Psychic or crazy?

[greendragon]

Hi, all,

I need answers to something that is really confusing to me. My 22 yr old RM son recently revealed to us, his parents, that ever since he was 14 he has experienced what I woud call empathic abilities. He struggled on his mission, and is still struggling now in college. He avoids other people and is really uncomfortable in social situations and avoids them as much as possible. He now believes he is psychic. He says, "it is a near constant and permanent state as I feel others emotions and thoughts everywhere I go." So is he psychic? What does the church teach about this? I don't know whether to have him committed or encourage him to get a job as a psychic (he can't seem to hold down a "regular" job). Last year he was diagnosed with Avoidant Personality Disorder and Social Phobia. Is he mentally ill, and should we help him get treatment? Because he's an adult, we can't really force him, and he is very secretive. How can I best help him? He lives in student housing near his college, so we don't see him very often and he usually ignores my emails, texts, and phone calls. What should I do?

[Vort]

As far as I know, the Church doesn't teach anything about psychic ability. In my opinion, it's hooey. It sounds to me like your son is emotionally disturbed and needs help.

[Jennarator]

The church does not teach of this.

It would be possible that he is very sensitive to other's feelings.

I don't know what to call "psychic" phenomenons, but I know people do just "know" things. Like my sister, growing up when we would go on a family road trip, she would say something like there is a blue house around the corner with a white bird bath that has a chip on the side and a big window and five stairs on the front of the house. She would say this when we had never been to the city before and she was ALWAYS spot on. Sometimes she would say something like a lady is going to come out and check the mail when we drive or walk by.

just can't explain it.

Edited May 15, 2013 by Jennarator

[greendragon]

Vort, you say that he needs help, but my question is HOW do we help him get that help? As I said, he is very secretive and we don't see him often (he lives about 30 miles away), and he does not respond to my attempts to contact him. Should I just leave him alone and let him live his life? Should I call his bishop and tell him what I know? He is active, and holds a calling in his singles ward, but does not date. He can't stand for anyone to touch him, as he says contact makes the feelings of the person much stronger. I'm his mother, but he is an adult. As long as he is not a danger to himself or others, my hands are tied.

[NeuroTypical]

Is he an independant adult living on his own dime, or is he still a dependent child relying on you to pay some/all of his bills?

The answer sort of determines your power in the situation.

[annewandering]

It is pretty strong to say he is mentally ill. There are people who are sensitive to things that I sure dont understand. We really have no idea how much we are capable of doing. Perhaps the better thing to do would be to help him deal with his reaction to others emotions.

If you felt others emotions all the time wouldnt you avoid social situations? I would. You dont have to believe he is psychic but it would be good to just accept that you dont know. Its not up to you, at this point, to feel you have to do anything other than be his mom. He is an adult. He is active. He seems to take care of himself. Sounds like he is doing better than a lot of kids out there.

Would it help to think about the gift of discernment?

[greendragon]

Thank you, Anne, I like that, the gift of discernment. Yes, he does take care of himself, for the most part. I have to get after him to cut his hair every 4 or 5 months though. He goes to college and gets decent grades (I think--he won't show me). I have helped him find out about counseling offered at the college, and he says he is going, but I have no way to verify if he is or not. I don't know how to help him deal with the emotions of others. What does that mean? How?

Your question, Loudmouth, is a good one. He is using student loans to pay for school, but we pay his living expenses, or did until recently. Several months ago I told him that we could no longer support him financially, and gave him the option to move back home and take the train to school, or get a job, even if it was at DI, or get financial aid to pay for his housing. We also helped him to apply for food stamps. We are still awaiting their decision. I helped him apply for Social Security disability, but he was denied. We are in the process of appealing that decision. He got some money recently but won't tell me where he got it from. I suspect he is doing some sort of psychic readings and getting paid for it online. I encouraged him to do that a couple of months ago, but now I am second-guessing myself. He has to support himself somehow, but he can't seem to hold down any kind of a regular job, though. He has only ever held two jobs, and both of them let him go after the first three weeks. He just renewed his lease at his apartment for the next year, so we are locked into that now. Somehow we will have to make sure that he has rent money. My husband lost his job eight months ago, so we told him we can no longer support him financially. Should I talk to his bishop about all of this?

