Catlick Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Hello everyone! I am a born-and-raised Catholic but was introduced to the LDS church by some friends about a year ago. I've been studying the Book of Mormon, listening to General Conference talks, as well as Mormon podcasts and I love it all. I've met several times with the missionaries and ward members and they are encouraging me to set a baptism date for a few weeks from now. I had to tell them no, because although my heart tells me that that the Church is true, there are lots of fears that I have that hold me back. It's come down to a heart-vs-head thing. Here are my fears: -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Do I need to stop listening to rock music and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. I'm a nostaligic type! Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Or would I have to shut that part of myself off? -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). Ack! That's a lot, I know! Thanks for reading all of that! I'm just straddling a fine line between two totally different churches and I just don't know what to do. I'm not totally sure that the BoM is true, but it feels right and I adore the way the LDS church functions on a spiritual level. I don't want to waste any more of the missionaries' time if I'm going to be so slow in making a decision. Any advice is greatly appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bini Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Following what's right, whatever path you choose, is always a work in progress. You will never be perfect in this lifetime. Set goals and tackle one at a time. Backroads and Catlick 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David13 Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 I think it's clear you have every reason in the world to not join the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.Therefore ... why even consider it?dc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane_Doe Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Catlick-- Do not worry, being nervous before baptism is 150% normal! As to your specific worries-- -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Do I need to stop listening to rock music and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? The most important thing in life is to follow the way of Christ and come unto Him. If something is not harming your relationship with Christ, why should you have to give it up??? (PS-- I love rock music and crime shows) -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. I'm a nostaligic type! Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Or would I have to shut that part of myself off? Have you seen the "Meet the Mormons" movie? (it's on Netflix). One of the people in there is from Nepal, and he talks about this exact thing (except his background is Hindu instead of Catholic). I'd highly recommend you check it out. Coming closer to Christ doesn't mean surrendering your culture, but rather adding more good to it. Example: you want a crucifix/cross in your house, because it reminds you of Christ- that's awesome! And now, hopefully you have a deeper love/appreciation/understanding of Him, and when you see that crucifix/cross you feel all the more love. -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? Family handling the baptism: I would recommend that you go to your dad right now, and share the joy you've found in Christ. Show him the wonder you see and feel-- light was never meant to be hidden, especially from those who love us most. As to other social situation: congrats, you are now the permanent DD!! There are plenty of people who go to social events and don't drink (present ladies, people with health issues, recovering acholoics, not to mention religious folks). You just order juice (or something else), and continue to chat with folks. -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? Christ is amazingly awesome at making heavy burdens light. -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). A ) Again, Christ is amazingly awesome at making heavy burdens light.B) If you're over-taxed, you can just scale back on things. God doesn't want us to run faster than we are able Ack! That's a lot, I know! Thanks for reading all of that! I'm just straddling a fine line between two totally different churches and I just don't know what to do. I'm not totally sure that the BoM is true, but it feels right and I adore the way the LDS church functions on a spiritual level. I don't want to waste any more of the missionaries' time if I'm going to be so slow in making a decision. Any advice is greatly appreciated! You are NOT wasting the missionaries time! In fact, I would GUARANTEE that their letters home each week include the lines "Catlick is such an amazing person!". Take your time, and remember the story of Peter walking on water. Josiah, Backroads and Catlick 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catlick Posted July 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 David13, sometimes I think you are right. Why am I even considering this major change? I don't really know, I just feel compelled. Jane_Doe, thank you soooo much! I have a feeling I'll be reading and re-reading your words. So much to consider, and I am praying so much these day's for guidance by the Holy Ghost and just hoping that Christ can remove these obstacles, or at least make them seem less daunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thoughts Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Fear of the unknown is pretty typical. But I wonder why all these things are unknown to you. For instance, share your testimony with your family; find out their response. Listen to their fears. Invite them to listen to the missionaries so they understand what you are being taught (instead of the things they think they know about what we believe). Start now to live the word of wisdom. Think through what you might do if you are up all night? Maybe you will try hard not to have such a night. Maybe you'll use 24 hour energy instead of coffee. (The word of wisdom forbids tea, coffee and alcohol, and drugs which are not prescribed. Yes, the spirit of the word of wisdom also includes mind altering substances, but it also includes eating healthy --- members continue to struggle with those long after their baptisms.) Baptism doesn't mean you will never again sin. But don't do it until you