NeuroTypical

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  1. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to Jane_Doe in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    That's a pretty good kid friendly explanation
    Amen.  On the other side of the fence: I will also say that I do also hear negative stereotypes of religious people from my scientists friends -- those are equally false and harmful.
    We all have a lot to learn from each other, learning which brings much good.
  2. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from zlllch in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Fun homeschooling story that unfortunately may reinforce a negative stereotype:
    My wife was homeschooling our young daughters.  Part of that experience was going to a homeschool Co-op run by our local mega-church.  Various mommies would teach various subjects, and the kids had group experiences, and it was a nice supportive environment for everyone.  They reacted favorably to us Mormons, and while it was clear our theological differences made it so we'd never teach, they were mostly content to love-bomb us and show us their best.  State and US history, music, math, how weather works - all good deals.  Architecture of the earth, geology, creation science - we tended to pass on those.
    Anyway, it was time for a nature field trip to a local nature center!  Wife was busy that day, so I went with all the mommies and kids and did all the nature things and learned from the park attendant people and all that.  As he was describing different types of river rocks, he pointed out several that contained fossils.  I saw one mommy visually react, and as the group moved down the river bank a bit, I was close by and heard a kid ask her what the man meant by fossil.  She was staggering and stuttering through an explanation, looking half embarrassed, half afraid she was committing an offence against God.  She looked at me with an expression that said 'help', so I tried to say something that wouldn't offend their creationist sensibilities.  
    "From what they tell me, it works like this.  Some critter died a long time ago, and was covered in mud.  Over time, the mud became rock, and also the critter's tissues and bones and stuff was replaced by various minerals and stuff that also be came rock, just rock that looked different enough to still look like critter bones.  It happens with trees and leaves and stuff too sometimes."
    The poor mom's nodding head and face was a symphony of conflicting emotions.  Relief, fear, anxiety.  She closed her eyes nodding for most of my explanation, she honestly was reacting like I'd expect someone to react if they had to accept some random stranger explaining nookie to her children using descriptive and detailed language.   When I was done, she let out a big breath, lifted her shoulders and thanked me.  We all went to join the main group.
    A few hours later as we were heading back, I saw that mommy, her kids climbing over some downed logs.  She closely examined where the log was entering the water, and said "look kids - this log is fossilizing!"   She was trying so hard to be a good mommy.  
    Anyway, if I was to summarize my thoughts on the whole experience, it would be this: Scientific ignorance is not a Christian virtue.  Not everyone believes that. 
  3. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to zil in Yay! FDA goes after stupid useless harmful homeopathetic drugs!   
    The sad thing is, the people who believe in government conspiracies (and the effectiveness of snake oil) will rant and rave and whine and complain without ever reading the regulations - seriously, they're not that scary or confusing - they're mostly common sense (though they seem over the top until you start thinking about the long-term consequences to patients, then they start seeming more reasonable).  It may take someone to teach you how to navigate and translate, but it quickly becomes second nature.
    At the end of the day, FDA's regulations are a bit of a nuisance to follow (lots of documentation and record keeping), but understandable and not hard to comply with, and not unreasonable given that it's about stuff that supposed to go into or onto a sick person.
    The company I work for is subject to FDA regulations, so everything of significance that I do is accompanied by paperwork documenting what I did, how I did it, why I did it, when I did it, and who tested / verified that it was done according to procedure and regulation.
  4. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to Vort in Yay! FDA goes after stupid useless harmful homeopathetic drugs!   
    Homeopathy, stupid though it may be, is not the graveyard of science. Science was never a part of homeopathy to begin with. You can't kill something that was never there.
    If you want to find where the decayed remains of science are interred, look no further than the global warming issue, and behold the scientific method being reduced to political conformity (aka "consensus").
  5. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Midwest LDS in Yay! FDA goes after stupid useless harmful homeopathetic drugs!   
