What is the answer to a sexless Marriage

[Quin]

There is are different ways to eat healthy. Weight loss (which is not always healthy) is about calorie control. There is no contradiction.

Whoops! I stand corrected. I thought you were linking the two, which is correct.

Weight loss = calorie control, however, is just wrong. Or, in a Princess Bride theme, MOSTLY wrong!

For SOME it's about calorie control.

For others?

Well, many people don't respond to diet changes at all... It's all about +/- exercise, the types, duration, frequency, etc.

For those that respond to diet, though, it's still variable as it's sometimes

+/- calories

+/- carbohydrates

+/- proteins

+/- lipids

+/- vitamins & or minerals

S'why diet & exercise fads come & go.

They always work brilliantly for one subset (or more) of the population, and terribly for everyone else.

It all comes down to our own unique physiology.

What's best for one isn't best for all.

Q

[NightSG]

I have no answer for it. I agree with you on just about every count -- you need to try to everything you can to be a good husband. Sometimes that means trying to lose that extra 25 pounds, sometimes that means putting extra effort in housework or childcare. I also agree that it is not right nor fair ("who said life was fair? where is that written?" if we want to add to our Princess Bride quote list) for her to wait until you have met a certain "threshold" before she responds to your requests for increased engagement in sex.

 

The problem is that this treads dangerously close to rewarding bad behavior; it's teaching her that she can get more than he is obliged to give by withholding affection, and that it's ok for her to do that.

[Guest]

The problem is that this treads dangerously close to rewarding bad behavior; it's teaching her that she can get more than he is obliged to give by withholding affection, and that it's ok for her to do that.

 

No, it isn't.

 

You should do everything you can do to be a good husband - including taking care of your physical self - because you want to be a good husband.  This is independent of anything the spouse perceives the action as.  He can't control what his wife does, he can only control himself.  Saying, I can't be the best husband I can possibly be because she might <insert whatever reason here> is a terrible excuse for not doing the best one can be as a husband.

 

Now, what makes a good husband?  Is it doing everything the wife asks you to do?  Of course not.  This is the main point about the gospel doctrine of "Becoming One".  Becoming One is not doing whatever your spouse wants - or getting your spouse to do what you want - so you can be united.  Becoming One is both of you aligning yourself with Christ.  As each of you becomes one with Christ, you both become one with each other.

 

So, what makes a good husband?  When you are completely aligned with Christ.  So that, when she finally figures out how to align herself with Christ (and you can help her with this) - then you can be One.

 

Of course, we are human, so we can't perfectly align ourselves with Christ just yet, but the closer we are to that line, the more one we become.  It's enduring to the end - the constant desire and struggle to get there. 

 

And when you're both One (or getting closer and closer to it) - sex just naturally follows... or other forms of expression of true LOVE which, not only is satisfying, but long-lasting.

 

[The Folk Prophet]

In support of anatess's point above: Covered this in priesthood this week. From the Joseph Fielding Smith manual:

 

If a man and his wife were earnestly and faithfully observing all the ordinances and principles of the gospel, there could not arise any cause for divorce. The joy and happiness pertaining to the marriage relationship would grow sweeter, and husband and wife would become more and more attached to each other as the days go by. Not only would the husband love the wife and the wife the husband, but children born to them would live in an atmosphere of love and harmony. The love of each for the others would not be impaired, and moreover the love of all towards our Eternal Father and his Son Jesus Christ would be more firmly rooted in their souls.

[Backroads]

I agree with the two posts above. 

 

My brother and sister-in-law spent several years in a sexless marriage.  SiL feels comfortable sharing such things with me (Brother is a man of few words, but was all right with my awareness), so I am privy to some details.

 

Now, there's was some other issues rather than "I don't want to have sex with you", but I think some principles can be shared.

 

They worked on the stuff mentioned above (along with seeing a counselor and what not).

[Guest Anonymous45258]

I hadn't thought about it that way and how it all is intertwined with the gospel and our individual relationship with Christ.  I have felt a need to become closer with Christ.  I have wondered if this would be enough to strengthen this part of our marriage.  Also I know I can lead as the priesthood holder and set an example but my wife's relationship with Christ is a personal one.  What happens if she doesn't want to progress and or doesn't really try.  Will that mean that the relationship can't improve?