are really committed to keep all the commandments and to learn and grow and submit your will to God. You'll still mess up, you'll still have to work to control your appetites and passions. But that is the whole point of eternal progression ---- you'll get better and better at being what your Heavenly Parents want you to do. As for Catholic traditions ---- attend Christmas mass if you choose. Keep rosary beads to hold if that gives you comfort. Yes, you'll quit praying to Mary, and your prayers will become more personal. But that doesn't mean you cannot love the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel. If you want to have family get togethers on the high holy days, then have them. There is likely enough room to continue to honor whatever catholic traditions you like, so long as you conform your worship to church teachings. You will qualify for the celestial kingdom as soon as you are baptized and doing your personal best and quickly repenting when you sin, because that will make you perfect in Christ, even when you are not yet objectively perfect. Summarizing, you don't have to get baptized when the missionaries set a date for you. Take as long as you need. Don't wait until you have proven you can do everything --- -that will deprive you of the help the Holy Ghost can give you to get there. But make sure that you really do understand and fully accept core doctrines, and wait until you can say with surety that you intend to do your personal best to keep the commandments, and quickly repent. At that point, you will feel joyous and peaceful about your baptism. Doesn't sound like you are ready yet. Catlick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Str8Shooter Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Following what's right, whatever path you choose, is always a work in progress. You will never be perfect in this lifetime. Set goals and tackle one at a time. I agree with following what's right. I politely disagree with not being perfect in this lifetime. Although it's very unlikely, it is possible, and we never know who might obtain it. Totally agree with setting goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Str8Shooter Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Hello everyone! I am a born-and-raised Catholic but was introduced to the LDS church by some friends about a year ago. I've been studying the Book of Mormon, listening to General Conference talks, as well as Mormon podcasts and I love it all. I've met several times with the missionaries and ward members and they are encouraging me to set a baptism date for a few weeks from now. I had to tell them no, because although my heart tells me that that the Church is true, there are lots of fears that I have that hold me back. It's come down to a heart-vs-head thing. Here are my fears: -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Do I need to stop listening to rock music and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. I'm a nostaligic type! Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Or would I have to shut that part of myself off? -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). Ack! That's a lot, I know! Thanks for reading all of that! I'm just straddling a fine line between two totally different churches and I just don't know what to do. I'm not totally sure that the BoM is true, but it feels right and I adore the way the LDS church functions on a spiritual level. I don't want to waste any more of the missionaries' time if I'm going to be so slow in making a decision. Any advice is greatly appreciated! Always follow what you know is true, no matter how difficult it may seem. God will take care of you with all of your concerns if you let him. Catlick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
askandanswer Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Hi Catlick It seems to me as if you want everything to be settled and sure in your life before you make a move. Perhaps you could allow a little more room for faith to work in your life. If you have a belief that the LDS church is true, and you act on that belief, even though you might still have concerns and questions, then you are showing faith in our Heavenly Father and then you are opening up greater opportunities for the Lord to bless you, and help you with whatever it is you might still be struggling with. If you wait until you are certain, you might be waiting a long time. Sometimes we have to take show our faith in God by taking those first few steps into the unknown by ourselves before we then feel the reassuring presence of the spirit confirming that what we have done is pleasing unto the Lord. But you would not be taking these steps into the unknown by yourself. You would be surrounded and supported by the missionaries and many members of your new ward. Its amazing how our perspective can change once we have acted on faith, and how seeming mountains can suddenly fade away into molehills. I think anatess would be a great person to talk with about the family and social situations that can arise when moving from Catholicism to Mormonism. She, along with several others on this site, has travelled that journey and can provide lots of helpful advice on how to manage that change. You can send her, or anyone else, a private message, by clicking on the “members” button on the left side of the screen, searching for the member you would like to send a message to, clicking on their name and then clicking on “Send me a message” near the upper right side of the screen. You mention in your post that you’re not totally sure if the Book of Mormon is true, but it feels right. Might I recommend that you re-read and further ponder and pray about Alma 32: 26 – 43. By all means read it here and now below, but I suggest that you also re-read it and ponder about it several times in the coming week and ask yourself how it applies to your situation. And then ask the Lord what you should do. (Book of Mormon | Alma 32:26 - 43)26 Now, as I said concerning faith—that it was not a perfect knowledge—even so it is with my words. Ye cannot know of their surety at first, unto perfection, any more than faith is a perfect knowledge. 27 But behold, if ye will awake and arouse your faculties, even to an experiment upon my words, and exercise a particle of faith, yea, even if ye can no more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you, even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words. 