I have a question...

[PassionForHisWord]

I read where Brigham Young, the second president of the LDS Church, taught that both the moon and the sun were inhabited by people (Journal of Discourses, 1870, v.13, p.271). Has the Mormon Church ever found scientific evidence of that to be true?

"We are called ignorant; so we are: but what of it? Are not all ignorant? I rather think so. Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening, called the moon? When we view its face we may see what is termed "the man in the moon," and what some philosophers declare are the shadows of mountains. But these sayings are very vague, and amount to nothing; and when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the most ignorant of their fellows. So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain. It was made to give light to those who dwell upon it, and to other planets; and so will this earth when it is celestialized."

Edited September 25, 2008 by PassionForHisWord

[Lbybug]

wasn't this subject just brought up in another thread?

[BenRaines]

Often.

Ben Raines

[PassionForHisWord]

I wouldn't know, I'm new here. lol

Is there a response to this though?

[BenRaines]

How would you be able to find scientific evidence that a world has become celestialized? How would you be able to find scientific evidence that spirits lived on a planet? I don't know.

In answer to your question, No. No scientific evidence.

I have a question. Do you know of any scientific evidence that the world was created in six days? The scriptures say it is so. God says he did it in six days, so it must be so.

Ben Raines

[Wingnut]

In reading that quote (which I've never heard, but find interesting), it sounds to me like Brigham Young was expressing his opinion, not necessarily teaching doctrine. Yes, there is a difference, part of which includes context (and I don't know the context of this quote).

To answer your question about scientific proof, I'm going to venture a big "No." That is mostly because we don't really have "scientific proof" of the Book of Mormon either, but we have faith that it is true. Such are the working of God. :) (To those of you who are about the respond to this with studies and digs that have taken place in Latin and South America, chill out. Those things suggest that the Book of Mormon may be true, but don't categorically prove it so.)

[PassionForHisWord]

How would you be able to find scientific evidence that a world has become celestialized? How would you be able to find scientific evidence that spirits lived on a planet? I don't know.

In answer to your question, No. No scientific evidence.

I have a question. Do you know of any scientific evidence that the world was created in six days? The scriptures say it is so. God says he did it in six days, so it must be so.

Ben Raines

I'll quote the Apologetics Study Bible on this one:

"Old earth creationists (OCs) argue against 24-hour creation days for reasons such as these: (1) The Hebrew word for 'day' (yom) is used in different ways in the creation account. For instance, Gn 1:5 refers yom only to daytime (daylight), not night-time. Also, Gn 2:4, literally translated, speaks of 'the yom that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens.' (2) God's rest on the seventh 'day' has no evening and morning (Gn2:2-3), and Heb 4:3-11 portrays this same Sabbath as continuing to the present time. (3) Adam could not have named all the birds and animals in 24 hours according to Gn 2." (Cabal 4)

[pam]

Ugh not this question again.

[PassionForHisWord]

Ugh not this question again.

I apologize if I'm personifying annoying cliche's

[Lbybug]

http://www.lds.net/forums/learn-about-mormon-church/14064-confused-missionary.html there's a link to the other thread. lots of responses.

[workofart2]

The moon is widely thought to have formed after an object roughly the size of Mars crashed into the Earth 4.5 billion years ago, throwing up a cloud of debris that eventually coalesced into a rocky sphere.

[rameumptom]

Brigham Young spoke to an exclusively Mormon population. In doing so, he sought to have them think outside the box, so as to open them to new possibilities and revelation. Often he speculated on things, even in Conference.

At one Conference, he spoke all morning on a topic. That afternoon when they reconvened, he said, "this morning I told you Brother Brigham's opinion on the subject. This afternoon, I'll tell you the Lord's will on the matter." IOW, Brigham often spoke from his opinions, not always from revelation.

[Pa Pa]

I read where Brigham Young, the second president of the LDS Church, taught that both the moon and the sun were inhabited by people (Journal of Discourses, 1870, v.13, p.271). Has the Mormon Church ever found scientific evidence of that to be true?

"We are called ignorant; so we are: but what of it? Are not all ignorant? I rather think so. Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening, called the moon? When we view its face we may see what is termed "the man in the moon," and what some philosophers declare are the shadows of mountains. But these sayings are very vague, and amount to nothing; and when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the most ignorant of their fellows. So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain. It was made to give light to those who dwell upon it, and to other planets; and so will this earth when it is celestialized."

I think that there was a time when someone serving in the role of Prophet, could not even state opinion without it being misunderstood as doctrine.

Pa Pa

[Dale]

There is one way the sun and moon can be inhabited. The Bible says invisible beings were created by God. So if such inhabitants lived on the moon, or the sun God would make them able to survive. And such beings if invisible could only be seen through a spiritual view not by astronauts, or telescopes.

[rameumptom]

We believe the Spirit World for this earth is upon the earth - yet we cannot see it. Invisible beings, those who dwell on another dimensional plane, or of matter so fine we cannot see them, is not impossible. As it is, astronomers cannot detect dark matter in the universe, but they know it is there and making up the majority of the mass of the universe.

[NeuroTypical]

So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it

So, what conclusions do you feel justified in drawing from this quote?

Here's what most LDS folks draw:

* Prophets are error-prone fallible humans who can be wrong like anyone else.

* Prophets are never wrong when saying stuff God wants them to say.

* Brigham wasn't saying what God wanted him to say here - he was offering the opinion of an 1800's era frontier-American opinion offerer.

