Forgiving

[checkerboy]

Ok my question is How do you know when you have forgiven someone?

I know we often hear it asked how do you know when you've been forgiven, but I am having a hard time with forgiving someone. I try not to be bitter and I pray every day that I can forgive but what steps have you all taken when you have had to forgive someone and how did you know that you had.

Obviously having them accept your forgiveness isn't necessarily required to forgive but what things have you done to know that you could move on with your life knowing that you had done what was required of you?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[Elphaba]

Ok my question is How do you know when you have forgiven someone?

I know we often hear it asked how do you know when you've been forgiven, but I am having a hard time with forgiving someone. I try not to be bitter and I pray every day that I can forgive but what steps have you all taken when you have had to forgive someone and how did you know that you had.

Obviously having them accept your forgiveness isn't necessarily required to forgive but what things have you done to know that you could move on with your life knowing that you had done what was required of you?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Excellent question. I'm interested in the answers as well.

Elphaba

[Acez]

Ok my question is How do you know when you have forgiven someone?

I know we often hear it asked how do you know when you've been forgiven, but I am having a hard time with forgiving someone. I try not to be bitter and I pray every day that I can forgive but what steps have you all taken when you have had to forgive someone and how did you know that you had.

Obviously having them accept your forgiveness isn't necessarily required to forgive but what things have you done to know that you could move on with your life knowing that you had done what was required of you?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

I think the best example of the forgiveness process is best described in the talk that President James E. Faust gave at General Conference and can be read in May 2007 Ensign entitled, The Healing Power of Forgiveness. It illustrates the power of Forgiveness through the example of the Amish people. A powerful talk given by President Faust.

On a more opinionated note, I know that it is easier to forgive someone else than yourself. We each are our own worst Critic as they say. But to forgive someone gives you peace of mind and clarity, while with bitterness and anger, it ensnares and poisons you. Not to mention the advice that the Saviour gave us in that, I, the Lord, will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to forgive all men. - Doctrine and Covenants 64:10 and the other various scriptural support.

I really hope that my words may help you in some way Checker. Best of luck to you

Acez

[Lonasunde]

I think you just have to move past it. Sort of realize it's insignificance.

Maybe he hurt you. Maybe it hurt bad. But eventually You Die.

What then? Will you have spent your life bitter about this?

Don't you think you could have done much more interesting things with your time?

I don't know if I'm putting it well, but I think you just need to look at it from another point of view. Put yourself in their shoes. Or better yet, your saviors. Whether you like it or not, that person is your brother, another child of God. Your Savior loves them too.

You've made mistakes, so have they. God loves you both equally.

Maybe you should look at the act as a little tumble that person had on the road back home. But now they've pulled themselves back up and are continuing to walk.

Can you respect that?

[Alaskagain]

Ok my question is How do you know when you have forgiven someone?

I know we often hear it asked how do you know when you've been forgiven, but I am having a hard time with forgiving someone. I try not to be bitter and I pray every day that I can forgive but what steps have you all taken when you have had to forgive someone and how did you know that you had.

Obviously having them accept your forgiveness isn't necessarily required to forgive but what things have you done to know that you could move on with your life knowing that you had done what was required of you?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

I know that I have forgiven someone when I can think of or see that person without having even a bristle of resentment or umbrage; or when I hear that something bad has happened to them (i.e. their car broke down, they are having money problems - not something SERIOUSLY life-threatening!) and I don't think "hmm, serves them right!" or "what goes around comes around") but instead ask myself "What can I do to help?" and then do it.

Forgiveness is a process, like anything else. You obviously have to identify what the offense was, and why you are having a hard time forgiving the offender. What is it they are not doing that would help them make it up to you? Sometimes there is nothing they can do to make it up. How are you looking at them that is keeping you from forgiving them?

