Faith. What is faith? How do you get it?

[Sunday21]

I have never understood what faith is. I read Ensign stories about people who give up their jobs because the job requires working on Sunday. This is labelled faith. I also read of people who have children while attending med school. This is also labelled faith. So is faith obeying commandments even if doing so seems foolish? I could do more church things if I spent fewer unpaid hours of overtime but I would displease my employer a great deal. Some of my colleagues would devote a lot of energy to punishing me. How do you decide when you have given enough to the church in terms of time? I have one calling but I turned down an additional calling because I just can't manage it with work. I never know how much is enough to give The Lord.

[Anddenex]

Read the Lectures on Faith given by Joseph Smith. This is a great place to start.

[applepansy]

Ether 12:6

And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen; wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no witness until after the trial of your faith.

[applepansy]

So is faith obeying commandments even if doing so seems foolish?

Yes. Sometimes it feels that way.

How do you decide when you have given enough to the church in terms of time?

Only you can decide that.

Personally I don't think I can give enough. The reason I feel this way is because Christ gave everything for me, for you, for everyone. He suffered everything for me, for you, for everyone. He doesn't ask for much in return. Believe in Him. Believing in Christ is faith. If you believe in Christ then you will believe the promises we find in the scriptures. If you believe in the promises then you'll act on the commandments we've been given. If you act on the commandments with nothing wavering the blessings do come and faith becomes knowledge. See Either 12:6 above.

[Palerider]

Alma 32 is very good to read about faith.

[bytebear]

Your examples are more about blind faith.

I am reminded of D&C 9:8-9:

8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

9 But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong;

Real faith comes after you have a confirmation of what the Lord wants you to do. This may mean making decisions that may seem foolish to others (or even yourself).

[Sunday21]

Your examples are more about blind faith.

I am reminded of D&C 9:8-9:

Real faith comes after you have a confirmation of what the Lord wants you to do. This may mean making decisions that may seem foolish to others (or even yourself).

Does this actually work for you? I mean praying about a decision that you have pondered over. I get many false promptings and thus have made many bad decisions. I have given up on following what seems to be revelation.

[Seminarysnoozer]

I have never understood what faith is. I read Ensign stories about people who give up their jobs because the job requires working on Sunday. This is labelled faith. I also read of people who have children while attending med school. This is also labelled faith. So is faith obeying commandments even if doing so seems foolish? I could do more church things if I spent fewer unpaid hours of overtime but I would displease my employer a great deal. Some of my colleagues would devote a lot of energy to punishing me. How do you decide when you have given enough to the church in terms of time? I have one calling but I turned down an additional calling because I just can't manage it with work. I never know how much is enough to give The Lord.

It is not a matter of how much you give but how much you love the Lord and keep an eye single to His glory.

D&C 64; " 33 Wherefore, be not weary in well-doing, for ye are laying the foundation of a great work. And out of small things proceedeth that which is great.

34 Behold, the Lord requireth the heart and a willing mind; and the willing and obedient shall eat the good of the land of Zion in these last days.

35 And the rebellious shall be cut off out of the land of Zion, and shall be sent away, and shall not inherit the land"

What is in the heart is a statement of who's will are we following; Moses " 2 But, behold, my Beloved Son, which was my Beloved and Chosen from the beginning, said unto me—Father, thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever."

Remember, by keeping our first estate in the pre-mortal world, we all made that same statement - thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever. This life is a test to see if we actually do the thing we said we would despite the pull towards self centered satisfaction.

I like how Elder Oaks said it; "If our service is to be most efficacious, it must be accomplished for the love of God and the love of his children. The Savior applied that principle in the Sermon on the Mount, in which he commanded us to love our enemies, bless them that curse us, do good to them that hate us, and pray for them that despitefully use us and persecute us. (See Matt. 5:44.) He explained the purpose of that commandment as follows:

“For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

“And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?” (Matt. 5:46–47.)"

Where do we seek our praise, from man? our employers? or are we in the service of God. We are more efficacious if it is done for the love of God and others.

________

Also, think about everything you know and understand in this life. I would say 99% or more was obtained by faith in someone else, either a parent or teacher or by reading someone else' words etc. That is how important faith will be to our learning in the next life too.

[Leah]

I have never understood what faith is. I read Ensign stories about people who give up their jobs because the job requires working on Sunday. This is labelled faith. I also read of people who have children while attending med school. This is also labelled faith. So is faith obeying commandments even if doing so seems foolish? I could do more church things if I spent fewer unpaid hours of overtime but I would displease my employer a great deal. Some of my colleagues would devote a lot of energy to punishing me. How do you decide when you have given enough to the church in terms of time? I have one calling but I turned down an additional calling because I just can't manage it with work. I never know how much is enough to give The Lord.

Obeying Heavenly Father's commandments is never foolish.

[Guest]

Does this actually work for you? I mean praying about a decision that you have pondered over. I get many false promptings and thus have made many bad decisions. I have given up on following what seems to be revelation.

Yes, it does actually work. But, you have to learn how to listen to the Spirit.

