NeuroTypical

Youth suicide risk and mental health

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come back to me when there is an actual physical test that measures "chemical imbalances" and can scientifically tell me that xyz chemical is out of whack compared to the normal range of individuals.  Then I will say, yes in that case someone has something identifiable wrong.

This isn't hard, take any other medical illness, cancer, blood pressure, etc. and you can see plain as day on a chart your levels of XYZ (cholesterol, pressure, ABP, etc.) are at this level and it should be at that level. To regulate your body we are giving you this medicine.

(Starting new thread - not really the direction the original thread starter probably wanted to go here. :) )

I remember back when I was 10 years old.  My family took a trip to Yellowstone park.  I had been looking forward to it, because my plan was to jump into a geyser and kill myself.  (I forget the details of why I thought this would work so well.  I think my parents, trying to curb my curiosity to leave the trail to stick my finger in a hot spring, had overdone their warnings about what would happen if I did so, and I filled in the rest.)  

30 years of hindsight, here, but I still remember my little 10 year old thought processes.  I had nothing to live for, no friends, I figured I would always be a failure at things, what I've since learned is normal doubts and fears, ramped up for whatever reason to levels of despair other kids just don't have.  The truth was I had no reason to think that way.  There was no abuse, my parents both loved me, I was in good health.  Good enough in school.  Had friends, a bike, and a treehouse we turned into a spaceship.

I remember standing in front of the hot springs that I was convinced would flay me dead instantly.  Trying to work up the courage to run and jump.  I thought if I jumped far enough, I could hit the water all at once, and would die faster than if I jumped in feet first.  But apart from making little jerky movements towards the pool, I wasn't able to get over my fear of the pain and act.  This scene would repeat itself a few times over the next decade, with various methods in mind.  Eventually I changed/grew up/grew out of whatever, and stopped thinking along those lines, and everything just got better. This got glossed over, but yeah, no really, suicide is a leading cause of death in folks age 10-24 in the US.  So yeah, no really, it is a legitimate issue that we as a society must deal with, in the absence of firm medical science.  

Yeah, it would be real nice if an actual physical test that measures brain stuff could scientifically tell us that something is out of whack.  It sure the heck didn't exist then, and it doesn't exist now either.  But what we have learned, is to look for warning signs, and to understand.  We understand most kids don't have thoughts like that.  Most of those that do, don't go through with their plans.  But some do.  Like, around five thousand kids a year, give or take.  Another 160,000 kids per year make a serious enough attempt they end up in the ER needing medical treatment. 

The issue deserves a heck of a lot more than yjacket's lolling and mocking finger-pointing at an overzealous pharmaceutical industry and pill-happy doctors.  

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The problem I see... is that mental health issues can't be seen.

If someone breaks an arm... They go to a doctor they get an x-ray (which people can see) then they get a cast (which people can also see)...  Everyone (even those with no experience with broken bones) that they have serious issues and limitations...  You will not get serious comments about the person needing to "just get over it", "shake it off", or "Simply have faith."  But you will when it is a mental health issue, because everyone have been depressed, but very few have been suffering from "Depression" in the mental health sense. And there are huge differences between the two.

This problem with being able to "see" mental health issues also affects the medical field.  How can they fix something when they aren't sure what exactly is broken?  The best they can do is try to treat the symptoms while guessing at what the cause is.  When they can't be sure what the problem is and they need to do "something" and they have a hammer well they are going to try swinging that hammer.  And if it works well then they are all the more likely to try it again.  Not exactly the scientific method.  This leads to all kinds different "expert" opinions on how to treat things.  With everyone thinking that their way is best.  

