Its tough to be a DAD

[Drpepper]

We just moved to a new property. Sunday morning i grabbed my 3 year old daughter and threw her on the front of a motor bike to go around a look at some of the property. I remember thinking as we explored things together that this was the best. She was laughing, and i was appreciating the time together. We checked out some hills, the creek and other things.

After that we got ready for afternoon church and i arrived home just before sunset after counting tithing and various other administrative duties.

It was arriving home that night, that my wife ambushed me about taking out the motor bike on the sabbath. I didn't think to much of it at the time, it merely just seemed like the transport to get me spending some time with my daughter. Needless to say insistent that i had broken the sabbath day and my refusal to see it that way, we both slept on the farthest sides of the bed that night.

This morning guns still loaded, Im still wondering if i did something wrong. Im not looking for supporters just a fresh perspective.

[Gretchen]

I assume motor bike has an engine, and that said engine can sometimes be loud? Perhaps she felt that the noise chases away the Spirit.

[Guest]

I can see it as being a recreational activity, similar to boating. But I can also see your view, so I am no help.

[Lakumi]

what if such a thing was your transportation to church? (whenever I get my scooter/e-bike it will be modified to look like the motorcycle from Akira) and it will always be a joy to ride that, but is it considered bad if its to church?

[Quin]

Query:

Is she upset because you went exploring, or upset that you scared her by having your toddler on the bike?

((Since I consider any activity that makes me in mortal terror of my child's life to be breaking the sabbath. 'Thou shalt not induce panic attacks & renting of clothes and hair' kind of vibe)).

Personally, I love bikes, and that wouldn't send me over the edge... But a lot of people (rightly) regard them as organ donor factories... And hate hate hate their loved ones on them.

Q

[dahlia]

Someone help me here. You can't take out your own bike, on your property, to engage in some quality time with your child, on the Sabbath?

I know we've had this conversation before, but I still don't understand. We're starting to sound like Puritans. What, no laughing on the Sabbath? No enjoyment of art or music? I'm curious, are the art galleries closed on Sunday in Utah?

As an aside, part of me wants to know why you are riding with a child on your bike? What kind of bike? Was the child wearing protective gear? Torts class was filled with stories that start out like yours and end up as tragedies. Just sayin'.

Edited July 29, 2013 by dahlia

[Drpepper]

No The bike is just a peewee 50 nothing dangerous and crashing at the speeds we were going would have resulted in a few band aids not much more. It was the sabbath breaking that was the main issue.

My daughter actually loves being on the bike.

Gretchen if noise chases away the spirit then most of our youth classes on Sunday would have suffered.

[Anddenex]

I am not sure there is anything different than what you did with your daughter and taking a Sunday drive up the canyon to enjoy the view with the family.

[Maureen]

I agree with dahlia. There's seems to be a need to find something to feel guilty about in the LDS world. If your bike is a source of transportation, then what's the difference when you drive a car? I find your wife's reaction very strange. You were having father/daughter time, and that's a good thing.

M.

[TalkativeIntrovert]

Maybe your wife felt left out and a family activity would have been better?

I would get cranky if it was our only family time and my husband chose to spend it alone with one of the kids (especially as the rest was on church). So it would depend on the circumstances. Though I would not call it breaking the Sabbath, jut being thoughtless.

[mnn727]

I'm curious, are the art galleries closed on Sunday in Utah?

I would hope so as if you are going to an Art Gallery, you are making someone work. Same with going to any business, regardless of whether the person working is LDS or not.

8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:

10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

There's no exception there for someone who doesn't share your beliefs, or for sports events or art galleries.

[jerome1232]

This sounds like a little dirt bike yes? I'd have to side with your wife on this, though I think she overreacted a bit. The sabbath isn't for recreation, spending some family time is great, but family time doesn't justify "taking the boat out to the lake" etc...

My biggest reservation is what are you teaching your child? That's it's okay to take the bikes out on sunday for family time? I think there are other activities that are more appropriate which you can engage in.

edit: It's odd that for some reason, my opinion would change if it was a street bike of some type, as I can't differentiate that from a car, and I'd have no problem with a short sunday drive. Some people would view a bike of any type as a recreational vehicle and I guess I can see that, but I use a motorcycle as a commuter, so they aren't recreational in my mind.

Edited July 29, 2013 by jerome1232

[Traveler]

I would hope so as if you are going to an Art Gallery, you are making someone work. Same with going to any business, regardless of whether the person working is LDS or not.

.

Hmmmmm maybe we should not go to church on Sundays?

The Traveler

[Traveler]

We just moved to a new property. Sunday morning i grabbed my 3 year old daughter and threw her on the front of a motor bike to go around a look at some of the property. I remember thinking as we explored things together that this was the best. She was laughing, and i was appreciating the time together. We checked out some hills, the creek and other things.

After that we got ready for afternoon church and i arrived home just before sunset after counting tithing and various other administrative duties.

It was arriving home that night, that my wife ambushed me about taking out the motor bike on the sabbath. I didn't think to much of it at the time, it merely just seemed like the transport to get me spending some time with my daughter. Needless to say insistent that i had broken the sabbath day and my refusal to see it that way, we both slept on the farthest sides of the bed that night.

This morning guns still loaded, Im still wondering if i did something wrong. Im not looking for supporters just a fresh perspective.

It is my personal belief that keeping the Sabbath is not about a list of do's and don't's. It is about covenants. Early in my marriage my wife and I had the all time worse fight we have ever had - before and since. It was over what we should do and what we should not do on the Sabbath.