28 Now, we will compare the word unto a seed. Now, if ye give place, that a seed may be planted in your heart, behold, if it be a true seed, or a good seed, if ye do not cast it out by your unbelief, that ye will resist the Spirit of the Lord, behold, it will begin to swell within your breasts; and when you feel these swelling motions, ye will begin to say within yourselves—It must needs be that this is a good seed, or that the word is good, for it beginneth to enlarge my soul; yea, it beginneth to enlighten my understanding, yea, it beginneth to be delicious to me. 29 Now behold, would not this increase your faith? I say unto you, Yea; nevertheless it hath not grown up to a perfect knowledge. 30 But behold, as the seed swelleth, and sprouteth, and beginneth to grow, then you must needs say that the seed is good; for behold it swelleth, and sprouteth, and beginneth to grow. And now, behold, will not this strengthen your faith? Yea, it will strengthen your faith: for ye will say I know that this is a good seed; for behold it sprouteth and beginneth to grow. 31 And now, behold, are ye sure that this is a good seed? I say unto you, Yea; for every seed bringeth forth unto its own likeness. 32 Therefore, if a seed groweth it is good, but if it groweth not, behold it is not good, therefore it is cast away. 33 And now, behold, because ye have tried the experiment, and planted the seed, and it swelleth and sprouteth, and beginneth to grow, ye must needs know that the seed is good. 34 And now, behold, is your knowledge perfect? Yea, your knowledge is perfect in that thing, and your faith is dormant; and this because you know, for ye know that the word hath swelled your souls, and ye also know that it hath sprouted up, that your understanding doth begin to be enlightened, and your mind doth begin to expand. 35 O then, is not this real? I say unto you, Yea, because it is light; and whatsoever is light, is good, because it is discernible, therefore ye must know that it is good; and now behold, after ye have tasted this light is your knowledge perfect? 36 Behold I say unto you, Nay; neither must ye lay aside your faith, for ye have only exercised your faith to plant the seed that ye might try the experiment to know if the seed was good. 37 And behold, as the tree beginneth to grow, ye will say: Let us nourish it with great care, that it may get root, that it may grow up, and bring forth fruit unto us. And now behold, if ye nourish it with much care it will get root, and grow up, and bring forth fruit. 38 But if ye neglect the tree, and take no thought for its nourishment, behold it will not get any root; and when the heat of the sun cometh and scorcheth it, because it hath no root it withers away, and ye pluck it up and cast it out. 39 Now, this is not because the seed was not good, neither is it because the fruit thereof would not be desirable; but it is because your ground is barren, and ye will not nourish the tree, therefore ye cannot have the fruit thereof. 40 And thus, if ye will not nourish the word, looking forward with an eye of faith to the fruit thereof, ye can never pluck of the fruit of the tree of life. 41 But if ye will nourish the word, yea, nourish the tree as it beginneth to grow, by your faith with great diligence, and with patience, looking forward to the fruit thereof, it shall take root; and behold it shall be a tree springing up unto everlasting life. 42 And because of your diligence and your faith and your patience with the word in nourishing it, that it may take root in you, behold, by and by ye shall pluck the fruit thereof, which is most precious, which is sweet above all that is sweet, and which is white above all that is white, yea, and pure above all that is pure; and ye shall feast upon this fruit even until ye are filled, that ye hunger not, neither shall ye thirst. 43 Then, my brethren, ye shall reap the rewards of your faith, and your diligence, and patience, and long-suffering, waiting for the tree to bring forth fruit unto you. Josiah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LiterateParakeet Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Catlick, I love Jane Doe's post and I agree with her! If you stick around here at LDS.net, you will see that Mormons can be a diverse group. About rock music, there is an LDS guy that is the leader singer for a rock band. The Killers? My teenagers would know . . . LOL. I think your concerns are normal and understandable. I've heard that it took Brigham Young three years to decide to convert. Apparently he had some reservations that took some time to over come as well. :) You are not alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backroads Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Much good has been said. As for the "free spirit" thing, yes, if it's not harming the essentials, why must you give it up? The 1st counselor in my ward's relief society presidency constantly looks like a gothic rock star (and she's a grandmother). We have very active members with tattoos and wildly dyed hair. I had an institute teacher who has practiced Hindu-based meditation everyday for decades. Catlick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josiah Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) Hi Catlick! As others have said, you aren't alone. These kinds of concerns aren't new, and others have overcome them. You can overcome them too, if you want to! Here are some scriptures, quotes, and ideas that came to mind as I read your post. I hope some of them are helpful to you. Warning: Really, really long post ahead. -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Do I need to stop listening to rock music and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? As far as joining the church is concerned, this is probably not an issue. Other than the specific things the missionaries have gone over, as well as following the overall process of faith and repentance in all areas of your life, the rest is between you and your Heavenly Father. You don't need to become a picture-perfect cookie cutter "Mormon." In fact, I don't know that you even should. When Joseph Smith was asked how he was able to govern the early Church so effectively, his response was this:"I teach them correct principles, and they govern themselves." I like this a lot. Heavenly Father doesn't spell out exactly how to live, what to do, etc. He gives us the basic commandments as examples, and then teaches us principles to guide is with the rest. If, for whatever reason, the day comes when you feel in your heart that God wants you to give up rock music and Dateline, then of course you should. For now, focus less on the specifics and more on the principles behind them. Who does Heavenly Father want you to be? Who do you really want to be, and why? Borrowing from earlier in this thread, why are you so strongly considering making this change in your life in the first place? What principles are guiding you that way in spite of the challenges? Stuff like that. -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. I'm a nostaligic type! Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Or would I have to shut that part of myself off? Bring the best of your religion with you, and just leave out what isn't right or good. Again, the principles are what matter most. The details have a way of working themselves out with time. From Moroni 7:13"But behold, that which is of God inviteth and enticeth to do good continually; wherefore, every thing which inviteth and enticeth to do good, and to love God, and to serve him, is inspired of God."Apply this test to anything from Catholicism, in light of the principles the missionaries are teaching you. Keep whatever helps you come closer to Christ. This will actually become easier after you are baptized and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. That gift will help you discern (spiritually see and feel) what is good to keep and what is not. -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? This one's a toughie. You probably feel obligated to your family to continue as you are, and you also probably feel somewhat obligated to your LDS friends and to the missionaries to attend there and be baptized. Those issues are real. But keep in mind that what's most important by far is your obligation to God, and to do what you feel in your heart is right.Even if you could make a decision that would please everyone you know, how would you feel about it if you knew that God had wanted something different, that you hadn't followed your heart? Or, from another perspective, what would your decision be if nobody else were involved - not your family, not your friends of any belief, not the missionaries - only you and Heavenly Father. What does He really want? What do you want? It's easier said than done, but as much as you can, leave the rest to Him. It'll work out for the best.Matthew 19:29 "And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life."No price is too great to find the peace of knowing and feeling that you are doing God's will. -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? You can! It might not be a flawless transition, but you'll get there. There is power in the Atonement of Jesus Christ beyond what you or I can even comprehend. With His help, you can do it. You can resist. You can function without it. You can even be happier than ever before without it - if you choose to do so with all your heart! Also keep in mind that if you quit, get baptized, and then cave once a week later, it isn't the end of the world - as long as you learn from it and keep trying. When we're following Christ and doing our best, mistakes become lessons, not condemnations. They are stepping stones, not roadblocks. You have nothing to fear except the danger of not trying or giving up.Luke 17:6 "And the Lord said, If ye had faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye might say unto this sycamine tree, Be thou plucked up by the root, and be thou planted in the sea; and it should obey you." -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). Your first calling in particular is unlikely to be especially demanding. The Lord realizes that this is a transition. He won't give you more than you can handle, although it may look like it at first. It can be a test of our trust in Him, but He provides a way. I can testify that the Lord has helped me immensely in my schooling and family relationships - far beyond what I would have gained on my own with the time I have spent serving in the church, including 2 years away as a full-time missionary. Believe me, any sacrifice you make doing God's will is returned to you a hundredfold (see again Matthew 19:29). That includes the value of your time. I know this is a long one already, but one last thought. The title of this thread says a lot. I may be wrong (let me know if so), but it implies to me that you want to be baptized and you are already trying to move in that direction, but are being restrained from realizing that desire - mainly by fear. If you really have already settled in your mind and heart what is right and true, know that faith is opposed to fear, and can overcome it. Know that "God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind. (2 Tim 1:7)" Know that you have access to the power of the Atonement of Jesus Christ to overcome your fears to the degree that you will trust Him! I think you would really like this talk. It was given by Elder David A. Bednar, of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, not too long ago. Elder Bednar's words given here have helped me work toward overcoming certain fears of my own in the past few months. https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2015/04/therefore-they-hushed-their-fears?lang=eng I hope something here has helped you. Best of luck! Edited July 12, 2015 by Josiah Backroads, Catlick, yoyoteacher and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) Hello everyone! I am a born-and-raised Catholic but was introduced to the LDS church by some friends about a year ago. I've been studying the Book of Mormon, listening to General Conference talks, as well as Mormon podcasts and I love it all. I've met several times with the missionaries and ward members and they are encouraging me to set a baptism date for a few weeks from now. I had to tell them no, because although my heart tells me that that the Church is true, there are lots of fears that I have that hold me back. It's come down to a heart-vs-head thing. Hi Catlick! I went through this. There comes a time in this journey when you just can't deny the truth of your testimony - in my case, it was Premortal Existence and Eternal Families that was the tipping point, things that were not present in my Catholic faith that I can't deny the truth of as I gained testimony of them. Because of those 2 things, I started to open myself to the possibility of the Apostasy and the loss of