* It's ok to think he was wrong. I do.

Here are some conclusions that are not warranted:

* BY wasn't a prophet.

* The church is not true.

LM

[Moksha]

"Nearly all the great discoveries of men in the last half century have, in one way or another, either directly or indirectly, contributed to prove Joseph Smith to be a Prophet.

"As far back as 1837, I know that he said the moon was inhabited by men and women the same as this earth, and that they lived to a greater age than we do -- that they live generally to near the age of 1000 years.

"He described the men as averaging near six feet in height, and dressing quite uniformly in something near the Quaker style.

"In my Patriarchal blessing, given by the father of Joseph the Prophet, in Kirtland, 1837, I was told that I should preach the gospel before I was 21 years of age; that I should preach the gospel to the inhabitants upon the islands of the sea, and to the inhabitants of the moon, even the planet you can now behold with your eyes."

(The Young Woman's Journal, published by the Young Ladies' Mutual Improvement Associations of Zion, 1892, vol. 3, pp. 263-64)

[MrNirom]

"Nearly all the great discoveries of men in the last half century have, in one way or another, either directly or indirectly, contributed to prove Joseph Smith to be a Prophet.

"As far back as 1837, I know that he said the moon was inhabited by men and women the same as this earth, and that they lived to a greater age than we do -- that they live generally to near the age of 1000 years.

"He described the men as averaging near six feet in height, and dressing quite uniformly in something near the Quaker style.

"In my Patriarchal blessing, given by the father of Joseph the Prophet, in Kirtland, 1837, I was told that I should preach the gospel before I was 21 years of age; that I should preach the gospel to the inhabitants upon the islands of the sea, and to the inhabitants of the moon, even the planet you can now behold with your eyes."

(The Young Woman's Journal, published by the Young Ladies' Mutual Improvement Associations of Zion, 1892, vol. 3, pp. 263-64)

And who is to say this is not true? Has anyone heard of the Hollow Earth Theory? Many prominent scientist of our day and age are trying to prove this now. Who says that the same is not possible on the Moon or Sun... or any other planet? There are many things that when we look at it.. are invisible to us. God is. Is it not possible that that we just are not given the means by which to see?

Why I was watching TV last night and found out that people had been reporting seeing flying objects in the sky before airplanes were even invented. Who knows? Can one say for sure it is not true?

[Book_of_Mormon_Warrior]

Jacob 4

1. [14] But behold, the Jews were a stiffnecked people; and they despised the words of plainness, and killed the prophets, and sought for things that they could not understand. Wherefore, because of their blindness, which blindness came by looking beyond the mark, they must needs fall; for God hath taken away his plainness from them, and delivered unto them many things which they cannot understand, because they desired it. And because they desired it God hath done it, that they may stumble.

[Dove]

Passion for his Word left looong ago from this site.

It's too bad we made him feel uncomfortable here.....

[antsyl]

Man Ill bet they could teach us a thing or two about Sun Block.

I think maybe I should stick to the Canning and putting up food section of this forum. There are some

crazy topics and thoughts in here.

Really!!!

[antsyl]

I think when we get to heaven God is going to say,"I made it so easy for you and you made it so hard for yourself". These posts indicate either to much free time or to much "my brain is the same as Gods" Its very dangerous either one.

[rameumptom]

Antsyl,

Don't you realize that God is wanting us to seek out His mind and understanding? How else are we to do it? You would wish all to remain ignorant, believing in YOUR understanding of the Bible. God would have us "ask, and ye shall receive..." We cannot be saved in ignorance, which means we each must seek out God and try to understand His mind and will.

My brain is NOT the same as God's, but I need to try and make my brain the same as God's. "Not my will, but thine, be done" is a policy we all need to have in our lives. But how shall we know God's will, if we do not use our own brains to seek it?

[Misshalfway]

I am getting to this thread a little late, but I think the OP BY quote (if it is indeed authentic) is just a snap shot of Brighams wonderings. I think the point he is making is that there is more out in the universe that this earth supposes. So what if he was speculating about inhabitants of the moon. I think such is beside the point.

[Hemidakota]

I read where Brigham Young, the second president of the LDS Church, taught that both the moon and the sun were inhabited by people (Journal of Discourses, 1870, v.13, p.271). Has the Mormon Church ever found scientific evidence of that to be true?

"We are called ignorant; so we are: but what of it? Are not all ignorant? I rather think so. Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening, called the moon? When we view its face we may see what is termed "the man in the moon," and what some philosophers declare are the shadows of mountains. But these sayings are very vague, and amount to nothing; and when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the most ignorant of their fellows. So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain. It was made to give light to those who dwell upon it, and to other planets; and so will this earth when it is celestialized."

If the Sun end state is a glorified world, the only level it has reached was Telestial. Not all worlds will reach the Celestial state - like this earth. I had often asked what and where will the inhabitants of the telestial order be? I would turned to the window and state; "Right here...go outside and look at our local Sun." :) This is a subject that requires a prayerful consideration in receiving such an answer.

Remember, the Russians or Alan Sheppard was not historically, first men in space. Enoch was given technology to rise up a land mass [City of Enoch] and did not travel far initially. If I am correct, I think Joseph Smith made a short statement on this very subject also. Did you ever wonder why, Nimrod seek to build a tower? To whom was he building the tower too? Then we have the City of Salem...another missing city who people were removed. Perhaps, others who achieved the state of perfection as a whole received the same.