And these things don't exist on its own. It all falls together as an entire LIFE process.

I'll give you an example using Exercise. Some guy wants to have a flat stomach so he does 100 abs crunches everyday. At the end of 6 months, he's wondering why he still has a big gut. Well, you can't get your gut smaller by just doing abs crunches. Instead, it would make your gut bigger because not only do you have that layer of fat, now you add a layer of muscle underneath it. If you want a flat stomach, you need to eat healthy, have enough sleep, and do cardio to increase your metabolism. It's a LIFE change. Not just abs crunches.

This is the same as Faith and Prayer. It's a whole LIFE process. Basically, you are putting your faith that God exists and He has this plan for our salvation. You put faith that the Plan is good and that you chose to follow that Plan in pre-mortal life. This is the first step. Then you ACT on that faith. You make baptismal covenants and then you KEEP those covenants. It is not until then that you can realize the truth of what you put your faith on... because you start to see the promises that Christ gave us. So that FAITH always comes first, then you ACT on it.

So... thinking - oh, I'm going to quit my job because the bishop told me I can't work on Sunday... that's not exercising faith. That's abs crunches. Exercising faith is gaining a testimony of the truth of the gospel by fulfilling your covenants. Prayer, fasting, intense study of the scriptures, studying the words of the prophets, following the word of wisdom, repenting of mistakes, serving in your callings, etc. These things tune you into that still small voice of the Holy Ghost guiding your life to where it needs to go. Because, the revelations that the Spirit tells you will fall in line with everything else that you have gained testimony on. When the revelation doesn't jive with what you've read in the scripture, for example, then you get to study that revelation and wonder if it is true prompting or not. So then you decide to quit your Sunday job because you know you can fulfill your covenant of taking care of yourself and your family without it, or you have planned what to do about its consequences to continue to fulfill your covenant of providing for your temporal needs. It goes in line with the testimonies that you have gained. You don't quit just because your bishop told you to.

THAT is exercising faith.

Edited February 27, 2014 by anatess

[Lakumi]

This is the same as Faith and Prayer. It's a whole LIFE process. Basically, you are putting your faith that God exists and He has this plan for our salvation. You put faith that the Plan is good and that you chose to follow that Plan in pre-mortal life. This is the first step. Then you ACT on that faith. You make baptismal covenants and then you KEEP those covenants. It is not until then that you can realize the truth of what you put your faith on... because you start to see the promises that Christ gave us. So that FAITH always comes first, then you ACT on it.

THAT is exercising faith.

I donno, personally I don't think God is looking out for me, but that's a lack of faith

[Finrock]

Good Afternoon Sunday21. It is a pleasure to meet you! Welcome to the forums. :)

If you believe the Lectures on Faith* then all things operate on the principle of faith. Faith is a principle of power. So, how do you get faith? You already have it. If you take the time to think about it and to reflect in your mind you will quickly realize that everything you do is an act of faith. If you had no faith in anything, whatsoever, you would cease to do any action, whatsoever.

Faith is acting on a belief or a hope that hasn't yet been realized but which you believe or hope will be realized once you begin acting on that belief. Some things we find out real quick that we can rely on and our faith in it becomes sure. Other things take more testing or trying.

I cannot recall a time when I did not believe, at least in principle, that there is a God. I do not always and have not always acted in accordance with this belief. However, there came a time when my pride, my self-assurance, and the worldly comforts I had depended on failed me. I was compelled to be humble. I began to act in accordance with my belief in God. As I continued to act I began to receive witnesses that my actions were indeed good and approved by God. Even today, I am a weak, prideful, and fickle man. I am in constant need of God reminding me of my dependence on Him. Slowly I am beginning to adapt my life to reflect what I believe to be true. Over a period of time I have had experiences that have resolved my belief or my faith in certain things. But, this has not culminated in a perfect knowledge of all or even most things. I still exercise faith every day, every second, in what I believe is the gospel of Jesus Christ. I am still learning to rely on the promptings of the Spirit. I am still learning to not to be afraid to act when I feel the Spirit telling me to act. But, little by little, I have learned that God is real. There is no other explanation for the manifestations of His power that I have witnessed. Jesus Christ lives. There is no other source or explanation for the healing I have received by putting my faith in Jesus Christ and in His atonement.

-Finrock

*I firmly believe that the Lectures on Faith are true doctrine and I stand as a witness of this truth.

[Quin]

There are a lot of different kinds of faith... Although I'd say eh fall into 2 main categories: Learned & Blind.

Blind faith is fairly rare.

Most people use some kind of learned faith.

Meaning it's happened often enough that you have faith it will happen again.

Even though you have neither proof, nor guarantee, that it will.

Here's a sciency example of faith: Every single time you've gotten sick, you've gotten better. Which I know, because you're here. So, even though the next cold you get COULD kill you, I'd lay money that you expect to live through it. That's learned faith. You believe in something that you have no proof for.

***

The 2 examples you gave: babies in Medschool & not working on Sunday may or may not be examples of faith.

