what should "anti-Mormon" mean?

[Soninme]

As a non LDS believer in Christ who frequents this site I often see the term "anti-Mormon" or simply "anti".

I can understand it's use when there are (unfortunately) those that come here with no other purpose than to pick a fight or to belittle LDS beliefs.

As one who frequents many websites of those who do not believe as I do, I don't see the terms "anti-Muslem" or "anti-Jehovahs Witness" or "anti-Buddist" etc. used to describe those who question others beliefs, whether they are sincere or otherwise.

My question is, why is that term used instead of, say, "non-LDS" or "non-believer"? (Or what I say (I confess) when I hope no one is listening "jerk":D)

Please understand I don't consider this a big issue, I'm just curious.

[Jennarator]

Non-LDS just means they are not a member of this church.

"anti" means they are against the church. Most of the time when someone says "anti" they are talking about someone that purposfully says something or does something to share with people how wrong the LDS church (or whatever church they are anti) is.

[Vort]

Do you see a difference between a non-Christian and an anti-Christian? The non-Christian is simply not a believer in Christ or Biblical doctrine, while the anti-Christian actively seeks to destroy Christianity. Similarly, anti-Mormons actively seek to destroy the faith of Latter-day Saints and convince others that "Mormonism" is false and evil.

But the term "anti-Mormon" is typically reserved for an even more specific group: Those that hate and seek to destroy the LDS Church by using gossip, innuendo, half-truth, and bald-faced lies, who happily use any means, honest or dishonest, in their hateful quest to tear down "Mormonism".

[NeuroTypical]

I don't like the term anti-mormon. It's overused as an insult and way to dismiss people - just like bigot and homophobe and warmonger and whatnot.

I prefer "church critic" for people who are critical of my church.

[prisonchaplain]

Having been here for a few years now, I have come to understand and appreciate the cautious use of this term "Anti-Mormon." The term tends the fit the following:

1. Religious organizations set up to either convert Mormons to evangelicalism

2. Religious organizations set up to "expose" LDS teachings

3. Individuals who come to LDS venues (such as conferences or pageants) with huge, confrontational signs, bullhorns, and other paraphenalia, in order to mock and berate

4. Individuals who come to LDS sites to argue and preach evangelicalism

5. Especially individuals who post "cut and paste" questions and talking points from such sources as described in #s 1&2.

Since LDS follow Jesus, and Muslims and Buddhists generally do not, the latter religions probably find it natural that Christians would try to convert them. LDS find it rather strange that we evangelicals have several "small industries" set up to oppose them. Some find it proof that they have some special.

Personally, I think President Mouw (Fuller Seminary) was largely right in recognizing that many evangelical and fundamentalist efforts at converting Mormons were and are unchristlike. His apology a few years back was controversial. Many found it presumptuous. Me, I think it was mostly appropriate. A leading evangelical speaks at the Mormon Tabernacle and says evangelicals have spread lies about LDS beliefs. - Beliefnet.com

Edited September 9, 2011 by prisonchaplain

[Dravin]

1. Religious organizations set up to either convert Mormons to evangelicalism

See for me, I don't see that as inherently anti, at least in the common sense. If you think about it the LDS Church's missionary program is dedicated to converting evangelicals (and others) to itself.

2. Religious organizations set up to "expose" LDS teachings

I'd agree with this if "expose" is scare quoted on purpose to indicate a certain misrepresentation. Personally I don't begrudge anyone explaining differences in theology, and why their's is the correct one. We do it all the time ourselves. It's when you have organizations that do stuff like, "They worship Joseph Smith!" and wait for the audience to gasp. If the teachings are being represented fairly and honestly I don't have objection.

I think it's when this gets combined with #1 that #1 gets the anti-flavor.

3. Individuals who come to LDS venues (such as conferences or pageants) with huge, confrontational signs, bullhorns, and other paraphenalia, in order to mock and berate

Yeah, it's an extension of misrepresentation combined with the fact that it seems less to be about conversion that it does trying to hurt people. It's just the naked antagonism I guess. There is also a sense of disrespect because we instruct our missionaries not to proselyte at other churches or religious properties, and we do so because we feel it's respectful, but I think it's mostly the naked antagonism that upsets.

