Jeff Bliss' rant on teacher

[pam]

This has pretty much gone viral. I will be honest, I support what he has to say. I think he kept it pretty respectful.

Jeff Bliss Rant Against Lazy High School Teacher - YouTube

[Vort]

The guy should be expelled from school and not allowed back in.

That said, I expect his assessment is probably pretty accurate. There is a reason more and more people homeschool.

[MorningStar]

He should have written an eloquent letter instead of ranting at her in front of the whole class, gone to the principal, etc.

[Mahone]

I don't think it was respectful at all. I've never considered public humiliation respectful.

If it was one of my future children that lost control and offloaded in public I'd be highly embarrassed and I'd demand that he apologised to both the teacher and principal.

As above, if he had a concern or complaint, he should have used the official channels for doing this. She is his teacher, and he is her student - he seemed to have forgotten that hierarchy for a moment.

[Gwen]

We don't really know exactly what happened before to start the rant. Because of that I have a hard time saying if it was worthy of being expelled. I didn't see it as public humiliation, it was public criticism.

It sounded to me like he was pushed over an edge. We are all guilty of that from time to time. Part of growing up is learning how to handle those feelings when we have them.

As far as high school kids go I'm sure he kept it rather respectful and articulate. However, I was disappointed, I think he could have done a better job of being both. lol I had to stand up to a couple of teachers in school, it was hard, very very hard. Being able to stand up to authority on something that is right is a huge step in growing up.

All that said there are consequences to things we say/do. He has to suck it up and take that part as well. He needs to apologize (not necessarily for what was said, that might be true, but how he said it) and calmly accept whatever reasonable consequences come. No using the media to get out of it.

If it was my child I would have his back. I would encourage him to accept the consequences as they came and apologize for the way he acted. As for the point he was making I'd have his back in that too. I had teachers like that and it's very hard to learn. Someone has to correct the teachers, if their peers won't do it why not the students?

As a teacher I would have made it a teaching opportunity. He would have been the "guest teacher" for the next chapter. Show me how it's done. Then I'd let the students critique him, I would critique him. Then the student with the loudest complaints would get to teach the next chapter and so on. But then teachers who are that proactive in the classroom probably aren't just handing out worksheets. lol

I guess I don't see it as the huge deal it's being made to be. He's not a hero but he's not a criminal either.

[Mahone]

I didn't see it as public humiliation, it was public criticism.

What's the difference? I think most people would be humiliated if they were criticised in public when it wasn't expected or asked for.

As far as high school kids go I'm sure he kept it rather respectful and articulate.

I just don't agree with this at all. The line he went down was neither, in my opinion. The "respectful" method would be to approach the teacher in private, and then the prinicpal if necessary.

Being able to stand up to authority on something that is right is a huge step in growing up.

There is also a right way to stand up to it, and a wrong way. I can't accept that his chosen method was right, unless the circumstances were extenuating. To me, it looks like an immature student who was unable to control his temper. From that video alone, I've lost respect for the student, but not for the teacher.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Mahone

[NeuroTypical]

Idealistic unhappy teenager is idealistic and unhappy. This is news?

As the years go by, if he learns any wisdom as he matures, lessons about what he can influence, and better ways to influence, may sink in a little. He sounds articulate and bright - I've got my fingers crossed.

[talisyn]

Poor kid knows full well that his time, and the time of his fellow students, is being wasted. I gather that he hasn't been in the class long, and he's obviously use to a higher level of teaching. He's a teenage, so his level of tact isn't very high. But I admire his courage to speak out about a perceived injustice.

I'm kind've surprised by the comments here, I was sure that this would be used as a platform to encourage getting rid of teacher unions so principals could get rid of ineffective teachers easier....I deeply apologize for my cynicism.

Edited May 12, 2013 by talisyn
I can't believe I spelled 'principles' :D

[Mahone]

I'm kind've surprised by the comments here...

That makes two of us

I am genuinely surprised at how polar people's definitions of "respect", "articulate" and "courage" can be. If the video shown is all of those... well I'm just surprised.

How many of us would allow our own children to speak to us like that (regardless of what in their opinion we have done incorrectly)? If not, why is it okay to talk to his teacher like that?

For me, it'd have taken a lot more courage to not lose my temper and walk away. But hopefully that's what I'd have done, and dealt with it more appropriately once I'd calmed down.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Mahone

[talisyn]

He's suppose to be more respectful than his teacher? How does that work?

I've had teachers in high school who completely wasted my time. I wish I had the guts to tell them they were a disgrace, but I was taught to be respectful to authority figures so I said nothing. How is that better than what he did?

