Undergarments

[thekabalist]

Hi forum,

Someone on the other forum asked me about Judaism and undergarments. Do religious Jews wear them? Absolutely! I'm wearing one at this moment. :)

The garment you are referring to is called the Tallit Katan or simply "small prayer shawl". It's a white piece of garment that usually someone wears under their shirt.

http://www.jewishbazaar.com/images_products/prayer-wear-tallit-katan-tzitzit-blue-thread-meyuchad-tallit-katan-cotton-arba-confes-mesh-kjakm-4932big.jpg

The garment itself has a kabbalistic concept of surrounding us with the clouds of the glory of the Holy One Blessed be He. It also contains the tzitziyot which are 4 sets of braided fringes that have been commanded upon us in Nm 15:38-39.

Now the white threads represent the commandments of G-d and the blue cord represents king Messiah the son of David.

There are also some who wear entirely white garments. This practice comes from the priestly sect of the Temple and is spoken of for example by Flavius Josephus in connection to the exiled priests. They would never wear anything other than such white garments. I think the Samaritan priesthood still does.

If there's anything else I can help with please say so! :)

b'shalom

[hordak]

Here's a dumb question but i don't know any Jews so here goes.

What is the difference between an orthodox Jew ( the hat, bearded , long curls) and the others like Jerry Seinfield?

Obviously one is more orthodox but are they different like LDS and Protestants are different?

I. E. Same religion, different churches, beliefs.

Or Like Sister Smith and Sister Jones?

I.E. same religion, same church, different interpretations of the beliefs.

If that makes sense to you.

[Misshalfway]

I asked a friend of mine this once. She also explained to me that not all Jews agreed on doctrine or practice and that some jews are atheists. Isn't it like Judiasm as a religion and then as ones lineage/culture?

[thekabalist]

Here's a dumb question but i don't know any Jews so here goes.

What is the difference between an orthodox Jew ( the hat, bearded , long curls) and the others like Jerry Seinfield?

Obviously one is more orthodox but are they different like LDS and Protestants are different?

I. E. Same religion, different churches, beliefs.

Or Like Sister Smith and Sister Jones?

I.E. same religion, same church, different interpretations of the beliefs.

If that makes sense to you.

That would only be the level of religious observance. But do notice that Mr. Seinfield would be welcomed anywhere he went and would be treated just like an Orthodox Jew because a Jew is a Jew. :)

We do have ramifications within Judaism but always with the feeling that it's all one big family. There are those who are less observant simply because they are more secular and there are those who, while still religious, believe they needn't be Orthodox. Those would be the Reform and Conservative movements.

b'shalom

[thekabalist]

I asked a friend of mine this once. She also explained to me that not all Jews agreed on doctrine or practice and that some jews are atheists. Isn't it like Judiasm as a religion and then as ones lineage/culture?

Yes, it is. It works like this: We believe that all Jewish souls pre-exist since Creation. The means through which they come into the world is through the womb of a Jewish woman. Sometimes however these souls end up in non-Jewish bodies and seek conversion. So whereas Judaism is a religion it is also in a way a lineage. We believe that once one converts to Judaism their bloodline becomes 100% Jewish so it's not exactly a racial issue. We are one complicated religion.

[Vanhin]

Very interesting. Thank you.

We wear completely white undergarments with similar meaning to those that were worn by the priestly sect anciently. We call it the Garment of the Holy Priesthood. According to our faith, with the coming of Jesus Christ, the holiest of temple blessings and blessings of the priesthood are available to all who prepare themselves for it.

Regards,

Vanhin

[Misshalfway]

Yes, it is. It works like this: We believe that all Jewish souls pre-exist since Creation. The means through which they come into the world is through the womb of a Jewish woman. Sometimes however these souls end up in non-Jewish bodies and seek conversion. So whereas Judaism is a religion it is also in a way a lineage. We believe that once one converts to Judaism their bloodline becomes 100% Jewish so it's not exactly a racial issue. We are one complicated religion.

I was gonna say that this idea isn't really that unfamiliar. In our faith, we believe that the blessings of Israel (all tribes) are for those who are literally born into the lineage. OR if one is not and they convert then they are adopted in and made equal with the rest.

BTW....I am really glad you chose to join our conversations here. Very interesting so far. I wish I had more Jewish friends, I really do.

[Traveler]

Hi forum,

Someone on the other forum asked me about Judaism and undergarments. Do religious Jews wear them? Absolutely! I'm wearing one at this moment. :)

The garment you are referring to is called the Tallit Katan or simply "small prayer shawl". It's a white piece of garment that usually someone wears under their shirt.

http://www.jewishbazaar.com/images_products/prayer-wear-tallit-katan-tzitzit-blue-thread-meyuchad-tallit-katan-cotton-arba-confes-mesh-kjakm-4932big.jpg

The garment itself has a kabbalistic concept of surrounding us with the clouds of the glory of the Holy One Blessed be He. It also contains the tzitziyot which are 4 sets of braided fringes that have been commanded upon us in Nm 15:38-39.

