Trying to save my Marriage

[Latter-Day Marriage]

42 minutes ago, NightSG said:

Yeah; that would be why the Scriptures promote deep, dark secrets over honesty.  

He'd be unable to confess to his bishop too, or hope to get away with "gee honey, I just can't find my TR so I'll have to pass on this trip" for however long it takes to get it back.

And then at the Final Judgement everything will come out and not only will there be the original offense, but the many, many years of deception on top of that. 

[Sunday21]

Yeah temple recommend back! Good work man! Keep it up, we are routing for you!

[Guest]

I know you are having some continuing problems with your wife right now.  But, for what it is worth, I just wanted to tell you that I think that coming forward and coming clean about your sins to the Lord, your wife, and the bishop was very honorable of you.  I know this hasn't been easy for you, and I respect you for doing the right thing and repenting.

Edited September 22, 2016 by DoctorLemon

[Nogard_Der]

Hey there man, former member of this site and it's been a while, wanted to chime in!

I struggled with pornography from age 12 to... jeez what 18 or 19. And let me tell you something, it's quite the dragon to slay. You were smart, you knew what you were doing was wrong and caught yourself. That's a hard thing to do, and to be so humble and honest about it is hard to do.

I've been married for a year and boy, sex is important in the strangest ways. I understand why you did what you did while your wife was pregnant. Doesn't make it right, but biologically it makes sense. You are doing all you can to dominate that problem and I really don't see any issue in your approach.

I think your wife has something deeper than the surface biting at her. Depression after having a kid can last YEARS, and to be honest it may be more that than your short stint with porn... As a human, I know how it feels to feel inadequate and tired and overwhelmed. As a woman, I know how it feels to stack hormones on that pile.

Just keep loving her. And be straightforward. Express concern for her needs and see if maybe you can get her to open up in a positive way rather than in this "I'll never forgive you" manner... And definitely meet with the bishop alone and tell him that she is treating you this way... Man I can't imagine doing that to my husband when he slips up on things. It isn't fair to you, and it certainly isn't good for her either.

Express concern to her family as well. If they know the situation, try to show your point of view and your love for your wife and your fear for her attitude. Something could be a lot more wrong under the skin than what you did. Counseling, therapy, visiting that bishop, and prayer, do it all man. Being young sucks, and being married can be complicated! But what I've learned in the past year? It can be done, all of it!

[Mcmkk]

It's been 3 months. My wife cannot get out of this "how could you do this" mindset. I understand why she feels that way. I betrayed her in a huge way at an important time in our lives. We ride this up and down roller coaster (mostly down). We just got back from a short vacation to be with her family. Her family knows of the situation and encourages her to forgive me. Her dad did something similar to a much smaller degree in his marriage and grew up addicted to porn. I have had no relapses. I have no desire to look around. I don't feel tempted. I feel clean and pure and I feel the spirit again. I feel forgiven. It's so hard that my wife acts like she doesn't love me or want to be with me. She acts likE im the most disgusting thing she's ever seen. We just got back and the whole time we were there it was like things used to be and she was so happy and sweet again as if she had forgiven me and moved on. Within an hour of returning home things are back to how they were. She goes silent. Gives me the silent treatment. Says she doesn't know if she can be with me. Flies off the handle for the smallest thing I do to upset her. Gets mad that I ask if we can start to move past this. She is just so negative about it all. This is so hard. Is this normal? I want to be with her forever. Am I being too impatient? I feel that things should be improving and they are at a sort of plateau . She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating. She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement. I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord. She hasn't gone to the temple on her own. She hasn't even read her patriarchal blessing. I just don't know what to do. This is so hard. 

