of getting a breast implant is based on the worldly view that female worth is located by breast size. In the world, “real” woman have “perfect” breasts. As such, women with smaller breasts or women who had mastectomies are then labeled in society as “less than.” This in turn, causes them to dislike themselves and question their worth. We need to act like the Savior and I do not think he could support the view that breast size equates female worth. I think the Savior (and therefore Christian and LDS people) should see inner attributes of female worth – such as kindness, humility, meekness, intelligences, a strong work ethic, service and so forth. By getting or supporting breasts implants, it send a worldly message -- non-purposeful -- that women with smaller breasts are “less than.” Further, the underlying ideology behind breast implants (e.g., women as sex objects) leads to a host other health concerns, such as eating disorders, depression, and so forth. Furthermore, there have been a number of general authority talks on not altering our bodies in vain ways.

I also oppose breast implants related to physical and psychological health issues. It is not like coloring one hair -- it is a surgery that still has serious side effects, such as bleeding and infections, and the long term side effects of breast implants are really unknown (has anyone died of bleeding from hair coloring?). Also, there have been a number of both popular magazines and scientific studies that outline the health issue associated with breasts implants. I find the following article Is cosmetic surgery a good gift for grads? - Health - Kids and parenting - msnbc.com to be interesting and helpful regarding this topic – especially about the societal norms it reinforces (quick fixes for mental health problems) and how many teenage girls are going to breast implants. Further, here is a summary of three scientific studies:

• See Dr. McLaughlin and colleagues 2004 article titled “Increased risk of suicide among patients with breast implants: Do the epidemiological data support psychiatric consultation” in the journal Psychosomatics. This study suggest that women who get breast implants have a threefold higher suicide rate and underscores that many women who get breast implants have underlying psychological problems who work on their underlying issues in questionable ways (e.g., going to a plastic surgeon rather than a mental health counselor, psychologist, or psychiatrist – I would also personally add, it is not in the study, or going to a Bishop or RS President).

• See Dr. Jacobsen and colleague’s 2004 article titled “Mortality and suicide among Danish women with cosmetic breast implants” in the journal Archives of Internal Medicine. This study outlines the same results as above and suggests women who go for breast implants surgeries should go for a general mental health examination (same conclusion some psychiatrists and mental health specialists have suggest with breast and penis augmentation surgery).

• Chapter five of Dr. Mary Rogers (sociologist who studies body image disorders) book “Barbie Culture” from 1999 outlines the many psychological and sociological side effects of plastic surgery (not reconstructive), such as consumer somanitics and surgery addiction.

I see this as scary stuff.

I would like to end this post with one last connection to the field of sociology. I also think that before any woman (or man) gets cosmetic surgery they also need to think beyond themselves and see how their individual actions can actual harm a broader social view – such as the concept of female worth. I see the breast implant issue as one that denotes a situation where a group of individuals, each acting in their own individual best interest (e.g., breast implants), find that the collective effect of their independently logical actions is actually a societal negative (e.g., reinforcement of a societal norm that “real” women have larger/perfect breasts, women are sex objects, and those women with smaller breasts are “less than”). I am looking through a Christian sociological lens focused on the teachings of Christ, not an individual lens focused on the self. I hear too many women simply justify their decisions, with something like “I did this for me” – with little thought regarding how me-decisions affect the larger community.

When more and women get implants, they really do affect a larger section of society. It can make women who have smaller breasts feel “less than,” it can cause men to desire larger breasts and desire being larger in private places (and even cause women to begin to think this way also related to male sexual attributes), it causes others (both men and women) to see women as sexual objects or seeing worth connected to breast size.

As you can see, I oppose breast implants very strongly and have probable said enough. Again, I look for thoughtful dialog.

[HiJolly]

I have a neighbor who was a divorced mom, augmented her bust and shortly thereafter was married again. I don't know if my new neighbor knows anything about it, but I do know that their marriage is a good one and their both wonderful people who went on to be RS president and High Councilor, respectively.

I think it has its place.

HiJolly

[justaname]

The Savior taught people to see the insides of others, not the outside. I believe the very act of getting a breast implant is based on the worldly view that female worth is located by breast size.

Anyone would recognize that we should follow the Savior's example by seeing people for their intrinsic value rather than their outward appearance. I often wonder about this though, when we specifically are instructed to appear a certain way to the outside world. Missionaries have extremely strict guidelines about their appearance, as do the GA's, and priesthood leaders. I was recently asked to shave my face by a member of the stake pres. when a certain calling was extended to me. I know this topic isnt entirely relevant to the issue of breast augmentation, but I do think we should recognize that we do in fact judge people by their appearance within our own walls.

[LostMarine]

I have two tattoos. I regret getting them more than I can express with meer words. I remember being told in primary, that my body was a temple. I am 29 now. If our bodies are temples, do they need to be painted, propped up or fixed? just asking.

[Milluw]

I don't assume anything. They might have a good reason, how would i know.

