My husband came back.....

[Just_A_Guy]

I just have to chime in here:

Is it "Rachel" or "Rachelle"?

[pam]

How funny. I was just wondering the same thing. Is it pronounced like "Rachel" or is the "ch" pronounced as "sh". Not that it matters whatsoever..it was just a curiosity thing.

[ryanh]

Wow, ryanh, you REALLY need to go back and slowly read Funky's posts again. He in no way was criticising or calling Rachelle names. He was commenting on her husband's behavior.

I do see now that the childish comment was pointed at rebellion, not looking over his shoulder. My bad, sorry, I misread that.

I still see the "shocking" that Rachelle also has BP comment and calling her condition a 'snake in the grass' as offensive. Were someone to call any condition I had as "shocking", and use an idiom with negative connotations, that would not feel good. There also appears to be fundamental misunderstandings of the nature of BP, that when understood, make much of the tone of the post difficult. Were Rachelle's husband to be the only one to have BP, then perhaps the post would be more appropriate, although still hurtful to anyone that did read it that had BP. (and no, I don't don have BP, but through various experiences, have great compassion for anyone that does - they are not people that inherently seek to betray or deceive - they have a condition that they may not be in control of.)

[Wingnut]

While I can't speak for anyone else, I think the "shocking" part is that through everything that Rachelle has shared with us, and all the dirty laundry (of her husband's) she's hung out, she never once mentioned that she too suffers from bipolar disorder, and that it is admittedly even worse than her husband's is. It's a little shocking to find that out now.

Just a guess.

[FunkyTown]

While I can't speak for anyone else, I think the "shocking" part is that through everything that Rachelle has shared with us, and all the dirty laundry (of her husband's) she's hung out, she never once mentioned that she too suffers from bipolar disorder, and that it is admittedly even worse than her husband's is. It's a little shocking to find that out now.

Just a guess.

Bingo, Wingnut. That I did find shocking.

[MorningStar]

While I can't speak for anyone else, I think the "shocking" part is that through everything that Rachelle has shared with us, and all the dirty laundry (of her husband's) she's hung out, she never once mentioned that she too suffers from bipolar disorder, and that it is admittedly even worse than her husband's is. It's a little shocking to find that out now.

Just a guess.

She has mentioned that before - multiple times. She has been very open about that.

[MorningStar]

I appreciate it, but I am certainly not "amazing" in any fashion. I have responsibility in this. Yes, he chose to not take care of himself mentally by taking the correct medication or by not keeping his appointments with his doctors. Considering his past behavior when not medicated, he knew full and well that it could lead to self-destructive and hurtful behaviors. Thus, he (albeit inadvertently) chose to cheat. Even if he wasn't in a stable frame of mind, he still made the choice.

However,

I am quite controlling when it comes to that sort of thing. I made the choice to micro-manage his meds and his doctor visits prior to his "breakdown". I remember being a teen with bi-polar and my parents constantly were over my shoulder making sure I was behaving "normally". It's exhausting, and I would often rebel by not taking meds, or by manipulating my dosages. I feel this is what happened with my husband too. He is an adult, and perfectly capable of caring for his own mental well being, he doesn't need me picking at his every move regarding that issue, and I feel it contributed.

Also, I am very combative. There were many times during our last few chaotic months where he and I would start to argue, and instead of just dropping the subject or walking away, I chose to escalate the situation because I was "right" and he was "wrong". I don't back down from conflict, and I have a habit of cornering people and bashing them over the head verbally with my opinion because I feel like I can kowtow them into changing their minds.

This is useless in general, even more so when dealing with a person who is not able to use reason due to mania. I failed to realize that his perception was his reality, and that it was useless and damaging to argue. I said hateful and stupid things too.

Anyway, those negative traits of mine including others were also responsible for the damage that was done the last few months I have already taken steps to rectify these issues, and these negative traits WILL be corrected in their entirety before my husband and I reconcile completely. Or before we divorce and I marry someone else for that matter. I need to change these problems regardless of the outcome of my marriage.

Sorry this is all so long. There are just so many factors to this issue. I appreciate you guys listening and offering your opinions.

I still find your ability to forgive amazing. :) I also admire you for recognizing the things you need to work on in your marriage.

I agree that you should wait before you let him back into your home. If he loves you, he will wait.