You will not really get disagreements from professionals on how they should handle a broken bone.  But there are still lots of disagreements from professionals on how to handle issues of mental health

 

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You're braver than I. Right now I don't feel safe enough to chronicle the trouble I had most of my life, which only a couple of years ago (when I was so crushed with depression that I could barely function) led me to seek help. Say what you want about "Big pHarma", my life has changed. I'm  better mother, better wife, more productive person, I can deal with challenge and disappointment as well as anyone else, and oh... I'm not suicidal, so that's good. I actually have a feeling of well-being more days than not for the first time since I can remember. It sure beats a neverending sense of impending doom. I've also mostly eliminated my chronic migraines, which 'science' is now learning can come from severe seratonin deficiencies. Kind of like depression. It's nice that one medication has treated both so effectively.

 

It's an uncomfortable subject, especially when you're talking about children. People get really comfortable in their boxes of what they believe is and is not. Thinking about children dealing with such things is tough. People with strong authoritarian, tow-the-line, see-but-don't-hear-children dogma especially seem to balk against mental illness as a discipline and as diagnoses. But as has been said, ignorance (or denial) of facts doesn't make them untrue. 

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43 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

everything just got better

I'm glad of it. The world is a better place for it. 

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2 hours ago, estradling75 said:

The problem I see... is that mental health issues can't be seen.

 

I'd have to disagree. As someone studying psychology and human behavior, mental illnesses can easily be seen if you know what to look for. It's the general population that has a hard time "seeing" it. There are a lot of philosophical arguments about normal behavior vs. abnormal behavior, but if you take it from the standpoint of someone who has "healthy" behavior and compare them to someone suffering from a mental illness, you can see a stark difference. 

Can we treat it as easily as something tangible like a broken arm? No, because the symptoms vary from person to person and each treatment varies in outcome for each person. But that just means to me that we need more research, funding, and education on these mental illnesses so we can better understand them and therefore treat them. 

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22 minutes ago, BeccaKirstyn said:

I'd have to disagree. As someone studying psychology and human behavior, mental illnesses can easily be seen if you know what to look for. It's the general population that has a hard time "seeing" it. There are a lot of philosophical arguments about normal behavior vs. abnormal behavior, but if you take it from the standpoint of someone who has "healthy" behavior and compare them to someone suffering from a mental illness, you can see a stark difference. 

Can we treat it as easily as something tangible like a broken arm? No, because the symptoms vary from person to person and each treatment varies in outcome for each person. But that just means to me that we need more research, funding, and education on these mental illnesses so we can better understand them and therefore treat them. 

So where exactly do you disagree?  You say you disagree and then you reinforce my points...  It is not really visible to the general population.. and the people who can detect it need to be specially trained and then spend time interacting with the person before they can tell.  Thus there is a social problem around mental health issues

And then you say that the specialist need more research, funding and education on the mental illnesses so they can have better understanding and treating... which reinforces what I was saying about them not really knowing.

 

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21 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

So where exactly do you disagree?  You say you disagree and then you reinforce my points...  It is not really visible to the general population.. and the people who can detect it need to be specially trained and then spend time interacting with the person before they can tell.  Thus there is a social problem around mental health issues

And then you say that the specialist need more research, funding and education on the mental illnesses so they can have better understanding and treating... which reinforces what I was saying about them not really knowing.

 

That's why I said if you take the perspective of "healthy" behavior, or maybe even socially approved behavior, and compare it to someone who may seem "different", those in the general population may be able to see a difference. I think a lot of people are aware of individuals suffering from mental illness, but there's a stigma associated with it and people are afraid to bring it up or talk about it for fear of offending or not knowing what to say.

We have a much better understanding of disorders such as Major Depressive Disorder and Bipolar Disorder than we did just 10 years ago. I don't think we'll ever have a complete understanding of it because it's so individualized, but I wouldn't say that psychologists or psychiatrists don't know how to treat it or understand it. There's different therapeutic treatments because these disorders are so individualized. The brain is so complex and personable to each of us that expecting a treatment to work the same on everyone isn't plausible. Those suffering from PTSD find a lot of help in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, but there are some that don't react the same way and need different treatments to help relieve them of their symptoms. 

Funding, research and education will always help the field of psychology, especially as it's becoming more socially recognized as just as important as medical problems. 