    Well, this is about a decade late, but glad to see it finally happening.  
    https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/12/18/571666553/food-and-drug-administration-plans-crackdown-on-risky-homeopathic-remedies
    https://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm589243.htm
    If you still haven't come down the "homeopathy/organic/all-natural are marketing buzzwords with no legitimate meaning and may even be dangerous" curve yet, you're absolutely welcome to come late to the party.  Free t-shirts to the left, dessert table to the right, here's your complimentary bag of common sense.  Sorry for the narrow hallway, we had to stack all the boxes of TRUTH somewhere.  
     
     
  6. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from zlllch in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Ditto.  And while I can come up with a handful of plausible speculations that, if correct, would reconcile the two - I honestly don't really care enough to pick my favorite and advocate for it.  Honestly, I'm content just saying "dunno" on the whole subject. 
    If I get to heaven and hear "Yep, the earth is 5647 years old, dinosaur fossils and other evidence of pre-adamite death were placed there by as a test of faith", then I'll say "huh - well, I'm really surprised but ok."
    Honestly, I've encountered a lot of judging each other's worthiness or status as Christian based on their answer to these issues.  I think 99% of that is just unrighteous judgment and inappropriate ego.
     
  7. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to Jane_Doe in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    The phrase "intelligent design" has some issues of it's own (mostly in the many inconsistent definitions), so I don't like it.  I'm just a evolution scientist and overjoyed LDS lady grateful for our almighty Creator & God.
  8. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from MrShorty in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Ditto.  And while I can come up with a handful of plausible speculations that, if correct, would reconcile the two - I honestly don't really care enough to pick my favorite and advocate for it.  Honestly, I'm content just saying "dunno" on the whole subject. 
    If I get to heaven and hear "Yep, the earth is 5647 years old, dinosaur fossils and other evidence of pre-adamite death were placed there by as a test of faith", then I'll say "huh - well, I'm really surprised but ok."
    Honestly, I've encountered a lot of judging each other's worthiness or status as Christian based on their answer to these issues.  I think 99% of that is just unrighteous judgment and inappropriate ego.
     
  9. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from docjohn in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Well, full disclosure, it's not like I keep all that stuff I said in my brain.  I pulled all those OT verses and church leader quotes from a file I started back in 1997.  Some real scholar did the work and posted it on the internet, I just put it in a file where I could find it if I needed.  I think I did actually go through all those verses once, just to make sure that yes, they do all say what is being claimed.  
    Basically, I agree that more internet-saavy missionaries would be a good thing, but that doesn't mean teaching them more church history, it means teaching them how to do effective internet searches, and how to tell the difference between crap and truth. 
  10. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to docjohn in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Wow, thank you sooooo much for all the answers. You have no idea how much this helps me to feel like I'm not insane or just some rebel  God blessed me with a good mind and it's hard to just ignore new information - that's why I really wish the senior leaders would just come out and give answers like this....it would help members, former members, and those earnestly seeking truth to engage in honest dialogue and feel at peace. Just the respectful process alone is validating and encouraging. I'm so glad I found this site. Some awesome people on here for sure. No judging, just honest answers; that's all I'm looking for. I think the missionaries might benefit by some deeper training in this new era of the Internet. They probably get frustrated with people like me who ask so many questions. Maybe even a separate unit of missionaries with special training. 
    The old testament is very hard to understand - I think Brigham and Joseph both loved the new testament and borrowed many ideas from there (e.g., temples). 
  11. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from zil in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Ditto.  And while I can come up with a handful of plausible speculations that, if correct, would reconcile the two - I honestly don't really care enough to pick my favorite and advocate for it.  Honestly, I'm content just saying "dunno" on the whole subject. 
    If I get to heaven and hear "Yep, the earth is 5647 years old, dinosaur fossils and other evidence of pre-adamite death were placed there by as a test of faith", then I'll say "huh - well, I'm really surprised but ok."
    Honestly, I've encountered a lot of judging each other's worthiness or status as Christian based on their answer to these issues.  I think 99% of that is just unrighteous judgment and inappropriate ego.