But if i had to choose for myself i don't think i would change anything about me unless it was making an actual damage on me and was impossible for me to work with. Both fysically or mentally. Even if i weren't happy with myself. There might be a lesson in it for me to learn.

[Snow]

I have two tattoos. I regret getting them more than I can express with meer words. I remember being told in primary, that my body was a temple. I am 29 now. If our bodies are temples, do they need to be painted, propped up or fixed? just asking.

I dunno. If they are temples do they need eyeliner and lipstick and hair gel and aftershave and plucking and baubles and bangles and shirts and shoes?

[pam]

Even temples can have a good coat of paint on them. And of course there is that golden statue at the top too. Plus stained glass windows.

[Snow]

I oppose breast implants on both spiritual and health grounds.

Excellent point. It is a well known fact that the efficacy of the Holy Ghost decreases to about 68% with implants. Also, God doesn't love you as much.

[john doe]

Excellent point. It is a well known fact that the efficacy of the Holy Ghost decreases to about 68% with implants. Also, God doesn't love you as much.

68%? Are you sure? I was always told that it was 66.333%, approx 2/3 Spirit. 68% is a number that makes it worth checking out though. Now I can tell my wife that those pectoral implants she has been telling me I can't have are 'Gospel-Approved'.

[Guest]

Explain to me again how "Your body is a temple" translates to "Thou shalt not make your body beautiful".

I never could understand that part.

I feel like I'm amongst Catholics again where you cannot have epidural at childbirth because a woman is supposed to bear the pain of having children naturally. Mishmash of doctrine that morphs into something else that the doctrine gets completely lost in translation.

I like it simple. Your body is a temple to me means my body deserves respect and that it is a vessel for my spirit to grow. I see nothing in it that says I can't improve on it as long as I am not using it as a vessel to bring my own damnation nor others to their damnation.

My father just told me about the new Cebu Temple (Philippines) that was dedicated a few weeks ago. My father (not a member) told me how the city of Cebu is in awe because of the beauty of the temple. They chose a perfect spot for it - high ground - and it is currently the most beautiful building in Cebu. At night it gets lit up so that it looks like it is floating. Everybody looks up to it in awe wondering "Who are these Mormons who can afford to build a building like THAT?".

Does the temple have to be the most beautiful building in the city? Nope. I don't think so. Doesn't the apparent wealth reperesented by the Cebu temple symbolize material vanity? Non-LDS people would probably see it that way. But, that's not why the temple is beautified. It is beautified because of our respect and regard for it. It is something truly special to us.

That's how I see my body. Breast implants for me is not to symbolize vanity and invite sexual lust. Of course there are others who use it that way, but most of us LDS women who have it done don't. Do we need it? Nope. It is a personal choice. But, those who choose it treat it like the grandeur of the Cebu temple - we make it beautiful to show our reverence to our personal temple.

[marshac]

*sigh*

I never thought I would see the day when I get more emails talking about breasts from "LDS Mormon Forums" than from other unsolicited email sources.

As for the temple anatess was talking about- I want to see it now.

[miztrniceguy]

The LDS temple or her personal temple?

[Carl62]

If a lot of people are so against doing anything cosmetic for vanity reasons, then why do parents get braces for theirs kids? or even for themselves? What's the difference there? I don't care how you slice or dice it, it's all about looking better to make yourself feel better, whether it's a new hair cut or new set of boobs. While some things may have more risks than others and may require a few more zeros when writing the check, the outcome is still for the same reason. Is one form of vanity o.k. and another not? I'll admit I'm vain and I'll bet 99% of the people on here are as well, right down to what they choose to wear to work for that day. This is one subject I will definitely put the stones down on.

[Guest]

*sigh*

As for the temple anatess was talking about- I want to see it now.

The LDS temple or her personal temple?

Sorry, the personal temple requires a different temple recommend. Only one person holds that recommend and sad to say, it isn't you.

Here is the Cebu Temple. Really awesome sight to behold. Especially in a place where majority of the population live in poverty.

photo courtesy of My Cebu Photo Blog

Contrast that picture with this - a common sight in the outskirts of the city where people live in shanties and don't have the luxury of something as simple as indoor plumbing:

photo courtesy of Cebu

Edited July 14, 2010 by anatess

[Just_A_Guy]

As for the temple anatess was talking about- I want to see it now.

Here you go:

But remember, the Holy Ghost goes to bed at midnight.

[Hemidakota]

I thought it was 2200 (for civilians, this means 10:00pm). This is when the cockroaches come out.

[miztrniceguy]

ummm...yeah anatess....I wasn't looking for it, marshac was. I've got mine already

[crazypotato]

I have lots of friends with implants. One of my friend because of breast cancer (totally understandable) and the rest for cosmetic reasons (ie they were small or saggy-baggy).

My main reason for opposing it is that it is major surgery that can actually be life threatening. There is a risk. Why risk your life for a major surgery? What if your husband and kids had to be without a wife and mom because she died getting breast implants? I know that is unusual, but still possible.