[NeedleinA]

32 minutes ago, Mcmkk said:

It's been 3 months. My wife cannot get out of this "how could you do this" mindset. I understand why she feels that way. I betrayed her in a huge way at an important time in our lives. We ride this up and down roller coaster (mostly down). We just got back from a short vacation to be with her family. Her family knows of the situation and encourages her to forgive me. Her dad did something similar to a much smaller degree in his marriage and grew up addicted to porn. I have had no relapses. I have no desire to look around. I don't feel tempted. I feel clean and pure and I feel the spirit again. I feel forgiven. It's so hard that my wife acts like she doesn't love me or want to be with me. She acts likE im the most disgusting thing she's ever seen. We just got back and the whole time we were there it was like things used to be and she was so happy and sweet again as if she had forgiven me and moved on. Within an hour of returning home things are back to how they were. She goes silent. Gives me the silent treatment. Says she doesn't know if she can be with me. Flies off the handle for the smallest thing I do to upset her. Gets mad that I ask if we can start to move past this. She is just so negative about it all. This is so hard. Is this normal? I want to be with her forever. Am I being too impatient? I feel that things should be improving and they are at a sort of plateau . She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating. She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement. I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord. She hasn't gone to the temple on her own. She hasn't even read her patriarchal blessing. I just don't know what to do. This is so hard. 

Did you both find an LDS Family Services Counselor or not? Last you mentioned you spoke to "someone" who tried some goofy hypnosis thing I believe. 

[Jane_Doe]

40 minutes ago, Mcmkk said:

 Within an hour of returning home things are back to how they were. She goes silent. Gives me the silent treatment. Says she doesn't know if she can be with me. Flies off the handle for the smallest thing I do to upset her. Gets mad that I ask if we can start to move past this. She is just so negative about it all. This is so hard. Is this normal? I want to be with her forever. Am I being too impatient? I feel that things should be improving and they are at a sort of plateau . She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating. She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement. I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord. She hasn't gone to the temple on her own. She hasn't even read her patriarchal blessing. I just don't know what to do. This is so hard. 

Forgiveness is a hard thing for us sinful mortals to do.  It takes time and a great deal of humility to let go, especially when all you want to do is point fingers and hate the person who hurt you.  From what you describe here, I would venture to guess that she's still in the process of forgiving and letting the pain be healed.  Yes, it is normal for this to take a long time.

You asked "Am I being too impatient?"  Yes, she needs time still.  And yes, these things due tend to come in plateaus, with some steps backwards along the way.  

"She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating."  One sin does not justify another.

"She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement."  Which is a huge point of pain for her too.  She'll only move when she's ready.

"I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord."  Not your place to judge.

"I just don't know what to do. This is so hard."  Yes it is hard.  Pray for patience for you, and healing for both of you.

Edited October 11, 2016 by Jane_Doe

[Guest]

I have a question for you.  If your wife is this way for the rest of your life, do you love her enough to stand by her?  Because you can't force her to change.

You have repented and you are temple worthy.  You are on course to go to the celestial kingdom.  Whatever is happening with all this right now will resolve by then, if not much much sooner.  Are you willing to live for the promise of a perfect, celestial marriage?  Do you have the faith to believe in it, even if you cannot see it right now?

Edited October 11, 2016 by DoctorLemon

[Latter-Day Marriage]

50 minutes ago, Mcmkk said:

It's been 3 months. My wife cannot get out of this "how could you do this" mindset. I understand why she feels that way. I betrayed her in a huge way at an important time in our lives. We ride this up and down roller coaster (mostly down). We just got back from a short vacation to be with her family. Her family knows of the situation and encourages her to forgive me. Her dad did something similar to a much smaller degree in his marriage and grew up addicted to porn. I have had no relapses. I have no desire to look around. I don't feel tempted. I feel clean and pure and I feel the spirit again. I feel forgiven. It's so hard that my wife acts like she doesn't love me or want to be with me. She acts likE im the most disgusting thing she's ever seen. We just got back and the whole time we were there it was like things used to be and she was so happy and sweet again as if she had forgiven me and moved on. Within an hour of returning home things are back to how they were. She goes silent. Gives me the silent treatment. Says she doesn't know if she can be with me. Flies off the handle for the smallest thing I do to upset her. Gets mad that I ask if we can start to move past this. She is just so negative about it all. This is so hard. Is this normal? I want to be with her forever. Am I being too impatient? I feel that things should be improving and they are at a sort of plateau . She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating. She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement. I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord. She hasn't gone to the temple on her own. She hasn't even read her patriarchal blessing. I just don't know what to do. This is so hard. 