     
  12. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Sunday21 in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Hi docjohn, I'll give two answers.  First, here are some LDS church leaders directly addressing your last sentence:
     
    Second, if you believe the Bible, but are skeptical about LDS claims that we have prophets again, it might do you some good to take a second look at the Old Testament, and maybe come to a deeper understanding about what OT prophets were and weren't, what they did and didn't do.  Here's a big dang list to get you started:
    Could a prophet...
    - Kill? Jg 14:19 (Samson); Ex 2:11-16 (Moses). 
    - Lie? Gen 12:10-29 (Abraham); Jer 38:24-28 (Jeremiah); 1 Ki 2:8-9 (David); 2 Ki 8:10 (Elisha); and Mt 26:69-75 (Peter). 
    - Get drunk? Genesis 9:21 (Noah). 
    - Boast? 2 Cor 11:16 (Paul). 
    - For a small fee, use his supernatural powers to tell where to find lost animals? 1 Sam 9:6-8, 20. 
    - Prophesy of an event which fails to occur? Jon 3:1-10; Jer 18:5-10.
    - Gamble? Jg 14:12-20. 
    - Be angry at God? Jon 4:1, 9. 
    - Believe something unscientific? Lev 11:6; Deu 14:7 (the hare does not chew the cud). 
    - Curse children? 2 Ki 2:23-25 (Elisha). 
    - Want vengeance? Ps 137:9; Jer 18:19-23. 
    - Contradict a former prophet? Mt 19:3-8 compare Deu 24:1-4 (divorce); 2 Sa 24:1 compare 1 Ch 21:1 (who caused David to sin?); Ex 34:7 compare Ez 18:20 (are children punished for the sins of their fathers); Ex 23:7 compare Ro 4:5 (does God justify the ungodly?). 
    - Fail to understand a revelation? Ac 10:3, 17; 1 Cor 13:9-12. 
    - Advocate divorce? Ezra 9, 10:3, 11, 19, 44. 
    - Institute strange sounding rituals? Ex 29. 
    - Give counsel not approved by the Lord? 2 Sa 7:1-5 (Nathan). 
    - Worship false gods? 1 Ki 11:9-10. 
    - Accept a position as the chief of magicians, astrologers, and soothsayers? Dan 5:11. 
    - Break God's moral law? Jg 16:1 (Samson visits a prostitute); 2 Sa 11 (David and Bathsheba). 
    - Give two contradictory prophecies? 1 Ki 22:14-18? 
    - Lie to another prophet in the name of the Lord? 1 Ki 13:11-32. 
    - Accuse God of deception and betrayal? Jer 20:7. 
    - Go out in public naked? Is 20:1-6 (Isaiah); 2 Sa 6:20-22 (David); Mic 1:8 (Micah). 
    - Be wrong about what God wants?  1 Chronicles 17, verses 2-5:
    - Teach doctrines which contradict earlier scriptures or were totally unknown to earlier prophets?   Peter's revelation concerning the consumption of unclean animals (Acts 10:9-20) contradicts earlier revelations given to Moses (Leviticus 10:10-11; 11:4-47; 20:22-26; Deuteronomy 14:1-20). Paul received a revelation that the Gentiles would be heirs with Israel through adoption in Christ. He taught that this information had been hidden from earlier generations (Romans 11:25; 16:25-26; Ephesians 1:5, 9-10; 2:11-13, 19; 3:3-6, 9; Colossians 1:26-27).
    Basically, if you believe the Bible, and accept those flawed, human, error-prone, agenda-driven OT prophets as prophets of God, then maybe that'll ease your mind thinking about how our modern prophets might have some flaws and occasionally be wrong.   My worry is that it'll just make you angry at the bible, like you're angry at the church - I honestly hope that doesn't happen.  
    God bless!
  13. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from SilentOne in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Ditto.  And while I can come up with a handful of plausible speculations that, if correct, would reconcile the two - I honestly don't really care enough to pick my favorite and advocate for it.  Honestly, I'm content just saying "dunno" on the whole subject. 
    If I get to heaven and hear "Yep, the earth is 5647 years old, dinosaur fossils and other evidence of pre-adamite death were placed there by as a test of faith", then I'll say "huh - well, I'm really surprised but ok."