[Guest]

My mentally disturbed SIL likes to say that she has the gift of discernment. Really it's just a manipulative tool she uses to win arguments. I've known she was dead wrong when she's insisting that she "discerns" her opinion by the Spirit and can't be wrong. So you've got to be careful with that one.

I think he's probably very sensitive, coupled with social anxiety. But none of us here are psychiatrists.

[Vort]

Vort, you say that he needs help, but my question is HOW do we help him get that help? As I said, he is very secretive and we don't see him often (he lives about 30 miles away), and he does not respond to my attempts to contact him. Should I just leave him alone and let him live his life? Should I call his bishop and tell him what I know? He is active, and holds a calling in his singles ward, but does not date. He can't stand for anyone to touch him, as he says contact makes the feelings of the person much stronger. I'm his mother, but he is an adult. As long as he is not a danger to himself or others, my hands are tied.

You ask how to help him to get help. My answer: I don't know.

In my experience, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. When your son decides he needs help, then -- and only then -- he will be in a position to receive help. Until that point, I suppose you keep loving, supporting, and parenting him as you can, helping him navigate the complexities of adult life while avoiding being an "enabler" of destructive behavior.

Good luck to you and to your son.

[applepansy]

Thank you, Anne, I like that, the gift of discernment. Yes, he does take care of himself, for the most part. I have to get after him to cut his hair every 4 or 5 months though. He goes to college and gets decent grades (I think--he won't show me). I have helped him find out about counseling offered at the college, and he says he is going, but I have no way to verify if he is or not. I don't know how to help him deal with the emotions of others. What does that mean? How?

Your question, Loudmouth, is a good one. He is using student loans to pay for school, but we pay his living expenses, or did until recently. Several months ago I told him that we could no longer support him financially, and gave him the option to move back home and take the train to school, or get a job, even if it was at DI, or get financial aid to pay for his housing. We also helped him to apply for food stamps. We are still awaiting their decision. I helped him apply for Social Security disability, but he was denied..We are in the process of appealing that decision. He got some money recently but won't tell me where he got it from. I suspect he is doing some sort of psychic readings and getting paid for it online. I encouraged him to do that a couple of months ago, but now I am second-guessing myself. He has to support himself somehow, but he can't seem to hold down any kind of a regular job, though. He has only ever held two jobs, and both of them let him go after the first three weeks. He just renewed his lease at his apartment for the next year, so we are locked into that now. Somehow we will have to make sure that he has rent money. My husband lost his job eight months ago, so we told him we can no longer support him financially. Should I talk to his bishop about all of this?

The standard for SSDI is to deny, deny, deny. So you appeal, appeal and appeal. You can do this for him but I suggest getting an attorney before the final appeal. It can take 3-6 years to get approval.

He is an adult as as an adult "you" can have him committed. He has to show that he is a danger to himself of others usually in a public way or in front of a police officer, counselor, etc.

If your husband is without and job I wouldn't continue to pay his rent unless you're on the lease. You can get out of a lease but there will probably be some sort of penalty.

The Bishop will be able to refer him to LDS Social Services for counseling but I have never met a Psychiatrist or a Psychologist there, only SW and LCSW.

Get his name and your name on the temple prayer roll. Fast and pray. With faith a solution will present itself.

[Gwen]

You can't give him what you don't have, won't make it any easier but it's a fact of life. If you don't have the income you can't keep paying the rent. If he renewed it then I'm guessing it's his name on the lease. So tell him you can't afford it and he shouldn't have renewed without consulting you. It's on him to make the payments or get evicted. If it's your name on the lease then he didn't have the authority to renew it. So call the landlord and let them know they screwed up and you did not intend to renew nor does your son have that authority. They need to redo the lease with your son or evict him. I would not accept any penalty for their screw up.

