Few Will Find Celestial Glory

[clbent04]

Matthew 7:14 states "Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."  So does this mean less than half of us under God's realm will ever make it to the Celestial Kingdom?

Since there are very few who will be going to Outer Darkness, and not a high percentage of us who are murderers and rapists (Telestial Kindgom - not that all murderers and rapists can't be forgiven and possibly qualify for a higher kingdom), I think most of us will be in the Terrestrial Kingdom.

How would you interpret Matthew 7:14, and if you interpret it the way I do, how do you define "a few"?  Because I define a few as not more than 20 percent.

Edited August 5, 2017 by clbent04

[Sunday21]

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1980/07/the-strait-gate?lang=eng

https://www.lds.org/new-era/1971/08/on-the-straight-and-narrow-way?lang=eng

 

[clbent04]

@Sunday21 Thanks for sharing.  I read both talks.  If I'm understanding correctly, Elder Maxwell is saying Matthew 7:14 doesn't refer to those who will inherit the Celestial Kingdom, but rather those who will find the true path to happiness in the life?  Is that the takeaway?

 

 

[Just_A_Guy]

The Telestial Kingdom also includes adulterers, fornicators, and those who "loveth and maketh a lie".  I fear it will hold the vast majority of those who lived to adulthood - at least, in 21st-century western society.

And when we talk about murder, don't forget about the west's acceptance of abortion.  We have much to answer for.

Edited August 5, 2017 by Just_A_Guy

[Fether]

3 hours ago, clbent04 said:

So does this mean less than half of us under God's realm will ever make it to the Celestial Kingdom?.

Only those that fully embrace the gospel and choose to love it will make it.

Look at all the members of the church and then compare that to the world population.

Then look at just the active members that attend regularly and compare to total church membership.

Lastly, take all the members that are kiving the gospel fully, studying scripture daily, magnifying their callings, living worthily and repenting daily. That those and compare them to those that are just counted active.

It will likely be that last group that "makes it". That sounds like a few to me

[Sunday21]

2 hours ago, clbent04 said:

@Sunday21 Thanks for sharing.  I read both talks.  If I'm understanding correctly, Elder Maxwell is saying Matthew 7:14 doesn't refer to those who will inherit the Celestial Kingdom, but rather those who will find the true path to happiness in the life?  Is that the takeaway?

 

 

I think he is talking about those who will inherit the celestial kingdom in the sense that a certain group will be most useful to GOd in this life and thus will be resurrected to a higher kingdom within the celestial kingdom in the next life. I suspect that many will inherit the celestial kingdom but that within the celestial kingdom there will be many levels and progression will be possible within those levels. I think that once you reach a certain level of understanding, you become more concerned about being useful to God then your celestial reward.

[Rob Osborn]

4 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Matthew 7:14 states "Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."  So does this mean less than half of us under God's realm will ever make it to the Celestial Kingdom?

Since there are very few who will be going to Outer Darkness, and not a high percentage of us who are murderers and rapists (Telestial Kindgom - not that all murderers and rapists can't be forgiven and possibly qualify for a higher kingdom), I think most of us will be in the Terrestrial Kingdom.

How would you interpret Matthew 7:14, and if you interpret it the way I do, how do you define "a few"?  Because I define a few as not more than 20 percent.

My interpretation is that in mortality here in this world very few find the path that leads to salvation. Salvation entails several things. It entails aknowledgement of sin, a knowledge of the Savior, repentance and baptism by proper authority and then continued obedience. In our latter days we see that less than 1% have found this path and of that less than 1% many of even those fall short of the obedience necessary for salvation. It is for this reason that missionary work continues in the spirit world and into the millennium where Christ will continue to work until almost all will be entered into the path leading to life.

[clbent04]

11 hours ago, Fether said:

Only those that fully embrace the gospel and choose to love it will make it.

Look at all the members of the church and then compare that to the world population.

Then look at just the active members that attend regularly and compare to total church membership.