Prayer is a big part. Ask for help in getting over your feelings of anger or betrayal. Ask for help in seeing the other person as a needy child of God, just as you are. Ask for help for the other person to be able to grow spiritually because of the situation, as well as yourself. Temple attendance also helps put things into perspective.

I personally have had a hard time forgiving some people for serious offenses, particularly when harm is inflicted upon or threatened upon my children. Mother's instincts come all out at that point! But such things occur, and mostly by accident. I struggle and feel anger, and once I have my emotions in check - which may take some time - I try to manage a face-to-face conversation with whoever is the offender, and sometimes I have even first asked their forgiveness of my initial reactions to whatever it is that happened. If I can't deal with the situation, I have been known to ask for a meeting with my bishop and the other person. There are times when a one-on-one conversation or a meeting with the bishop is not possible, particularly with non-member situations.

If I can't seem to forgive someone, I have practiced forgiving them. I find some alone time, and do some invisible role-playing. I imagine them sitting in a chair across from me, and what would I say to them if I could? How angry and hurt I was? How they were a terrible human being? How could they do such a thing? I write those things down in a note; it makes them more concrete. (I shred it later, unless it is journal-worthy.) Then I say out loud "Person, I forgive you for doing this to me." It is amazing how just verbalizing can help lift the burden, even if no one else is there to hear - hearing yourself say those words is powerful. It usually is not an instant solution, but a step towards where you want to be. Eventually, the true feelings of peace come that define genuine forgiveness.

I hope some of my rambling helps. You are heading in the right direction, Checkerboy; hang in there.

[Gabelma]

for me its when Christ is the focus of your life and you know that the Lord will look after you and take care of the situation it becomes no longer your concern. When even if you won't be bosom buddies with a person you would still at least pray for them to havea good life, or pray that they will get over their problems or have heart softened and no longer look at them in anger. When you don't think about what they did unless something reminds you

-Charley

[siouxz72]

Hi Checkerboy!

Here are my two cents on forgiving someone else. Just do it. The only person that you're harming by not forgiving her for what she has done is YOU. You can't change the facts of what has happened and how your life has changed because of it. If you walk around with bitterness and anger for her it doesn't affect her. She's fine. (well, maybe not fine...but you know what I mean) The best thing that you can do for you is to forgive her. It will make everything that you have to do easier. It will make seeing her easier, talking to her easier...all that. Because, honestly once you've forgiven her, she won't have as big of a hold on you as she does now. There won't be that bitterness in your heart and mind when it comes to her and that will make you feel so much better. It is a choice that you need to make. Think of the Saviour and what he would do. He would have compassion and empathy for someone like her, you know that. Let the anger go. You can't change what happened. You can look forward to what YOU can do to make the best life possible for you and your boys. They are so lucky to have a dad like you because you do want to make it better. You want to make it all better and that says so much about the man that you are. ( i happen to think you're awesome and then some! but i am a little biased since you are one of my favorite people ) anywhoo...sorry about the long ramble. basically, my advice is this... forgiveness is a choice you make. let the anger go. every day it will get a little easier. I promise. oh! I really like Alaskagain's thought of writing it all out and then saying out loud "x, i forgive you for all this" and then shredding it. That would be very healing. maybe you should try it. :)

love you buddy!! you're doing good! don't ever forget that!

-siouxz

[Canuck Mormon]

Hi Checkerboy!

Here are my two cents on forgiving someone else. Just do it. The only person that you're harming by not forgiving her for what she has done is YOU. You can't change the facts of what has happened and how your life has changed because of it. If you walk around with bitterness and anger for her it doesn't affect her. She's fine. (well, maybe not fine...but you know what I mean) The best thing that you can do for you is to forgive her. It will make everything that you have to do easier. It will make seeing her easier, talking to her easier...all that. Because, honestly once you've forgiven her, she won't have as big of a hold on you as she does now. There won't be that bitterness in your heart and mind when it comes to her and that will make you feel so much better. It is a choice that you need to make. Think of the Saviour and what he would do. He would have compassion and empathy for someone like her, you know that. Let the anger go. You can't change what happened. You can look forward to what YOU can do to make the best life possible for you and your boys. They are so lucky to have a dad like you because you do want to make it better. You want to make it all better and that says so much about the man that you are. ( i happen to think you're awesome and then some! but i am a little biased since you are one of my favorite people ) anywhoo...sorry about the long ramble. basically, my advice is this... forgiveness is a choice you make. let the anger go. every day it will get a little easier. I promise. oh! I really like Alaskagain's thought of writing it all out and then saying out loud "x, i forgive you for all this" and then shredding it. That would be very healing. maybe you should try it. :)