If he is disabled enough to get government assistance to survive then it does not seem unreasonable to get a mental health evaluation. I would guess there could be many reasons he says he feels other emotions. Some of those might be helped with medication. He may really be feeling something, if he is then he needs to get help to learn to cope with that. If he can get a job and he's not a danger to anyone then he's got the right to live a secluded life, there is nothing wrong with that. I can understand how it would be hard on you.

[NeuroTypical]

It sounds like the little bird has taken a step out of the nest, and is currently in the air. Whether he's working his wings and flying, or spiraling down to crash, I guess isn't known yet.

If he ends up flying, it looks like you'll have to just deal with the fact that he's making choices with which you disagree. I'm just guessing here, but I'm guessing you might have a real big problem with that.

If he ends up crashing, you can offer to scoop him back up. Make sure your terms are clear. You wouldn't be the first parent to enable a bunch of destructive nonsense by paying bills without a valid agreement about behavior, including consequenses. You wouldn't be the first parent to make bad financial decisions that land on your head, to keep a kid's bad financial decisions from landing on theirs.

Consider the following: He may end up in a few years in debt, jobless, out of the church, pursuing foolish paths, and ticked off. Consider that that state of affairs is his to deal with, and not yours. Consider the appropriateness of removing his agency by manipulating him or pressuring him to avoid this end.

Oh - and please come back and give us updates every now and then! I may be in your position some day, and I'd love to know if my free advice is actually worth anything. :)

[Martain]

Is it possible to know the thoughts and emotions of others? Yes.

Alma 10

17 Now they knew not that Amulek could know of their designs. But it came to pass as they began to question him, he perceived their thoughts, and he said unto them: O ye wicked and perverse generation, ye lawyers and hypocrites, for ye are laying the foundations of the devil; for ye are laying traps and snares to catch the holy ones of God.

Alma 12

2 Now the words that Alma spake unto Zeezrom were heard by the people round about; for the multitude was great, and he spake on this wise:

3 Now Zeezrom, seeing that thou hast been taken in thy lying and craftiness, for thou hast not lied unto men only but thou hast lied unto God; for behold, he knows all thy thoughts, and thou seest that thy thoughts are made known unto us by his Spirit;

Alma 18

16 And it came to pass that Ammon, being filled with the Spirit of God, therefore he perceived the thoughts of the king. And he said unto him: Is it because thou hast heard that I defended thy servants and thy flocks, and slew seven of their brethren with the sling and with the sword, and smote off the arms of others, in order to defend thy flocks and thy servants; behold, is it this that causeth thy marvelings?

Q: Could my son really hear the thoughts and feels the emotions of others he is nearby and if so by what power could this be done?

A: It is by the power of God could such be done.

Q: So you think he has such a spiritual gift from God?

A: No I do not.

Q: No? Why not?

A: Based upon the effects of the gift. It doesn't draw him nearer others to serve them and doesn't grant him greater compassion and charity for others. I couldn't find a single effect of this gift on his life which I would deem positive from what you shared. He's now saying he has psychic powers which is like a priesthood holder saying he has magic powers. If he does have psychic powers, they are not from God.

Q: If not from God then from where?

A: Well he could be simply making this up to tick you off and create space.

Q: What if he's not making it up?

A: Is there not opposition in all things? Are there not true gifts from God and counterfeit gifts from Satan? The feelings and thoughts have to come from somewhere. If it's not a gift from God and it's not intentionally or unintentionally of his own making then that leaves false revelation from the Devil.

Q: -scoff- From the Devil?

A: What you think he's dead? He's just as alive and kicking as he's ever been if not more powerful than ever. He'll deceive the very elect if they do not take the Holy Ghost as their guide and remain vigilent. Astrology, phrenology, palm reading, psychic readings etc. etc., are all false forms of the true spritual gift of prophecy. What God creates Satan imitates and he's very effective at what he does.

Q: So you think that this is a false and evil spiritual gift and revelation from the Devil?

A: Yes I do.

Q: Couldn't it simply be mental illness and not have anything to do with the Devil?

A: It could be. Based on personal experience I really doubt such is his case but it could be.

Q: Personal experience?