We were able to resolve this very difficult issue be deciding that perhaps the worse thing we could engage in to break the sabbath - was a heated argument over what to do and not to do on the Sabbath.

I suggest you and you wife have a discussion about what your Sabbath covenant is and what you believe is the purpose of the Sabbath.

The Traveler

[Dravin]

It's odd that for some reason, my opinion would change if it was a street bike of some type, as I can't differentiate that from a car, and I'd have no problem with a short sunday drive. Some people would view a bike of any type as a recreational vehicle and I guess I can see that, but I use a motorcycle as a commuter, so they aren't recreational in my mind.

I find it interesting that it seems the design of the vehicle rather than the activity itself that seems to define if something is Sabbath breaking. Admittedly, one may not be using the different vehicle for the same activity, but if the activity is the same I have a hard time following the thinking.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Dravin

[Sali]

I think it all depends on what is in the intent of the activity. If you were riding the bike to get a kick, so to speak, then that would be breaking the Sabbath, but a leisurely ride with your daughter to enjoy your property, I don't think that is. My family will sometimes go to the beach on a Sunday evening to enjoy the calming nature of the ocean. We don't consider that breaking the Sabbath. We are enjoying nature, not swimming or boating. It's all about the intents of your heart. Spirit versus Letter and all that. :)

[estradling75]

The problem is not 'Did you not keep the Sabbath Day Holy.'

The problem you are having is that you and your wife have a different understanding of what it means to Keep the Sabbath Day Holy. We can give you all kinds of opinion on if you did or not. But we are totally and utterly irrelevant to your problem. Discuss it with your wife. Between the two of you figure out an agreeable set of standards for your family.

[Bini]

I'm just a stick in the mud. I'd be royally upset if my husband took our toddler on any kind of motorbike. I just feel that an enclosed car is safer but that's me. I told my husband that if he absolutely had to get a toy like that, he could get a boat instead, and the whole family could enjoy it.

Anyway, I guess as far as breaking the Sabbath, I don't see it. Though I will admit that we are not very strict about our sabbath Do's and Dont's. We go swimming, shop and sometimes eat out on Sundays. I've seen other members participate in the same activities, some still in their Sunday best, so I don't think it's forbidden but rather we should determine WHY we choose to do these things on The Lord's day. I think if it's in the name of quality family time, it's not a sin.

[Anddenex]

Hmmmmm maybe we should not go to church on Sundays?

The Traveler

There are paid employees at your church?

[jerome1232]

I find it interesting that it seems the design of the vehicle rather than the activity itself that seems to define if something is Sabbath breaking. Admittedly, one may not be using the different vehicle for the same activity, but if the activity is the same I have a hard time following the thinking.

I was admitting that my own thinking doesn't make complete sense. Those were statements about how I *feel*.

[Dravin]

There are paid employees at your church?

The post he quoted didn't specify paid employees. That said, I'm not entirely sure where he's going with his question.

Edited July 29, 2013 by Dravin

[Leah]

I'm just a stick in the mud. I'd be royally upset if my husband took our toddler on any kind of motorbike. I just feel that an enclosed car is safer but that's me. I told my husband that if he absolutely had to get a toy like that, he could get a boat instead, and the whole family could enjoy it.

Anyway, I guess as far as breaking the Sabbath, I don't see it. Though I will admit that we are not very strict about our sabbath Do's and Dont's. We go swimming, shop and sometimes eat out on Sundays. I've seen other members participate in the same activities, some still in their Sunday best, so I don't think it's forbidden but rather we should determine WHY we choose to do these things on The Lord's day. I think if it's in the name of quality family time, it's not a sin.

Just because you see other members of the church doing something, doesn't make it automatically "okay" to do, or justify it in any way.

Church teaching is very clear about things such as shopping and eating out on Sundays. Just because others act in ways contrary to church teachings, doesn't somehow make it magically in line with church teachings or okay to do.

I also don't understand the argument about "family time" making any and all activities that involve family okay on the Sabbath. Yes, family is a very important part of the Sabbath, but it is just part of the focus. The focus is on the Lord's day and keeping it holy.

If a family spends "family time" on the Sabbath doing an activity such as...going to a movies or a football game together, how is that any different from doing that on any other day of the week? Watching a football game certainly doesn't put the focus on the Lord.

There are PLENTY of things the family can do together on the Sabbath, that actually honor the Sabbath....go to church together...study scriptures together....visit a shut-in together...take a meal to a new mom....

[Bini]

Leah, if you carefully read what I posted I never said that it was okay. Just not forbidden. I did, however, specify that it's important to know WHY we do these things -- what are our intentions.

(How's that post Anddenex, like it?)

[Leah]

Leah, if you carefully read what I posted I never said that it was okay. Just not forbidden. I did, however, specify that it's important to know WHY we do these things -- what are our intentions.

(How's that post Anddenex, like it?)

Heavenly Father never interferes with free agency, even if the Church would explicitly say "forbidden". Church teachings are clear on this subject, but with your free agency, you can make whatever mental gymnastics you like to justify whatever activities you like. Sill doesn't make certain things in line with church teaching.

[Bini]

Heavenly Father never interferes with free agency, even if the Church would explicitly say "forbidden". Church teachings are clear on this subject, but with your free agency, you can make whatever mental gymnastics you like to justify whatever activities you like. Sill doesn't make certain things in line with church teaching.

Mental gymnastics? That's a new one. Again, intentions are what's important and unlike how some see the world -- it isn't black or white. It's what's in your heart and The Lord knows what's in your heart. Killing isn't exactly in line with gospel teachings, and yet, there is a justified time to kill -- The Lord knows this.