Now the white threads represent the commandments of G-d and the blue cord represents king Messiah the son of David.

There are also some who wear entirely white garments. This practice comes from the priestly sect of the Temple and is spoken of for example by Flavius Josephus in connection to the exiled priests. They would never wear anything other than such white garments. I think the Samaritan priesthood still does.

If there's anything else I can help with please say so! :)

b'shalom

First - I am personally grateful you have come to post. For whatever reason it is rare for LDS and Jews to engage in deep discussions. Please visit often and involve yourself in as many discussions as you feel you would like to join.

Concerning our “under” garment. This is a token and reminder of our most sacred covenants that are only made within temples. It is our belief that we are the only religion of modern time that understands the ancient propose of temples and covenants associated with temples.

Thank you for your input. If you would like to visit this site – I have many question and things I would enjoy having your input. Are you fluent in Hebrew?

The Traveler

[thekabalist]

Thank you for your input. If you would like to visit this site – I have many question and things I would enjoy having your input. Are you fluent in Hebrew?

The Traveler

I would be glad to help. I've enjoyed our exchange immensely this far. Yes, I can help with Hebrew if necessary. :)

b'shalom

[beefche]

First - I am personally grateful you have come to post. For whatever reason it is rare for LDS and Jews to engage in deep discussions. Please visit often and involve yourself in as many discussions as you feel you would like to join.

I don't understand why LDS and Jews wouldn't engage in deep conversations. So many of LDS doctrines and practices reflect the Jewish traditions. I have a Jewish friend from work who has been kind enough to allow me to visit and participate in a Seder dinner. I'm frankly amazed at some of the same doctrines practiced.

Thanks a ton for joining our site, thekabalist, and I really would love to hear your perspective on various topics.

[Just_A_Guy]

thekabalist, my understanding is that you can roughly put the three types of Jewish movements on a spectrum with Orthodox being the "most observant", Conservative being middle-of-the-road, and Reform being "least observant". Correct?

Also, my understanding is that the hat, beard, curls, etc is embraced mostly by Hasidic Jews, who are a subset of the Orthodox movement. Correct?

[WmLee]

My mother lives in California and is a member of a group they call, "Women of Faith". They meet once a quarter for a dinner and have a women form another faith come a speak. Men are not invited! She has shared some of what she has learned and what you have posted here is nice. She also told me of the Jewish "baptism" that a woman would have. She also implied the High Priest would/could be baptised. Can you help with this one?

[FunkyTown]

I have a question! The Jewish religion is something that I have always had great esteem for, but I wanted your input in to something.

I have read both Rashi's commentary on the Torah and Richard Elliott Friedman's commentary on the Torah. Is there considered, beyond Rashi, to be an ultimate authority on what the Torah teaches?

[thekabalist]

thekabalist, my understanding is that you can roughly put the three types of Jewish movements on a spectrum with Orthodox being the "most observant", Conservative being middle-of-the-road, and Reform being "least observant". Correct?

Yes. But you will also find degrees of observance within Jews regardless of affiliation. Some people are quite observant and go to Reform synagogues while others are the farthest from being religious but go to Orthodox synagogue.

Also, my understanding is that the hat, beard, curls, etc is embraced mostly by Hasidic Jews, who are a subset of the Orthodox movement. Correct?

Yes. But then again most Orthodox wear hats and beards. What you are referring to as "curls" are called peyot. Jews are forbidden to shave their heads in an oval format and thus they let grow enough hair on the sideburns to achieve a certain length. Some chassids usually will refrain from even trimming such hair resulting in long locks.

[thekabalist]

My mother lives in California and is a member of a group they call, "Women of Faith". They meet once a quarter for a dinner and have a women form another faith come a speak. Men are not invited! She has shared some of what she has learned and what you have posted here is nice. She also told me of the Jewish "baptism" that a woman would have. She also implied the High Priest would/could be baptised. Can you help with this one?

Ah yes in Judaism we have immersions but they're not quite the same as a Christian baptism. One immerses himself on a regular basis as a rite of ritual purity.

What you are referring to is the fact that the Bible in Leviticus 15 says that a Jewish woman should immerse after having her period. Some Reform synagogues interpret this as a equivalent to taking a shower but more religious women will do a ceremonial immersion before being reunited physically to their husbands.

[Vort]

Mormon ['môr mən] n. pl. Mormons, Mormonites, them durn Marman folk: A Muslim who thinks he's a Christian but wants to be a Jew.

[pam]

Ah yes in Judaism we have immersions but they're not quite the same as a Christian baptism. One immerses himself on a regular basis as a rite of ritual purity.

What you are referring to is the fact that the Bible in Leviticus 15 says that a Jewish woman should immerse after having her period. Some Reform synagogues interpret this as a equivalent to taking a shower but more religious women will do a ceremonial immersion before being reunited physically to their husbands.