4. Individuals who come to LDS sites to argue and preach evangelicalism

I think this one doesn't need much qualification. And in all fairness I think an LDS who goes to say a Catholic or Protestant Religious site doing the same thing is in the same category as those who do it to us. It should be noted though that seeking understanding and respectfully explaining your beliefs is perfectly fine, even if there is the hope that you may touch someone in said efforts.

5. Especially individuals who post "cut and paste" questions and talking points from such sources as described in #s 1&2.

It's kind of a one two punch, you have as you note, elements of #1 and #2 because of the source being combined with #4. It's not entirely uncommon* to have the open antagonism of #3 in there either.

*Changed common to uncommon.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Dravin

[Guest gopecon]

I think the key to someone being "anti" Mormon (or any other faith) is when they specifically target that faith for criticism. Go into most Christian book stores and you will find whole sections devoted to attacking Mormonism (and some other faiths as well). It becomes a hobby for some, and a career for others. On the internet they are the ones who raise questions not out of interest in the answers, but in the hope that they will trip up or weaken the faith of someone who passes by.

You will not find writings in LDS bookstores devoted to tearing down other specific churches (beyond making the case that there was a general apostacy after the apostles were killed). While there are individual exceptions, we generally are taught to appreciate the good in other churches and to seek friendships and alliances on issues in which we find common ground.

[Guest gopecon]

Regarding PC's list and Dravin's response

1) I'm with PC on this one - Organizations set up to preach against (or convert) Mormons are inherently anti. We don't target Baptists, Catholics, or any other group. We preach a positive message that the Gospel has been restored.

2) I think PC meant "expose" in a sensationalistic manner. These are the ones who cherry pick teachings that may or may not be true and put them out there without context to make us look odd (not that we need help in that regard :).

3) Clearly these people have too much time on their hands - does screaming at people ever influence them?

4) Coming to LDS sites to preach - it all depends on the methods and attitudes they bring, but many cross the line into anti by repeating tired arguments and not listening to responses.

5) Cutting and pasting from anti-sites is pretty clear evidence of a lack of desire for civil discourse.

[Soninme]

THanks for the responses thus far.

Quote:

1. Religious organizations set up to either convert Mormons to evangelicalism

See for me, I don't see that as inherently anti, at least in the common sense. If you think about it the LDS Church's missionary program is dedicated to converting evangelicals (and others) to itself.

Quote:

Hello Dravin,

I also don't see that as inherently anti.

As a non LDS Christian I see it as part of my walk with Christ to “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature"(Mark 16:15) and "sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; (1 Peter 3:15) and "to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints. (Jude 3)

We all encounter those of other faiths yet IF we believe they "have other gods" (Exodus 20:3) or "another Jesus" or "different gospel" (2 Corinthians 11:4) it is a good work to witness to them. I believe the Holy Spirit does lead us to do just that. I for one am so grateful for those who very patiently did that for me even though I thought much less of them at the time. It is being loving.

That being said, if it is not done in love and with respect then it's worldly and probably should be labeled "anti" and who wants to listen to that anyway.

Thanks

[prisonchaplain]

Several have mentioned that some organizations dedicated to evangelizing Mormons are not "Anti." Perhaps. Others though, to even link them here could lead to a violation of TOS. The other reality is that some people's "civil disagreement" is other people's "spiritual genocide."

To use a third-party example, many many Jews find the whole idea of Messianic Judaism (Jews who believe in Jesus as the Messiah) to be a horrific ruse perpetrated by Southern Baptists. It's not true, though the SBC does sponsor Jewish evangelism, by sponsoring Messianic congregations. Jews for Jesus is a much more direct organization, engaging in pamphleteering and sidewalk evangelism in Jewish neighborhoods. Some Jewish people are so anti-missionary that they do indeed accuse these groups of engaging in spiritual genocide. The opposition is so strong that some Jews reject the charity behind evangelical Christian political and monetary support for Israel is merely a tactic to win converts. Other Jews are very thankful for that friendship, and very tolerant of our missionary efforts. As a local rabbi in our area put it, when a Christian friends starts to "introduce me to Jesus" I just put a hand up and say, "No thanks." He adds that no one has ever pushed the matter, afterwards.