I understand feeling frustrated at things progressing slower than you want, but you have no right to set any kind of timetable for her.  The deeper the cut, the longer it takes to heal so recognize that the length of time it takes her to work through this is a message to you about how deeply you've hurt her.  And while it is great that you feel God's forgiveness, that doesn't make you entitled to get her forgiveness just as quickly.  The fact that you stopped and haven't gone back is great too, but it doesn't undo anything you already did.   It will take however long it takes, be patient and humble.

[omegaseamaster75]

13 hours ago, Mcmkk said:

It's been 3 months. My wife cannot get out of this "how could you do this" mindset. I understand why she feels that way. I betrayed her in a huge way at an important time in our lives. We ride this up and down roller coaster (mostly down). We just got back from a short vacation to be with her family. Her family knows of the situation and encourages her to forgive me. Her dad did something similar to a much smaller degree in his marriage and grew up addicted to porn. I have had no relapses. I have no desire to look around. I don't feel tempted. I feel clean and pure and I feel the spirit again. I feel forgiven. It's so hard that my wife acts like she doesn't love me or want to be with me. She acts likE im the most disgusting thing she's ever seen. We just got back and the whole time we were there it was like things used to be and she was so happy and sweet again as if she had forgiven me and moved on. Within an hour of returning home things are back to how they were. She goes silent. Gives me the silent treatment. Says she doesn't know if she can be with me. Flies off the handle for the smallest thing I do to upset her. Gets mad that I ask if we can start to move past this. She is just so negative about it all. This is so hard. Is this normal? I want to be with her forever. Am I being too impatient? I feel that things should be improving and they are at a sort of plateau . She feels justified because what I did she considers cheating. She isn't making a decision to stay with me or to leave me. So she stays at this center point of indecision and no movement. I don't feel like she is seeking help or the lord. She hasn't gone to the temple on her own. She hasn't even read her patriarchal blessing. I just don't know what to do. This is so hard. 

You both need to see a real MFT.....the spiritual aspect for you at least seems to be resolved maybe your wife should make an appointment and discuss forgiveness or her inability to forgive with the bishop, but what you really need is real marriage therapy not some hokey hypnosis, crack your wallet and invest in your marriage I can almost guarantee you that you and your wife are not communicating effectively. If your wife won't go you go alone.

[Mcmkk]

On 10/10/2016 at 9:10 PM, DoctorLemon said:

I have a question for you.  If your wife is this way for the rest of your life, do you love her enough to stand by her?  Because you can't force her to change.

You have repented and you are temple worthy.  You are on course to go to the celestial kingdom.  Whatever is happening with all this right now will resolve by then, if not much much sooner.  Are you willing to live for the promise of a perfect, celestial marriage?  Do you have the faith to believe in it, even if you cannot see it right now?

I would absolutely will stand by her. She's the love of my life. 

[Guest]

17 hours ago, Mcmkk said:

 

I would absolutely will stand by her. She's the love of my life. 

Then you are going to be fine!  

Two things can happen at this point, as I seriously doubt she is going to leave you after all this time.  First, one day soon she may wake up and realize that it isn't worth being mad at you anymore, that it is making her miserable, and everything is back to normal.  (I know what I am talking about here - I am one of the biggest grudge-keepers you will ever meet, and time and time again it makes me miserable and exhausted to hold a grudge and nothing good comes out of it).  You have already made up your mind that you would be willing to endure for life if necessary, so what is a few more weeks?

Second, she could stay mad at you.  If this is the case, it is no longer about the pornography - it is evidence of her deep emotional insecurities that she needs to work through.  Christ will heal all afflictions in time, both physical and emotional, in this life or the next.  He is going to heal your wife - the question is when.  You have made the commitment to stick it out, for the rest of your life if necessary, so you are going to be OK.  Have faith, go to the temple, and endure it well.