A: If only you knew. Fortunately you personally don't know which has saved you from a lot of pain and sorrow.

Q: Care to explain?

A: Not at this time but someone who really wanted to know could comb through all my posts here and glean some insights as to what I refer to.

Q: Is it important that I know the source of this gift and if so why?

A: Absolutely! You wouldn't want to treat it as mental illness if he's making it up would you? Likewise if it's a false gift from the Devil then do you really think physical medications are going to help him with a spiritual condition? How can you move forward in the right direction in regards to what you do from here on out if you do not know the cause and hence the direction you should go?

Q: Well how do I find out for sure the source of this gift then?

A: Your son is claiming a certain spiritual gift. His bishop has the right to the gift of spiritual discernment in part specifically for situations just like this.

D&C 46:27 And unto the bishop of the church, and unto such as God shall appoint and ordain to watch over the church and to be elders unto the church, are to have it given unto them to discern all those gifts lest there shall be any among you professing and yet be not of God.

My recommendation is to counsel with his Bishop and gain confirmation via revelation as to the source of this gift. Once you know that, you'll be in a position to move forward in the right direction in your efforts to help him.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Martain
to reply to other poster's requests

[annewandering]

A: The feelings and thoughts have to come from somewhere. If such feelings and thoughts are not of his own creation and not of God then they are of the Devil.

Q: So you think that this is a false and evil spiritual gift from the Devil?

A: Yes I do.

And this is why we have had burnings at the stake. People dont understand something so its better to decide its from satan and condemn them. I note you have no scripture to defend this position but have quoted scriptures for your other statements. Could there be a reason for this? Sometimes we just do not know why some things are.

My grandfather who did not have the priesthood at the time, snuck into a friends hospital room in the middle of the night and healed his extensive burns that were killing him. Where did he get the power to do that? He had no priesthood yet he healed burns and stopped massive bleeding somehow. I wondered if it were by satans power but have come to realize we just dont know. He did it. Lots claim to but are just quacks but others can. Fortunately we dont burn people at the stake for things we dont understand anymore.

[NeuroTypical]

I'd add one very possible QA:

Q: Is he doing this to tick mom off as he does the usual 'teenager creating space to find out who he is' thing?

A: Quite possibly

[Martain]

Agreed, that is also a distinct possibility that ran through my mind. Thanks for adding it LM.

[Jane_Doe]

GreenDragon,

I hear your worries. I was once very much like your son, and worried my mother constantly. Having been in a very similar situation, here is my unsolicited advise:

It is my personal opinion that slapping a label on whatever your son is going through will not ‘solve’ the situation. Whether it is from God or the devil is also irrelevant: value matters little where life’s situations came FROM, but instead depends on where a person chooses to GO with the cards they are dealt.

Your son is going through a rough time, is very caught up in the emotions of others (whether real or imagined) and probably has some degree of clinical depression. He wants space to sort himself out. Meanwhile your budget is strained and you need to cut the bills (you’re paying for his rent).

My suggestion is to have faith: in your son and the Lord. Trust in them. Trust your son to do what’s best for himself— if he says needs time and space to sort things out, then step back and let him have it. I know how hard stepping back is for a concerned mother, but if he needs your help he knows your there for him, and you can help the minute he asks for it. If you can no longer afford your son’s rent, then step back from that too; if you don’t take care of yourself now, then you won’t be able to help your son when he asks for it.

Most of all, trust in the Father to keep watch over yourself and your son: He knows what’s best.

-Jane

Edited May 18, 2013 by Jane_Doe

[rayhale]

To know whether or not someone is psychic, crazy, has the power of discernment, or is just really observant, is difficult, if not impossible to determine. This is my personal opinion, if a person has the ability to ‘see’ other people’s emotions, there are numerous other professions other than being a psychic, like being a: psychiatrist, psychologist, counselor, or even a ‘life coach’ (whatever that is).

I don’t know if it’s like this for all psychics, but it seems like they’ll say anything that their client wants them to, to keep the money flowing in.