Lastly, take all the members that are kiving the gospel fully, studying scripture daily, magnifying their callings, living worthily and repenting daily. That those and compare them to those that are just counted active.

It will likely be that last group that "makes it". That sounds like a few to me

@Fether I agree that few will  obtain Celestial glory.  I would even say under your reasoning that maybe 2 percent of us will return to exist in the presence of God.

Not that I have access to the Church's worldwide church attendance and home teaching records, but from what I've observed myself I would say 1 out 50 Mormons are faithful followers in terms of always abiding by all the works expected of a Mormon (reading scriptures, prayer, temple attendance, home/visiting teaching...). I might differ from you in my own personal opinion that following all of the standard Mormon works religiously is not requisite to obtaining Celestial glory, but I get it can be used as a general way to gauge who is truly converted to the gospel.

[Rob Osborn]

I personally think that in the end almost all of Gods children will enjoy celestial glory.

[slamjet]

I believe God is not a failed parent.

[clbent04]

1 hour ago, slamjet said:

I believe God is not a failed parent.

Not a failed parent? Meaning you're optimistic on how many of us will make it to the Celestial Kingdom?

[Mike]

On 8/5/2017 at 5:19 PM, clbent04 said:

@Sunday21 Thanks for sharing.  I read both talks.  If I'm understanding correctly, Elder Maxwell is saying Matthew 7:14 doesn't refer to those who will inherit the Celestial Kingdom, but rather those who will find the true path to happiness in the life?  Is that the takeaway?

 

 

I think, yes, that is what one should probably take away from the the verse if one were laboring under a tendency to want to reduce the plan of salvation and of exaltation to numbers. I think the verse is meant more for you and for me to take it personally in terms of our behavior.

 

[Mike]

On 8/6/2017 at 9:41 PM, Rob Osborn said:

I personally think that in the end almost all of Gods children will enjoy celestial glory.

I kinda hope you're right. But I think I'd better not let that make me complacent about my own situation.

 

[Guest]

I have heard it said that temple worthy = worthy for celestial kingdom, and there is a reason that the questions asked are the ones asked.  This is still probably less than 50% of Mormons who are temple worthy, particularly internationally.  But no you won't miss Celestial if you only do 75% of your home teaching or something like that.

My guess is we will have a 20/40/40 split of all mankind between the kingdoms once you consider work for the dead, God taking circumstances into account, etc.

[The Folk Prophet]

23 minutes ago, DoctorLemon said:

But no you won't miss Celestial if you only do 75% of your home teaching or something like that.

Wherein did you get the authority to state this?

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

Wherein did you get the authority to state this?

Let me clarify.  I strongly believe, based off of my readings of general authorities, the teachings of Paul, and the general feeling of mainstream Mormonism that while keeping commandments matters, Heavenly Father is not looking for reasons to keep people out of the Celestial Kingdom, such as over missing home teaching once in awhile.  I strongly believe saying 98% of Mormons won't make it is contrary to the hope the scriptures teach us to have in Christ.  Moreover, I have heard multiple general authorities use temple worthiness as a benchmark to tell if we are headed towards the celestial kingdom.

[slamjet]

2 hours ago, clbent04 said:

Not a failed parent? Meaning you're optimistic on how many of us will make it to the Celestial Kingdom?

I am.  

<Gospel According to Slamjet> It's my view that in the final judgement, God will be taking into account the whole of our environment and influences including that which created the catalyst for our decision making progress; the first being our imperfect parents.  Because we have been raised under the tutelage of flawed people, we can't be expected to make flawless decisions.  Besides, there are a host of flawed people who influence us to the day we die.  Some have it good, some have it bad.  In the end, the trials will be more or less equal and it's how we work within these trials that will ultimately count: 

Quote

We may foolishly bring unhappiness and trouble, even suffering upon ourselves. These are not always to be regarded as penalties imposed by a displeased Creator. They are part of the lessons of life, part of the test.

Some are tested by poor health, some by a body that is deformed or homely. Others are tested by handsome and healthy bodies; some by the passion of youth; others by the erosions of age.