Authority. That Authority is the main thing where LDS and Catholicism diverged and it becomes one or the other. So, with my testimony on Pre-mortal Existence and Eternal Families, I had to put my faith in the Authority conferred to Joseph Smith rather than Pope Linus. Once I settled this in my heart, the rest was a landslide. At this point, my testimony was burning and there was nothing - nothing at all - that could have stopped me from acting on that faith. Here are my fears: -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Do I need to stop listening to rock music and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? Whether you belong to a Catholic Church culture or LDS Church culture - it's the same... you don't have to conform to culture. You just have to conform to Christ's commandments. Whether you are Catholic or LDS, it's the same - you listen to music that inspires you and stop listening to music that drives you away from the Spirit. Even Catholics caution you against violent and unchaste choices in entertainment. This shouldn't be different. If you're watching shows that lead you away from the Spirit as a Catholic, you should try to change - even if you don't convert to LDS. -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. I'm a nostaligic type! Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Or would I have to shut that part of myself off? You can pray however you like as long as you're praying to Our Heavenly Father in the name of Jesus Christ. I still do a lot of things I learned as a Catholic - like lighting candles on the Advent Wreath, going through the Stations of the Cross, putting my angel wings on for Flores de Mayo. I also attend my nieces/nephews/friends baptisms, first communion, confirmation, etc. And then I attend the mass for my dad's death anniversary and whatever else my mother wants me to attend. I don't take the sacrament at mass, of course. One time, I attended mass with the LDS missionaries. They wanted to know what goes on at mass so I told them if they want to experience one, I'll take them to attend mass with my brother (Catholic Church is right next-door to our ward building). -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? My dad and brother did not speak to me for years just for marrying a Mormon outside of the Catholic Church... then I got baptized LDS... and my mother gave me heated lectures. Even until today (14 years later), she still submits my name to the Carmelite sisters every week to pray for my lost soul... My testimony was undeniable. If somebody would have said, "I'll kill you if you get baptized LDS", I would have said, "Okay, kill me". Awkwardness in social situations is nothing. Even without being LDS, awkwardness in social situations is a given. Try migrating to the USA from the Philippines and saying "I can't go to the movies because I have to go to the laundromat to wash my bedsheets" and this guy you have a major crush on hears the ee as i because there's no ee sound in your native language. My family's reaction was expected because they love me very much and getting baptized LDS is for them turning my back on my Catholic faith and a rejection of the beatific vision that will surely lead my soul to the fires of hell. So, of course, they are very, very concerned. But, I know what I know... and I know I am on a journey to bring myself closer to Christ. With that, I am covenanted to honor my parents and love my neighbors and serve them. And so, I do that. Even if it is difficult sometimes. I have no problem going to a party and refusing the alcohol/coffee/tea/whatever. I don't need to explain it, even. I just say, no thanks. This is the same when I was an athlete in training season - I had no problem saying no to soda/alcohol/coffee because my coach had rules against it. This is no different really. People really don't worry much about you saying No to anything. They might tease you if you say, I'm not drinking because I'm Mormon. But, who cares? If they stop inviting you because they think you're "no fun" or whatever, then they weren't good company to begin with! If you can't give up your coffee, you can't be baptized. It's a covenant you make which is a requirement for baptism. If you can't even give up a small thing like coffee, how are you going to do the more difficult thing - like overhauling your wardrobe to allow for garments - or the very important things - like, holding to your faith in the face of adversity. There are better ways to get through a difficult morning - a prayer can do a lot more than coffee... or even some rock music... -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). Life is about balance. You give up those of lesser priority to make room for higher priorities. Like the Navy says - God, family, country. Anyway, the LDS church don't "give" you anything. They "call" you to it. It's a calling. You can accept or refuse a calling depending on how it falls in your life. But, a calling is inspired of God - it is something that is FOR YOU. That's the beauty of service - the more you lose yourself in the service of others, the more it does good things for you. So, you get to choose - would you rather serve in the school library, or would you rather accept the calling to serve a Church calling. That's all up to you in the way you apply balancing of priorities. Catlick, what you really need to do is figure out your testimony. If you have a testimony, all of these things you listed will just fall into its natural place in your life. Edited July 13, 2015 by anatess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catlick Posted July 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 I've spent the last few days reading and re-reading your responses, thank you all so much for taking the time to respond the way you did. I am going to try living the WoW and see how my life changes, and possibly reach out to my Dad when I feel the conversation would be at a good time. I am allowing these fears to transform into doubts, and that is where I start reconsidering. I'm still meeting with the missionaries, still reading (and loving) my Book of Mormon. When I stop reading my BoM, and I start reading things that cast Joseph Smith in a bad light or involve the lack of archaeological evidence for LDS beliefs, I lose what little testimony I have. When I read my BoM, listen to General Conference talks, and spend time with my Mormon friends, I feel the stirring of the spirit unlike