Utah Medical Marijuana passes

[Guest MormonGator]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tomangell/2018/11/07/utah-voters-approve-medical-marijuana/#162390f24140

Putting my personal feelings on this issue aside, I think this shows that the political influence of the church might be declining.

[Guest Godless]

Hasn't the church softened its stance on medical marijuana? 

Also worth noting, voters in super-red Nebraska, Utah, and Idaho elected to expand Medicaid. Early estimates predict that roughly 300,000 low income individuals will now be able to get coverage. Link

[estradling75]

6 minutes ago, Godless said:

Hasn't the church softened its stance on medical marijuana? 

Also worth noting, voters in super-red Nebraska, Utah, and Idaho elected to expand Medicaid. Early estimates predict that roughly 300,000 low income individuals will now be able to get coverage. Link

The stance is we want medical marjuana done right...  Prop 2 does not do it right and it needs to be rejected and something better needed to be found.

https://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/coalition-seeks-safe-compassionate-alternative-utah-medical-marijuana-initiative

[Guest MormonGator]

7 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

 Prop 2 does not do it right and it needs to be rejected 

Hasn't it already passed? 

Edited November 7, 2018 by MormonGator

[estradling75]

11 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Hasn't it already passed? 

Isn't that why you said it looks like the political influence of the Church is declining?  I mean if the church said "Don't do this." and the people do it anyways that does seem to be a lack of influence.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tomangell/2018/11/07/utah-voters-approve-medical-marijuana/#162390f24140

Putting my personal feelings on this issue aside, I think this shows that the political influence of the church might be declining.

This is not the first time this has happened.  The Prophet also said to vote against repealing prohibition.  But Utah voted to repeal it.

That said, please clarify.  There were multiple marijuana bills up for vote.  One of them had the full support of the Church.  Was this not the one?

[Guest MormonGator]

Believe me gentlemen, I hope you are both absolutely right and that the church has never been stronger in Utah. However, this, combined with SLC having an openly lesbian mayor (which I'm fine with) does lead me to believe that the influence of the church might be in slight decline. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

Believe me gentlemen, I hope you are both absolutely right and that the church has never been stronger in Utah. However, this, combined with SLC having an openly lesbian mayor (which I'm fine with) does lead me to believe that the influence of the church might be in slight decline. 

Who said I disagreed?

[scottyg]

The influence is decreasing because, sadly, there are many of the rising generation that do not believe in the traditions of their fathers. There is a reason the Prophet has asked us to "eat our vitamin pills". The reason the work is moving forward much more quickly is due to the adversary doing so on his side. He is very deceptive and pushes his agenda forward by calling evil good, and good evil. If the proposition is implemented as currently constructed it will be felt in the state for years to come, as it will only amplify the disintegration of the family and decrease the ability of many to feel the influence of the spirit.

Edited November 7, 2018 by scottyg

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, scottyg said:

The influence is decreasing because, sadly, there are many of the rising generation that do not believe in the traditions of their fathers. There is a reason the Prophet has asked us to "eat our vitamin pills". The reason the work is moving forward much more quickly is due to the adversary doing so on his side. He is very deceptive and pushes his agenda forward by calling evil good, and good evil. If the proposition is implemented as currently constructed it will be felt in the state for years to come, as it will only amplify the disintegration of the family and decrease the ability of many to feel the influence of the spirit.

So you voted in favor of it, right? 

 

[Colirio]

Considering how many times you have posted in this topic, @MormonGator, I am starting to wonder if someone will be petitioning the prophet for the next big change announcement for the April 2019 General Conference.... 

 

🚭

[Guest MormonGator]

18 hours ago, Colirio said:

Considering how many times you have posted in this topic, @MormonGator, I am starting to wonder if someone will be petitioning the prophet for the next big change announcement for the April 2019 General Conference.... 

 

🚭

To me it's fascinating. The church has every right to speak about political issues, and I hope they never stop doing so. The church doesn't have the right to tell non-members how to live their lives though. 

[mordorbund]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

The church doesn't have the right to tell non-members how to live their lives though. 

Don't tell that to the missionaries.

[Still_Small_Voice]

In my opinion it does not matter than the people voted to pass medical marijuana.  The Utah legislature is going to modify the medical cannabis laws anyway.