Edited May 12, 2013 by talisyn

[Still_Small_Voice]

I can understand the student's frustration. There are too many teachers out there in our public education system that have no desire or have legally been tied up from teaching. His frustrations should not have been vented in front of the class like this in my opinion.

[pam]

A little background behind this kid. He dropped out of school for a year. He realized that education was extremely important if he wanted to do anything with his life. So he went back to school with a sincere desire to learn. He states his rant was due to his frustration about the way this teacher taught. All he had done in her classroom was packets. She never taught in front of the class. In an interview he did, he mentioned that the teacher mentioned several times she was there only for the paycheck.

[prisonchaplain]

It's a whole new world we live in. How many teachers throughout the generations have, in a moment of weakness and frustration, told an obstinate student that at least they get a paycheck? Now, such a statement gets recorded and put on youtube and 20+ years of successful teaching gets reduced to an that one moment of exasperation. In high school most teachers hand out a worksheet now and then, and take the class time to correct papers, catch up on bureaucracy, etc.

So, it may well have been that the teacher was fine, and the student was just a show-boating wannabe rebel. On the other hand, the teacher could be a worksheet issue distributor who's given up on true teaching, who may well have deserved the reprimand.

We don't know. Without context, my inclination would be to consider the student out of line. Note to that his fellow classmates were pretty quiet through the whole thing. That does not do much for the student's case.

And, as usual for these stories, we will not get the teacher's side of the story. It amazes me that one who quit school can come back and suddenly be the expert on teaching methodology and who deserves a public chastising.

Edited May 12, 2013 by prisonchaplain

[MorningStar]

I would love to hear the teacher's side of the story. I have seen teachers gets burned out by ill behaved kids. Also, maybe she's afraid some kid might pull out a cell phone to take a video of her instructing the class? I knew a substitute teacher who was humiliated on the Internet because some student made a video of her bending over as she got into file cabinets, he made fun of her disorganization, etc. I can imagine that being a teacher is harder than ever.

[pam]

The school and the school district have stated they are taking no action against the student. Yet it is interesting that the teacher is now on paid administrative leave.

[lagarthaaz]

The school and the school district have stated they are taking no action against the student. Yet it is interesting that the teacher is now on paid administrative leave.

I can't believe this issue has even been discussed as something noteworthy in a school, let alone the idea of suspending a student or teacher over it. Teacher and student have a disagreement about what's going on in the classroom - she refused to engage with him in an argument and told him to wait outside. They would have sorted it out and moved on. She did say a couple of times "I respect that" so at the very least the confrontation might have been enough for her to put more effort into engaging her students in the lesson material.

The fact that he made a point of repeating her statement about the paycheck makes me think it might have been set up to humiliate her...in the background one kid says "score one bliss" so they had the phones out ready to go when he stomped up out of his desk.

All that aside, this is pretty tame compared to what many teachers put up with from kids in high-schools. In fact most could never get away with just giving worksheets to students and leaving them to it...the kids in the video must normally be a compliant group, since most classes would quickly dissolve into behaviour chaos if all they had was worksheets thrown at them.

Edited May 12, 2013 by lagarthaaz

[lagarthaaz]

I would love to hear the teacher's side of the story. I have seen teachers gets burned out by ill behaved kids. Also, maybe she's afraid some kid might pull out a cell phone to take a video of her instructing the class? I knew a substitute teacher who was humiliated on the Internet because some student made a video of her bending over as she got into file cabinets, he made fun of her disorganization, etc. I can imagine that being a teacher is harder than ever.

That's terrible. Do the kids know it's actually illegal to photograph someone in a school and distribute the image without permission? What a shame they can hide under pseudonyms on youtube so no-one can make them accountable.

[Dravin]

Do the kids know it's actually illegal to photograph someone in a school and distribute the image without permission?

Statements like the above really require a location disclaimer. For example, unless there is a federal statute making such illegal that means it is up to the laws of 50 different states as to whether the behavior (speaking of the one quoted above) is illegal. Do you have a reference for the federal law the makes this behavior illegal, or baring that a reference to the 50 state codes that do so? Or are you referring to Australian law? Which is fine but is obviously not applicable to the US.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Dravin

[Blackmarch]

The guy should be expelled from school and not allowed back in.

That said, I expect his assessment is probably pretty accurate. There is a reason more and more people homeschool.

Ditto

[Mahone]

He's suppose to be more respectful than his teacher? How does that work?

I don't see the teacher shouting at him in the same way he was shouting at her. Do you? In fact, I think she remained very calm throughout the whole thing. It was the student that was out of control.