anything else. It really helps to hear from you, anatess, and your experience in a totally Catholic family. I'm not Filipina, but I'm Mexican American, and we have similar values and connection to Catholicism. I really enjoy reading your posts because I can relate and that gives me strength. askandanswer, I went right to the passage that you mentioned, and highlighted it. That was very helpful, thank you. Josiah, Jane_Doe, askandanswer and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catlick Posted July 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2015 (edited) One more thing I'd like to mention, in case any other newbies are thinking along the same lines. My biggest struggle is with the literalism of religious historical narrative. While I get so much out of reading my BoM and tuning into LDS media, I still have a hard time with Joseph Smith. The lack of even a shred of archaeological evidence in either the US or MesoAmerica, the KJV matching mistakes between Smith's Bible and the BoM, the Book of Abraham turning out to be falsley 'translated,' It's pretty damning evidence, and even Richard Lyman Bushman cannot explain these things away in his scholarly biography on Smith. And yet...I'm feeling this pull. It is so hard to have my head (which says Smith made up his own religion) and my heart (which agrees with so many of the tenets such as the premortal existence) at odds. In other words--if these things aren't true, why do I still have a testimony??? I'll keep praying, keep reading counter-evidence, and keep asking questions. I really, really, really want to believe. Edited July 19, 2015 by Catlick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LiterateParakeet Posted July 19, 2015 Report Share Posted July 19, 2015 Catlick, I wish I had some really helpful answer for you, but all that comes to mind is keep praying, keep asking questions, keep searching. These are all good things. :) I'm just finishing reading The Crucible of Doubt by Terryl and Fiona Givens. It has been immensely helpful to me regarding some things I was wrestling with. They have a chapter called "The Use and Abuse of Reason", which to me is about the battle between following your head or your heart as you are experiencing. One of the things they say about this is: Emotion is not a defect in an otherwise perfect reasoning machine. Reason, unfettered from human feeling, has led to as many horrors as any crusader's zeal. Something else that stands out to me that you might find helpful is the Introduction Paradigms and Premises: Starting Off on the Wrong Foot. They begin by telling a story about a "magnificent restored house" in Scotland, built before Columbus. The house had been once occupied by James Mossman who was a brilliant craftsman. On the third floor is a room protected by a heavy oak door. Off center, on the right of a large iron panel that conceals the locking mechanism, is a keyhole. It does not appear to be a lock that would be more resistant than most to tampering or picking, but it is. No burglar, no matter how ingenious, ever did or ever could gain access to the room by manipulating the mechanism accessed through this keyhole. No skeleton key--no, not even the master key itself--will turn the heavy tumblers and open the lock that guards the room. At least , not via this keyhole. For the keyhole is a dummy keyhole. The ornamental bar next to it conceals the real keyhole and the location of the true lock. I love this analogy. How often are we kept from finding the truth, because we have not yet learned the right question to ask? We are all prisoners of our preconceptions and faulty models. Those are frequently the problem in faith crises--not the question that arise from them. Keep searching, keep praying, and keep listening to your heart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Here's my thoughts on it: -That I'm too much of a free spirit to conform to the larger church culture. While I'm not a fan of rated R movies and I don't use salty language (except when I stub my toe), I still wonder if I'll fit in to the wholesome Mormons that I know! Plenty of "Mormons" watch R rated movies and use salty language when they stub their toes. Not that they should, necessarily. But they do. Do I need to stop listening to rock music Probably depends on the "rock" music. I think there is wholesome rock music and, decidedly, unwholesome rock music. and watching Dateline Mysteries due to their violence? I haven't seen Dateline Mysteries, so I can't directly give my opinion. I can say that, based on the advice of a few others in my ward, I began watching The Walking Dead (and I cannot imagine Dateline Mysteries are more violent). About 6 months ago I quit watching it. Why? I do not want that spirit in my life. But... as with many things in my life, I changed the type of music I listened to and the kinds of shows I watch not because I was forcing myself to follow some letter of the law, but rather because as I grow in the Spirit, and strive to have that Spirit (meaning the Holy Ghost) in my life, I simply do not want those other influences. We all grow line upon line. There are many who listen to or watch things they probably shouldn't in the LDS church. Hopefully, we all grow up little by little, put off the natural man, and have a mighty change of heart as we strive to repent. -I fear that I'll get homesick for my Catholic heritage. It's all I've ever known, and I get homesick for things regularly. You will. It's simply a matter of choosing a better country (See Hebrews 11). Are we willing to trade something we love and feel sentiment for in exchange for something greater? Yes...it can be hard to do so. But to put away those things of lesser value for those of greater is what sacrifice is all about. Can I still use my rosary to pray when so moved? Short answer -- no. See the previous point. The simple truth is that there is a better way, and even though your heart may still feel attachment to traditions and practices of your past life, as you learn to pray with the Gift of the Holy Ghost, you will find, over time, a sweeter and better experience and develop a truly personal relationship with your Father in Heaven. -I worry how my friends and family will react. My devoutly Catholic father will not be happy. Will it make social occasions with my friends awkward when I refuse a cold beer or a tea party invitation? My advise for family troubles (unhappy parents, etc.) comes down to the