That's the Jewish community. In the case of Mormons, we have been much more ham-handed. There are some intelligent, thoughtful, conversational evangelicals who seek to engage LDS in dialogue...as one said, with the hope of "touching" someone. Then there are the sign-waving, BoM stomping, sacred garment hoisting folks that FAIRLDS captures on video. I'm not sure why you attract so much of our more foolish efforts, but you do win points for patience. I would be outraged if theological opponents set up shop outside my conferences, or church, or rallies.

So...I guess the caveat is that with all broad categories, there are exceptions. Some organizations can target specific religions, but do so respectfully. Some individuals can "preach," but do so without offense, and with charity. Kudos to them.

[rameumptom]

I don't like the term anti-mormon. It's overused as an insult and way to dismiss people - just like bigot and homophobe and warmonger and whatnot.

I prefer "church critic" for people who are critical of my church.

Wow, LM, being so nice to like this, you sure sound like an Anti-Mormon right now....

[Guest mormonmusic]

Personally, I think President Mouw (Fuller Seminary) was largely right in recognizing that many evangelical and fundamentalist efforts at converting Mormons were and are unchristlike. His apology a few years back was controversial. Many found it presumptuous. Me, I think it was mostly appropriate. A leading evangelical speaks at the Mormon Tabernacle and says evangelicals have spread lies about LDS beliefs. - Beliefnet.com

And this is precisely why I'd be willing to talk to prisonchaplin about my beliefs with an open-mind -- and not with the people who distort our beliefs and resort to deceptive and belligerent tactics. If I know they have done this (belligerance and deceit), I'm out of there.

I'm someone with out-of-the box ideas in just about any context, and my family are all Evangelicals. You would think I would be ripe for conversion from the Mormon religion. Yet these people have absolutely no influence over my thinking because they, and the people they associate with, subscribe to deceit, disrespect and just plain annoying behavior to try to get us to change. It reduces their message to tinkling brass. They don't realize that when you net their successes with their silent failures (like their total loss of my willingness to listen), they are probably doing more harm than good to their cause -- and to Evangelicalism stripped of anti-Mormonism in general.

The only glimmers of hope I see for Evangelical ideas to alter my thinking are people like President Mouw and Prisonchaplin who acknowledge the tactics used by others in their religion, thus restoring a degree of trust and opening my heart.

[prisonchaplain]

The other reality is that the majority of evangelicals are now believers in the doctrine of free will (somewhat similar to free agency)...thus we should recognize that everyone has the spiritual authority to choose. The Holy Spirit will woo, but not coerce. Thus, burning bridges is such foolishness.

If I were to sit down with mormonmusic and discuss religion, the openess we would share would likely exist because we both felt confident in our faith, we both believed the other would respectfully listen, and we might both hold out the slim hope of actually be a vessel for God to use to bring spiritual blessing and added truth to the other. Ironically, all of that is predicated on mutual openness--something many on both sides of the fence might find unacceptably risky.

[Blackmarch]

As a non LDS believer in Christ who frequents this site I often see the term "anti-Mormon" or simply "anti".

I can understand it's use when there are (unfortunately) those that come here with no other purpose than to pick a fight or to belittle LDS beliefs.

As one who frequents many websites of those who do not believe as I do, I don't see the terms "anti-Muslem" or "anti-Jehovahs Witness" or "anti-Buddist" etc. used to describe those who question others beliefs, whether they are sincere or otherwise.

My question is, why is that term used instead of, say, "non-LDS" or "non-believer"? (Or what I say (I confess) when I hope no one is listening "jerk":D)

Please understand I don't consider this a big issue, I'm just curious.

anti is generally referring to people who lay a trap for their neighbor, and who strain at gnats while trying to swallow a camel.

[Soninme]

I don't like the term anti-mormon. It's overused as an insult and way to dismiss people - just like bigot and homophobe and warmonger and whatnot.

I prefer "church critic" for people who are critical of my church.

