Is this ok?

[azaware]

I believe that a person shouldn't gamble for all the above reasons. I believe the reason is that people they get hooked and in the end will lose. But if a person had a gift to win and was able to make a good living at it. Could this be treated as a job and ok as Mormons?

[Jamie123]

LOL - the following quote from Roald Dahl springs to mind: This proves that gambling's not a sin, provided that you always win!

I've no idea what the Mormon take would be, but (assuming that you're talking about gambling with cards etc.) my gut feeling is that it would be uncharitable - since the only way you can win is by causing the other person to lose - possibly money he or she can't afford.

On the subject of Mormons and gambling, I read a story some years ago about a group of BYU students who were caught gambling at Las Vegas, and accused of breaching the university's honor code. They were all acquitted on the grounds that there was no written rule forbidding gambling off-campus - though they were given a stern lecture on the possible dangers of it.

[WillowTheWhisp]

A gift to win? I don't believe there is such a thing.

[Jamie123]

A gift to win? I don't believe there is such a thing.

There are good gamblers and bad gamblers. A good gambler knows which risks to take, and how much to gamble. The ability to do this quickly and instinctively could be considered a "gift" of sorts - though I think it could probably be put to better use than to win money in card games. A talented gambler might, for example, become a good insurance actuary. Edited April 7, 2009 by Jamie123

[Gwen]

if one is really that "gifted" at winning they could invest in the stocks. i hear it's a great time to buy.

[Hemidakota]

Not really...buying into speculation as with energy stocks, it is not over 'until the market collapses."

[Hemidakota]

I believe that a person shouldn't gamble for all the above reasons. I believe the reason is that people they get hooked and in the end will lose. But if a person had a gift to win and was able to make a good living at it. Could this be treated as a job and ok as Mormons?

What did the prophets tell us?

[Churchmouse]

The Church stance isn't that it's ok to gamble if you win. Winning or losing has

nothing to do with it. We are told by our leaders that we should not play games of chance. Either we follow their council or we don't. Those that don't usually find themselves in trouble.

This council also includes state lotteries. These are nothing more than a user tax that falls most heavily on the poor. I worry about states that depend on gambling when drawing up their budget.

[NeuroTypical]

A quote from the Gospel Principles manual:

God condemns receiving gain from evil and idle pursuits. Elder Spencer W. Kimball said, “I feel strongly that men who accept wages or salary and do not give … [fair] time, energy, devotion, and service are receiving money that is not clean.” He also said that money obtained by evil or idle practices, such as theft, gambling (including lotteries), graft, illegal drugs, oppression of the poor, and the like is unclean money.

Elder Kimball defined the difference between honorable work and evil work: “Clean money is that [pay] received for a full day’s honest work. It is that reasonable pay for faithful service. It is that fair profit from the sale of goods, commodities, or service. It is that income received from transactions where all parties profit. Filthy lucre is … money … obtained through theft and robbery, … gambling, … sinful operations, … bribery, and from exploitation” (in Conference Report, Oct. 1953, p. 52).

LM

[Lbybug]

i've always been taught "if you have to ask if it's ok, then it probably isn't."

[Traveler]

I believe that a person shouldn't gamble for all the above reasons. I believe the reason is that people they get hooked and in the end will lose. But if a person had a gift to win and was able to make a good living at it. Could this be treated as a job and ok as Mormons?

One of my concerns about our society is the love and admiration of money. There are many and varied ways to obtain money. There are ways to obtain money that do not benefit anyone but the one that takes the money. It is my personal conviction that those that take money without providing a good or service of benefit are a blight on society.

I believe entertainment is a benefit on society but of a low quality. Personally, I feel that professional entertainers, including sport figures, news commentators and several politicians or of such little value that I wonder if we would be better off without their participation in society. As for a successful and affluent gambler? I am inclined to think that most people that “deal” with them will be much better off without them.

The Traveler

[Wingnut]

i've always been taught "if you have to ask if it's ok, then it probably isn't."

My mom always said that. "If you have to ask, you already know the answer." With regards to menus and clothes (and sometimes not being able to find prices), she also said, "If you have to ask how much, it's too expensive."

