When did you know for a certainty that the church was true?

[KingintheNorth]

I still have a lot of reservations about this sect. When did you know without a doubt that the church was true? Was it some spiritual experience? When you had a prayer answered? When you read some history?

[EarlJibbs]

Good morning King. Just a quick note before my reply.

Sect:

1.A group of people with somewhat different religious beliefs (typically regarded as heretical) from those of a larger group to which they...

2.A group that has separated from an established church; a nonconformist church.

I do not beleive that we are a sect. Glad to get that out of the way.

So to my response to your question. It is hard to pin down an exact moment that I knew without a doubt that the teachings and established doctrine was from our Heavenly Father. I suppose there may be some out there that had some sort of miricle happen. But I think that for the rest of us, our testimony of the truth was built up over time. When I prayed growing up, I would feel the spirit in my life. When I would go to church and hear truths, I would feel the spirit. When I would give service I would feel the spirit. And when I would read the Bible and the Book of Mormon, I would feel the spirit.

You may feel the spirit over praying, service or even hearing truths. However, my testimony of our gospel principles are based of the Scriptures. So when did I know? Little by little until I had a full fledged knowlege through the Holy Ghost that this was all true.

There was a moment in my life that I decided to say a prayer asking Heavenly Father to reassure me of the truthfulness. And at the moment I started to ask the question, a distinct thought came into my mind, so clear that there was no mistake of it's origin. It said, "why are you asking? Dont you already know for yourself?" And it dawned on me, I did know, and I had always knew.

Best of luck to you.

[pam]

I'm kind of like EarlJibbs. I've been a member my entire life. I grew up being taught that the church was true. I think I was probably early 30's when it just struck me hard that I truly believed it. No bolt of lightning, no miracle. I think it was just a building up over time. Yet I can honestly say that there has never been a time in my life that I have ever doubted it.

[Anddenex]

I still have a lot of reservations about this sect. When did you know without a doubt that the church was true? Was it some spiritual experience? When you had a prayer answered? When you read some history?

This is a great question KingintheNorth, however, I think you have misunderstood the process of faith and gaining a testimony.

The majority of members do not know the Church is true "without a doubt," because the majority of us act in faith to answers we have received from the spirit of the Lord.

My first experience with the Lord's spirit was when I was 15, then 17, and then 18. At least, according to my sure recollection. I probably felt the Lord's spirit while I was younger than 15, but I do not recall an exact time as I can when I was 15.

I have come to love Joseph F. Smith's words,

“When I as a boy first started out in the ministry, I would frequently go out and ask the Lord to show me some marvelous thing, in order that I might receive a testimony. But the Lord withheld marvels from me, and showed me the truth, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little and there a little, until he made me to know the truth from the crown of my head to the soles of my feet, and until doubt and fear had been absolutely purged from me. He did not have to send an angel from the heavens to do this, nor did he have to speak with the trump of an archangel. By the whisperings of the still small voice of the Spirit of the living God, he gave to me the testimony I possess. And by this principle and power he will give to all the children of men a knowledge of the truth that will stay with them, and it will make them to know the truth, as God knows it, and to do the will of the Father as Christ does it. And no amount of marvelous manifestations will ever accomplish this. It is obedience, humility, and submission to the requirements of heaven and to the order established in the kingdom of God upon the earth, that will establish men in the truth” (Gospel Doctrine, 5th ed. [1939], 7).

Through my faith, through my personal studies of scripture, and through personal prayer the Lord has given me line upon line, experience upon experience, and grace for grace...that I know this is His gospel. This is truth.

I look forward also to the time when I am able to declare, without faith, that this is the gospel of Jesus Christ.

[Bini]

I'm going to be brutally candid here. I will probably never know LDS Doctrine inside out like most and I'll probably never read the Book of Mormon in entirety, yet, I have felt confirmation that the Gospel is true. There are days when I feel lost and uncertain but it's interesting how whenever I get to that point and fall on my knees for guidance, I get it and I feel whole again in my beliefs. Having off days is part of being human -- we stumble and we even fall sometimes -- but with an earnest heart, and a little bit of faith, The Lord answers.

[sarah331]

The concept of a Father and Mother in heaven make sense to me. I prayed about it and I feel a connection to my Heavenly Parents. It makes sense to me that if there is a God, S/He would check in on us every now and again -- personal revelation. It makes sense to me that there was something before this life. It makes sense to me that there'd be something after. These are the tenants of my tentative faith.

The rest mostly falls in there but I'm still burrowing through a lot of stuff for me. And I think I will always phrase it, for me, as the Gospel is true.

[Backroads]

I believe it was during junior high. That was a time of spiritual pondering for me. In the end, this gospel made sense.

[annewandering]

I grew up in an LDS small town. My grandfather, who lived on the ranch with us, was antimormon. My parents were inactive. My brothers and I were outcasts, perhaps due, in part, to my fathers heavy smoking habit, which he conquered later.

Hardly a hopeful beginning. Yet despite this I never doubted the gospel was true. It is not like I see miracles of angels etc every day. Or ever for that matter! It is the peace and occasional more direct touching of the spirit in my life that reinforce my belief. It is not an amazing conversion story but it is mine and it is true.

[Gwen]

I might upset some ppl but......

When did you know for a certainty that the church was true?