same, sacrifice, thing. Beyond that, it's difficult for me to advise as I have not had to experience that. But I can promise that if you bear it in patience that it will be worth it. As to the WoW issues: Sure, there will be some social get togethers that will be awkward. But, frankly, no more awkward (probably) than I get from my fitness bouts where I go to family parties and refuse to eat the junk food that tends to be the center of social life and makes one who abstains a bit of a social pariah. Okay...I exaggerate. But still, hopefully you get the point. -What if I just can't conform to the WoW? I looooove my morning coffee. Suck it up and deal with it. "Can't" is simply untrue. You can. What if I have a sleepless night and have to function the next morning with my kids and end up caving to a hot mug of coffee? Don't. By way of side note: there are plenty of caffeine sources that are not against the word of wisdom if they are not abused or used as a crutch or in an addictive manner. -I also worry about what callings I would recieve. I'm so busy as it is--would extra volunteer hours take me away from my family? As it is, I'm working on a graduate degree, volunteering tons of hours at my sons' school, on the parent board, and volunteering in the school library. I worry that callings would be an even heavier burden that I can bear, and I like the fact that I can choose what to participate in at my Catholic church (I also volunteer there, but things of my own choosing that work with my schedule). The standard of church callings is that they are supposed to come after certain things. Family first. Work second (including schooling). Callings third. Moreover, most callings are not that heavy of a burden. Particularly as a new member. And...sacrifice. Blessings come from it. I'm not totally sure that the BoM is true, Find out! :) If you do not know this (and, accordingly, that Joseph Smith was a prophet, and that the gospel is absolutely true) then the concerns you have WILL be an issue. Big issues! If you do know these things, there are no issues that you will not be able to overcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 (edited) One more thing I'd like to mention, in case any other newbies are thinking along the same lines. My biggest struggle is with the literalism of religious historical narrative. While I get so much out of reading my BoM and tuning into LDS media, I still have a hard time with Joseph Smith. The lack of even a shred of archaeological evidence in either the US or MesoAmerica, the KJV matching mistakes between Smith's Bible and the BoM, the Book of Abraham turning out to be falsley 'translated,' It's pretty damning evidence, and even Richard Lyman Bushman cannot explain these things away in his scholarly biography on Smith. And yet...I'm feeling this pull. It is so hard to have my head (which says Smith made up his own religion) and my heart (which agrees with so many of the tenets such as the premortal existence) at odds. In other words--if these things aren't true, why do I still have a testimony??? I'll keep praying, keep reading counter-evidence, and keep asking questions. I really, really, really want to believe. You will never know the truth of the Book of Mormon through science, evidence of the world, archaeology, etc., Why? Because God, very clearly, intends us to follow His word on faith. God very well could have maintained evidence in the archaeological record to prove to the entire world that the Book of Mormon was true. He very well could have ensured that all the papyri survived from Joseph's translation, etc, with proof it was accurately translated, etc. He did not. He wants us to learn the truth of these things by turning to Him and gaining our testimonies of their truthfulness from the Spirit. As to "lack of even a shred of archaeological evidence" and "The Book of Abraham turning out to be falsley 'translated,'", both of these statement are outright falsehoods (stemming, I'm sure, from the anti-sources you've come across in your study). There is plenty of "evidence" (for example http://bookofmormonevidence.org/). It simply isn't concrete "proof". And the idea that anything can be proved about the Book of Abraham translation legitimacy when most of the papyri was destroyed is almost laughable. I'm not saying this to argue with you or start a debate. As I said, the only proof, ultimately, is going to come from the Spirit. God will make truth known if we ask Him (James 1:5). If our hearts are closed because we do not believe, and have no witness from the Spirit, then we can easily find support on the world-wide-internet-of-everything-must-be-true-that-anyone-says. If, on the other hand, we have a witness from the Spirit, there is also support for that by way of the link I posted above, fairmormon.org, jefflindsay.com, and other LDS apologists* who provide perfectly reasonably explanations for most things. Do they "prove" it? No. Of course not. But if one has the witness from God of the truth, they give many great explanations to some of the difficult issues. * I should add, askgramps.org. Not an "apologist" per se, but still some great answers to a variety of questions. Edited July 20, 2015 by The Folk Prophet Vort 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkstpaul Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Assuming you are stating that you believe this to be the True church and the leaders are prophets, seers, and revelators: When being baptised, there are some specific things you are committing to. Paying tithing, living the Word of Wisdom, and following the Law of Chastity. If in fact, you wish to be a smoker, or drinker and don't want to give up casual sex, or can't dream of parting with 10%, then don't commit to baptism. If you can master those three things, you need not worry about a squeakly clean presentation in the LDS culture. I can't stress enough that not being willing to commit to those things will not be tolerated within the culture (i.e. you will not progress in callings and temple blessing, etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Assuming you are stating that you believe this to be the True church and the leaders are prophets, seers, and revelators: When being baptised, there are some specific things you are committing to. Paying tithing, living the Word of Wisdom, and following the Law of Chastity. If in fact, you wish to be a smoker, or drinker and don't want to give up casual sex, or