If this is an emotional insecurity, maybe it is good that you are having to confront it early on in your marriage?  It would have manifest in some other way sooner or later had this all not happened, so why not now, when you are both still young and it is easy to change your ways?  So keep working through it and know that it will be worthwhile when you are on the other side of this trial.

 

Edited October 14, 2016 by DoctorLemon

[Mcmkk]

Just an update. I'm sorry I post so much on this thread. I'm just having such a hard time. She still is struggling so badly. I don't feel like she's trying at all. She's not willing to meet with a counselor. Only the bishop. I come home after a long day and she is super mean to me. I got mad the other day because I'm tired of being treated like such a piece of scum and she said she still can't see herself with me in the future and doesn't even want to entertain the thought. She said she doesn't want to heal right now. I can't understand why she wants to stay hurt. She doesn't do anything to help our marriage. She says she has no obligation to try anymore and that she is trying just By being here. Not even chores around the house. It feels like she has given up but is staying with me going through the motions. I don't think she'll leave me. But she isn't trying to get past this at all. She is just "stuck". What do I do? She has become extremely controlling and I'm having a hard time as my job requires me to be gone a lot. She expects me to do all the chores and watch the baby 100% of the time while I'm home. She won't let me have social media, won't let me watch any videos. Gets upset if I'm gone too long during the day. Won't let me go to the gym. All because she says she can't trust me to not look at other women. She flips out at me for random things all the time and constantly thinks I'm trying to look st other women. I am doing so great personally with god and I truly have forsaken the sin. She doesn't believe I've changed and thinks I'm just lying to her and making up my repentance. I'm struggling so much to be patient and bear this trial. Help!  Advice? 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

First of all, no need to apologize for posting on this thread.  You know what bugs me is the opposite!  It bugs me when people come here and ask for advice, and then well-meaning people offer it, but the original poster never responds.    You are just fine.  

The only thing I can think of to tell you is remember that feelings are like waves of the ocean.  They come and they go.  When we are in the midst of a feeling (whether we are happy, sad, mad, whatever) we tend to think we will always feel that way.  But it's not true.  So while it may seem that your wife will always be mad at you, and you will both always be miserable together, that is unlikely.

Since you can only change you, I will give you advice (that doesn't mean I don't think she needs to change...she does, but she's not the one asking for help.)   My suggestion is be as Christlike as you can be.  That means being patient and long-suffering....you can't rush other people to forgive.  BUT it does not mean being a doormat and allowing her to treat you poorly.  A great book for Christians about boundaries is called Boundaries by Cloud and Townsend.  Buy it or borrow it from the library.  Great advice there.  Hang in there.

https://www.amazon.com/Boundaries-Marriage-Henry-Cloud/dp/0310243149/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1478255768&sr=8-1&keywords=boundaries+in+marriage

[Windseeker]

Hey Mcmkk, 

I really like what LP told you. 

As for my advice, I can't recommend this book enough The Peacegiver: How Christ Offers to Heal Our Hearts and Homes by James L. Ferrell

This is the book I feel you need right now. What this book did for me is helped me view those around me as our Father in Heaven views them. This is a huge step towards developing that pure love which attributes include long-suffering. I also learned what true forgiveness is.

The information in this book put things into perspective for me and gave me the strength to truly Love my wife even during times she was completely wrong about me. No book has changed me as much as this book did (I wish it was the Book of Mormon, but I've always been LDS so I can't say I really know what I would be like without it).

On top of that when I read your post I also thought about the need for boundaries as well, so even though I've never read the book LP recommends I think it's also a good idea. 

Some other advice I would add is a little unconventional perhaps. But I don't know what your routine or hobbies are. But one thing that might help is to switch things up. Part of doing this is to create space but you can also switch up the routine with your wife and I think it might be a catalyst for change. 