If I may say, I agree with you LM.

Sometimes (not always) it may be overused if we don't understand a persons heart/motive. Case in point; I wonder what the Scribes and the Pharisees thought of Jesus after His remarks in Mathew 23, calling them "blind guides" "fools and blind" "hypocrites" and reffering to some of their faulty teachings and practices, then correcting them, and for sure, offending them. Christ certainly wasn't anti-scibe and anti-pharisee in the sense that He didn't love them, But He was very "anti-false teachings/practices", yet some may consider His words quite harsh.

Christ came to set captives free. Free from false rules, teachings, and teachers. Many were offended. It did after all get Him crucified by those that were offended.

Certainly, if we are, His true disciples we are to, above all things, show His love to all and be loving. Jesus died also for those caught up in false teachings and religions too and we are called to witness in love to those too. It is loving (I believe) when (for instance) a LDS tries to correct me of false or incomplete teaching. If I disagree with them I don't think of them as anti-....

Please understand I know some things are clearly "anti" but maybe not as much as first thought.

Others in this thread have shown how those with opposing "truth" can have respectful dialogue and that makes good sense.

Edited September 18, 2011 by Soninme

[Mamas_Girl]

I have absolutely NO problem with people who teach what *they* believe. In fact, I enjoy the kind of open discussions that we seem to have on these forums.

To me, an anti-Mormon is not merely a church critic, but is one who either through ignorance or intention creates, promotes, and distributes pamphlets, books and movies claiming it to be well documented as the LDS belief; when in reality they are taking things out of context, adding spooky music for special effects, or including ex-Mormons who are "experts" in what the LDS believe.

If I were to sit down with mormonmusic and discuss religion, the openess we would share would likely exist because we both felt confident in our faith, we both believed the other would respectfully listen, and we might both hold out the slim hope of actually be a vessel for God to use to bring spiritual blessing and added truth to the other.

I get the impression that the anti-Mormons are NOT confident in their own beliefs and are concerned that the LDS message may look better so they need to focus their time, energy and money on trying to tear apart the LDS Church, rather than build up their own.

Sadly, my sister is an anti-Mormon. I've had many a long nights where I've had to sit down with my mother and go point by point over what my sister's info said to calm her down. Oddly my family is a mixture of religious beliefs: My parents were Methodist, my sister Evangelical Born Again (that's what she'd call herself), another sister is Catholic, and a brother that's Episcopalian, and I've gotten it from all sides but my parents.

If I was ever disgruntled with the LDS church and wanted to leave, I'd be far more easily converted by the love and respect that I feel prisonchaplain has for the Church (despite not being a member), than the negativity and falsehoods that I see coming from the anti-Mormons.

[prisonchaplain]

Loving those we disagree with theologically is not a new idea, but we still see far too few stories like this: Assemblies of God minister turns away from hatred

[clint25n]

My two cents... as a Christian, we believe people will be led astray by many different religions, and in the end will be separated from God forever. These people that speak out against the LDS beliefs may be Anti-Mormonism, but certainly not Anti-Mormons. The love for other people and their souls combined with the commandment from Jesus to earnestly contend for the faith cause them to speak out against the teachings of the LDS church. I hope no one believes these people have nothing but compassion for Mormons.

There is no doubt the Gospel is both good news to many and offensive to others.

[Spartan117]

These people that speak out against the LDS beliefs may be Anti-Mormonism, but certainly not Anti-Mormons.I hope no one believes these people have nothing but compassion for Mormons..

I believe you have been misinformed.

[rameumptom]

My two cents... as a Christian, we believe people will be led astray by many different religions, and in the end will be separated from God forever. These people that speak out against the LDS beliefs may be Anti-Mormonism, but certainly not Anti-Mormons. The love for other people and their souls combined with the commandment from Jesus to earnestly contend for the faith cause them to speak out against the teachings of the LDS church. I hope no one believes these people have nothing but compassion for Mormons.

There is no doubt the Gospel is both good news to many and offensive to others.