love you buddy!! you're doing good! don't ever forget that!

-siouxz

I agree with everything sioux72 said. I would also add that, to forgive doesn't mean we need to be friends with this person. I went through a similar process a few years ago. It took me a long time to forgive my ex-wife. I was finaly able to forgive her, and we can have a civilized conversation, but we are NOT friends. Here's hoping that you can forgive and move on with YOUR life. Once I did, I found my eternal companion, and have never been happier. Good luck to you.

[prisonchaplain]

Some things about forgiveness:

1. Forgiveness is not endorsement. YOu are not approving of the sin when you forgive.

2. Forgiveness is not forgetting. If someone has cheated you financially, you certainly are not obligated to go back into business with them again.

3. Forgiveness is not trust. You might forgive the alcoholic, but you won't go out drinking with him/her. You might forgive the abuser, but may not move back in. You may forgive the adulterer, but still divorce (I'm not sure of LDS doctrine on this point--I understand unfaithfulness to be an exception by which divorce is allowed).

So, what is forgiveness? It's giving the offense and the bitterness over to God. If the sinner is unrepentent, vengence becomes God's, not yours. If repentence comes, you've had a part in the reconciliation.

[the_jason]

I heard from someone that you've truly forgiven someone when you no longer wish them ill. I don't believe you have to fully trust someone to forgive them. Someone who molests, for example, should not be left alone with children; however, we can still forgive that person and help them to repent. We can love them as we would anyone else.

PC probably said it better than I did though, so just go with his answer. :)

[checkerboy]

Thanks so much for all the things that have been shared. Most of you know who it is that I am trying to forgive. For those that don't, my wife and I are getting divorced and I am having a hard time forgiving her for the things she has done to bring this about. I pray for her every night and have got to a point where I don't want to strangle her every time I see her, but I know that I am still bitter and am really wanting more peace in my life. I will try those things that you have all suggested. Thank you.

[snipe123]

<div class='quotemain'>

Ok my question is How do you know when you have forgiven someone?

I know we often hear it asked how do you know when you've been forgiven, but I am having a hard time with forgiving someone. I try not to be bitter and I pray every day that I can forgive but what steps have you all taken when you have had to forgive someone and how did you know that you had.

Obviously having them accept your forgiveness isn't necessarily required to forgive but what things have you done to know that you could move on with your life knowing that you had done what was required of you?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Excellent question. I'm interested in the answers as well.

Elphaba

Elph,

I thought you might have jumped at the chance of sharing a very touching story of forgiveness from LDS history, being the LDS history lover that you are...(gentle dig there...haha). The story of William W. Phelps return to the fold and what Joseph wrote to him???...hint hint...:) I just have a feeling you could do a better job telling the story than I...

Waiting Patiently for your account...

EDIT INSERT: Assuming of course you are willing to give said account???

[the_jason]

Check, I wish you well. You and I haven't always gotten along, but I've always respected you for being the best father you can be and taking the high road with every hand that's dealt to you. You're in my thoughts, man.

[Moksha]

In my own life, I believe that through the Atonement of Jesus, God has already forgiven us. I sometimes insist on being more picky till I reflect on the Atonement and ask myself why I have to be more picky than God. I suppose it is because I do not process information as effectively. However, with prayer and meditation, I am able to bring myself around.