For example, I've worked while in school, and had babies in school, and babies while working (aka I've 'done it all')... And PERSONALLY... It's a heckuva lot easier & less expensive to do babies & school. Why? Because you're not in school for 50 hours a week (aka don't need to fund childcare full time), what childcare you do need is subsidized-so you can afford top notch childcare, and you can study while they sleep.. For me, it's the DREAM work-from-home job that SAHMs are always looking for. I love it. Others would hate it. So Baby in Medschool COULD be super hard, or it could be absolutely perfect. Depends on the family. Would I be willing to have a baby in Medschool? Yep. Because I have faith BECAUSE I've had babies while in school before. I've never been in Medschool, so it might be misplaced faith, but I still believe it could not only work, but work well.

Same token, not working on Sundays. It could be a faith thing... But people also prioritize not to work on Saturdays for dance, or Tuesdays for soccer. People prioritize their lives differently. I may look for work that doesn't work on Sundays... But I don't. Not for a lack of faith (I get to visit wards all over the country/world because I work weekends!), but rather the inverse. My faith leads me to work weekends.

So... While the person USING the example (Medschool, or never working Sundays) may see it as an expression of their faith (and it durn well is, if they say so) it isn't universal. Some people choose to wait to have kids due to their faith, and choose to work weekends due to their faith (I have perfect faith that I'll either be able to attend as a visitor, or that HF understands when I have to miss...perhaps ironically, I tend to miss church more often at home than on the road).

Anyhow... Point being: Not only are there different kinds of faith, but different expressions of it.

Just because one thing is an example of faith for one person, doesn't mean that your own faith is less for doing something differently.

Q

[Traveler]

I will take a different approach. I would suggest that everything we do and every act we engage in - while living in mortality - is an expression of our faith. Not only do we live our life in faith of something but like the star trek kobayashi maru we will eventually fail at whatever quest we pursue and die. Whatever purpose we think life is - it is a purpose of faith.

I would also suggest that as intelligent beings we expand our intelligence and our faith through discipline. As we exercise our faith and improve our discipline - we humans develop talents. Mostly we think of talents as gifts from G-d but the truth is that like muscles become stronger through physical exercise - our spiritual faith becomes stronger through exercising our faith. And so it seems that those that do not prepare through exercise and discipline; when the need for strength is real - it is most likely that they will not endure.

Many think that when our strength fails it is faith in G-d that will lead us on and that G-d will over come obstacles for us. If the obstacles are not over come it is because we did not believe on our faith enough. I find this belief to be unreliable - therefore I do not believe it. I think such belief is made example in the parable of the 10 virgins - and that this thinking is the false hope of the 5 foolish virgins.

We exercise faith through the commandments. It is this exercise of faith that makes us fit to finish the race.

The Traveler

[McLainDow]

The best way I have heard faith described is as follows. Belief is the building materials used in building the temple. Faith is the craftsmanship used to build the temple

[The Folk Prophet]

You may have heard the phrase (or something similar) that faith is an action word.

To put this more scripturally, we have James 2:17

Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

And James 2:20

But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

A lot of people take this to mean that faith must be accompanied by works as a separate thing. But it is, I believe, saying that works are a part of faith and that without works there is no faith at all.

This understanding makes the whole saved by faith or works discussion pretty irrelevant. We are, indeed, saved by faith and faith alone. But without works, there is no faith. It's really quite simple.

Point being, if you have no works, you have no faith. Faith IS works. A choice to act is a choice of faith. They cannot be separated.

Giving up a job to not work on Sundays is faith. It is a work that is based on a hope that is substantiated by something that is believed. One believes they will be blessed by keeping the Sabbath holy. They hope for the blessings that will attend. They believe that working on the Sabbath is not keeping it holy. So they act. This is faith.

Same with having children. A person believes that having children will result in blessings. They hope that they will be blessed by prioritizing that because they believe it. So they act.

Faith is the substance of things hoped for. This means that it is the foundation of our hope. Faith comes first. No faith = no hope. And faith without works is dead. No works = no faith.

We have faith, so we have hope, so we act. If we do not act it is because we do not hope because we have no faith.

[skalenfehl]

In order to truly understand faith, one must understand in what or in WHOM one must have faith and why. Prayerfully study the Lectures on Faith written by Joseph Smith, which were once part of the Doctrine & Covenants. It will teach you empowering faith.

[Sunday21]

TO CHURCH: Thank you very much for this practical and comprehensive reply. This is information that I can use!

[applepansy]

I had an experience Friday that brought this thread to mind.

We were driving of the North Ogden Divide and had to slow down for some people crossing the road to the trail head. I mentioned to my husband that I would like to hike that trail. He smiled and said I don't think you'd make it. I said I have faith I can. He just looked at me. Then I said I can hope can't I?

I do have faith I can and I hope I can climb that trail. Until I actually climb the trail there won't be knowledge. Thinking of Either 12:6 "...faith is things which are hoped for and not seen..." I don't think this scripture describes blind faith. I think it describes the process (faith + works = knowledge).