Doctrine / prophesy- will we be gathered to Utah in last days?

[NeuroTypical]

A  few open questions to everyone (especially our three new folks who all showed up within days of each other):

Have you watched the 47 minute Mormon Leaks video focusing on Church Preparadness?

Did you see any discussion about callouts, asking the saints to move or travel, or any hint of such things?  If so, at what minute mark?

Did the video have any impact on your thoughts about end times/callout/national collapse/etc scenarios?  Please share.

[askandanswer]

6 hours ago, pam said:

Since you are speaking such blasphemy, I'm sure you will be called.

I have no doubt of the need for such a call. And like Jonah, who eventually accepted his call, I would accept such a call, although I doubt that I would have the same kind of success that Jonah had in Ninevah. 

[askandanswer]

On 11/15/2016 at 2:22 AM, NeuroTypical said:

I lost my first girlfriend to that line of thinking.  I was 7 and she was 5.  We were going to grow up and get married.  Then her father moved their family to Jackson county because he wanted to get there before the official call came.  "So you all will have a place to go", he told us.  That was in 1977.  She'd be 44 now.  Thanks a lot, conspiracy people.  

I remember her name was Laurel.  I don't remember her last name - my wife tells me her last name is Stinkbottom.  Although I'm sure it's hyphenated now - old Laurel Stinkbottom-NotNeuroTypical.  She might be a grandma for all I know.

..... and she might still be waiting for you..........

[askandanswer]

4 hours ago, Traveler said:

I have pondered and wondered if making fun of or evil speaking of the L-rd's anointed applies to places as well as people.

 

The Traveler

This comment makes me ponder the Lord’s attitude towards free speech. On the one hand, it seems to be a concept that He was reluctant to ban the practice in the war on heaven, despite that war costing him 1/3 of His beloved children. And the concept of free speech features prominently in the constitution which He inspired, and of which He has spoken in such approving terms. On the other hand, I note the sentiments expressed in the following scriptures:

Matthew 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

 34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God’s throne:

37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

James3: 6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.

 7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind:

 8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.

 9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewithcurse we men, which are made after the similitude of God.

 10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.

 

 (New Testament | Matthew 15:11)

11  Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

[SilentOne]

From your evidence, I would conclude his attitude towards free speech to be similar to his attitude towards free agency in general. We should have it. There are certain ways he would prefer us not to use it, but he will allow us to say/do those things.

[askandanswer]

5 hours ago, SilentOne said:

From your evidence, I would conclude his attitude towards free speech to be similar to his attitude towards free agency in general. We should have it. There are certain ways he would prefer us not to use it, but he will allow us to say/do those things.

I was thinking the same thing, but then I thought a little bit more about Matthew 5:34, 37. These seem to be quite specific and direct, in giving us very clear instructions, about what to say and what not to say.

_{34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God’s throne:}

_{37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.}

These verses seem to be somewhat different from the verses in James, which seems to be James expressing his opinions and attitudes re. tongues and communication.

 

[SilentOne]

I still don't see how that is significantly different than him telling us honor the Sabbath day and thou shalt not steal. We are told what we should do and then given the freedom to choose whether or not to obey.

[Blackmarch]

On 6/23/2013 at 8:23 PM, Bananikka said:

I was raised to believe we would all be called to Utah in the last days, though I'm not sure if it is real doctrine. Also, I've been told we would have a Mormon president eventually. Is this rumor urban legend or another piece of doctrine? Thanks guys!s

havent ever heard of having a mormon president as president of the US, at least pre-2nd-coming. We are to be gaathered in zion, and seperately there will be a gathering over in the east in missouri if I recall right, that is to happen shortly before the second coming commences.

[jeremiah58morgan]

On 11/14/2016 at 9:32 AM, omegaseamaster75 said:

So what? This does not make it doctrinal and I wonder how many of the people he was addressing went back if any....I most certainly would not apply to me. 

JD, O PRATT 24:4

We expect that these mountains will not be the residence of all the Latter-day Saints; we expect that the great majority of the people will emigrate. We want to tell you where our eyes are fixed. As stated in our former discourse, they are fixed upon... the western boundaries of the State of Missouri and the boundaries of the State of Kansas. We expect to go there just as much as we expect the sun will rise and set. We have no other expectation. We expect to return there just as much as the Jews expect to return to old Jerusalem in the latter days. Perhaps you may inquire if we expect to return as a majority. Yes. Do we expect to return as a great people? Yes. Do we expect to return with our wives and our children? Yes. Do we expect to return in a peaceable manner? Of course.

 

[NeuroTypical]

Again, jeremiah58morgan, it would seem, from the leaked video where our apostles are getting updates on church preparadness, that you can't find a single church leader anywhere on the planet that still expects that, and that includes our apostles.  

Otherwise, they wouldn't be devoting their efforts to helping the saints make it through difficult times wherever they live.  They wouldn't be talking about storehouses in California.  They wouldn't be talking about the lessons we could learn from remote branches in Africa.  There would have been at least some discussion about population movements or something.  And there wasn't.  Because there isn't any.  

It would be great if you new folks would interact with all that, rather than just cut and pasting stuff from Orson Pratt...

[Just_A_Guy]

@NeuroTypical, is your position that there will not be a city of New Jerusalem built on the American Continent as per the 10th Article of Faith?  Or are you just saying that the prophecy has little bearing on the life choices Mormons should currently be making both individually and as a church?

I'm down with the latter; but I think the former is a bridge too far.

[NeuroTypical]

My position is that the notion of a callout, where the saints will be asked to leave most of their worldly possessions behind and live in tents in the rocky mountains for a year, has been conclusively refuted, and was poorly supported to start with.

I'm guessing the three folks who all joined up here in the last week or so, and are not talking to us, just cut and pasting things, are adherents of this belief.  I'm wondering if the latest leaked videos have had a dent in their beliefs.  Nothing else seems to.