Some suffer disappointment in marriage, family problems; others live in poverty and obscurity. Some (perhaps this is the hardest test) find ease and luxury.

All are part of the test, and there is more equality in this testing than sometimes we suspect.

Boyd K. Packer, "The Choice"

</Gospel According to Slamjet>

[Rob Osborn]

5 hours ago, Mike said:

I kinda hope you're right. But I think I'd better not let that make me complacent about my own situation.

 

The scriptures state that in the end the majority will receive eternal life. Only "some" will be cast off to suffer everlasting damnation.

[clbent04]

25 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

The scriptures state that in the end the majority will receive eternal life. Only "some" will be cast off to suffer everlasting damnation.

@Rob Osborn Could you please reference the scripture you are referring to for me? Specifically how the majority will receive Eternal Life? Thx

Edited August 9, 2017 by clbent04

[Rob Osborn]

2 hours ago, clbent04 said:

@Rob Osborn Could you please reference the scripture you are referring to for me? Specifically how the majority will receive Eternal Life? Thx

25 And I would that all men might be saved. But we read that in the great and last day there are some who shall be cast out, yea, who shall be cast off from the presence of the Lord;
26 Yea, who shall be consigned to a state of endless misery, fulfilling the words which say: They that have done good shall have everlasting life; and they that have done evil shall have everlasting damnation. And thus it is. Amen. (Hel. 12:25-26)

[clbent04]

9 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

25 And I would that all men might be saved. But we read that in the great and last day there are some who shall be cast out, yea, who shall be cast off from the presence of the Lord;
26 Yea, who shall be consigned to a state of endless misery, fulfilling the words which say: They that have done good shall have everlasting life; and they that have done evil shall have everlasting damnation. And thus it is. Amen. (Hel. 12:25-26)

All I glean from this is "some...shall be cast out" meaning some will go to Outer Darkness, right?  Just because some are to be cast out, doesn't mean the majority of everyone else is going to the Celestial Kingdom.  There's still the Terrestrial and Telessital Kingdom to account for

[Rob Osborn]

8 minutes ago, clbent04 said:

All I glean from this is "some...shall be cast out" meaning some will go to Outer Darkness, right?  Just because some are to be cast out, doesn't mean the majority of everyone else is going to the Celestial Kingdom.  There's still the Terrestrial and Telessital Kingdom to account for

The majority receive eternal life. Here is what the latter day scriptures say of eternal life-

4 This Comforter is the promise which I give unto you of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom;
5 Which glory is that of the church of the Firstborn, even of God, the holiest of all, through Jesus Christ his Son (D&C 88:4-5)

65 Therefore, I must gather together my people, according to the parable of the wheat and the tares, that the wheat may be secured in the garners to possess eternal life, and be crowned with celestial glory, when I shall come in the kingdom of my Father to reward every man according as his work shall be;
66 While the tares shall be bound in bundles, and their bands made strong, that they may be burned with unquenchable fire. (D&C 101:65-66)

 

 

[clbent04]

21 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

The majority receive eternal life. Here is what the latter day scriptures say of eternal life-

4 This Comforter is the promise which I give unto you of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom;
5 Which glory is that of the church of the Firstborn, even of God, the holiest of all, through Jesus Christ his Son (D&C 88:4-5)

65 Therefore, I must gather together my people, according to the parable of the wheat and the tares, that the wheat may be secured in the garners to possess eternal life, and be crowned with celestial glory, when I shall come in the kingdom of my Father to reward every man according as his work shall be;
66 While the tares shall be bound in bundles, and their bands made strong, that they may be burned with unquenchable fire. (D&C 101:65-66)

I'm still not seeing anything within these verses saying the majority will receive eternal life

[Rob Osborn]

7 hours ago, clbent04 said:

I'm still not seeing anything within these verses saying the majority will receive eternal life

Go read Helaman 12 again. He wants all men to have eternal life but some will not get it.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

Go read Helaman 12 again. He wants all men to have eternal life but some will not get it.

I misunderstood where you were going, did I?