I was just disagreeing that mental illnesses can't be "seen". I believe they can be. With the right viewpoint. 

Edited by BeccaKirstyn

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40 minutes ago, BeccaKirstyn said:

I was just disagreeing that mental illnesses can't be "seen". I believe they can be. With the right viewpoint. 

And if I ever claimed that even those with the right viewpoint could not see it you  then would be disagreeing... But I never said those with the right view point could not see it..  I pointed out that it was not obviously visible and even the experts are still trying to come to terms with how to handle it.  And if the experts are still working on it how can the non experts be expected to know and handle it?

 

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30 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

And if I ever claimed that even those with the right viewpoint could not see it you  then would be disagreeing... But I never said those with the right view point could not see it..  I pointed out that it was not obviously visible and even the experts are still trying to come to terms with how to handle it.  And if the experts are still working on it how can the non experts be expected to know and handle it?

 

Alright cool. So we can stop talking in circles and have verified what we both mean. 

Depends on how you define "handle it".

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5 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

 We understand most kids don't have thoughts like that.  

The issue deserves a heck of a lot more than yjacket's lolling and mocking finger-pointing at an overzealous pharmaceutical industry and pill-happy doctors.  

Not true; yeah I had suicidal thoughts growing up; I would sit in my room and thing about jumping out a window and how high I would have to get before killing myself.  Look, you can laugh at me; but I have studied the issue. Most people who have suicidal thoughts don't want to kill themselves, b/c the ones who do are successful. At some point in time, I can almost guarantee you every single person that has lived has at one point in time or another had suicidal thoughts. From time to time I still have crazy thoughts, "I should just smash this car into the median"

I've got history and facts on my side.  Yes, children today have more "mental health" issues than children 50 years ago, just like they have more behavioral issues, more issues with obedience, more issues of well just about all types of "mental illness behavior". Instead of treating children as you know like children, we treat them as these huge massive problems. Kids in general were more responsible, more mentally stable 50 years ago.  Human biology hasn't changed that fast.  What has changed . . .parenting and culture.

Neuro, you were 10 years old for pete's sake. Who knows why you had those thoughts-you have allowed those thoughts to take a very huge importance in your life. You yourself admit you grew up/changed/etc. That is part of growing up is realizing " When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things. "

It really is quite simple; I'm a father this happens with my children; I've done it both ways example.  Child A comes to me with huge load of drama, I sit there and get sucked into the drama, become part of the story, blah, blah, blah.  Child A then later comes with more drama. and more drama and more drama.  Or I've done it this way, Child A comes with drama,"well child I can certainly understand, if I was your age I would feel the same, however you need to fix your problem". In the first scenario, I become part of solving the child's problem and not only that but I attach way more attention to the problem then it really needs to be. Children take cues from adults, if an adult makes a big fuss over something, they will take the cue that a big fuss should be made over it and consequently they will subsequently make a big fuss over xyz. If an adult does not make a big deal of it-empathizes and then throws the problem back on the child, the child develops self-reliance and hardiness.

What our forefathers knew, we have forgotten.  Thoughts and feelings don't matter nearly as much as actions. We are a drama centered cultured, everyone has become a little look-at-me drama soap story, you see it on facebook, on tv, everywhere.  

Here is a dirty secret, everyone has problems, that is what the Atonement and God is for. We have replaced God with psychologists and men in white jackets.

There is a role for counseling, counseling has been done for 1000s of years, one doesn't need a fancy title or a 4 year degree to give good guidance and counsel.  In fact, I'd rather receive counsel from my father vs. a PhD. I'd rather receive good counsel on how to be a father from someone who has successful raised children, I'd rather receive counsel from someone who has been married for 40 years to the same person than see a marriage counselor.

There are cases that do require some sort of medication; however the vast majority of cases simply end up being the individual has to figure out how to fix themselves.  Once the individual learns how to take responsibility for their own life and fixes themselves then the "mental illness" goes away.