    Honestly, I've encountered a lot of judging each other's worthiness or status as Christian based on their answer to these issues.  I think 99% of that is just unrighteous judgment and inappropriate ego.
     
  14. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Jane_Doe in Adam and Eve and Evolution   
    Ditto.  And while I can come up with a handful of plausible speculations that, if correct, would reconcile the two - I honestly don't really care enough to pick my favorite and advocate for it.  Honestly, I'm content just saying "dunno" on the whole subject. 
    If I get to heaven and hear "Yep, the earth is 5647 years old, dinosaur fossils and other evidence of pre-adamite death were placed there by as a test of faith", then I'll say "huh - well, I'm really surprised but ok."
    Honestly, I've encountered a lot of judging each other's worthiness or status as Christian based on their answer to these issues.  I think 99% of that is just unrighteous judgment and inappropriate ego.
     
  15. Like
    NeuroTypical reacted to Grunt in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    @docjohn,
    I'm not LDS, but I've had things that shook what little knowledge I have.  Fortunately, I got the right answers in time.  The very first thing I did was just ask for peace on a topic.  Mormonism is a very complicated religion, in many ways because its members are encouraged to ask questions and pay attention to their personal revelations.  There is no possible way to work through all the questions and issues that come up, so just drop back to the core of your beliefs and ask God to bring you peace with the rest until you can figure it out.  
    The other thing I did was wise advice I was given by a Stake President.  He reminded me that God speaks to us through a triangle.  We have the Prophet and Apostles to bring us revelation.  We have the Scriptures.  We have personal revelation.  Because we are imperfect people, it's often hard for us to understand God's divine word.  If you are having trouble with one point of the triangle, fall back on the other two to examine what is giving you trouble.
    I'm a crappy speaker and this probably makes zero sense to a normal person, but it really helped me.
  16. Thanks
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from seashmore in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Hi docjohn, I'll give two answers.  First, here are some LDS church leaders directly addressing your last sentence:
     
    Second, if you believe the Bible, but are skeptical about LDS claims that we have prophets again, it might do you some good to take a second look at the Old Testament, and maybe come to a deeper understanding about what OT prophets were and weren't, what they did and didn't do.  Here's a big dang list to get you started:
    Could a prophet...
    - Kill? Jg 14:19 (Samson); Ex 2:11-16 (Moses). 
    - Lie? Gen 12:10-29 (Abraham); Jer 38:24-28 (Jeremiah); 1 Ki 2:8-9 (David); 2 Ki 8:10 (Elisha); and Mt 26:69-75 (Peter). 
    - Get drunk? Genesis 9:21 (Noah). 
    - Boast? 2 Cor 11:16 (Paul). 
    - For a small fee, use his supernatural powers to tell where to find lost animals? 1 Sam 9:6-8, 20. 
    - Prophesy of an event which fails to occur? Jon 3:1-10; Jer 18:5-10.
    - Gamble? Jg 14:12-20. 
    - Be angry at God? Jon 4:1, 9. 
    - Believe something unscientific? Lev 11:6; Deu 14:7 (the hare does not chew the cud). 
    - Curse children? 2 Ki 2:23-25 (Elisha). 
    - Want vengeance? Ps 137:9; Jer 18:19-23. 
    - Contradict a former prophet? Mt 19:3-8 compare Deu 24:1-4 (divorce); 2 Sa 24:1 compare 1 Ch 21:1 (who caused David to sin?); Ex 34:7 compare Ez 18:20 (are children punished for the sins of their fathers); Ex 23:7 compare Ro 4:5 (does God justify the ungodly?). 
    - Fail to understand a revelation? Ac 10:3, 17; 1 Cor 13:9-12. 
    - Advocate divorce? Ezra 9, 10:3, 11, 19, 44. 
    - Institute strange sounding rituals? Ex 29. 
    - Give counsel not approved by the Lord? 2 Sa 7:1-5 (Nathan). 
    - Worship false gods? 1 Ki 11:9-10. 