I've had teachers in high school who completely wasted my time. I wish I had the guts to tell them they were a disgrace, but I was taught to be respectful to authority figures so I said nothing. How is that better than what he did?

Because she is his teacher, whether he liked that or not. By virtue of the position alone, she deserves to be treated with more respect than she was shown, regardless of whether or not he liked her methods. I haven't for one moment suggested he shouldn't have complained, I'm only referring to the method he chose to complain.

Okay so lets say we think the way he acted was acceptable. Do we allow this to set a precedent? Is it now acceptable for students to shout their personal opinions and criticisms of the teacher from half way across the classroom, in front of anyone that just happens to be present? Should this become a de facto standard? If one is allowed to get away with it, why not all of them?

What happens when they reach employment? Shouting out their disagreements with their boss from half way across the office in this manner like they've been taught at school won't get them any support, they'd get fired the same day. I could continue, but I think you see where I'm going with this.

I will ask this again though: If you were home schooling your children, would you allow them to talk to you in this manner if they disagreed with your teaching methods? If not, why is doing the same to the teacher acceptable?

Edited May 12, 2013 by Mahone

[talisyn]

There is a point for everyone where you have to take a stand against what you perceive as injustice, even in paid employment. I would hope that more people are willing to say 'This is wrong' instead of 'This is how it is'.

My homeschooling methods would not involve packets.

BTW, in Idaho as long as one on the people being recorded knows there they are being recorded it is completely legal.

[Gwen]

I don't think it was staged because the ym said in a later interview he didn't know the video was out there. And there was a lot before he got up to leave (he left because she kept saying "get out of my class" not because he was "storming out"). Seems to me it really was an impassioned plea from him.

I didn't perceive him as shouting. I saw emotion and passion but not shouting. Shouting would have been out of line and should be disciplined. There was also no name calling that I saw - that too I would have an issue with. I don't recall any cursing - which would need to be disciplined.

I would not have an issue with my teenager talking to me that way if I needed the correction. Sometimes my kids do correct me and not always "politely" but in the way they know how. The adult who can't hear what is being said to them simply because "you are a child" is too prideful. Even the scriptures talk about a child leading. Part of the reason so many kids rebel is because they are not heard, they learn they won't be listened to. So they take control of the power in their life by force. Kids are brilliant and insightful, we need to be listening. Acknowledge what they are saying and then if need be course correct the methodology.

[lagarthaaz]

Statements like the above really require a location disclaimer. For example, unless there is a federal statute making such illegal that means it is up to the laws of 50 different states as to whether the behavior (speaking of the one quoted above) is illegal. Do you have a reference for the federal law the makes this behavior illegal, or baring that a reference to the 50 state codes that do so? Or are you referring to Australian law? Which is fine but is obviously not applicable to the US.

Ok, pardon me for having a somewhat informed opinion based on experience. However if you want to get pedantic, yes, it is against the law to take pictures of anyone in Australian schools without written permission from parents (if they are kids) and consent of some kind (if they are teachers). Most parents are ok with images being used for school purposes unless there are privacy or custody issues, and children who are in care most certainly are not allowed to have their images published.

I also taught in Northern Virginia for about four years and we were not allowed to take pictures of kids for even the school webpage without a written release form from parents. I have never been to a school (and I've been around) where a release form has not been required to protect children's privacy.

Of course I can't speak for every state in the US, but in my experience, schools base their student privacy policies on the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA).

The school in the video was easy to find and they do have a privacy policy, you can look up Duncanville High, Texas and search for the Student Code of Conduct. There are many references in that document about 'improper use of visual recording' by students (a suspendable sentence of 5-90 days), about parents having the right not to sign a release to allow their kid's picture to be published (although the school strongly encourages parents to allow this for school promotional purposes), etc.

Afraid I don't have time to research the policies of 50 states - though since we're not allowed to make blanket statements - you're welcome to qualify your disagreement with me by looking them all up yourself.

[Dravin]

School policies are neither State nor Federal statue. You could provide a reference for every single school and school district in the United States having something against policy and you would have provided not a single reference that it is illegal. You claimed the behavior was illegal not against school(s) policy.

Edited May 13, 2013 by Dravin

[Mahone]

There is a point for everyone where you have to take a stand against what you perceive as injustice, even in paid employment. I would hope that more people are willing to say 'This is wrong' instead of 'This is how it is'.

Of course, but you've once again missed my point. It's not about whether or not to take a stand, it's about how that stand is taken.

My homeschooling methods would not involve packets.

Irrelevant. That wasn't part of the question.