And yes, I do know what I'm talking about, having been married to someone who qualify for a Bipolar Type II; I've seen what works and what doesn't work. No drugs and pretty healthy today.  I've known someone else who was certified crazy-spent time in a actual institution.  She simply says, "I decided not to be crazy".

The power of the human mind to make the choice of how we act pales in comparison to what we actually think we know about it.

Edited by yjacket

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In general, it seems that children are not allowed to accomplish much in their lives. This lack of accomplishment gives them no reason to be proud of themselves (there's nothing to be proud of), and so, understandably, they think they are worth little or nothing.

We have taken work away from them. We have taken chores away from them. They get a pet, Mom takes care of it. They have no need to study because everyone gets an "A". They compete, and everyone gets a trophy. The value a person sees himself as having arises from solid accomplishments, and we don't allow them to try. Or, trying, they are not allowed to fail.

Of all of God's gifts to us, I believe the right to fail is among the most important. Because unless we fail, no success has any meaning.

A wise man once told me that "Anything worth doing, is worth doing poorly." Why? Because the first time anyone does anything, he'll do it poorly, because, if it's worth doing at all, the person must fail at it, once, twice, a dozen times, but he must fail before he succeeds.

Children are not allowed to try most things, but when they can try, they are not allowed to pay the price of failure, and so, are denied the power to succeed. Without successes, there is no value in his life, so he is not important.

If we see fragile children, it's because their parents and their teachers and their leaders and their peers have taken away the opportunities to fail, and to build success, and to be valuable.

Gypsy children don't get violin lessons. They get small violins. Then, they copy what daddy does, and they do it badly. They do it badly the first time, the second time, the forty-fourth time. Then, miraculously, they become violinists on the two-hundred, eighty-seventh attempt. No one laughs at the the first try, nor the eighty-first, nor the two hundred first. But, more importantly, no one says, "Wow, Honey, that was great!" on the first time, or the two hundred first, either.

David Farragut, the first admiral in the USmerican Navy, commanded a warship when he was 13 years old. But he had learned the principles of the sea, of command, of being a man from a captain who, when his cabin boy failed to bring them because he'd seen a headless sailor on the ladder, simply asked, "If you're not hurt, where are the igniters I sent you for?"

Children are far more resilient than we give them credit for being. But they, like all of us, need challenges in their lives, and those challenges are sadly lacking in modern USmerica.

Lehi

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Personally, I have found much truth and help in psychology. I don't use meds; my condition is not caused by a physical problem. Therapy has helped me inmeasureably. No its not something a friend could have done. 

My therapists (two), I suspect have both been atheist. I'm not sure because I never asked them. But they have both been supportI've of my religious beliefs. In my experience psychology does not replace religion, if anything I would say my therapy has enhanced my spiritual life. 

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You guys wanted to kill yourselves.... I wanted to kill somebody.  My sister, in fact.  Threw a knife at her even.

Yes, mental health is part of general physiological ailment.  And yes, it can be alleviated by healthy lifestyle choices including proper nutrition.  Chemicals are released by the brain in response to stimuli.  Sometimes, the body's chemical release system misfires or is just broken so it releases the wrong chems or it releases an unbalanced amount.  This is the same concept as allergies.  The body releases histamines in response to stimuli when it is not supposed to.

The problem with the medical community in the US is that they go into focused specialties and forgets the whole.  So that solutions to physiological problems are targeted for specific ailments without much regard to its effect as a whole.  It's very reactionary so much so that mental health treatment gives this chem for that which caused a side effect here, so they give chems for that which caused another problem there until you end up with a chemical cocktail that causes more problems than it solves.