can't dream of parting with 10%, then don't commit to baptism. If you can master those three things, you need not worry about a squeakly clean presentation in the LDS culture. I can't stress enough that not being willing to commit to those things will not be tolerated within the culture (i.e. you will not progress in callings and temple blessing, etc.) In toto, I agree with this. I would just note that there is a large gradient in both visibility and seriousness of the mentioned items.The law of chastity is pretty much a sine qua non. Sure, lots of our fellow Saints stumble in this area, and we don't discard or shun them because of it, but if you're going to be a Saint, that's really sort of a minimal expectation.Tithing is indeed important, but it's pretty much invisible to others (aside from Temple blessings -- you can't go to the temple if you don't pay tithing). Your tithing status is between you and your bishop, so no one else will know about it.Word of Wisdom issues are among the most visible, and are certainly not unimportant. But in my experience, most Saints over the age of 18 really aren't that hung up on WoW issues. If you're having trouble quitting smoking, people empathize. It's a temple issue, and it's important. But it simply is not in the same category with adultery. Now, if you really have no intention of giving up your beer or cigs. that's another matter. If that is how you feel, you should not be getting baptized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkstpaul Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Short answer -- no. See the previous point. The simple truth is that there is a better way, and even though your heart may still feel attachment to traditions and practices of your past life, as you learn to pray with the Gift of the Holy Ghost, you will find, over time, a sweeter and better experience and develop a truly personal relationship with your Father in Heaven. I disagree on this point (regarding the use of the rosary. President Hinckley taught - bring with you your faith and we will add to it - semi-paraphrased. This is also backed up by the 13th Article of Faith - If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things. If a person has established value in using the Rosary, there is no harm done in doing so. This would likely be at home alone and not in the chapel or classroom. I am keeping in mind the fact that some of the prayers are contrary to our doctrine but it isn't exactly a pledge of allegiance to the Catholic church. In fact, especially if you pray the Mysteries, is very meditative and spritually fulfilling. Jane_Doe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Folk Prophet Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 I disagree on this point (regarding the use of the rosary. President Hinckley taught - bring with you your faith and we will add to it - semi-paraphrased. This is also backed up by the 13th Article of Faith - If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things. If a person has established value in using the Rosary, there is no harm done in doing so. This would likely be at home alone and not in the chapel or classroom. I am keeping in mind the fact that some of the prayers are contrary to our doctrine but it isn't exactly a pledge of allegiance to the Catholic church. In fact, especially if you pray the Mysteries, is very meditative and spritually fulfilling. I don't know a ton about the Rosary...but based on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosary, I think it quite plain that praying on the rosary is an incorrect tradition that should not be continued. Now having or holding a rosary as a sentimental thing....that's, perhaps, a different matter. Using it to count off Hail Mary prayers, though is inappropriate for a converted Latter-day Saint, and should rightly be discouraged in favor of a better way. Application of Pres. Hinkley's teaching here doesn't imply that we should hold onto false traditions. Bring truth, discard error. Clearly it's not going to be a show stopper to use a rosary. But I think it valid to plainly say that the tradition, ultimately, should be discarded. Backroads 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 (edited) I disagree on this point (regarding the use of the rosary. President Hinckley taught - bring with you your faith and we will add to it - semi-paraphrased. This is also backed up by the 13th Article of Faith - If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things. If a person has established value in using the Rosary, there is no harm done in doing so. This would likely be at home alone and not in the chapel or classroom. I am keeping in mind the fact that some of the prayers are contrary to our doctrine but it isn't exactly a pledge of allegiance to the Catholic church. In fact, especially if you pray the Mysteries, is very meditative and spritually fulfilling.I am former Catholic who went to Catholic school from 5th-12th. My parents are orthodox and we went to church every week. The rosary is a truly beautiful devotion, but I'm not sure why a Latter Day Saint would pray it. I don't see the harm. I think anytime someone prays it's probably a good thing. I feel as though sometimes we religious people (myself included!) get so wrapped up in pedantic arguments we forget the big picture. And I love the Hinckley quote! Edited July 20, 2015 by MormonGator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 I am former Catholic who went to Catholic school from 5th-12th. My parents are orthodox and we went to church every week. The rosary is a truly beautiful devotion, but I'm not sure why a Latter Day Saint would pray it. I don't see the harm. I think anytime someone prays it's probably a good thing. If I understand the rosary correctly, it includes prayers to Mary. This is clearly contrary to LDS doctrine. We do not even pray to Jesus (unless he's standing in front of us). Our prayers are directed to the Father, and to the Father alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MormonGator Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 If I understand the rosary correctly, it includes prayers to Mary. This is clearly contrary to LDS doctrine. We do not even pray to Jesus (unless he's standing in front of us). Our prayers are directed to the Father, and to the Father alone. Great. Than don't do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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