I feel like I need to point out that the scriptures that Martain quoted from, the prophet observed what was going on, this is especially true in Alma 10:17 where Amulek questioned the lawyers, and the lawyer questioned Amulek, meaning what? I guess this is a chicken or the egg type of question, of which came first, did Amulek get his answer from God, or from the dialog he had from the lawyers, for which I don’t know there is an answer.

[greendragon]

If it's your name on the lease then he didn't have the authority to renew it. So call the landlord and let them know they screwed up and you did not intend to renew nor does your son have that authority. They need to redo the lease with your son or evict him. I would not accept any penalty for their screw up.

If he is disabled enough to get government assistance to survive then it does not seem unreasonable to get a mental health evaluation. I would guess there could be many reasons he says he feels other emotions. Some of those might be helped with medication.

It's his name on the lease, but I am the cosigner. So unfortunately we would be on the hook for it if he moves out. We may be able to find someone take over the lease in August if he can't afford it after that. That will give him a few months to see if he can do it on his own.

He has had a mental health evaluation. I thought he had aspergers syndrome, but the results showed social phobia, Avoidant personality disorder, and depression not otherwise specified. Apparently that was not enough for Social Security to declare him unable to work though. He has tried medication in the past, but he says he does not like the way it makes him feel, so he refuses to take it. Since he is an adult, no one can force him.

[greendragon]

My suggestion is to have faith: in your son and the Lord. Trust in them. Trust your son to do what’s best for himself— if he says needs time and space to sort things out, then step back and let him have it. I know how hard stepping back is for a concerned mother, but if he needs your help he knows your there for him, and you can help the minute he asks for it. If you can no longer afford your son’s rent, then step back from that too; if you don’t take care of yourself now, then you won’t be able to help your son when he asks for it.

Most of all, trust in the Father to keep watch over yourself and your son: He knows what’s best.

-Jane

You are so right, Jane! I guess I have been operating from a place of fear, which is the opposite of faith. Thank you for the reminder.

[SenSixB]

Wow what a bunch of jerks there are on here...mentally disturbed? Thats not what I gathered at all...

In my opinion the OP parent sounds like the disturbed one... sounds like a mean and cruel person talking about having there son committed and being crazy...maybe the OP needs to do some soul searching, about why there son is that way...I would live 30 miles away from my parents if they felt that way about me...

If he is empathic...he avoids people because when you are empathic, you feel others emotions as your own, and that is very mentally and emotionally draining. I deal with it myself. But I've learned how to control it, and not let it effect me negatively and how to use it for good...but when your parents are negative like the OP on here it can have a HUGELY negative impact on you... Poor guy.

Mercy: A Spiritual Gift

the characteristics of a spiritual gift

A Christian’s motivational spiritual gift represents what God does in him to shape his perspective on life and motivate his words and actions. Romans 12:3–8 describes “basic motivations,” which are characterized by inherent qualities or abilities within a believer—the Creator’s unique workmanship in him or her.

Through the motivational gifts, God makes believers aware of needs that He wants to meet through them, for His glory. Then, believers can minister to others through the ministry and manifestation gifts of the Spirit, in ways beyond mere human capability and ingenuity, with maximum effectiveness and minimum weariness.

Each person’s behavior will vary according to factors such as temperament, background, age, gender, culture, and circumstances. However, it is not unusual for individuals who share the same motivational gift to demonstrate common characteristics. Below are some general characteristics that are typically exhibited by those who have the motivational gift of mercy.

General Characteristics

A mercy-giver’s basic motivational drive is to sense and respond to the emotional and spiritual needs of others. Those with the mercy motivational gift have a divine ability to sense hurt and respond to it with love and understanding.

The mature mercy-giver is kind and gentle.

Mercy-givers sense and reflect the spiritual and emotional atmosphere around them. Whereas prophets, organizers, and teachers tend to project their attitudes to others, individuals who have the gifts of mercy and exhorting are more likely to sense how others are feeling.

Mercies need to be needed. People with this gift must reach out and get involved, or their mercy will turn inward, resulting in an introspective focus that concentrates on their own hurts or fears.