The medical community, including sociological healing, needs to step back and look at a person as a whole instead of a sum of parts.  Mental health can be better managed if it is approached as a teamwork of solutions that brings together nutrition, physical activity, mental exercises, discipline, faith healing, and chems as necessary.  It also helps if the community broadens its understanding of what is normal for a person and only tries to effect change if that normal is not pleasing to God.  For example, there's nothing wrong with an autistic person going to school with his shirt on backwards.  It does not bring him farther from Christ,

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14 hours ago, Eowyn said:

You're braver than I. Right now I don't feel safe enough to chronicle the trouble I had most of my life, which only a couple of years ago (when I was so crushed with depression that I could barely function) led me to seek help. Say what you want about "Big pHarma", my life has changed. I'm  better mother, better wife, more productive person, I can deal with challenge and disappointment as well as anyone else, and oh... I'm not suicidal, so that's good. I actually have a feeling of well-being more days than not for the first time since I can remember. It sure beats a neverending sense of impending doom. I've also mostly eliminated my chronic migraines, which 'science' is now learning can come from severe seratonin deficiencies. Kind of like depression. It's nice that one medication has treated both so effectively.

 

It's an uncomfortable subject, especially when you're talking about children. People get really comfortable in their boxes of what they believe is and is not. Thinking about children dealing with such things is tough. People with strong authoritarian, tow-the-line, see-but-don't-hear-children dogma especially seem to balk against mental illness as a discipline and as diagnoses. But as has been said, ignorance (or denial) of facts doesn't make them untrue. 

We love you! Hang in there!

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11 hours ago, LeSellers said:

In general, it seems that children are not allowed to accomplish much in their lives. This lack of accomplishment gives them no reason to be proud of themselves (there's nothing to be proud of), and so, understandably, they think they are worth little or nothing.

We have taken work away from them. We have taken chores away from them. They get a pet, Mom takes care of it. They have no need to study because everyone gets an "A". They compete, and everyone gets a trophy. The value a person sees himself as having arises from solid accomplishments, and we don't allow them to try. Or, trying, they are not allowed to fail.

Of all of God's gifts to us, I believe the right to fail is among the most important. Because unless we fail, no success has any meaning.

A wise man once told me that "Anything worth doing, is worth doing poorly." Why? Because the first time anyone does anything, he'll do it poorly, because, if it's worth doing at all, the person must fail at it, once, twice, a dozen times, but he must fail before he succeeds.

Children are not allowed to try most things, but when they can try, they are not allowed to pay the price of failure, and so, are denied the power to succeed. Without successes, there is no value in his life, so he is not important.

If we see fragile children, it's because their parents and their teachers and their leaders and their peers have taken away the opportunities to fail, and to build success, and to be valuable.

Gypsy children don't get violin lessons. They get small violins. Then, they copy what daddy does, and they do it badly. They do it badly the first time, the second time, the forty-fourth time. Then, miraculously, they become violinists on the two-hundred, eighty-seventh attempt. No one laughs at the the first try, nor the eighty-first, nor the two hundred first. But, more importantly, no one says, "Wow, Honey, that was great!" on the first time, or the two hundred first, either.

David Farragut, the first admiral in the USmerican Navy, commanded a warship when he was 13 years old. But he had learned the principles of the sea, of command, of being a man from a captain who, when his cabin boy failed to bring them because he'd seen a headless sailor on the ladder, simply asked, "If you're not hurt, where are the igniters I sent you for?"

Children are far more resilient than we give them credit for being. But they, like all of us, need challenges in their lives, and those challenges are sadly lacking in modern USmerica.

Lehi

I agree mostly with this.

In addition though... a lot of times parents say, I can beat that crap out of them.  Kinda like that the kid who just can't play the violin has to because that's just what we do.  We play the violin.  Now, there are times when the kid really has to.  But there are times when... meh, you be you.

My conversation with my son a month or so ago is a good example of this.  My son has been battling a back problem for weeks and so I told him he'll have to stop jiujitsu until we figure it all out.  Then one day, on the way to the doctor he tells me... Mom, what if I have cancer?  I was a little taken aback by the question and realized he was serious.  So I answered it seriously, "Well, if you have cancer then we'll take you to an oncologist and see what we can do about it.".  And he says, "Well, at least I won't have to go to school anymore.".  And I tell him, "Nope.  You're going to school.  You're going to seminary.  Nothing much will change except we'll have to adjust your schedule around your chemo.".  And my son replied, "That's right.  Never give up.  Never surrender."

This would be the same for mental health issues.  A lot of times, parents think - I'll beat it out of him.  And on the other end, a lot of times, parents think... Oh, my kid has depression, he doesn't have to go to school because he'll be depressed... or whatever.

 

 

Edited by anatess2

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12 hours ago, BeccaKirstyn said:

Alright cool. So we can stop talking in circles and have verified what we both mean. 

Depends on how you define "handle it".

Ok... Lets go back to the broken bone comparison...   If you break a bone.. you can go to just about any medical doctor for a correct diagnoses... Depending on that doctors training they may or may not refer you to someone with more expertise (Not all doctors handle all issues).  But the medical community has a clear understanding of how to treat a broken bone and that treatment is pretty standardized.  So you come out of the doctors office with a cast.  And those non-medical people see the cast and they understand that the person has some serious limits to their activity, and that it is not all in their head, its not something they can just tough out, and it not a case of lacking faith.

Then you get to mental health issues... some the issues the medical community has better understanding then others but all the issues (per you own statement) can benefit from more understanding (which would come from research).  Unlike with a broken bone the medical communities understanding of how to treat a broken mind is still a work in progress.  So you go to a doctor for help and they are going to use all of their training and experiences to try to help. They are going to have to spend some time talking you, listening to what you are saying, observing how you are acting, and determining what it is that you have.  This diagnoses is not as easy as the one for the broken bone (and depending on the mental illness might not be accurate or uncontested).  But after the diagnoses then you need treatment.  A doctor who has had good success with drugs is going to be inclined to go that route.  A doctor who has had good success with therapy is going to be inclined to go that route.  Then you start treatment... maybe it works maybe it does not.  Maybe some tweaking or adjustments are in order.  That is not very standardized

And of course once under treatment no one can visibly see that you are under a doctors care and how you are limited.  You can try to tell them of course and they are are going to respond as they think is the most helpful.  But the non medical community is (understandably) even more clueless then the medical community. They might think that their brushes with some issues (like depression or suicidal thoughts) are the on the same level and give you the advice they found most helpful for them.  Of course this is less then helpful... especially if you are the type of person who gives weight to the opinions of people who lack understanding.  People who would never say to a person with an arm in a cast "Oh its all in your head", or "you just need to choose to be different" as a way of getting better... Could very well do so while trying to help someone with mental illness because they think they know more then they really do about what is going on in your head.

 

 

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This got glossed over, but yeah, no really, suicide is a leading cause of death in folks age 10-24 in the US.  
...
We understand most kids don't have thoughts like that.  Most of those that do, don't go through with their plans.  But some do.  Like, around five thousand kids a year, give or take.  Another 160,000 kids per year make a serious enough attempt they end up in the ER needing medical treatment.

yjacket, I just want to make sure I understand what you are advocating on how to address this issue.  

Should you become aware of a child having suicidal impulses/thoughts/feelings/actions, you suggest the following: 

- "If an adult does not make a big deal of it-empathizes and then throws the problem back on the child, the child develops self-reliance and hardiness."

- Focus on the Atonement 

- There is a role for counseling, and you suggest a suicidal kid is better served receiving counsel from someone who raised kids who didn't kill themselves, rather than someone educated in everything humans know about kids who kill themselves.

- There is a role for medication, a tiny fraction of the current role meds play in our society.

- You know someone who learned how to deal with their Bipolar Type II issues, and you figure "I decided not to be crazy" is something that would work for lots and lots of people suffering from mental illness.

yjacket, am I basically understanding what you're saying here?

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12 hours ago, LeSellers said:

In general, it seems that children are not allowed to accomplish much in their lives. This lack of accomplishment gives them no reason to be proud of themselves (there's nothing to be proud of), and so, understandably, they think they are worth little or nothing.

We have taken work away from them. We have taken chores away from them. They get a pet, Mom takes care of it. They have no need to study because everyone gets an "A". They compete, and everyone gets a trophy. The value a person sees himself as having arises from solid accomplishments, and we don't allow them to try. Or, trying, they are not allowed to fail.

Of all of God's gifts to us, I believe the right to fail is among the most important. Because unless we fail, no success has any meaning.

A wise man once told me that "Anything worth doing, is worth doing poorly." Why? Because the first time anyone does anything, he'll do it poorly, because, if it's worth doing at all, the person must fail at it, once, twice, a dozen times, but he must fail before he succeeds.

Children are not allowed to try most things, but when they can try, they are not allowed to pay the price of failure, and so, are denied the power to succeed. Without successes, there is no value in his life, so he is not important.

If we see fragile children, it's because their parents and their teachers and their leaders and their peers have taken away the opportunities to fail, and to build success, and to be valuable.

Gypsy children don't get violin lessons. They get small violins. Then, they copy what daddy does, and they do it badly. They do it badly the first time, the second time, the forty-fourth time. Then, miraculously, they become violinists on the two-hundred, eighty-seventh attempt. No one laughs at the the first try, nor the eighty-first, nor the two hundred first. But, more importantly, no one says, "Wow, Honey, that was great!" on the first time, or the two hundred first, either.

David Farragut, the first admiral in the USmerican Navy, commanded a warship when he was 13 years old. But he had learned the principles of the sea, of command, of being a man from a captain who, when his cabin boy failed to bring them because he'd seen a headless sailor on the ladder, simply asked, "If you're not hurt, where are the igniters I sent you for?"

Children are far more resilient than we give them credit for being. But they, like all of us, need challenges in their lives, and those challenges are sadly lacking in modern USmerica.

Lehi

I really like what you said here. Reminds me of this great article I've read recently. 

 

Here is a quote

Quote

Mental toughness is what allows a person to keep going despite everything going wrong. People with mental toughness are the ones who come out on top. They battle through job losses, difficult relationships, illness and failure. It is a quality born from adversity. Adversity is a GOOD thing. It teaches you what you’re made of. It puts into practice the old saying “what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.” It’s life’s teacher.

The article is a great read but will warn you it does have some mild language. Are Today’s Parents Getting a Raw Deal?

 

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13 hours ago, LeSellers said:

Gypsy children don't get violin lessons. They get small violins. Then, they copy what daddy does, and they do it badly. They do it badly the first time, the second time, the forty-fourth time. Then, miraculously, they become violinists on the two-hundred, eighty-seventh attempt. No one laughs at the the first try, nor the eighty-first, nor the two hundred first. But, more importantly, no one says, "Wow, Honey, that was great!" on the first time, or the two hundred first, either.

As a side note, I also blame the "everybody gets a trophy" mentality for the existence of 99% of "praise band" music.  When mommy kept telling little Johnny how wonderful his lyrics were instead of suggesting that there might be something else that he would actually be good at, he got the idea that repeating the same line 6,897 times and calling it a song was OK.

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11 minutes ago, Windseeker said:

I really like what you said here. Reminds me of this great article I've read recently. 

 

Here is a quote

The article is a great read but will warn you it does have some mild language. Are Today’s Parents Getting a Raw Deal?

 

On mental toughness:

Just like physical toughness, mental toughness also has to account for mental health.  An asthmatic, for example, can be taught and trained and disciplined to be physically tough.  But, it doesn't change the fact that he will have to fight through the elephant sitting on his chest and have to be cognizant of his limitations.

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11 minutes ago, NightSG said:

As a side note, I also blame the "everybody gets a trophy" mentality for the existence of 99% of "praise band" music.  When mommy kept telling little Johnny how wonderful his lyrics were instead of suggesting that there might be something else that he would actually be good at, he got the idea that repeating the same line 6,897 times and calling it a song was OK.

While this is a contributor of the decline of today's society, this really has nothing to do with Mental Illness.

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