I realize the existence of anger is necessary part of completing the grieving process and I suspect it is a part of the being offended process as well. It is good however, to never get hung up in an endless loop with these processes and hopefully prayer and meditation can help break these loops for you as well.

[Maureen]

Thanks so much for all the things that have been shared. Most of you know who it is that I am trying to forgive. For those that don't, my wife and I are getting divorced and I am having a hard time forgiving her for the things she has done to bring this about. I pray for her every night and have got to a point where I don't want to strangle her every time I see her, but I know that I am still bitter and am really wanting more peace in my life. I will try those things that you have all suggested. Thank you.

Sometimes it just takes time. As your life changes and your ex-wife (to-be) takes up less time in your life and thoughts, then at some point in the future you may come to realize she has no power over you anymore. Then you'll know you've forgiven her.

M.

[Elphaba]

Elph,

I thought you might have jumped at the chance of sharing a very touching story of forgiveness from LDS history, being the LDS history lover that you are...(gentle dig there...haha). The story of William W. Phelps return to the fold and what Joseph wrote to him???...hint hint...:) I just have a feeling you could do a better job telling the story than I...

Waiting Patiently for your account...

EDIT INSERT: Assuming of course you are willing to give said account???

Thank you for the idea Isaac. Joseph's forgiveness of Phelps was heartfelt and beautiful, as Phelps had accused Joseph of very heinous acts.

However, I’ve decided I'd rather post some of the writings of Emmeline B. Wells, and hope Checker finds them helpful.

Emmeline was married three times, and loved each one of her husbands. Her last husband was Daniel H.Wells, a prominent member of the Church during the early pioneer years. She was his seventh wife.

Though Emmeline is one of the most influential and beloved pioneer women with an incredibly rich history, I’m not going to spend any time on that in this post. I’ll just mention that Emmeline suffered heartbreak often, and the following are some of her writings about it.

I’ve purposely left off dates and to whom she is referring so you can just hear the longing in her words.

As far as forgiveness, she does not address it directly. However, when I first read her diary long ago , what I heard was that her love was so strong all of the confusion, hardship and abandonment would be instantly forgiven.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“Today I am alone and I have time for reflection. Memory brings the past before me in all its joy and light. Life seems like a dream. Am I awake? Would that it were a dream and that I could awake and find myself at the side of him my love. . . . Even now when he as left me to the mercy of a cold unfeeling world am I ready to receive him to my heart again whenever he returns and I want O how much I desire to have him come O James where art thou O that thou couldst hear my voice and thou shouldst return O come to her who gave and forsook all others for thee. . . . Is not my life a romance indeed it is a novel strange and marvelous.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But storms and clouds were thick upon my way;

Yet here and there sometimes would intervene

Bright hours of sunshine in the darkest day

And so I’ve traveled on, and sought to be

Some help to other wanderers like me.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“. . . She mourned over the ‘memories, only the coming and going and parting of the door. The joy when he came the sorrow when he went as though all of the light died out of my life. Such intense love he has manifested toward me of late years. Such a remarkable change from the long ago--when I needed him so much more, how peculiarly these things come about.”’

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“This evening I fully expected my husband here but was again disappointed. . . . He is not in want of me for a companion or in any sense, he does not need me at all, there are plenty read and willing to administer to every wish caprice or whim or his, indeed they anticipate them, they are near him always, while I am shut out of his life. . . . It is impossible for me to make myself useful to him in any way while I am held at such a distance.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So even the most beloved and admired of the pioneers had a broken heart. I believe reflection and writing were her tools in coping with her losses and, eventually, forgiving as well. I’m sure it wasn’t easy for her, because she wasn’t perfect. But I do think her desire to forgive was strong, just as I sense Checker’s is strong.

I wish you the best Checker.

Elphaba

[Acez]

Thank you for the idea Isaac. Joseph's forgiveness of Phelps was heartfelt and beautiful, as Phelps had accused Joseph of very heinous acts.