What concerns me is those that voted to expand Obamacare in Utah.  This is going to require a huge tax increase and it has been a disaster in every other state where they have implemented this expansion of "free" health care.  I hope the Utah legislature modifies this medicaid law heavily as well but I doubt it.  Governor Herbert wanted Obamacare in Utah and tried to get it passed thru before.

[Guest MormonGator]

21 minutes ago, Still_Small_Voice said:

In my opinion it does not matter than the people voted to pass medical marijuana.

So the will of the voters can be ignored? 

People rightfully complained that the courts forced gay marriage unto states even when voters didn't want it. Now, people are asking the state to do something against the will of the people. You can't have it both ways. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by MormonGator

[Still_Small_Voice]

10 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

So the will of the voters can be ignored? 

We will have to wait and see what the Utah Legislature passes.  I think they are going to make medical marijuana available to those who need it in my opinion.

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

So the will of the voters can be ignored? 

People rightfully complained that the courts forced gay marriage unto states even when voters didn't want it. Now, people are asking the state to do something against the will of the people. You can't have it both ways. 

Not the same.  We complained about Courts overruling laws (that the people or legislature passed) based on supposed constitutional rights that are not in the Constitution.

The legislature on the other hand is elected specifically to make and change laws. 

AFAIK, the state supreme court justices cannot be removed by vote of the people.  Legislative representatives can.  So, the people still have a voice to change what the legislature does.  It has no voice to change what the courts do.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Guest

[Guest MormonGator]

41 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Not the same.  We complained about Courts overruling laws (that the people or legislature passed) based on supposed constitutional rights that are not in the Constitution.

So if Utah voted 99 to 1 to keep all forms of weed illegal, you'd have no problem with me saying "Well hopefully the state legislature will still allow it to pass." 

 

[Guest]

Just now, MormonGator said:

So if Utah voted 99 to 1 to keep all forms of weed illegal, you'd have no problem with me saying "Well hopefully the state legislature will still allow it to pass."

You know, if the voting citizens of Utah have their heads in the sand so far that they vote 99:1 for something, but vote for elected officials that vote 99:1 against it, then they deserve what they get.

We HOPE that the voters will vote for legislators who will have similar positions as they themselves do.  Then if it were only a question of a small margin either way, then, yes.  The legislature should be able to override the decision by Proposition when it is by such a small margin.  That's exactly what a representative government is supposed to do.  The Founders intended a republic to moderate the whims of a populist democracy.

[Guest MormonGator]

See this is why I love and hate politics. Our views change depending on if we win or lose a debate/election. I think Senator Nelson needs to accept that he lost, stop looking for a sleazy way to stay in office, and move on. I think people in Utah who didn't support the weed amendment need to accept that they lost, stop looking for a sleazy way to change things, and move on. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by MormonGator

[estradling75]

Honesty if the politicians over turn it chances are they will not get re-elected...  However they can tweak/amend/adjust the law.  As long as it still allows medical MJ then the will of the people is still stands and the proper protections can be put into place/beefed up.

[Guest MormonGator]

I think it's a moot point. Soon enough it'll be legalized nationwide, so....

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

See this is why I love and hate politics. Our views change depending on if we win or lose a debate/election. I think Senator Nelson needs to accept that he lost, stop looking for a sleazy way to stay in office, and move on. I think people in Utah who didn't support the weed amendment need to accept that they lost, stop looking for a sleazy way to change things, and move on. 

I fail to see how I've changed positions.

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, Carborendum said:

I fail to see how I've changed positions.

Chill, I didn't say you did. It's a general comment about politics/people -how people change their stances if their side wins/loses. I think it's 100% accurate. Another great example of this is people who love the electoral college-when their side wins. But hate it when their sides loses. I saw that all over the place in 2016. 

[Guest Godless]

2 hours ago, Still_Small_Voice said:

What concerns me is those that voted to expand Obamacare in Utah.  This is going to require a huge tax increase and it has been a disaster in every other state where they have implemented this expansion of "free" health care. 

I'm curious where you're getting your information from. Kaiser performed a study  of the performance of Medicaid expansion in previously-expanded states and came up with a very different conclusion.