Porissocri Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 Is there any biblical account in which someone was justified by Law regardless of faith? Did God create two ways to justify sinners in a way that, in the old covenant, they were justified by the Law and, in the new covenant, Christians were justified by Faith? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 I can't speak to mainline Christianity; but my read of Hebrews 11 is that the answer to your question is "no". prisonchaplain, Vort and Irishcolleen 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolarVortex Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 I've always wondered about the story of Jesus and the rich young ruler (Matthew 19, Mark 10, Luke 18). Here we have someone asking Jesus point-blank how to inherit eternal life. Jesus' answer is very commandment-centric and mentions nothing of faith. Of course, the commandments Jesus does mention aren't trivial things from a checklist. I know some Protestant ministers who refuse to keep savings accounts or retirement accounts, and they give away their excess income to charities... but I'm not there yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 Sinners are not justified. Only the repentant. Blackmarch, Vort and skalenfehl 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted November 3, 2014 Report Share Posted November 3, 2014 I'm with JAG. Even the rich young man could not have been justified by selling all he had. Instead, the obedience would have demonstrated his faith in Jesus. Moses did not require giving up all the money. Jesus told him to do so, very likely to demonstrate that his faith was actually in his money. skalenfehl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gordonj Posted November 17, 2014 Report Share Posted November 17, 2014 I would argue that only in that way has any scriptures indicated justification: The Law. simply put, if one does not acknowledge The Word of God, then they are not justified in anything. The Word of God is wisdom. If they adhere tot he law, then they adhere to the Word of God, and they are justified. They have not rejected him unless they refuse to acknowledge sin as detrimental to prosperity and accept righteousness as truth. I would love to have a private conversation about this to respond specifically to any inquiry of definitions of faith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pam Posted November 18, 2014 Report Share Posted November 18, 2014 This is a forum. We would prefer the conversations remain public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishcolleen Posted November 20, 2014 Report Share Posted November 20, 2014 No, because as Just_A_Guy mentions, Hebrews 11:6. "But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted November 21, 2014 Report Share Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Justice demands that if you keep the law you are rewarded for the law,BUT, and it's a big one,if your heart isn't in the right place sooner or later you'll break the law anyways (combined with being imperfect, which only helps that happen faster) and choose a path that isn't godly and or is destructive for you spiritually.- Hence why Faith is more important.If your heart and your faith are in the right place first, then fulfilling the law will fall into place. Edited November 21, 2014 by Blackmarch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest intra Posted December 6, 2014 Report Share Posted December 6, 2014 I would argue that only in that way has any scriptures indicated justification: The Law. simply put, if one does not acknowledge The Word of God, then they are not justified in anything. The Word of God is wisdom. If they adhere tot he law, then they adhere to the Word of God, and they are justified. They have not rejected him unless they refuse to acknowledge sin as detrimental to prosperity and accept righteousness as truth. I would love to have a private conversation about this to respond specifically to any inquiry of definitions of faith.if you acknowledge the Word of God as authoritative, and the Word says: Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight:for by the law is the knowledge of sin.(Romans 3:20) how can you say that the "only" way anyone is justified is by the Law? and how can you say the scripture "only" talks about justification by law, if the scripture says: For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law.(Romans 3:28) ? do you reject the book of Romans as canonical? i would love to have a public conversation with you about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest intra Posted December 7, 2014 Report Share Posted December 7, 2014 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you.And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.(Ezekiel 36:26-27) this promise is fulfilled with the coming of the risen Lord Jesus Christ, through the justification by faith in Him and His completed work on the cross. He has sent the Holy Spirit to everyone who believes in Him, in accordance with this saying. this new Spirit within us will cause you to walk according to God's statutes and laws. not the shadow that is the Levitical codes and regulations, but according to the law of love in Christ. it is by grace that we are justified through faith in Him, and by grace that He sends to us this Spirit, who also by grace works within us to renew our hearts and regenerate our minds and to compel us towards righteousness. so in this the law is completed -- what it could not do, to change the heart and desire of men, now grace does, Christ Himself does through the ministration of the Spirit. in Christ, through grace the law is perfected. the letter of the law can never make you love the truth asserted by the law, but instead now the Truth is inside believers, and manifests itself through love in the one who is no longer judged by the law, but who does the things in the law anyway, in accordance with the new nature that is the gift of grace. following the law cannot make you pure; it only reveals to you that you require grace. if you could make yourself acceptable before God, then Christ died for nothing. by grace now in Christ i am dead as far as the law is concerned, and cannot be judged by it. the purity of Christ is imputed to me and the requirements of the law are become my nature - now what i require is strength to willingly do these things, not grace to look over my trespass, because grace i have indeed received. praise Christ Jesus the Only Wise Son! He has saved us from death and turned our darkness into light!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted December 8, 2014 Report Share Posted December 8, 2014 I would say that it is technically possible to be justified by the law, without faith.... It would require keeping 100% of the law 100% of the time without fail.but as far as I know only one person could achieve that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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