However, I’ve decided I'd rather post some of the writings of Emmeline B. Wells, and hope Checker finds them helpful.

Emmeline was married three times, and loved each one of her husbands. Her last husband was Daniel H.Wells, a prominent member of the Church during the early pioneer years. She was his seventh wife.

Though Emmeline is one of the most influential and beloved pioneer women with an incredibly rich history, I’m not going to spend any time on that in this post. I’ll just mention that Emmeline suffered heartbreak often, and the following are some of her writings about it.

I’ve purposely left off dates and to whom she is referring so you can just hear the longing in her words.

As far as forgiveness, she does not address it directly. However, when I first read her diary long ago , what I heard was that her love was so strong all of the confusion, hardship and abandonment would be instantly forgiven.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“Today I am alone and I have time for reflection. Memory brings the past before me in all its joy and light. Life seems like a dream. Am I awake? Would that it were a dream and that I could awake and find myself at the side of him my love. . . . Even now when he as left me to the mercy of a cold unfeeling world am I ready to receive him to my heart again whenever he returns and I want O how much I desire to have him come O James where art thou O that thou couldst hear my voice and thou shouldst return O come to her who gave and forsook all others for thee. . . . Is not my life a romance indeed it is a novel strange and marvelous.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But storms and clouds were thick upon my way;

Yet here and there sometimes would intervene

Bright hours of sunshine in the darkest day

And so I’ve traveled on, and sought to be

Some help to other wanderers like me.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“. . . She mourned over the ‘memories, only the coming and going and parting of the door. The joy when he came the sorrow when he went as though all of the light died out of my life. Such intense love he has manifested toward me of late years. Such a remarkable change from the long ago--when I needed him so much more, how peculiarly these things come about.”’

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

“This evening I fully expected my husband here but was again disappointed. . . . He is not in want of me for a companion or in any sense, he does not need me at all, there are plenty read and willing to administer to every wish caprice or whim or his, indeed they anticipate them, they are near him always, while I am shut out of his life. . . . It is impossible for me to make myself useful to him in any way while I am held at such a distance.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So even the most beloved and admired of the pioneers had a broken heart. I believe reflection and writing were her tools in coping with her losses and, eventually, forgiving as well. I’m sure it wasn’t easy for her, because she wasn’t perfect. But I do think her desire to forgive was strong, just as I sense Checker’s is strong.

I wish you the best Checker.

Elphaba

And you said you couldn't write posts with feeling and emotion. A great and wonderful post Elphie :)

I learned something new today from your post

Acez

[snipe123]

<div class='quotemain'>Elph,

I thought you might have jumped at the chance of sharing a very touching story of forgiveness from LDS history, being the LDS history lover that you are...(gentle dig there...haha). The story of William W. Phelps return to the fold and what Joseph wrote to him???...hint hint...:) I just have a feeling you could do a better job telling the story than I...

Waiting Patiently for your account...

EDIT INSERT: Assuming of course you are willing to give said account???

Thank you for the idea Isaac. Joseph's forgiveness of Phelps was heartfelt and beautiful, as Phelps had accused Joseph of very heinous acts.

However, I’ve decided I'd rather post some of the writings of Emmeline B. Wells, and hope Checker finds them helpful.

Oh well, I know the story so I guess I can't complain...I just no longer have the source material to quote from...Good job on the journal citations...very moving...

[tiancum]

One thing i recommend is don't expect it to happen overnight.

Have you noticed that the prophets have NEVER counciled..."just get over it!"

The process of repentance and forgiveness is a long drawn out one. It is a school of sorts and you can't just do it all overnight. It comes slowly and powerfully by revelation.

Those that say they can forgive overnight, have most likely just buried their anger, and the unforgiveness exhibits itself in passive aggressive ways.

Forgiveness is not "easy" for anyone. I assert that those who truly have learned repentance/forgiveness have seen Christ.