    - Accept a position as the chief of magicians, astrologers, and soothsayers? Dan 5:11. 
    - Break God's moral law? Jg 16:1 (Samson visits a prostitute); 2 Sa 11 (David and Bathsheba). 
    - Give two contradictory prophecies? 1 Ki 22:14-18? 
    - Lie to another prophet in the name of the Lord? 1 Ki 13:11-32. 
    - Accuse God of deception and betrayal? Jer 20:7. 
    - Go out in public naked? Is 20:1-6 (Isaiah); 2 Sa 6:20-22 (David); Mic 1:8 (Micah). 
    - Be wrong about what God wants?  1 Chronicles 17, verses 2-5:
    - Teach doctrines which contradict earlier scriptures or were totally unknown to earlier prophets?   Peter's revelation concerning the consumption of unclean animals (Acts 10:9-20) contradicts earlier revelations given to Moses (Leviticus 10:10-11; 11:4-47; 20:22-26; Deuteronomy 14:1-20). Paul received a revelation that the Gentiles would be heirs with Israel through adoption in Christ. He taught that this information had been hidden from earlier generations (Romans 11:25; 16:25-26; Ephesians 1:5, 9-10; 2:11-13, 19; 3:3-6, 9; Colossians 1:26-27).
    Basically, if you believe the Bible, and accept those flawed, human, error-prone, agenda-driven OT prophets as prophets of God, then maybe that'll ease your mind thinking about how our modern prophets might have some flaws and occasionally be wrong.   My worry is that it'll just make you angry at the bible, like you're angry at the church - I honestly hope that doesn't happen.  
    God bless!
  17. Thanks
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from docjohn in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Hi docjohn, I'll give two answers.  First, here are some LDS church leaders directly addressing your last sentence:
     
    Second, if you believe the Bible, but are skeptical about LDS claims that we have prophets again, it might do you some good to take a second look at the Old Testament, and maybe come to a deeper understanding about what OT prophets were and weren't, what they did and didn't do.  Here's a big dang list to get you started:
    Could a prophet...
    - Kill? Jg 14:19 (Samson); Ex 2:11-16 (Moses). 
    - Lie? Gen 12:10-29 (Abraham); Jer 38:24-28 (Jeremiah); 1 Ki 2:8-9 (David); 2 Ki 8:10 (Elisha); and Mt 26:69-75 (Peter). 
    - Get drunk? Genesis 9:21 (Noah). 
    - Boast? 2 Cor 11:16 (Paul). 
    - For a small fee, use his supernatural powers to tell where to find lost animals? 1 Sam 9:6-8, 20. 
    - Prophesy of an event which fails to occur? Jon 3:1-10; Jer 18:5-10.
    - Gamble? Jg 14:12-20. 
    - Be angry at God? Jon 4:1, 9. 
    - Believe something unscientific? Lev 11:6; Deu 14:7 (the hare does not chew the cud). 
    - Curse children? 2 Ki 2:23-25 (Elisha). 
    - Want vengeance? Ps 137:9; Jer 18:19-23. 
    - Contradict a former prophet? Mt 19:3-8 compare Deu 24:1-4 (divorce); 2 Sa 24:1 compare 1 Ch 21:1 (who caused David to sin?); Ex 34:7 compare Ez 18:20 (are children punished for the sins of their fathers); Ex 23:7 compare Ro 4:5 (does God justify the ungodly?). 
    - Fail to understand a revelation? Ac 10:3, 17; 1 Cor 13:9-12. 
    - Advocate divorce? Ezra 9, 10:3, 11, 19, 44. 
    - Institute strange sounding rituals? Ex 29. 
    - Give counsel not approved by the Lord? 2 Sa 7:1-5 (Nathan). 
    - Worship false gods? 1 Ki 11:9-10. 
    - Accept a position as the chief of magicians, astrologers, and soothsayers? Dan 5:11. 
    - Break God's moral law? Jg 16:1 (Samson visits a prostitute); 2 Sa 11 (David and Bathsheba). 
    - Give two contradictory prophecies? 1 Ki 22:14-18? 