[MorningStar]

She has mentioned that before - multiple times. She has been very open about that.

Examples: http://www.lds.net/forums/lds-gospel-discussion/20520-suicide-post358623.html?highlight=bi-polar#post358623

http://www.lds.net/forums/adult-advice/14735-how-deal-severe-sudden-anger.html?highlight=bi-polar

http://www.lds.net/forums/advice-board/5699-want-cut-post251029.html?highlight=bi-polar#post251029

[Wingnut]

Perhaps it was never mentioned in the context of any thread about her husband, I don't know...I've not read them all thoroughly enough, and I don't remember them precisely. I do know that in this particular situation, however, it comes as news to those who have given her advice regarding her separation with her husband.

[ruthiechan]

The problem with bipolar is that you feel normal while on medication, and you feel so fine you can't imagine how you weren't fine before and you start thinking you don't need the meds anymore so you get off them and for a while you may be okay but then you're not anymore until you finally get on the meds again.

Rachelle think of the meds as glasses. I have glasses, and no matter what I do, no matter how hard I try, no matter how well I see with them on, without them I can not see. It's the same with your brain. If your brain doesn't work right, you won't work right.

Also, I disagree with not allowing him to move back in with you. I don't think it's cut and dry the way some are making it sound. I feel that you should ask the Lord what to do about it. Ask Him if you should allow him to move back in, and he'll tell you yay or nay. You will need to be on your knees every day praying for guidance on what to do you RIGHT NOW for your marriage. It will help him and you. It's so easy to go right back into your pain, your suffering, your whatever. It's so easy to get distracted. You need lots of focus and getting on your knees in prayer and reading your scriptures will enable you to keep that focus. Power of the Spirit.

Here are 50 Brain do's and don't's.

50 Brain Dos and Brain Don’ts | Amen Clinics

Here are 7 ways to optimize your brain.

Seven Ways To Optimize Your Brain and Your Life | Amen Clinics

Here are some chapter-lets on brain function. At the very least look at the pictures in Images of Normal Brains to see what normal is supposed to look like and then go to the one on Bipolar and Schizophrenia so you can better appreciate the difference.

SPECT Atlas | Amen Clinics

Show it to your husband as well.

You and your family are in my prayers.

[prospectmom]

Thanks Ruthie for this Site I love all the information. I rreally appreciate your sharing.

[ruthiechan]

Thanks Ruthie for this Site I love all the information. I rreally appreciate your sharing.

You're very welcome. It was a pleasure.

[Guest Alana]

Here are 50 Brain do's and don't's.

50 Brain Dos and Brain Don’ts | Amen Clinics

WHat does this mean, from the list...

Use paradoxical requests in dealing with cingulate people

[talisyn]

WHat does this mean, from the list...

Use paradoxical requests in dealing with cingulate people

Ummm..asking cingular wireless people to fix a billing problem they caused?

Rachelle, I'm glad your husband has seen the light. I hope he continues on the right path. I also hope that these past months have shown you how strong you can be

[mynewlife]

WHat does this mean, from the list...

Use paradoxical requests in dealing with cingulate people

I think it means to approach a seemingly unapproachable person in an out of the ordinary manner. Reverse psychology?

Use abnormal, out of the ordinary, "think outside the box" requests in dealing with obstinate, hardheaded, unyielding, uncompromising, etc. people...

[ruthiechan]

WHat does this mean, from the list...

Use paradoxical requests in dealing with cingulate people

Cingulate people are very difficult, they're cingulate gyrus is over active, is in, it makes them extremely contrary, so when you say to such a person, "Hey, I'm going to the store would you like to come with me?" They say, "What? I'm busy, can't you see I'm in the middle of something and I don't have the time to go with you?" You're then stuck being disappointed and saying "Oh okay then."

So instead you say, "Hey honey, I'm going to the store, I know you probably don't want to go with me. . . " They say, "What do you mean I don't want to go with you? Of course I want to go with you!" Then you can say, "Okay, great. Let's go."

Right now, unfortunately youtube is doing some maintainnance. If you go to my user account which is YouTube - ruthiechan's Channel you'll find a playlist called "Dr. Amen" as soon as that function is back up and running. You'll then get to hear Dr. Amen speak on this.