Do they consider a woman to be unclean due to this and therefore need to do a ceremonial immersion? That has been my understanding but I could be incorrect on this.

[thekabalist]

I have a question! The Jewish religion is something that I have always had great esteem for, but I wanted your input in to something.

I have read both Rashi's commentary on the Torah and Richard Elliott Friedman's commentary on the Torah. Is there considered, beyond Rashi, to be an ultimate authority on what the Torah teaches?

While there are other commentaries of great importance I believe Rashi is Rashi. We believe that Rashi's commentaries were inspired by the Holy Spirit which is something people can't claim for every commentary. There are some pretty good ones out there. I'm particularly fond of the Baal HaTurim. :)

[thekabalist]

Do they consider a woman to be unclean due to this and therefore need to do a ceremonial immersion? That has been my understanding but I could be incorrect on this.

Yes a woman is considered unclean due to this. But the whole logic behind uncleanness is not a typical Western logic. In Judaism the holiest thing there is is life. Therefore life is the purest thing of all. Uncleanness is simply the lack of purity like darkness is the lack of light. When a great sage dies we believe that his graveyard is greatly unclean given the amount of purity that once was on earth and now is not.

So when a woman is ovulating she is focusing all of her life in her womb to generate new life. The woman's womb is therefore the purest part of human body at that moment. When she has her period then all that life is lost. And with the loss of such life comes the loss of purity and she becomes unclean. The same happens when she gives birth because she has given from her life into the life of another human being. She becomes twice as unclean when it's a girl because it takes a lot more life to generate another womb. The same happens when a man emits his seed. He also becomes unclean for similar reasons. As you can see it's a totally different way of thinking. Without the proper explanation it may shock outsiders. Sadly we have been accused by Evangelicals of discrimination on such grounds.

[Vort]

Yes a woman is considered unclean due to this. But the whole logic behind uncleanness is not a typical Western logic. In Judaism the holiest thing there is is life. Therefore life is the purest thing of all. Uncleanness is simply the lack of purity like darkness is the lack of light. When a great sage dies we believe that his graveyard is greatly unclean given the amount of purity that once was on earth and now is not.

So when a woman is ovulating she is focusing all of her life in her womb to generate new life. The woman's womb is therefore the purest part of human body at that moment. When she has her period then all that life is lost. And with the loss of such life comes the loss of purity and she becomes unclean. The same happens when she gives birth because she has given from her life into the life of another human being. She becomes twice as unclean when it's a girl because it takes a lot more life to generate another womb. The same happens when a man emits his seed. He also becomes unclean for similar reasons. As you can see it's a totally different way of thinking. Without the proper explanation it may shock outsiders. Sadly we have been accused by Evangelicals of discrimination on such grounds.

Ritual impurity != moral impurity.

[Zechariah]

Yes a woman is considered unclean due to this. But the whole logic behind uncleanness is not a typical Western logic. In Judaism the holiest thing there is is life. Therefore life is the purest thing of all. Uncleanness is simply the lack of purity like darkness is the lack of light. When a great sage dies we believe that his graveyard is greatly unclean given the amount of purity that once was on earth and now is not.

So when a woman is ovulating she is focusing all of her life in her womb to generate new life. The woman's womb is therefore the purest part of human body at that moment. When she has her period then all that life is lost. And with the loss of such life comes the loss of purity and she becomes unclean. The same happens when she gives birth because she has given from her life into the life of another human being. She becomes twice as unclean when it's a girl because it takes a lot more life to generate another womb. The same happens when a man emits his seed. He also becomes unclean for similar reasons. As you can see it's a totally different way of thinking. Without the proper explanation it may shock outsiders. Sadly we have been accused by Evangelicals of discrimination on such grounds.

That surely puts understanding and light on it. Thank you for explaining. :)

[thekabalist]

Ritual impurity != moral impurity.

An yes. Very well observed! Some people confuse both.

[pam]

So let me ask this and I mean no disrespect at all. It's western thinking. So when a woman goes through this immersion ceremony is it a public or a private thing. And do all know the reason for going through it? I'm asking because as a person growing up in a western culture..a woman's monthly course is not something that we like to publically announce to the community.

Again no disrespect meant..just something I'm curious about.

[thekabalist]

Don't worry it doesn't offend me at all. :)

It's a private ritual concerning only to the woman. The only one that would know about it is her husband. Yes, they know the reasons or at least they should because it's widely taught. Sadly not all Jewish people take interest in studying religion.

So let me ask this and I mean no disrespect at all. It's western thinking. So when a woman goes through this immersion ceremony is it a public or a private thing. And do all know the reason for going through it? I'm asking because as a person growing up in a western culture..a woman's monthly course is not something that we like to publically announce to the community.

Again no disrespect meant..just something I'm curious about.

[Moksha]

I suspect this custom stems back even further than the Tallit Katan.