    - Lie to another prophet in the name of the Lord? 1 Ki 13:11-32. 
    - Accuse God of deception and betrayal? Jer 20:7. 
    - Go out in public naked? Is 20:1-6 (Isaiah); 2 Sa 6:20-22 (David); Mic 1:8 (Micah). 
    - Be wrong about what God wants?  1 Chronicles 17, verses 2-5:
    - Teach doctrines which contradict earlier scriptures or were totally unknown to earlier prophets?   Peter's revelation concerning the consumption of unclean animals (Acts 10:9-20) contradicts earlier revelations given to Moses (Leviticus 10:10-11; 11:4-47; 20:22-26; Deuteronomy 14:1-20). Paul received a revelation that the Gentiles would be heirs with Israel through adoption in Christ. He taught that this information had been hidden from earlier generations (Romans 11:25; 16:25-26; Ephesians 1:5, 9-10; 2:11-13, 19; 3:3-6, 9; Colossians 1:26-27).
    Basically, if you believe the Bible, and accept those flawed, human, error-prone, agenda-driven OT prophets as prophets of God, then maybe that'll ease your mind thinking about how our modern prophets might have some flaws and occasionally be wrong.   My worry is that it'll just make you angry at the bible, like you're angry at the church - I honestly hope that doesn't happen.  
    God bless!
  18. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from anatess2 in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Good story: In my wife's ward a long time ago, a new member moved in.  People got to know him quickly, because the week he moved in, he was involved in an auto accident with a ward member, and immediately filed a lawsuit.  He apparently had a certain personality - I forget how they characterized it, but they didn't have much positive to say. 
    Anyway, in a short amount of time, he was called to be bishop over this ward.  Now there's a group of people who can answer TFP's question.  The whole ward, including the new bishop, struggled very hard with this new state of affairs.  I wasn't there to see any of this happen, but folks tell me that looking back, he was one of the best bishops they ever had, and many members grew immensely in the gospel as they wrestled with what it meant to sustain someone with so many obvious flaws.  
  19. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from zil in Utchdorf, Sometimes we have made mistakes   
    Hi docjohn, I'll give two answers.  First, here are some LDS church leaders directly addressing your last sentence:
     
    Second, if you believe the Bible, but are skeptical about LDS claims that we have prophets again, it might do you some good to take a second look at the Old Testament, and maybe come to a deeper understanding about what OT prophets were and weren't, what they did and didn't do.  Here's a big dang list to get you started:
    Could a prophet...
    - Kill? Jg 14:19 (Samson); Ex 2:11-16 (Moses). 
    - Lie? Gen 12:10-29 (Abraham); Jer 38:24-28 (Jeremiah); 1 Ki 2:8-9 (David); 2 Ki 8:10 (Elisha); and Mt 26:69-75 (Peter). 
    - Get drunk? Genesis 9:21 (Noah). 
    - Boast? 2 Cor 11:16 (Paul). 
    - For a small fee, use his supernatural powers to tell where to find lost animals? 1 Sam 9:6-8, 20. 
    - Prophesy of an event which fails to occur? Jon 3:1-10; Jer 18:5-10.
    - Gamble? Jg 14:12-20. 
    - Be angry at God? Jon 4:1, 9. 
    - Believe something unscientific? Lev 11:6; Deu 14:7 (the hare does not chew the cud). 
    - Curse children? 2 Ki 2:23-25 (Elisha). 
    - Want vengeance? Ps 137:9; Jer 18:19-23. 
    - Contradict a former prophet? Mt 19:3-8 compare Deu 24:1-4 (divorce); 2 Sa 24:1 compare 1 Ch 21:1 (who caused David to sin?); Ex 34:7 compare Ez 18:20 (are children punished for the sins of their fathers); Ex 23:7 compare Ro 4:5 (does God justify the ungodly?). 
    - Fail to understand a revelation? Ac 10:3, 17; 1 Cor 13:9-12. 
    - Advocate divorce? Ezra 9, 10:3, 11, 19, 44. 