So if you don't work out, start working out. Go to a Gym, If you already work out try something different like go to a rock climbing gym, start doing Yoga get into hiking or mountain biking. You need to show yourself and her that you are dynamic. You may notice that people who go thru divorce all seem to get into shape and start taking on new healthy hobbies. It's because they realize they are independent and are trying to heal and get out of a rut. They also want to feel attractive and good about themselves. There is no reason why you need to go thru a divorce to switch things up. You are getting allot of negative input from your wife, so you need to show yourself and her that there's much more to you then this problem. If she get's jealous then invite her along but this is your way of taking control of YOUR life and may help your spouse face the fact that you are a separate person with your own feelings, hopes, and desires. The more you like yourself, and see yourself improving in other ways (outside of work)  and the more confidence you show the more attractive you are going to be. One last thing I'd recommend is to also improve spiritually. If your not having family home evenings and prayer with your spouse you need to start doing that. Go to the temple with or without her. 

Just some ideas. Become the sort of man that you would admire. I wish you the best.

 

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

18 minutes ago, Windseeker said:

As for my advice, I can't recommend this book enough The Peacegiver: How Christ Offers to Heal Our Hearts and Homes by James L. Ferrell

This is the book I feel you need right now. What this book did for me is helped me view those around me as our Father in Heaven views them. This is a huge step towards developing that pure love which attributes include long-suffering. I also learned what true forgiveness is.

Great suggestion, Windseeker!  I love this book too.  It's been years since I read it, you just reminded me that it is time to read it again.   

I second the whole post!  

[omegaseamaster75]

9 hours ago, Mcmkk said:

Just an update. I'm sorry I post so much on this thread. I'm just having such a hard time. She still is struggling so badly. I don't feel like she's trying at all. She's not willing to meet with a counselor. Only the bishop. I come home after a long day and she is super mean to me. I got mad the other day because I'm tired of being treated like such a piece of scum and she said she still can't see herself with me in the future and doesn't even want to entertain the thought. She said she doesn't want to heal right now. I can't understand why she wants to stay hurt. She doesn't do anything to help our marriage. She says she has no obligation to try anymore and that she is trying just By being here. Not even chores around the house. It feels like she has given up but is staying with me going through the motions. I don't think she'll leave me. But she isn't trying to get past this at all. She is just "stuck". What do I do? She has become extremely controlling and I'm having a hard time as my job requires me to be gone a lot. She expects me to do all the chores and watch the baby 100% of the time while I'm home. She won't let me have social media, won't let me watch any videos. Gets upset if I'm gone too long during the day. Won't let me go to the gym. All because she says she can't trust me to not look at other women. She flips out at me for random things all the time and constantly thinks I'm trying to look st other women. I am doing so great personally with god and I truly have forsaken the sin. She doesn't believe I've changed and thinks I'm just lying to her and making up my repentance. I'm struggling so much to be patient and bear this trial. Help!  Advice? 

See my Prior post:

On 10/11/2016 at 9:24 AM, omegaseamaster75 said:

You both need to see a real MFT.....the spiritual aspect for you at least seems to be resolved maybe your wife should make an appointment and discuss forgiveness or her inability to forgive with the bishop, but what you really need is real marriage therapy not some hokey hypnosis, crack your wallet and invest in your marriage I can almost guarantee you that you and your wife are not communicating effectively. If your wife won't go you go alone.

Ok, since you stated that she won't go see my last sentence.  You need to learn to deal with her behavior.  Being a long suffering doormat is not the solution you have a child and you need to look out for the welfare of that child.  Her behavior is not conducive to a happy and healthy home. You want your child to grow up in a  happy and healthy home don't you? 

 

[Mcmkk]

I absolutely want my baby to grow up in a happy healthy home. I need to go see a counselor by myself and read those books. I feel awful about myself right now and I don't feel like I have any control I. My life. Tonight my wife told me she feels very tempted to start drinking again and she also told me a few months ago that she was tempted to go on dating websites to meet other men. I just feel like I can't handle another month of this. I have been patient but I can't come home and be treated this way and be a happy person. Today was her birthday. I booked a massage for her. We went shopping and went to a nice dinner. The whole day was great and then I came home and she is mad that I want to go to bed at midnight because I have to get up at 4:30. She lost it at me and called me selfish and said that I'm just thinking of myself on her day. I feel so manipulated. I don't necessarily need a response but I need to vent. Currently we're not on speaking terms with my family because they don't like her and mistreat her. She won't let me talk to any of my friends because she says all this is personal. Do I lie to her and go behind her back? 