[Carl62]

Being that nobody here is God or otherwise in a position to offer you forgiveness, either from Him or from the Church, perhaps that's why you haven't received a direct answer. It might be more helpful to talk to a real-life person who is in that kind of position.

I thought, being that I'm on an LDS board, that someone here would be in that kind of position (or used to be) to tell me. Oh and BTW, this isn't pertaining to forgiveness for me. It came from a discussion a friend of mine and I were having trying to understand where the line starts/ends between the two 'forgivenesses'.

[Elphaba]

Hey Rachelle,

You remind me of my husband and me twenty years ago. He had had an affair, and I was devastated, but in my devastation I came to realize how controlling i was in the relationship.

I'll just give an example that applies only to me; in other words, I'm not saying this is your situation, but your self-reflection reminds me of you.

Before his affair I expected everything of him, but gave nothing back to my family. I was in school full time, editor-in-chief of the school newspaper--a full-time job in itself, and had another part-time job. I ate, drank and burped school.

Yet, even though I was never home for either my husband or my then three-year-old daughter, I blamed my husand when my daughter stopped coming to me to be held, have her diaper changed, etc. The obvious truth is, it was all my fault.

Because of the affair we both came to understand our relationship in a way I know would never have happened otherwise, and we both changed, profoundly. Enough so that the ensuing eight years were fairly happy ones.

Things went south after that, but not because we lost site of what we had learned.

I'm not saying your experience will replicate mine--obviously I cannot know that. I am just impressed with your self-reflection as I think it takes courage to acknowledge the issues you wrote about in your post. I do believe that if things do work out, it will be in part because of your self-reflection. (I'm still concerned I sound like I think it was all your fault when I don't think that at all.)

You are in my thoughts, and thank you for keeping us apprised of what's happening. I know how concerned for you I was when you wrote that agonizing post after he had just left.

Elphaba

Edited July 23, 2009 by Elphaba

[Elphaba]

Hey Rachelle,

In a way you remind me of my husband and me twenty years ago. When I say the following I don't mean to imply our situations are exactly the same, or that I think you are to blame for what has happened. I don't believe that.

Anyway, he had had an affair, and I was devastated, but in my devastation I came to realize how I, and my actions, was every bit as responsible for the breakdown of our relationship.

For example, before his affair I expected everything of him, but gave nothing back to my family. I was in school full time, editor-in-chief of the school newspaper--a full-time job in itself, and had another part-time job. I ate, drank and burped school.

Yet, even though I was never home for either my husband or my then two-year-old daughter, I blamed my husand when my daughter stopped coming to me to be held, have her diaper changed, etc. The obvious truth is, it was all my fault.

Because of the affair we both came to understand our own roles in the relationship's breakdown, which I know would never have happened otherwise. As a result, we both changed, profoundly. Enough so that the ensuing eight years were fairly happy ones.

Things went south after that, but not because we lost site of what we had learned.

I'm not saying your experience will replicate mine--obviously I cannot know that. I am just impressed with your self-reflection as I think it takes courage to acknowledge the issues you wrote about in your post. I do believe that if things do work out, it will be in part because of your self-reflection. (I'm still concerned I sound like I think it was all your fault when I don't think that at all.)

You are in my thoughts, and thank you for keeping us apprised of what's happening. I know how concerned for you I was when you wrote that agonizing post after he had just left.

Elphaba

[lilered]

Is thinking outside the box, the same as thinking in a circular motion?

[Moksha]

Is thinking outside the box, the same as thinking in a circular motion?

No, thinking in a circular motion means being stuck in how you solve problems. Thinking outside the box means that you are opening yourself up to new ways of understanding and being. This helps you arrive at previously unthought of answers.

[RachelleDrew]

Just for the record, I was not at all offended by what Funky said regarding my husband or regarding my mental illness.

Yes, I have Bi-Polar I and my husband has Bi-Polar II. I don't get the depressive states that he does.

The only thing that keeps me from being a complete animal is taking my meds religiously. I do not forget or skip doses, ever ever ever.

My husband is okay about taking medications, but is often forgetful or downright defiant regarding them.

He isn't moving back in permanently for a while. We are just kind of playing things by ear. I appreciate all the feedback from you guys. Sorry this isn't more informative. I've been having trouble with my net connection.

