mt_mck7

How do I get my point across to her that our friendship can't go on if she's doing these things and making it harder for me to spiritually grow?

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I have had this "friend" for the past few years of high school. This friendship didn't actually start until I was a Sophomore. During my Freshman year, this girl who was in the grade above me would immediately go to me once she entered the high school before school started. I would be there earlier because of seminary (seminary is a class that is completely optional, but highly encouraged for high schoolers. Seminary is held as early as 5:30 and as late as 6:15). She and I kind of talked during my Freshman year, but we didn't really do anything. I did go to her house maybe once or twice before a big football game. Sophomore year, I could feel like she was trying to really use me. I felt like her slave in a way. I got my license Sophomore year after March, and she was constantly trying to take MY car out to lunch (my school let's us take our cars out to lunch, but the Sophomores can't take our cars. It's something that only the upperclassmen can do). Her excuse was that she had to get paint for a retirement home that the service club needed, and I found out that she was actually getting just lunch after the 2nd or 3rd time that she went out. My dad eventually found out because he was putting my next year's enrollment into my car, but my car wasn't there, so after freaking out thinking that he'd take away my license, I told my dad about it, and he told me simply to not lend my car out to other people. 

Junior year, I was truly her slave. I constantly with her whenever there was a break, and whenever lunch was. In September, she broke her left calf playing softball, so she had to ride on a scooter the entire time, and I ended up being the one to get doors for her, and carry her bags for her (sometimes). She was also in the fall school musical, and she'd been working on it during the summer. Our drama teacher who is in charge of the musical productions at my school kicked her out of the musical (and she's not even looking into music after high school! She wants to go into criminal investigation) and she started crying like someone broke her other leg. I can see why our drama teacher kicked her out though- the past musicals she's auditioned for, she either dropped out because she didn't get the role she wanted, or because she said empty threats of dropping out, but she just sucked it up and stayed in her small part. Towards the end of this past school year, she started to try and tell me the "phrases that guys use and what they mean" as a way to keep me protected. while she's in college. I kindly told her I don't want to know about that kind of stuff because I'm a Mormon and I always will be a Mormon, but she was insistent. 

Whenever she drove in my car, she always took the aux cord and played the dirtiest music on her playlist with the windows rolled down, and everytime, I was about to say "I have a BYU sticker on the back of my car right now, and I probably look like a hypocrite to other people who know what BYU means" but i didn't say it. When I was going to go to Prom, I told her I might not go because the guy I was going to take went to Jerusalem to see his older sister who is studying abroad there, and she started freaking out and said "Come for the pictures!" I ended up taking a Sophomore girl since the Sophomores aren't able to go by themselves and they need an upperclassmen to ask them in order to go, but I would not have gone if it weren't for my "friend" constantly pushing me about it. And when I told her that my guy was in Jerusalem, so I didn't want to go, she exploded pretty much saying "You need to date other guys" "You can't have your heart set on one guy", and when I told her that I'm only dating LDS guys, she didn't agree with that. She said all of this 5 minutes before Chorus started (we're both in chorus) and I started bawling, so she and I stepped out and she had to explain herself a little more. 

Currently, she just got back from a 3 month cruise, and she's going back to me again, and talking to me again. I really don't want to hang out with her anymore because she's not helping me grow at all, and I actually felt better when she wasn't with me. I've been able to grow stronger, and stand a little taller without her, and I know that the friendship between her and I can't continue under these circumstances. She needs to accept the fact that I'm a Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, and there are certain rules and standards that I want to live by. How do I get my point across to her that our friendship can't go on if she's doing these kind of things?

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12 minutes ago, Backroads said:

You may have to fund ways to make yourself legitimatemy unavailable to her.

Just telling her that the "friendship" is over ought to be enough to end it. There should be no need to make herself "legitimately" unavailable. She just won't see her anymore, and that is that.

Lehi

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For starters, I'd like to congratulate you on standing up for yourself realizing what is and is not good for you.  There are many red flags about this "friendship" and it is not okay.

What you're going to have to do is tell her "no" and keep telling her "no".  I'm guessing that she's not used to hearing that, and will beg/threaten/apologize over and over again until she's can keep using you as a door mat again.  Be prepared for that, and keep telling her "no".  If she's unwilling to treat you as the Daughter of God that you ARE then she is no friend.

 

(Also-- it is illegal for her to drive your car, because she is not specifically (aka by name) covered under your insurance.   If she gets pulled over or in an accident it'll be a nightmare for the both of you).  

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2 hours ago, LeSellers said:

Just telling her that the "friendship" is over ought to be enough to end it. There should be no need to make herself "legitimately" unavailable. She just won't see her anymore, and that is that.

Lehi

True.

But I worry the OP may have trouble being so blunt.

With such vampires, one often needs to build up a separate and stronger life as not to fall back into such a friendship.

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You don't need her.  Make your boundaries clear to her and make it clear that if she wants to continue the friendship she has to respect those boundaries.  If she doesn't want to do that, or says she will but keeps violating them, you end it.  If you dont' do that, then she won't take your standards seriously or respect them.