[Jane_Doe]

23 minutes ago, Mcmkk said:

I absolutely want my baby to grow up in a happy healthy home. I need to go see a counselor by myself and read those books. I feel awful about myself right now and I don't feel like I have any control I. My life. Tonight my wife told me she feels very tempted to start drinking again and she also told me a few months ago that she was tempted to go on dating websites to meet other men. I just feel like I can't handle another month of this. I have been patient but I can't come home and be treated this way and be a happy person. Today was her birthday. I booked a massage for her. We went shopping and went to a nice dinner. The whole day was great and then I came home and she is mad that I want to go to bed at midnight because I have to get up at 4:30. She lost it at me and called me selfish and said that I'm just thinking of myself on her day. I feel so manipulated. I don't necessarily need a response but I need to vent. Currently we're not on speaking terms with my family because they don't like her and mistreat her. She won't let me talk to any of my friends because she says all this is personal. Do I lie to her and go behind her back? 

For starters: *hugs*

As to your question: " She won't let me talk to any of my friends because she says all this is personal. Do I lie to her and go behind her back?"  This alone is a major red flag.  Healthy relationship don't dwell in secrecy.  You need to talk to someone about what's going on in your life: you're not supposed to be going at things alone, and such is majorly destructive.  If it were me in your situation, I would not honor this destructive request.  This does not mean you lie about it or go behind here back, but honestly deny her destructive request.  She'll be upset, but it's better than any other alternative.

(Just 2 cents from a stranger on the internet)

Edited November 5, 2016 by Jane_Doe

[Mcmkk]

Well she says that if I go to anyone for support she'll leave me. Just tried that so I don't really know what to do. What do I do?

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

2 hours ago, Mcmkk said:

Well she says that if I go to anyone for support she'll leave me. Just tried that so I don't really know what to do. What do I do?

Her threat sounds like something an abuser would say.  Huge red flag.  Go get some support.  Start with your Bishop.  

[Sunday21]

Second that, triple that, Talk to Bishop! 

[Sunday21]

By the way, if distance is a problem, I think you can have lds counselling by Skype. You really, really need to get some lds advice from a trusted source. Good luck!

[Guest]

I am trying very hard not to say anything that would be discouraging to your efforts, but threatening to start drinking again, threatening to indulge in infidelity, and saying you cannot talk with your friends and family are crazy and abusive behaviors.  I don't really know how to advise you when confronting crazy and abusive behavior, but it is not right for you to be isolated and to suffer alone.  Does the bishop know that all this is going on?  Maybe he has some better advice...

[Just Someone]

I have not read this entire feed, but what I have read causes me some concern. I only know some basics of psychology, and I would never pretend that I can diagnose, but it sounds like your wife needs to be evaluated. There are many personality disorders that include manipulation and threatening to self-harm if you don't do what they want.

On another note, my husband came to me with the same confession. Yes, it was crushing. It took a long time, even after I had forgiven him, to be comfortable being intimate with him again. I would wonder if he thought I was as attractive as the girls he looked at, but I did come to forgive him. The key for me was to figure out who I am, to be comfortable with who I am, and to learn to love myself for who I am. All this rejection she is giving you may, if she is experiencing what I did, just be that she doesn't love herself. SHE has to be able to do it, and there really isn't anything you can do for her, except love her and show her that you are committed to your eternal marriage. I know it's hard to face the possibility that it isn't really in your hands, but continue to pray for her and ask God to help you forgive her for her controlling behavior. It is a long road, one that you will have to carry the marriage on your own through some of it, but in the end, hopefully worth it. For me, my husband and I are as strong as ever now.