We have no problem with those who speak out against our teachings. What we consider Anti-Mormon are people that do the following:

1. Stand by the Salt Lake Temple during General Conference and harangue the passers-by, waving garments in the air, and sometimes even cursing at the LDS. It is one thing to debate intelligently the issues. It is another thing entirely to harass others like this. It definitely does not show any semblance of respect or love to those they are trying to reach.

2. Those who use lies to scare people away from considering Mormonism. There are some who twist our teachings to make them very macabre. Imagine someone warning others to stay away from Christianity, because it included a vampiric zombie leader who teaches his followers to drink blood and eat flesh! It falsely describes the theology of Christ and Christianity, but such a twist could essentially scare people away from it all. As LDS, we see such twisted claims regarding our religion all the time, such as Mike Huckabee bringing up 4 years ago in the presidential campaign against Mitt Romney the question, "don't Mormons believe Jesus and Satan are brothers?" Actually, no we don't believe they are brothers, as Satan fell from his high perch and lost any status within the kingdom of God. Yet, such "twists" of logic make things seem awful within Mormonism.

Neither of these shows respect nor love for those they are trying to reach. Instead, it insults us. They use lies and insults in an attempt to beat us into submission. What they end up doing is scaring their own followers away from researching the actual teachings of Mormonism by setting up straw men. They create their own version of Mormonism, then knock it down in any way they can.

I have been in discussions where such "loving" Christians have tried to tell me what I believe - even when I do not. Again, would you feel it right for someone to claim that Christians follow a zombie?

Such are the Anti-Mormons. They do God no service by lying. They only enrich themselves and condemn their own souls to hell. They are Pharisees, who not only keep themselves out of heaven, but seek to do the same for others as well, by using scare tactics.

[MrShorty]

I have been in discussions where such "loving" Christians have tried to tell me what I believe - even when I do not.

Especially that one time, sitting across a table from one of these "loving" Christians who, every time I said that I believed with all my heart that Jesus is my Savior and Redeemer, he responded with, "No, you don't." That was the biggest insult to my faith that I believe I have experienced.

[Spartan117]

The "loving" Christians outside of general conference each year are my favorites.

[Mamas_Girl]

The love for other people and their souls combined with the commandment from Jesus to earnestly contend for the faith cause them to speak out against the teachings of the LDS church.

I have no problem with people who speak out against the teachings of the LDS church, to me they are not the anti-Mormons that we're talking about. However, I do have a problem with people who take our sacred beliefs out of context, use lies, and scare tactics to try to scare people away from finding out what we really believe.

I hope no one believes these people have nothing but compassion for Mormons.

The gospel of Christ is one of love and compassion, yet when these so-called anti-Mormonism people are around they bring hatred and contention. A person who takes another persons religion and trashes it based on lies is NOT one who has "nothing but compassion" for a person.

If you want to have true compassion for Mormons, take away the movies, books, pamphlets, etc. and focus more on what your church believes and let the pure love of Christ do it's job.

[clint25n]

What are these "lies" everyone is telling which you are speaking about? I'm not familiar with people spreading lies.

I understand that there are people whom are very rude and perhaps do not truly love you but are instead preaching out of their pride. If you wish to call them Anti-Mormons, I would most definitely agree with you.

But there are also many outside the pageant whom DO love and that can be seen taking the same approach as the apostles whom preached and contended for the faith at the steps of Jewish temples, synagogues and pagan temples. They were prosecuted, beaten arrested, and even killed for their offensive actions. These apostles were not Anti-Jew or Anti-Pagan, but were Anti- their belief system. These whom truly love Mormons and have compassion for their souls I could not call Anti-Mormon, but only Anti-Mormonism. You can be Pro-Mormon but Anti-Mormonism.

[Mamas_Girl]

What are these "lies" everyone is telling which you are speaking about? I'm not familiar with people spreading lies.

Well, I'm not going to make this into a doctrine bashing, but I'll simply give the biggest one -- that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints still practices polygamy. That's in almost every anti-Mormon movie, book, pamphlet, etc, and simply is not true. I could go on about the half-truths, fallacies of defective induction, sensationalism, etc found in the anti-Mormon propaganda, but I'd rather not waste my time talking about what we don't believe, I'd rather use my time productively by sharing what we do believe.