To the mercy-giver, spirituality is not a textbook analysis but rather is an emotional confirmation of God’s presence in his life. He is interested in learning doctrine mainly so that he can act on it and then feel that he has been obedient. If no feelings accompany his experience, he tends to downplay its significance.

Mercies are drawn to other sensitive people.

Believers who have the gift of mercy are the backbone of the prayer power in the Church. They feel they must pray. To them, prayer is an expression of their hearts to God, and nothing else they can do releases these emotions and captures God’s heart better than prayer.

A Mercy’s Strengths

Mercies have a God-given ability to sense a person’s spirit or the atmosphere among a group of people. They recognize the feelings that may be at work in others’ minds and hearts. When mercies are walking in the Spirit, this gift equips them to reach out to people who are suffering but who would likely be reluctant to tell others about their needs.

Mercy-givers are attracted to people in distress; they love the people that most of us tend to run away from.

Mercies love the unlovable, such as the handicapped, the elderly, the seriously ill, and the wounded in spirit. They are drawn to the outcast, the out of fellowship, and the rebellious. Mercy-givers run toward people who are unpleasant or unresponsive, reflecting the heart of God toward needy people.

Because of their sensitivity, mercies do not take sin lightly—their own or someone else’s.

Mercies tend to embrace humility, because of their sensitive spirits and awareness of their own weaknesses and failures.

A Mercy’s Weaknesses

Mercies can be indecisive, tossed to and fro by their emotions. (See James 1:5–8.)

Mercy-givers can easily allow others to become dependent on them, when the individuals should be dependent on God. They often become rescuers of those who do not need to be rescued.

The mercy-giver’s warmth can be falsely interpreted as personal, intimate affection. They must learn to temper their demonstration of affections based on the mindset of those to whom they are ministering. If they fail to do this, both parties may be led into temptation.

Mercies are quick to take up others’ offenses, which can quickly lead to anger and bitterness.

Because mercy-givers try to avoid conflict of any kind, they often avoid confrontation that is needed. Mercy-givers would rather hide from or ignore their enemies than confront them, even when they are in authority over those enemies. Delaying the inevitable always leads to more trouble—for everyone.

Immature or rebellious mercies tend to be harsh and impatient, reflecting their own self-condemnation by lashing out at others whom they judge to be as weak or sinful as they are.

Mercies tend to be introspective. As a person who is sensitive to hurts, it is easy for him to become overly sensitive to his own. If a mercy falls into this trap, he will wallow in past offenses, cling to past bitternesses, and dwell on past mistakes or sins.

It is easy for mercies to develop a poor self-image, since they tend to be introspective and remain acutely aware of their own failures. The longer the mercy dwells on his failures, the more worthless and wicked he feels.

Mercies tend to be worriers as a result of focusing on their own failures.

[Wingnut]

Wow what a bunch of jerks there are on here...

Gee, it's nice to meet you, too.

[SenSixB]

Not all of the replies in here were negative but it did upset me at some of the responses on here.

[Bini]

Not all of the replies in here were negative but it did upset me at some of the responses on here.

You'll either get used to it, or you won't. But name calling is never received well.

[dahlia]

Although the system is set up so that a person can apply for disability on his/her own, don't do it. You'll be denied because you don't know the terms of art that the examiners are looking for. Get a disability attorney (not the lawyer in the mall) if you are going to apply for aid.

My schizophrenic sister would be one of the few exceptions to this rule. Apparently she was so out there, the doctor approved her at the first interview. I hope your son doesn't get to this point.

I believe people can have '2nd sight.' I don't think that many of the people who profess to have it, have it, but I think that some have it all the time and some of us (myself included) have it some times. That said, when a college-aged person starts talking about such things, coupled with problems dealing with other people and holding a job, I get concerned that something else is going on. See if you can convince him to go to a counselor at Student Health. As an adult, you can't force him, but he might still be amenable to a suggestion from you to talk things over with a mental health professional.

I'm sure someone on here will say go see the bishop. Unless your bishop is a PhD in psychology or a psychiatrist, I'm not sure what kind of help he can give. I think this is serious. You can pray all you want, but it sounds like he needs professional help.