Hair coloring, makeup, earrings, etc are safe/r.

Also, I agree that it seems the more women get them, the more other women around them want them too because they feel less attractive than the haves.

Our bodies are not our own to do whatever we want with. They belong to God. They are temples to our spirits. I am sorry that people have been made fun of for body parts. All the people that alter their bodies surgically to stop cruelty from others, aren't they sending a message to those too poor for cosmetic surgery that they need to get it too? That the way to handle bullying is to change who you are to please everyone else? Everyone needs to be attractive to be worth something?

Last general conference I think Elder Holland, was talking about how mothers need to set a strong example to their daughters of their worth based on being Christlike women. He also said that in society today, our culture treats women as only valuable if they are sexually appealing. This demeans women into sex objects. A lot of you are making comments about it being a personal choice and no one should judge each other. This is literally true, but a bit simplistic. All of my "'personal choices" affect my family and my community around me. If I choose to not read the scriptures today, it affects me, my family and maybe my neighbors or people I visit teach because I wasn't in tune with the spirit so maybe missed a prompting to help them. If I choose to get a tatoo, it affects people that see it in one way or another. I can't expect everyone to respect and accept me for who I am no matter what I do.

I understand that there are women who get augmentation for a variety of reasons, the most extreme I know was that she wanted to be a stripper or pole dancer (not kidding)! She wears hardly any clothes even in the freezing cold to show off her girls, and it is not attractive. Compare her to my other friend who was reconstructing after a double masectomy and when she reconstructed, got a normal size rather than porn star size. Then there are the middle ground people.

[Milluw]

I get your point, and i agree with the part of that there is nothing wrong with making yourself feel pretty. But i think there is a difference between having braces, doing makeup and new hairstyles and then getting your body reshaped, because obviously that is cutting yourself open. We are told to appreciate our bodies, as they are a gift from God. Thats why we've been told that you can't have piercing and tattoo's all sorts of places. That is why i think you should be very alert about your personal reasons for doing it. For example, i don't think it is wrong for someone that can't grow her/his eyebrows out to get some permenantly tattooed on, if they wanted too. Also to make changes through surgery would be fine if you were sure that it was damaging you and somehow irriversible. Both physically and mentally.

But thats just my point of view on it.

Hope it made sense.

[Guest]

I get your point, and i agree with the part of that there is nothing wrong with making yourself feel pretty. But i think there is a difference between having braces, doing makeup and new hairstyles and then getting your body reshaped, because obviously that is cutting yourself open. We are told to appreciate our bodies, as they are a gift from God. Thats why we've been told that you can't have piercing and tattoo's all sorts of places. That is why i think you should be very alert about your personal reasons for doing it. For example, i don't think it is wrong for someone that can't grow her/his eyebrows out to get some permenantly tattooed on, if they wanted too. Also to make changes through surgery would be fine if you were sure that it was damaging you and somehow irriversible. Both physically and mentally.

But thats just my point of view on it.

Hope it made sense.

It made sense... just one thing - tattoos and piercings are taboo because of the negative image attached to those things. Have you tried applying for a job at a corporate office - or even just as a cashier or waitress with visible tattoos and piercings?

Same thing with pink hair.

Not so with regular sized boobs. So, you can't really compare those the same way.

But, I agree about the risk involved in an invasive procedure. Is it really worth going under the knife to look normal? Yeah - personal decision.

[FunkyTown]

Not so with regular sized boobs. So, you can't really compare those the same way.

Yeah. People are trying to compare... Not apples and oranges; It's more like - Well... Apples and boobs, really.

A boob job is no different than a nose job for someone whose nose is too big.

As an aside: How do people feel about breast reduction surgery for comfort reasons? Is it any more acceptable for someone to have invasive surgery to reduce physical discomfort than it is to have invasive surgery to reduce the emotional discomfort they feel for having what they perceive as small/lopsided/droopy/whatever-floats-your-boat breasts?

[Blackmarch]

getting anything stuck in my body to change the shape or size just gives me the squirmies like none other...

[Wingnut]

Yeah. People are trying to compare... Not apples and oranges; It's more like - Well... Apples and boobs, really.

A boob job is no different than a nose job for someone whose nose is too big.

As an aside: How do people feel about breast reduction surgery for comfort reasons? Is it any more acceptable for someone to have invasive surgery to reduce physical discomfort than it is to have invasive surgery to reduce the emotional discomfort they feel for having what they perceive as small/lopsided/droopy/whatever-floats-your-boat breasts?

Many people who get breast reductions do it for physical comfort. A lot of large-breasted women have back problems. Because of this, most insurance companies will actually pay for a reduction. I'd be interested in getting a reduction when I'm done having kids (and breastfeeding them) for two reasons: (1) As a large-breasted woman, it can be difficult to find blouses that fit your bust but don't look like a tent elsewhere; and (2) I seem to be the opposite of most breastfeeding women: instead of smaller boobs after weaning, mine stayed bigger, just saggier than before. I'd like a reduction and a lift.