    - Institute strange sounding rituals? Ex 29. 
    - Give counsel not approved by the Lord? 2 Sa 7:1-5 (Nathan). 
    - Worship false gods? 1 Ki 11:9-10. 
    - Accept a position as the chief of magicians, astrologers, and soothsayers? Dan 5:11. 
    - Break God's moral law? Jg 16:1 (Samson visits a prostitute); 2 Sa 11 (David and Bathsheba). 
    - Give two contradictory prophecies? 1 Ki 22:14-18? 
    - Lie to another prophet in the name of the Lord? 1 Ki 13:11-32. 
    - Accuse God of deception and betrayal? Jer 20:7. 
    - Go out in public naked? Is 20:1-6 (Isaiah); 2 Sa 6:20-22 (David); Mic 1:8 (Micah). 
    - Be wrong about what God wants?  1 Chronicles 17, verses 2-5:
    - Teach doctrines which contradict earlier scriptures or were totally unknown to earlier prophets?   Peter's revelation concerning the consumption of unclean animals (Acts 10:9-20) contradicts earlier revelations given to Moses (Leviticus 10:10-11; 11:4-47; 20:22-26; Deuteronomy 14:1-20). Paul received a revelation that the Gentiles would be heirs with Israel through adoption in Christ. He taught that this information had been hidden from earlier generations (Romans 11:25; 16:25-26; Ephesians 1:5, 9-10; 2:11-13, 19; 3:3-6, 9; Colossians 1:26-27).
    Basically, if you believe the Bible, and accept those flawed, human, error-prone, agenda-driven OT prophets as prophets of God, then maybe that'll ease your mind thinking about how our modern prophets might have some flaws and occasionally be wrong.   My worry is that it'll just make you angry at the bible, like you're angry at the church - I honestly hope that doesn't happen.  
    God bless!
  20. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Backroads in Husband drinking   
    Just something to think about, what's wrong with being judgmental here?  We mormons read our scriptures on the subject and half of them say "thou shalt not judge" and the other half say "thou shalt judge".  It's confusing.
    I recommend this talk from Elder Oaks on the subject.  It really helps us sift through issues like our responsibility to righteously judge and our duty to not judge.  It sure applies here.
    https://www.lds.org/ensign/1999/08/judge-not-and-judging?lang=eng&query=
  21. Like
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Sunday21 in Sealing Cancellation Letter   
    This isn't half bad advice for living life in general either, IMO.
  22. Haha
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from askandanswer in Not really a joke but a bit of fun   
    We were babysitting my 3 yr old niece.  She was excited to come to church.  So excited, in the middle of the sacrament she came running up the aisles screaming "Uncle [NT]!  I went pee-pee on the potty!" at the top of her lungs.
  23. Thanks
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Sunday21 in Husband drinking   
    Just something to think about, what's wrong with being judgmental here?  We mormons read our scriptures on the subject and half of them say "thou shalt not judge" and the other half say "thou shalt judge".  It's confusing.
    I recommend this talk from Elder Oaks on the subject.  It really helps us sift through issues like our responsibility to righteously judge and our duty to not judge.  It sure applies here.
    https://www.lds.org/ensign/1999/08/judge-not-and-judging?lang=eng&query=
  24. Haha
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from mirkwood in Hello from the Mile High City!   
    There are people who become passionate about fountain pens, there are crazy chicken ladies, and there are people who have caught the genealogy bug.  It's a passion that grabs some folks.
    The genealogy of my family is all done by my non-LDS half-sister, who used to make trips to SLC just to go to "that mormon family library building" before computers.  
    Addictions like this span all religious boundaries:

  25. Haha
    NeuroTypical got a reaction from Kenvincible in Hello from the Mile High City!   
    There are people who become passionate about fountain pens, there are crazy chicken ladies, and there are people who have caught the genealogy bug.  It's a passion that grabs some folks.
    The genealogy of my family is all done by my non-LDS half-sister, who used to make trips to SLC just to go to "that mormon family library building" before computers.  
    Addictions like this span all religious boundaries: