Latter Days Guy Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 LP, with all due respect, this article goes in the same vein as that Mormon blogger (was it Well-Behaved Mormon Woman?) who slammed Frozen as purposely advocating the Gay Agenda. Like all interpretative works of art - Fictional narratives, paintings, etc. - what you glean from it depicts more of what your interests are rather than what the artist's are... as aptly pointed out by that Gay Mormon dude who is married to a woman... can't remember his name either... who responded to that Frozen article. There's a gay agenda in Frozen! Never heard that one before! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LiterateParakeet Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 Good point Anatess. I'll have to give your point consideration because I loved the post you are speaking of. I'm on my phone so I can't link it right now but I can tell you it was Josh Weed. His blog is joshweed.comThat said linking Frozen to an LGBT agenda is a much farther stretch than linking a BDSM book to child sexual abuse.I think I can post a couple articles later about the link between porn and abuse. I know that there are some about porn and sex-trafficking which is another form of abuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LiterateParakeet Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 There's a gay agenda in Frozen! Never heard that one before!If you think that's ridiculous then that is a point we can agree on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 There's a gay agenda in Frozen! Never heard that one before! Here ya go. Enjoy! http://wellbehavedmormonwoman.blogspot.com/2014/02/movie-frozen-gay-homosexual-agenda.html#.VOdTGVUo5Ms And here's the response I mentioned also:http://www.joshweed.com/2014/03/my-response-to-well-behaved-mormon-woman.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) Good point Anatess. I'll have to give your point consideration because I loved the post you are speaking of. I'm on my phone so I can't link it right now but I can tell you it was Josh Weed. His blog is joshweed.comThat said linking Frozen to an LGBT agenda is a much farther stretch than linking a BDSM book to child sexual abuse.I think I can post a couple articles later about the link between porn and abuse. I know that there are some about porn and sex-trafficking which is another form of abuse. Sure. I read the book and what that psychologist said never even once entered my thoughts. But then, I'm not one to think that only children don't masturbate... The thing is - everyone is talking like 50 Shades is "new". Porn has been mainstream for a very long time in the US. We dropped all our pay channels - HBO, Cinemax, etc. because most, if not all, their series shows are pornographic. And they are popular! Game of Thrones, Dexter, Spartacus, Boardwalk Empire... and even the non-pay channels skate it - Sons of Anarchy, etc. None of them even came close to this kind of response. Not even a ripple. Harry Potter got major ripples too but we were on the side of Harry Potter on that one so we just thought those making ripples were cooks. The only new thing is the BDSM angle. It's something most people - even those who watch Game of Thrones on a regular basis - can get shocked about. But, for those in that world - they don't see it in the same way we see it. You know how we get weirded out by sex between 2 men? Well, for those 2 men, there's nothing weird about it. Same thing. And gay sex is now becoming mainstream too. Edited February 20, 2015 by anatess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latter Days Guy Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 I think that from now on I'm just going to ask anatess to write anything I want to post here as she says it so much better than me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LiterateParakeet Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 No the author is a woman, there is no if or buts about it. Also if the book says she's 21 I would assume that that is her age, if you or the author of the article read into it something else then I think its you who has the problem not the author of the book. I asked my wife about this last night (she has read all three books and seen the film), if she thought that Ana's character in the book was written to be a lot younger than portrayed? She laughed and said no, she's just very inexperienced and a bit naive to start.You are right the author is a woman. I checked after I wrote that. The book says she is 21...but she doesn't act 21. Outside of the church (even in the church) it's rare to find a 21 yr old girl who has no sexual experience. She wears pigtails and talks about cartwheels....sound pretty young to me. And there is no doubt in anyone's mind that Gray is abusive, right?I'll accept that we cant know for sure what the authors intent was. However there is something called "death of the author which means once the work is out there people will interpret it as they will. Frozen is an example...though I didn't agree with the LGBT angle, many people did. Another example is Lord of The Rings...many people see Christian themes in that but Tolkien said that was not his intent. And let's not forget Harry Potter and the witch craft accusations.Whether or not we agree about the pedophilia/abuse angle we can all agree that a movie that is openly pornographic and BDSM being so popula in our culture is not a good sign. What comes next? THAT question is my main point in sharing the article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 Abusers can be women, it's rare, but it does happen.How do we know this? It's the common wisdom of our day, but what evidence do we have that abusive women are rare? I know from personal familial experience that men and children abused by women (wives and mothers, respectively) usually never say anything to anyone. A man who did those kinds of things would be rejected and probably arrested. LP, with all due respect, this article goes in the same vein as that Mormon blogger (was it Well-Behaved Mormon Woman?) who slammed Frozen as purposely advocating the Gay Agenda.I like almost everything I have read from WBMW. I didn't agree with that particular column, but it was no more outrageous than many other columns that I read every day on the Internet, usually spouting leftist tripe. Yet she's crucified for this one column. I think that's wrong. Latter Days Guy and Crypto 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latter Days Guy Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 You are right the author is a woman. I checked after I wrote that.The book says she is 21...but she doesn't act 21. Outside of the church (even in the church) it's rare to find a 21 yr old girl who has no sexual experience. She wears pigtails and talks about cartwheels....sound pretty young to me.And there is no doubt in anyone's mind that Gray is abusive, right?I'll accept that we cant know for sure what the authors intent was. However there is something called "death of the author which means once the work is out there people will interpret it as they will. Frozen is an example...though I didn't agree with the LGBT angle, many people did. Another example is Lord of The Rings...many people see Christian themes in that but Tolkien said that was not his intent. And let's not forget Harry Potter and the witch craft accusations.Whether or not we agree about the pedophilia/abuse angle we can all agree that a movie that is openly pornographic and BDSM being so popula in our culture is not a good sign. What comes next? THAT question is my main point in sharing the article. You say she doesn't act 21, doesn't stop her being that. When I was at bible college we had an American girl in our year, she wore her hair in pigtails, did cart wheels out the back of the dorm, roller bladed around the car park. She was quite proud that she had never experienced or done any of those things before in her life either (talking about sex and masturbation). She was 23. Is it consensual? If what happens in the books is consensual then by definition it cannot be abuse. From what my wife says he never goes beyond what she wants to happen, if it was abuse then that wouldn't be the case.But its not popular in our culture, the our culture being the culture of the Church. It is popular in the worldly culture outside of the church, but then the world isn't defined by the same standards as the Church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) The book says she is 21...but she doesn't act 21. Outside of the church (even in the church) it's rare to find a 21 yr old girl who has no sexual experience. She wears pigtails and talks about cartwheels....sound pretty young to me. Her characterization in the book was to put a contrast between Grey and Steele. From very dark to very light. It's a thematic effect to put the conflict to a breaking-point situation to make an intriguing story. The pigtails and no make-up characterization brings that lightness. Sure, if you want to use that to represent children... that's your interpretation. But, you're going to have to be consistent with that interpretation all throughout the book... so that.. the child then saved the... monster(?). Because, Steele remained pigtailed and no make-up all through the end of the book when Grey started to walk in the light. And there is no doubt in anyone's mind that Gray is abusive, right? Grey's bio-mom's pimp was abusive, the pedophile (Grey's mom's best friend) was abusive. Grey himself, is up to interpretation. People not familiar with BDSM attribute Grey as abusive because in the BDSM relationship other than with the pedophile, he holds the role of dominant. But... in the book, his being dominant is under contract - that is... everything he does is outlined in the contract that he and his partner adjusts to fit their specific wants and then they both sign. But... Steele refused to sign a contract, so Grey is left flailing - so he ends up doing things he thought would be good but Steele realizes is too much for her so it becomes a back-and-forth until they understand each other. See, the thing is - the vehicle of the story is BDSM, something people (including myself) already see as abusive - if the vehicle was vampire-versus-human, this would be just a normal getting-to-know-you-feeling-out-of-boundaries. For BDSM people, though... it's not abusive. Grey is also very controlling... the same as Edward is controlling. Grey because he has hapnephobia, Edward because he is a vampire... Some see that as abusive, others don't. So it's left up to the reader whether Edward/Grey are abusive people... the authors don't necessarily portray them as such. The author even went so far as to state through dialogue and events that in Grey and Steele's relationship, Steele has all the power even to the point that Grey gave Steele the dominant role while he became the slave when he got so confused about his place in the relationship. I'll accept that we cant know for sure what the authors intent was. However there is something called "death of the author which means once the work is out there people will interpret it as they will. Frozen is an example...though I didn't agree with the LGBT angle, many people did. Another example is Lord of The Rings...many people see Christian themes in that but Tolkien said that was not his intent. And let's not forget Harry Potter and the witch craft accusations. Yes. The only thing I was saying was... the article was just another interpretation of the artwork. So it was wrong for the article to attribute an agenda to the book in the same manner that it is wrong for WBMW to attribute a gay agenda to Frozen. It's okay to say this is what you got out of it, it's something else to say this is what the author is trying to do to America... or some such. Whether or not we agree about the pedophilia/abuse angle we can all agree that a movie that is openly pornographic and BDSM being so popula in our culture is not a good sign. What comes next? THAT question is my main point in sharing the article. Agreed. 100%. I've been saying that ever since some politician tried to pass Divorce Law in the Philippines citing all the divorces happening in Philippine-Hollywood and all the Philippine movies about it. Good thing there are still enough people in the Philippines who don't let entertainment stuff sway them in voting principles. I mean - electing celebrities to government positions is popular over there... Manny Pacquiao is a Congressman! Jaworski (Michael Jordan of the Phils) is a Senator, etc. etc. Once it hits mainstream, it won't be long until it changes culture and changes government. But, at the same time... these things go in phases... it seems like doomsday now but this too will dissipate and pass... in the same manner that the shock of Linda Blaire's cussing in The Exorcist dissipated and passed. Edited February 20, 2015 by anatess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 I'm a fat 52-year-old man and I do cartwheels. Cartwheels are fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted February 20, 2015 Report Share Posted February 20, 2015 I think that from now on I'm just going to ask anatess to write anything I want to post here as she says it so much better than me! I believe anatess gave me power of attorney over all her points a month back or so. So maybe you should rethink this. Latter Days Guy and Crypto 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crypto Posted March 2, 2015 Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 How do we know this? It's the common wisdom of our day, but what evidence do we have that abusive women are rare? I know from personal familial experience that men and children abused by women (wives and mothers, respectively) usually never say anything to anyone. A man who did those kinds of things would be rejected and probably arrested. I like almost everything I have read from WBMW. I didn't agree with that particular column, but it was no more outrageous than many other columns that I read every day on the Internet, usually spouting leftist tripe. Yet she's crucified for this one column. I think that's wrong.Just to follow up with this, there was a 2011 CDC report release that created a new category of sexual abuse called "forced to penetrate" The numbers of men who were "forced to penetrate" nearly equaled that of women "raped" within a 12 month period observed. Approximately 50% of the abusers of men were women. There are other fairly recent statistical reports and studies that are now following through with this and finding the difference to be less than is commonly thought, often due to inherent bias, definitions, under reporting, societal expectations, reports that are ignored etc...Based on this I don't believe this is a men only do it kind of problem, it's worse than most might think for both genders.It's very disheartening. Vort 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted March 3, 2015 Report Share Posted March 3, 2015 What, there are articles in Playboy!!! Thought it was all nekkid ladies and pin ups! (Yes I've never looked at a copy of Playboy!) Used to be some quite good ones. Don't know about now. There also was a push once to get them to produce a magazine of just the articles, but I'm guessing that never got anywhere since I haven't seen anything of the sort. I suspect part of the issue was that they would often interview people like Penn Jillette on political topics, and of course not censor anything he said, which I'm sure would limit their readership to people who don't mind nudie pics either. (Of course, that was also back in the day when I would say Playboy was more "erotic art" than hardcore porn, too. IMO, they alienated at least some of their original audience when they went for less art and more...whatever you want to call it.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted March 3, 2015 Report Share Posted March 3, 2015 Picture-free Playboy would be like sugar-free cotton candy. Even if it's fortified with ten essential vitamins and iron, it's still pure sugar. Even if Playboy published/publishes great, insightful articles, it's still just a purveyor of pornography. Blackmarch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted March 3, 2015 Report Share Posted March 3, 2015 wow thread is still going lol. well here's my thought on the showBLEGHH!You can turn anything into an "ART". just because it can be done does not mean it should be, nor does it = safe or good.Soon as it becomes boring its going to go to more extremes. what this is now is going to pale in comparison whats going to come out on legal popular media in years to come. Even the educational channels are falling into this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mordorbund Posted March 4, 2015 Report Share Posted March 4, 2015 Soon as it becomes boring its going to go to more extremes. what this is now is going to pale in comparison whats going to come out on legal popular media in years to come. Even the educational channels are falling into this. Has Curious George started flinging poo? Backroads, Blackmarch and Vort 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Picture-free Playboy would be like sugar-free cotton candy. Even if it's fortified with ten essential vitamins and iron, it's still pure sugar. Even if Playboy published/publishes great, insightful articles, it's still just a purveyor of pornography. It used to be pretty common for artists and portrait photographers to have subscriptions to Playboy; they kept their poses to fairly classic artistic stuff, and actually quite a few of them worked great for regular (clothed) portrait work. For the art types, it was a monthly collection of great figure studies to work from without the hassle of getting a model comfortable with the idea of hanging out (literally) motionless for whatever length of time would be needed. Then they started dropping their standards, and AFAIK, they're not of professional interest to anyone but possibly gynecologists now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latter Days Guy Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 (edited) So some kid went to school on world book day dressed as Christian from 50 shades! Didn't go down too well! http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-31760713 Edited March 6, 2015 by Latter Days Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 So some kid went to school on world book day dressed as Christian from 50 shades! Didn't go down too well! http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-31760713I saw that. The kid's mother is an idiot of the lowest caliber. Seriously, what kind of scumbag, or hopelessly lost soul, dresses her preteen son as an S&M/bondage fetishist and thinks it's funny? Leah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 So today, my husband's FB newsfeed got an Ad for a book series... and in big highlights "Has BDSM!"... and in the comments section, hundreds of women saying, "Oh, can't wait to get my hands on this book!" and the like. I guess BDSM is now a selling point for erotica. Sigh. And over the weekend... we went touring historical sites and museums and went through a few art galleries in the area. We went to the first art gallery and my son exclaimed, "This is an interesting store. Everywhere I turn I see boobs!". And an elderly lady approached me and said, "you shouldn't have brought your children here.", and so I told her, "They know what breasts are. They'll be fine." I don't know... I don't see anything wrong with kids going to an art gallery. But, I do find something wrong with women excited to read about erotica and BDSM... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 And over the weekend... we went touring historical sites and museums and went through a few art galleries in the area. We went to the first art gallery and my son exclaimed, "This is an interesting store. Everywhere I turn I see boobs!". And an elderly lady approached me and said, "you shouldn't have brought your children here.", and so I told her, "They know what breasts are. They'll be fine."If your son's comment upon entering the gallery was the prevalence of nude female breasts, methinks he wasn't gaining an artistic education. Whether or not "they'll be fine", I can't say; I certainly hope they will be. I certainly agree that the very idea of bondage and sadomasochism as selling points to women (or to anyone else) is a sickening perversion of public tastes. Women have long functioned as the gatekeepers of sexual decency in society, a role they appear only too happy to abandon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 If your son's comment upon entering the gallery was the prevalence of nude female breasts, methinks he wasn't gaining an artistic education. Whether or not "they'll be fine", I can't say; I certainly hope they will be. We didn't go to the art gallery for "artistic education". Interestingly, he goes to an arts school. We went to the art gallery to admire the art. And his observation was accurate. Everywhere you look is a sculpture of a naked female interspersed with all the other artwork. It's nothing new to my kids. They lived in the Philippines where children run around the village naked and breast feeding in public is common. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackmarch Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 Has Curious George started flinging poo?thats his bro, Furious GeorgeI've seen Curious stoned out tho...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightSG Posted March 16, 2015 Report Share Posted March 16, 2015 If your son's comment upon entering the gallery was the prevalence of nude female breasts, methinks he wasn't gaining an artistic education. Not necessarily; one can note a prevalent theme in several works without losing any of the value of those works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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