[Dravin]

This council also includes state lotteries. These are nothing more than a user tax that falls most heavily on the poor.

My favorite description of lotteries? A tax on those who are bad at math.

[prospectmom]

I think the STOCK MARKET is the biggest form of gambling we have..... and the worst

[skippy740]

I think the STOCK MARKET is the biggest form of gambling we have..... and the worst

May I respectfully disagree with you?

Both have similar attributes. The "thrill" of "betting" to get a "win". In my mind, that would be equivalent of investing in penny stocks.

However, PROPER stock market investing involves a lot of research into the workings of that particular company.

THEN, you need to determine how this new holding will fit & correlate with your other holdings.

To do a proper portfolio of individual stocks, one must have a MINIMUM of 2 dozen stocks properly balanced among at least 5 asset classes & sectors.

(Of course, this assumes that the market is efficient in generating returns and that all material facts about each company is shared prior to making the investment. Over the past few years, we've learned that this simply isn't so. But that doesn't mean that there isn't a place for stocks SOMEWHERE in your financial portfolio.)

[prospectmom]

Ok take example our 401k .. we invested over 900 dollars to it last year.... beacuse of a loss in stock values we ended up wit 785 dollars to me that is worse than putting it in a low interest savings account and since it is obvious we aren't affluent we can not afford to gamble with our money

[beck61]

You can't win a gift.

A gift is given with no strings attached, or else it's not a gift.

[Moksha]

But if a person had a gift to win and was able to make a good living at it.

If they were so gifted, they would be abusing this gift by gambling. It would be better to put this winning ability to work in some capacity to benefit Mankind.

[NeuroTypical]

Investing in the stock market may or may not be gambling.

The difference between gambling and investing? The act of gambling introduces risk that wouldn't otherwise be there. Investing is a way of handling risk that is there no matter what you do.

If you have money, that money is at risk. The risk varies on what you do with your money.

Cash under a matress is at risk of being destroyed by fire, and loses value over time due to inflation.

Gold/Silver/etc is at risk of being stolen

House/Land/Property can go up or down in value.

FDIC insured banks/CD's/ultra-safe investments tend to decrease in value over time due to inflation.

Stocks/Bonds may go up or down in value

401Ks/IRAs trade benefits (like company match and tax benefits) for loss of immediate access to funds.

So no, choosing to invest your money in stocks is not in and of itself, gambling. Because there's nothing you can do with your money that doesn't come with it's own bunch of risk.

Heavily playing stocks and day trading and the like, is probably much closer to gambling than contributing to a 401K.

LM

[richlittell]

I'm a really good cat burglar. I never get caught, and I only steal tidbits from rich people who never even miss their items (that's why I never get caught). It adds up to millions, but I give most to charity and give my family a great lifestyle.

[hordak]

May I respectfully disagree with you?

Both have similar attributes. The "thrill" of "betting" to get a "win". In my mind, that would be equivalent of investing in penny stocks.

investing involves a lot of research into the workings of that particular company.

Have you never been to vegas?

[Traveler]

You can't win a gift.

A gift is given with no strings attached, or else it's not a gift.

Then there is no such thing as a gift.

The Traveler

[Traveler]

I am sorry that there are some that have difficulty understanding the difference between investing and gambling. Please allow me to point out one very glaring difference. When we lose capitol in investing it is because someone other than us has not performed their function well. In gambling when we lose capitol it is because someone other than us has performed well for what-ever reason.

The difference is how we look at others and respect them. If we have an attitude of respect we will invest in them and hope they will win. If you have little respect or concern for others we will “bet” against them in gambling and hope they will fail.

It appears to me that it is impossible for a Christian to gamble and remain a Christian and likely that a Christian would invest – even in seemingly hopeless cases.

The Traveler

[Churchmouse]

Are you sure your name isn't Bernie Madoff:)

[Churchmouse]

I'm a really good cat burglar. I never get caught, and I only steal tidbits from rich people who never even miss their items (that's why I never get caught). It adds up to millions, but I give most to charity and give my family a great lifestyle.

Are you sure your name isn't Bernie Madoff?