[Tarnished]

Having gone through something like what you are going through recently with myself and my husband I have to say that I think you should give things back slowly. That is if you are planning on getting back together. He put you through quite a lot.

In our case it was myself and not my husband who did the cheating and I completely understood when he said that I needed to earn things back. Trust is something that is difficult to earn back and there are different things that must be done to earn that trust back. If he really wants to come back he has to understand that things will be different, he no longer has your trust to be able to hang out late, or have female friends. He has to understand that he no longer has your trust to surf the internet unwatched. He has given up the privilege of having your trust in those matters and he has to earn them back. If he did not you would forever be wondering what he was doing, you would be opening yourself up to hurt and pain that you do not deserve.

From one who has gone through it, earning the trust back means that you feel like it means something, you remember what it felt to know that your spouse could no longer trust you and you don't want to go back to that. It is much like what my parent's said about money, earning it makes it mean something to you.

As it relates to your Bishop and Branch President, I am sure that they are doing what they think right, and like some people have said it is really up to your husband to go in and fully repent. However, if I were you I would not get back together with him until he has started himself on the repentance process. In fact, after what he has done, with claiming that he did not care for you or your son, I would wait until he was well on his way through the repentance process. If he is not really dedicated to repenting then there is a better chance that he will do this again, or that he will convince himself that it was all ok, not not a big deal. This world already downplays the seriousness of sexual sin, don't let that into your home, protect yourself and your son. I pray for the best for both you and your little boy.

[Guest missingsomething]

You articulate very well.

Can I ramble a few thoughts...

Get a blessing - this will help you

Pray... taking him back wont be easy but sometimes the things worth having is worth working for and arent easy.

You should read the thread by faded and tarnished. It is very enlightening. You arent wrong for needing to put rules and regulations on his social life. His commitment to regaining your trust would (in my opinion) show you whether or not he has the ability to change.

The fact that you can forgive is great - just make sure you are forgiving and not just burying. (not saying you are, just throwing this out there)...

And remember, your bishop saw your struggles and pains when he left... sometimes its hard for those that love you to trust too. Its concern he has for you. But dont just disregard your bishop, he has the spiritual gift to receive revelation for you and your family. So take his advice and pray about it.

And did I say?... congrats... I will pray for you that it works out. but not our will be done.. but Gods will be done.

[Gatorman]

Rachelle,

This is truly a tough scenario you have brought. I have read many of the posts, but not all. Here is my take, and something I think can apply to every situation.

First, the 'something to do' piece. Find the movie Fireproof, if you can. Watch it. Then, get the book 'The Love Dare'. Read it. Then pray about it. It is as much a challenge to learn about you, as to save your marriage/relationship. I believe that its methods, when truly applied, can truly bring about miracles. But, be warned, it requires a serious commitment and work on your part.

Now, my feeling on that work. If you decide to work on this and to try to work it out, your goal will have to be to completely forgive him, and yourself. That does not mean that you aren't careful and that you ignore signs and symptoms. It means that you can't always be looking for him, or yourself, to fail. It means that you have to be prepared for trips and stumbles. It means that you have to be prepared daily to love him fully. The Love Dare will create a challenge for you that, if you truly pray about it, you will understand. The basic question will become, am I willing to commit myself to saving my marriage or has it already ended. It is possible, and it can be okay, for you to have already reached an end. But, if after truly thinking about the principles taught in the book or shown in the movie, you are still prepared to do the work, it can be a grand blessing.

Now, before it seems like I am coming from non experience, I am not. I have worked on the Love Dare in my own marriage. Unfortunately, it was too late. I do not regret have started it or having learned about it. I was too blind to see that it was too late, but, I learned a great deal about the challenge. And, I am commited to applying the principles in any future relationships I may have. That is the other reason I so freely and regularly suggest this book and movie. It can absolutely be applied to failing relationships. But, it can also apply to future relationships or current good ones. I would be extremely distraught right now about my relationiship future, if not for my Heavenly Father, some good friends, and the lessons I learned from the Love Dare.

And, here is my offer. If you can not find the movie and book in your area, let me know. I will get a copy of both and send it to you. However, the movie can be rented at BlockBuster. I pray that you can find the strength to follow this course and path without being weary. Just be prepared for the work, effort, and challenge of what you have before you and remember to trust in the strength of the Lord, not your own or your husbands.