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19 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

it is illegal for her to drive your car, because she is not specifically (aka by name) covered under your insurance.

I doubt it's illegal. Any crash is going to be a problem, irrespective of who's driving, but untangling the fault is the least of the issues. Notice (at least in Utah, Colorado, and California) that it's the car, not the driver, that's insured.

If she took the car under false pretenses (as seems to be the case here), there might be a case for fraud, etc.

I'm not a lawyer, I'm not your (or her) lawyer. Don't take my advice on this (or any legal matter) too seriously. Seek legal competent counsel before acting on anything, since you have probably already committed three felonies today. This disclaimer is required because the government thinks you too stupid to know all this beforehand. That, and my own lawyers want to protect me from all the others out there.

Lehi

Edited by LeSellers

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28 minutes ago, LeSellers said:

Notice (at least in Utah, Colorado, and California) that it's the car, not the driver, that's insured.

The law is a bit gray on this issue.  If it is known that she is a "regular driver" for this car, then it is illegal.  If she is an "incidental" driver for that car, it is legal.  Proving either in a court is difficult.

@mt_mck7,

This may be the gateway for you to start asserting yourself.

MT: I'm sorry, I can't let you drive my car anymore.  I found out it's illegal since you're not insured on it.
Vampire: What?  Well, can't you put me on your policy?
MT: I can't afford that.
V: Sure you can (blah blah).
MT: No, I really can't.
V: Well, then just tell people I was just borrowing it.
MT: Yes, but that only goes so far.  And you've been using it a LOT.
V: So just tell anyone that it was my first time borrowing it.
MT: But it isn't.
V: You can still tell people that.
MT: So, you want me to lie for you?
V: Sure, I'm your friend, right?
MT: I thought you were until you started asking me to lie for you.  Friends don't do that :mad: ! (be sure to do the frown and furrowed brow with the exclamation).  

You may even further emphasize the point by walking away at this point -- and don't turn back if she calls to you.

Edited by Guest

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2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

The law is a bit gray on this issue.  If it is known that she is a "regular driver" for this car, then it is illegal.  If she is an "incidental" driver for that car, it is legal.  Proving either in a court is difficult.

@mt_mck7,

This may be the gateway for you to start asserting yourself.

MT: I'm sorry, I can't let you drive my car anymore.  I found out it's illegal since you're not insured on it.
Vampire: What?  Well, can't you put me on your policy?
MT: I can't afford that.
V: Sure you can (blah blah).
MT: No, I really can't.
V: Well, then just tell people I was just borrowing it.
MT: Yes, but that only goes so far.  And you've been using it a LOT.
V: So just tell anyone that it was my first time borrowing it.
MT: But it isn't.
V: You can still tell people that.
MT: So, you want me to lie for you?
V: Sure, I'm your friend, right?
MT: I thought you were until you started asking me to lie for you.  Friends don't do that :mad: ! (be sure to do the frown and furrowed brow with the exclamation).  

You may even further emphasize the point by walking away at this point -- and don't turn back if she calls to you.

I no longer let her borrow my car. It was only during Sophomore year, but once I found out she wasn't using it to get paint anymore, I put a stop to her borrowing my car. 

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Guest

Learn to boot people like that out of your life now. People like us tend to be a magnet for them. I wish I'd learned a lot sooner than I did.

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27 minutes ago, Eowyn said:

Learn to boot people like that out of your life now. People like us tend to be a magnet for them. I wish I'd learned a lot sooner than I did.

Eowyn-like most life lessons it truly is better to learn them "late" then never. Don't beat yourself up for it! 

 

Lifelong LDS do tend to be more forgiving and more tolerant than non-LDS. It's a good thing, don't get me wrong-but you don't need to be a doormat either. 

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23 hours ago, Carborendum said:

Stop being a door mat.

^^^This.

You need to establish boundaries. If she can respect these boundaries (spoiler alert: she won't at first), then your friendship can continue, though you should stay vigilant in case she falls back into her old behavior. She may try to push the boundaries from time to time. Stand up for yourself and make it clear what you will and will not tolerate.

It's also possible (and more likely, unfortunately) that she'll never be okay with your boundaries. This could end one of two ways: 1) She'll move on from you and latch on to someone else, or 2) You'll have to move on from her. This won't be easy. You have to stay strong and stay consistent. Put the word "no" firmly in your vocabulary. Ignore her completely if you have to. Chances are that she'll eventually cast you aside, which will be to your benefit. It may feel like you lost a friend, but how much of a friend was she to begin with if she couldn't respect you or your decisions? 

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This might sound like a slightly Machiavellian approach, so I don’t feel wholly comfortable with it, but I offer it here in the hope that it might be helpful.

I suggest you take the offensive – start asking things of her instead of her always asking stuff from you. Specifically, I suggest that you invite her to church. I suspect she will refuse. This refusal then becomes the basis for the termination of the “friendship.” You could explain to her how important church is to you and how your character/values/identity have all been significantly influenced by your beliefs and church membership and that because your church membership means so much to you, and is such an important part of your life, you would like her to have the opportunity to experience the blessings of church membership. If she is not interested in a) learning more about what has made you the person that you are, a person who she claims to like and be friends with, and b) exposing herself to an opportunity that could help to strengthen her moral values and character, then I think you can use her refusal as a legitimate reason to terminate the relationship. If she’s not interested in learning more about why you are who you are, then her interest in you seems to be somewhat shallow, and her refusal to come to church should be a clear demonstration of how shallow her interest is, both  to you, and to herself.

Of course, if she does come to church, and comes on a regular basis, that provides a great opportunity for you and her to start helping her shift her values, priorities and behaviours more towards those that you would feel more comfortable with.

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I would end the bad friendship and move on. The most positively assertive approach would be to directly tell her you are ending the friendship and spell out why. Maybe she would even learn something that way. At the minimum, ignore her and always say you are busy. You are not obligated to give her any time or anything else.

Why put up with friends who are not actually friends?

What you have described is a bad, inproductive relationship:

On 7/5/2016 at 10:36 AM, mt_mck7 said:

I really don't want to hang out with her anymore because she's not helping me grow at all, and I actually felt better when she wasn't with me. I've been able to grow stronger, and stand a little taller without her

 

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Okay, this is a personality type mismatch.  You are both still learning your place in the world.  Still growing up.  But you are in a situation where you have a very strong personality interacting with a very mild personality.  The natural direction this relationship is going to go (if untamed) is that the strong personality will roll over the mild one until the mild one reaches a breaking point and either, breaks or pushes back.

I'm of a strong personality myself but I had parents who beat my butt - literally - to discipline me so I was able to mostly behave appropriately in public as I was growing up.

My sister is a mild personality and she was the baby in the family so she was "delicately handled" and so she never learned to assert herself so until today, when we discuss family issues and I want it solved one way and she wants it solved the other way, we would do it my way because she wouldn't say anything!  I would just find out that she did not like what we were doing because I would hear about it from someone about how she's crying or something... it gets so frustrating trying to figure out if what I want is okay with her.  And we've talked about it some and she said she doesn't want to say anything because she's afraid I would question her or challenge her about what she thinks is the right way and she hates my confrontational personality.

Anyway, when you have this kind of mismatch, BOTH of you need to realize you have to strike a balance.  Unfortunately, you can't control what somebody else does, you can only control yourself.  So, you will need to learn to be more assertive so you can check her impulses and provide the balance.  You can't just "suffer in silence" because she won't know she's stepped beyond her boundaries.  Anytime you start to feel uncomfortable practice saying this line, "I'm sorry, I'm uncomfortable with that.".  Say it with a smile.  When she starts to argue or push, "Listen politely (she might have a point), then if you're still not comfortable with it then repeat yourself - I'm sorry, I'm uncomfortable with that."  If you can offer an alternate activity that you're comfortable with then offer that as a negotiation.  But be firm about standing on a plain where you're comfortable.  Then she will learn where her boundaries are and you both can decide whether you can still be friends with the boundaries you set for yourselves.

You won't really know if you have any influence on a person until you try.

So, say you're driving and she controls the music and puts garbage on... turn it off and say, I'm not comfortable with that.  If she insists, stop the car on the side of the road, and say it again, I'm not comfortable with that.  Then offer to play something that you think she might like that is not garbage.  You're driving.  You have control of this situation as it is your car.  If you're not comfortable, nobody is going anywhere... so, next time she rides in your car, she'll know not to play garbage.

If you're riding in her car, you're not in a strong position of control.  It's her car.  But, you can still exert some control by telling her that you really don't like that garbage as it is against your personal convictions.  If you both value your friendship, you'll try to find some music you both can enjoy, or if you're just too different in this regard, then you can agree to turn off the radio and you can just talk.  If her strong personality has to insist on her music as it is her car, then you know to just take your car next time.

Hope this helps.

Edited by anatess2

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@askandanswer

You should never make someone's lack of interest in the Church the reason to terminate a relationship.  IMHO, the OP has plenty of good reasons without even bringing the Church into it.

 

My thoughts to the OP:

Tell her that it upsets you that she doesn't support you in your beliefs/standards.  Tell her that there have been many instances where you have felt used by her.  Then let her know that you refuse to hang out with her anymore.  Period.

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There are times that we have to remove ourselves from people who are unhealthy for us, are negative influences, or treat us bad. That does not make YOU a bad person, it makes you someone who recognizes the need for self love and protection. Something you will learn with time, is that some people just can be selfish and not have the desire to change. There is only so much you can do, and so many times you can give someone another chance. If they do not change, then it is on your end to make the change that will end being hurt and used. That means you have to say goodbye. Try not to worry about being nice about it. Just be direct. "You have hurt me many times, and I have given you opportunities to improve, but nothing has changed. I cannot be treated like this anymore. I feel it is in our best interests to no longer be friends. I wish you well. "     Sometimes you just have to be direct to avoid them thinking it is a bluff, or looking for ways to wiggle back in.

Edited by GratefulHeart

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