 

I know this is the most important part.  But I need to work on all the other points I listed out.  I like the comment on needing to do more than my chores list (I should go above and beyond).

 

It's funny everyone says you can't change somebody but I am trying to change for my wife.  I guess in her case it is working or it will have worked if I succeed.

 

Girl outside with book - Can you share some more details about your brothers relationship and what they did to overcome it?

 

I wonder if this is a common problem in the church.    

[The Folk Prophet]

The example you set can be a powerful, powerful thing. But you cannot force someone else to change.

[Backroads]

 

Girl outside with book - Can you share some more details about your brothers relationship and what they did to overcome it?

 

I wonder if this is a common problem in the church.    

 

 

Their problem was more of the classic "good girl syndrome":  my sister-in-law was the only girl in her family and her mom just wasn't up for talking about sex with her growing up. 

 

Without going into any details (per board policy and, well, common decency) suffice it to say they had to build up slowly through increasingly sexual and intimate behaviors.

 

Through that (this was years in the process, sadly) they still had to preserve their marriage.  They were very affectionate in all other areas (lots of touching, hugging, cuddling) so there was still SOME intimacy even if it wasn't sexual plus continuing their spiritual relationship.

[Quin]

It's funny everyone says you can't change somebody but I am trying to change for my wife. I guess in her case it is working or it will have worked if I succeed.

LOL...Nope! She's not changing you one iota. That's ALL you.

She can't make you lose weight, be nice, wear a green hat, or anything else.

YOU can choose to lose weight, be nicer, and wear a green hat... But you & only you are the one with the ability to do so.

I suppose she could chain you to a truck and force you to run, keep you in a box and not feed you, superglue (staple, sew) the hat on your head... But you get now that's why forcing people to do something is called abuse. Anything short of being forced, is choice*. Exercising our own agency.

We're all of us influenced by the people around us.

But it is our choice how much.

For example we can choose to do things differently, or choose to be annoyed (whether we do things differently or not), or choose to ignore them, or choose to divorce. We're never made to do the things that others ask or tell us to do. We choose to. For a whole variety of reasons. Either we trust their fashion sense (green hats), or want to make them happy, or see their point, or disagree but are willing, or are in a rush, or want to trade x for y, or, or, or, or.

Doesn't mean that there are not consequences for our actions (my bringing my mum flowers has one consequence, my refusing to pick up the papers I knocked over has another consequence) for our actions and our choices. But they are OUR choices. How another person chooses to react is on them.

Accepting influence is one of those key things in most relationships.

_________

* asterix because there are things we cannot change about ourselves even if we want to.

[Roseslipper]

Just do all you can to be the best husband,the best you become selfless and think of her needs, and in time it will work out.  and she will become her loving self.  I do agree with what the others have said.  If she doesn't want to go to counseling then you go in time she will probably follow. A women needs to feel loved, and cherished.  I do think its best to go to a lds therapist

 

And don't leave Heavenly Father out He wants you to ask him for His help!!!  You can work a miracle in your lives, in your marriage as well.

 

Now go ahead and do what you need to do.....Start!!!!!!!!

[ACommonMan]

Unfortunately, I am not in a position to offer advice on what to do. My advice is more along the lines of what I know did not work. (and divorce is always on the table, even if you are not willing to play that card, she might)

 

The notion of punishment and reward should never exist in marriage. I don't care what examples where she started providing more sexual favors, so he started doing more dishes anyone can cite. Those are statistical anomalies and don't actually prove anything. There are many more short term examples than there are long term resolutions, because the notion is a short term solution.

 

In my case, we were clinically sexless. (Therapists define sexless and less than six times a year, and we averaged about twice a year for the last 10 years.) It wasn't until the ink was drying on her divorce filing that I began to see many of the mistakes I had made. I tried to accept and understand that see had "good-girl" issues and other such theories. But one fundamental problem was that when she rejected my advances, I was hurt. As much as I thought I was "manning up" and accepting the situation, she could still feel that I was hurt, and that hurt her. There were countless other ways she misinterpreted my sincere intentions, and in almost every instance, it was because I wasn't reacting well to situations.

 

The book I read, which helped me see the critical errors I was making, is called "Real Love" by Dr. Greg Baer. If it's fair to boil a book down to a couple of sentences, the book states that you must love your spouse with the pure love of Christ. You cannot expect anything from them. Your love for them cannot be conditioned on anything they do, or don't do.

 

Ultimately, says Baer, you only ever have three choices:

1. Live with it and like it

2. Live with it and hate it

3. Leave it

 

Nothing else works. While other theories, like Love Languages, are important to make sure that your communications of love are being most effectively received by your spouse, They don't work when you're trying to manipulate someone into either giving you love or to protect you from from being hurt.

[Angewange]

I think the answers here are really helpful most especially the Quin. I love my children and it was a good and proper choice to stay at home with the children. But it doesn't develop your brain power with adults, it doesn't fill you as a human being, you always feel less than and you can never ever relax. If I did not get a break from the kids when my husband got home and if I did not get one 'day off' I would have left this job long time ago. Being a mother can be fulfilling and wonderful, but mostly it is thankless, exhausting, unending and hard with little to no relief. You get to leave your job, your wife does not. this is no reason to feel guilty but volunteering to do things and just getting into a routine of assistance is a most fantastic gift. The best thing my husband can do for me is clean the kitchen. 

 

When it comes to sexually take special care - I dont want to insult you in this and I mean this in the kindest and most sensitive way. But we are not taught how to please our partners. Many LDS have been married virgins and some have no experience sexually when they get with their partner. As such we do not know how to really please our partners without genuinely exploring and learning about how their bodies tick. There is no routine to sex, it isn't just kissing, a bit of feeling and then penetration. Woman take a long time to really be ready for sex, it takes kindness affection, ongoing attention and care to even get to the point where she will think it. Then it takes you exploring her body without the rush for satisfaction just really enjoying her bits. 

 

Many women eventually give up on sex because they are not being satisfied and they may not even tell you because they are scared of hurting you. A good idea is to practice foreplay on your partner without actually having intercourse. Actually spend time. The more a woman is turned on the less she resists. But a woman needs to be turned on in her mind and body to be able to let the wall down. 

 

Also it is important to be a consistently good lover. Find out her cycle and when she is ovulating is a good time to initiate sexy time, because physically her body is more responsive, but spend time on her body and her desires before your pleasure. This way it doesn't leave her unsatisfied. Women who are long term unsatisfied close the door to sexuality because it is painful to continuously be in that state. 

 

Some women who resent staying at home with the kids and feel unappreciated for giving up themselves doing it avoid sex in case it brings yet more children which will steal more of their life time to be in enjoyment of life. Really look into this position. It is a huge shock when the reality of how bone achingly hard it is to be a parent settles and then you have the children, you cant send them back, you love these people but suddenly you have lost who you are and society always looks down on mums. A bit or normality is a very helpful and mind settling thing. Your wife sounds like she needs a break from the kids and house issues and just be a woman. The sitter may not be a good idea, but maybe farming the kids over to various places for a 'sleepover' and trading with other parents for alone time may be a good choice. Going on a wonderful date and coming back the reality of a dirty house, and screaming kids is the biggest contraception you could get. We have parents who have kids in the same primary class as the kids which we make a deal with that they take our respective kid for one Saturday night and we do the same in the return. this does take organisation but it is worth it. 

 

Failing your weight loss, your helping in the home, giving her a break, and doing the dates over a few weeks and this not being righted I would definitely push for counselling. There is only so long that that type of relationship will survive before it cracks. But please be aware that the desire will not be ignited only after one week it takes consistency, over a while before the reality will change because she sounds like she is locked in to an unhappy view of life. 

 

I wish you luck. 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

I don't know if someone mentioned this (I apologize for not reading the whole thread)....but I agree with Prison Chaplain (I did read his post).  

 

I think it's reasonable to consider that something deeper is going on here.  Survivors of sexual abuse or rape, often have difficulty with sexual relations even in a loving relationship.  Statistics say that 1 in 4 women and 1 in 6 men are sexually abused or assaulted, so there is a good chance that could be what is going on in your marriage.  "Lose weight" or "help more around the house" sound like excuses masking the real problem to me.  I suggest therapy, therapy, therapy.

[omegaseamaster75]

I would be interested in updates as the OP progresses through some of the suggestions. If that's the direction he wants to go. Which is sounds like it is. 

 

My suggestion to the OP is to not take divorce off the table. Think about the example that is being set for your children, is your relationship with your wife the example of a relationship that you would like them to be in when they grow up and choose their eternal companions? Like it or not you have a very big influence on their decision making process. If you think that they do not notice you and your wife's issues you would be mistaken.

 

3 years without sexual relations? This is unacceptable, granted we are only getting one side of the story here so we can give the OP a 50% discount on whatever he tells us, but a "reasonable" person perspective says that issues lie deeper than house keeping and weight. Lets be honest women are not as focused on the visual side of sex as men are and 25lbs are pretty easy to look past so that excuse flies right out the window for me, it also sounds like the OP already helps keep the house up.

 

So he gets up and goes to work all day to provide for his family, comes home helps around the house, and I'm sure still finds time to spend with the kids, is still sexually attracted to his wife aka wants to have relations.....hmmmmmm run this by a reasonable woman and she would say your a great guy.

 

You have a roommate who does not like you. I would not live with someone who does not like me

 

I would be willing to bet that if you lost the 25 lbs and kept a perfect house, took her out to dinner/movies weekly you still would not get "lucky". Marriages are a 2 way street you can do all of these things and more but if she has emotionally checked out your done for.

[Sunday21]

We haven't been to counseling.  I have brought it up but my wife isn't willing to go.  She doesn't feel like there is anything wrong.  Plus if you asked her she would put the blame squarely on me.  Also this isn't something I could ever share with my bishop and I am not sure that he would even know what to say.

What does she say is the problem?

[Sunday21]

What does she say is the problem?

Sorry. Ignore this. I got lost in the tread and did not realize that it has been answered repeatedly

[WhatDoIDo]

omegaseamaster75,

 

Thank you for articulating some of my feelings so well.  While my marriage doesn't fit the clinical definition of sexless, it is certainly much, much, much less often than I would prefer.  

 

Again, our situation is slightly different from the OP, but I feel like I've done the "lose 25 lbs, keep a perfect house, take her out to dinner/movies" (basically I've tried my best to be the perfect husband for so long) and the situation hasn't changed at all.  It's been a problem as long as we've been married (10+ years).  I've brought it up several times, and it may change for a few days/weeks, but it never lasts.  During those few days/weeks, I always try to show appreciation for the changes (small as they may be sometimes).  But I've resigned to the fact that she just doesn't desire me that way very much and never really has.  I thought it could be a medical problem, but she's been checked out and there's nothing medically that would be causing this lack of desire.  

 

I've considered divorce several times, but in the LDS culture saying you're getting divorced because of differences in sexuality is a major no-no.  So I'm stuck.  

[Quin]

There was a quote in here that just keeps taking up space in my mind, and I just can't let it go:

"you have a room mate who doesn't like you very much"

That concept just kind of stuns me.

And I'm on the other side of the spectrum, here:

- Divorced after 10+ years of marriage

- Very active/robust/whatever physical side to our marriage

(True, it decreased to about 1/5th of what it was in the beginning, which is pretty normal 1/3-1/5 of the first 2 years is once a week to once a month for the bigger part of the bell curve, but it was still daily. Which isn't normal. Our decrease was normal, but we both had high libidos to start. Normal = hte bell curve, right? I'm only pointing this out, because I'm not trying to argue that sexless is okay because I have a low libido / justifying my own self. NOT where I'm coming from. Point being that I GET having a high libido and placing a high value on physical intimacy.).

So from the other side of the divide.... Where (in our many many problems), that wasn't one of them.

.

There is soooooooooooooooooooo much more to a marriage than physical intimacy!!!!

The difference between a room mate & a spouse isn't "just" whether or not you're sleeping together.

Just like it's not a checklist of if you do this for me, I'll do that for you business relationship (whether paying for goods or service, or bartering action for action).

Marriage is the merging together of 2 lives.

It's this huge, big, complex thing...

Whereas room mates simply split the rent, and the rest is negotiable

I'm actually a rather big fan of divorce in general, and I know a LOT of divorced people...

But while we come up with polite brush offs, I don't know ANYONE who divorced over a single issue.

Driven crazy by a single issue?

For sure.

One liners a single issue?

That's the polite brush off.

But you actually sit down and talk about your divorce/marriage and you find it's never a he did this, she did that kind of thing.

Even in what seems like fairly straightforward 1 issue divorces (abuse, adultery, etc.), it's never "just" that.

It's the total breakdown of that big complex thing that marriage is.

And I am NOT blame the victim, here, to be clear from the vey very very outset.

Because it is very possible for 1 person to cause that breakdown themselves, and then go out and wound the other party further... And in fact, that's usually the case in abuse, addiction, & adultery (Hmmmm... Wonder if that's part of why those are the 3 "okay" options... Because in all 3 it's impossible for 1 party to affect any change in the marriage, if the other party has chosen one of those 3 roads?).

But it's far more common for there to be domino type problems: both parties knocking down things causing chain reactions.

Where it takes both parties working together to fix it.

None of the above is true in a room mate situation.

It's not even true in a living together situation.

I think it's very dangerous to oversimplify a marriage into these terms.

Not because it leads to divorce, per se...

But because oversimplifying a marriage kills it.

It turns it into a ledger sheet.

______

Realizing that may sound weird, to oversimplify even in my example, I'll put up with stuff from my best friend I won't put up with in a new friend. Because of decades of experience with her means this is a bad day/ month/ year for her. Ditto, I'll put up with attitudes/ ideals/etc. from her That in someone else means I would never even be friends with to start with... Because I've been here with her on this road. I've seen her journey, and can see the POTENTIAL for where it's going to go. And even if it never meets that potential? In most things I'm okay with that. (In others it may eventually kill our friendship, but the decades I've spent with her, mean I may give it 10 years to sort itself out, rather than the 10 minutes I'd give a relative stranger).

Friendship, though, is only one aspect of marriage.

Just like sex is only one aspect.

Communication

Finances

Values

Parenting

Parenting Styles

Family

Goals

Ambition/Drive

Spirituality

Fun / Hobbies

Intelligence

Sense of humor

Anger reactions

(Those 2 get their own subcategories, just because they get definitive / high priorities in most relationships)

Emotional reactions

Interactions with others (socially, professionally)

Personality

History & Future

Health

Challenges

Strengths

Jealous v Protective v Possessive v Ambivalent v Dismissive (aka how "mine" is the other person)

Politics

Social Stature

Aesthetics

Polite v Rude

Et cetera. Serious et cetera.

I mean... The list of all the pieces of what goes into a MARRIAGE is huge. It just keeps going. All these working parts.

We all prioritize those parts differently.

Both within a marriage, and individually.

A room mate?

Finances. MAYBE aesthetics (what the house looks like/ cleanliness) , Polite v Rude, & MAYBE friendship. But that's it.

A roommate situation implodes if ANY of those very, very, very few points of intersection chafe.

Hence the danger of oversimplifying a marriage.

All marriages chafe.

Q

[WhatDoIDo]

Quin,

 

I agree that marriage is a very complex animal that encompasses all the many things that you listed.  There are many strong marriages that can go through that list and highlight several areas where they've greatly struggled.  It's also very tough to try to deconstruct that entire marriage to the point of posting on a forum without turning it into a book.  I don't think it's oversimplifying so much as trying to cut to the chase.  

 

There also is the concept of a dealbreaker.  A dealbreaker is something within a marriage so important that if it happens (or in this particular thread isn't happening) it's just cause for termination of the relationship.  Adultery is the classic example.  For many people, that's a dealbreaker.  Everything else on your list could be 100% perfect, but if one partner commits adultery, it's over.  Though I think we can all agree that if adultery has happened, the other stuff on the list can't be 100% perfect.  Which I think is the heart of what you were saying, you can't just break it down to one thing.  However, the dealbreaker is what turns an unhappy marriage into an unacceptable marriage.  

 

Now what may be a dealbreaker for one person, may not be a dealbreaker for another.  For some couples, adultery is a dealbreaker, but others are able to move past adultery and return to a strong relationship.  But like you said, it takes BOTH parties working together to fix it.  So what's a guy to do if the other party is either unwilling or unable to work toward fixing it?   Then what?  

 

Getting back to the dilemma of the OP and myself.  What if you fell like you've done everything you can to try to fix the relationship only to see your spouse unwilling or unable to work on it?  If a sexless marriage is a dealbreaker, where do you go from there?  

[MrShorty]

Quinn:

I find myself rather interested in understanding what makes good relationships/marriages and how sex fits into it. It is an interesting blend of religion, anecdotal evidence, and science. As you note, sex is not all there is to building a good marriage, but it consistently seems to be part of a good marriage. While strongly correlated, what does this mean in terms of causation? And, ultimately, what does this mean as far as "actions" a couple should take to try to have a good marriage? In what ways do we overemphasize the importance of sex in marriage? In what ways do we underestimate it?

 

Getting back to the dilemma of the OP and myself.  What if you fell like you've done everything you can to try to fix the relationship only to see your spouse unwilling or unable to work on it?  If a sexless marriage is a dealbreaker, where do you go from there?

I'm reminded of a concept Dr. Gottman uses: the concept of a "perpetual problem" and "gridlock." (http://www.gottmanblog.com/2012/07/managing-conflict-solvable-vs-perpetual.html). What you describe begins to sound to me like sex could be a "perpetual problem". The idea would be to learn how to deal with it so we don't become "gridlocked" over it. I sometimes wish I could find some good case studies where Dr. Gottman shows how to use these principles to deal with sexual issues specifically.

[Guest Silarias]

Like someone posted earlier, read And They were Not Ashamed.  Read it together if possible.  

 

I get the impression that you try to communicate with your wife; never stop that.  If you have a problem, bring it up with her, and let her know she can bring up problems of her own.  Talk talk talk.  Build up and sustain trust.  Build up your friendship, and reminisce with her about your wedding and honeymoon often.  Go to the Temple together often, once a month if possible.

 

Also, I'm trying not to come across as rude or prying, and you don't have to tell me if you don't want, but is she involved in any groups outside of the Church that have questionable practices not in alignment with the Gospel?  I know this can mess with the mentality of a spouse, and pull them away from their spouse and even the church.  I've seen it happen in my own family, whether or not the person was married.  I've recently come to understand the true importance the anti-church affiliation question in the Temple interview.

 

I don't know all of the details of course, and I haven't been as married as long as you, but I hope my advice is useful.  Never stop praying, even in the darkest of times.

[MorningStar]

To me it sounds like the problem is on her end and rather than face it, she's giving a bunch of excuses that involve blaming you.  You could drive yourself crazy trying to do everything to appease her, but she'll most likely come up with another reason.  So sorry you're dealing with this.   

 

When a man complains his wife is overweight, people jump down his throat.

[WhatDoIDo]

I purchased "And They Were Not Ashamed" and my wife and I are reading it together every night.  Reading it for the past week has initiated several conversations about the situation, all of which are things we've discussed in the past.  I think it has given her some insight into herself, but a good portion of it doesn't really apply.  

 

Last night we read the section on men needing sex to feel love and women needing love to desire sex.  It tells the story of Joe and Mary.  In therapy Joe says, "Every time I reached out for you and you said, 'No,' I feel unwanted, unloved.  I wonder if you're still attracted to me.  I question whether you think I'm a good lover or not.  I wonder whether I turn you off.  I worry whether you've fallen out of love with me.  I feel hurt and distant from you.  Your rejection leaves me feeling lonely."  That was a very hard section to read without breaking down and sobbing.  I had to stop several times as I read it to compose myself.  

 

After reading and in our conversations, promises of change are made and while it's only been a week, nothing has actually changed.  At least in the past, when promises of change were made, there would be a few days of hope as things seemed to improve.  

 

Many times I feel like I'm asking her to change who she is.  Which doesn't seem like a fair thing for me to ask of her.  Often times when there is a discussion about wanting to change things about your spouse, the usual response is, "Well you knew how she was when you married her, so you need to accept that is who she is."  The difference is that we were both virgins when we got married.  We had discussed what our sexual relationship would be like before we were married, but we didn't really know how it would be until we were married.  For me, it didn't take long after we were married to realize there was a big problem.  I think it was just 2 months after we were married that I first brought up my concerns.  10 years later, we're still having the same conversations.  

 

It's really sad to say, but had I known then what I know now, I either wouldn't have married her or divorced her back then, before kids got involved.  But I wanted to be a "good" husband.  I wanted to do what I thought was the "right" thing to do.  I thought to myself that maybe if I leaned on the Lord, he would heal my broken heart or change hers.  But here I find myself 10 years later unhappy, unsatisfied, full of resentment, anger and lacking any hope for the future.  

 

I've considered divorce several times, but I ask myself is the pain, anguish and heartache not only for myself, but also for my kids, my family, et. al. worth it?  I know that my parents/family would never understand.  There have been two divorces in my family of 50+ couples (among aunts/uncles, cousins - yea my mom is 5th of 9 kids).  Both times were caused by infidelity.  I want to go see my bishop, but am hesitant because he's a personal friend that I've known him and his wife since high school.  

Edited December 15, 2014 by Eowyn

[MrShorty]

Many times I feel like I'm asking her to change who she is.  Which doesn't seem like a fair thing for me to ask of her.  Often times when there is a discussion about wanting to change things about your spouse, the usual response is, "Well you knew how she was when you married her, so you need to accept that is who she is."  The difference is that we were both virgins when we got married.  We had discussed what our sexual relationship would be like before we were married, but we didn't really know how it would be until we were married.  For me, it didn't take long after we were married to realize there was a big problem.  I think it was just 2 months after we were married that I first brought up my concerns.  10 years later, we're still having the same conversations.

One thing Dr. Schnarch says a lot is that "marriage is a people growing machine." Yes, you are asking her to "change" and "grow" sexually. That is difficult, but it just might be an important part of what marriage is. On the flip side, she is also asking you to "change" and "grow" sexually. It often seems to me that the real skill is how to take two sexually different individuals and blend them together into "one flesh".

 

Sister Brotherson (in a podcast on her strengtheningmarriage.com website) talks about "awakening" versus "bridling" sexuality. The basic premise is that some of us (maybe you) need to work on "bridling" our sexuality, and others (like your wife) of us need to learn to "awaken" and develop our sexuality.

 

Try not to give up. It's a long and sometimes painful road, but this can be overcome.

[WhatDoIDo]

I really don't like using the term "bridling" when discussed in the context of marriage. For those who may be unfamiliar, the term is derived from Alma 38:12 where Alma gives advice to one of his more faithful sons, Shiblon.  Shiblon is advised to "bridle all your passions, that ye may be filled with love."  

 

Usually in gospel discussions, this is used as an instruction to young men and young women to "bridle" (or keep under control) their passions until they are married.  Youth will have sexual passions and desires as God-given traits, but need to learn to keep those passions under control until they can and should be used within the boundaries the Lord has set (aka. marriage).

 

The idea of "bridling" passion within marriage seems to imply that those passions are somehow wrong or sinful and thereby need to be controlled.  Is it wrong or sinful to want my wife to give me sexual pleasure?  Certainly not.  If there is anything I have taken away from Sis Brotherson's book is that those passions are from God and within the boundaries of marriage, can and should be used as an expression of love and oneness.  It is within marriage that those passions should be openly and freely expressed (i.e. "unbridled"), provided both partners agree and one partner isn't being (or feeling) cooerced, degraded, etc.