Never and I don't expect I ever will. My testimony is not in the church. I went through some very hard times where I almost walked away from it all. During that time I had to sort a lot of things out. One thing I came to realize was that the church was "good enough" but did not have to be the basis for my belief. If it was the basis for my belief then all would fall in end. The church is not enough.

Among other things some key points to my testimony......

I had/have a testimony of family. Through my experiences with childbirth and raising kids I knew that we were family before getting here and would be later. The doctrine of the family was vital to me.

I had/have a testimony of revelation. I had received a lot of revelation in my life that even if I left the church I could not deny the experiences. Even when I was not actively receiving revelation I knew that it was real and possible.

I had/have a testimony of god and that things are to be done in an order with an authority.

These three things were sufficient to realize that though I had issues with "the church" I did not have issues with "the gospel". Right now, here, today this is the church that teaches things I know to be true, it provides the closest of any other to what I know to be god's will. So I accept the church in it's flaws.

However, I would not be surprised and fully expect that upon the second coming christ will start over. Just as he has many times before. I do not expect to be "mormon" forever. I am a follower of christ and his doctrines as they have been revealed to me, right now being in the church is where I find that.

As for "when" it was a growing process to be honest that has spanned probably the last 14yrs. It was an accumulation of events and growing experiences in my life. The hardest and most challenging being in the last 5-8yrs.

[Leah]

I still have a lot of reservations about this sect. When did you know without a doubt that the church was true? Was it some spiritual experience? When you had a prayer answered? When you read some history?

Ditto what EarlJibbs said regarding sect.

I first knew the church was true during one of the missionary lessons. The one wherein they talked about the pre-motal existence.

It has since been confirmed to me time and time again.

[Praetorian_Brow]

I don't think I can say that our church is true, it is a rather exclusive statement that makes me uncomfortable and sometimes I wonder if a lot of people just drank the peach drink, because they see other people doing it. Black and white statements really irk me, as life is never black and white.

I'll grant that our faith has elements of truth and the church as a structure is unique and has elements that other organized religions seem to lack. I recognize that I appreciate the nostalgia of attending church, as in a large part, returning to my roots on a regular basis brings comfort.

To most people, stating their position in a definite way helps to solidify their faith as unchangeable and finite, but I differ in that I recognize that truth itself, is relative and therefore, open to discussion. However, I have no doubt people will view my perspective merely as an undecided or weak vote, which I will agree that is partly the case, however, it is by no means, all of the truth.

[Magen_Avot]

However, I have no doubt people will view my perspective merely as an undecided or weak vote, which I will agree that is partly the case, however, it is by no means, all of the truth.

I think the term Jesus used, as translated in the KJV, was "luke warm".

No offense meant, IMO I think that is where a lot of members are, and where I have been until a year ago.

And that leads to the op...

I "believed" it from my youth,... I came to undeniably "know" it a year ago.

My experience,... and testimony is that this church really is His blessing to all mankind, and our best help in their, um,... our journey to become like Christ and return,... not triumphant, proud and boisterous,... but humble, meek and more like our God and Jesus Christ.

Do I mean "true" church? I'd ask just what others mean when they say it. I know what I mean. But to be short:

True church (the organization): Legitimate; rightful ... established by God

True church (the people): Sincere; not deceitful

Ok, so "we" members have lots of work to do.

So then, yes,... His church, His organization equals "true" church IMO.

I would suggest that when we, imperfect human children of God, receive answers to prayer,... do we not filter His messages with our own biases, imperfections and good intentions?

Does that negate His message? Or do we run with it, even wildly out of control at times to the injury of others? In the name of God, self-righteously call others out for their sin? and quietly dismiss our own weeknesses?

Or do we go the other way and rage against that which is good?

The center of focus is, and should be Jesus Christ. He is true to us and we should be true to Him. This church is HIS organization, His blessing to lead us to immortality and eternal life, if we repent and come to Him.

Edited June 29, 2013 by Magen_Avot

[Dravin]

Black and white statements really irk me, as life is never black and white.

Amusing.

[Praetorian_Brow]

Disdain usually is.

[Just_A_Guy]

I think Dravin was referring to the irony in using a black-and-white statement to impugn black-and-white statements.

[NeuroTypical]

When did you know without a doubt that the church was true?

Here's what I wrote about it. Sorry it's long.

I was a 25 yr old guy. I had realized something 6 or 7 years before that. My entire experience of going to church, advancing up from class to class, becoming a deacon, then teacher, then priest, then elder, all of that had happened without hardly any faith or belief or even knowledge on my part. I was a kid, going through the program the church had set up for kids to go through. I did not know the church was true, and I stopped standing up in front of people to say so the minute they stopped making me. About the only thing I did know, it's that I didn't know what was true, what was important, or how to find out.

So, I spent 6 or 7 years basically enjoying myself on Sundays. I had LDS friends and inactive/non-LDS friends. Both were off engaged in setting the foundations for the rest of their lives. Both seemed (relative to me) fairly confident that they had halfway decent notions of what they wanted out of life, and were shooting for it.

I found myself at a crossroads. If God existed, if all of this stuff they taught me in church was true, then I needed to be on one path. If the church was not true, then I had no reason to be on that path. Mozart composed his symphonies in his mind, then basically dictated them out onto paper as a finished product. Surely it fell within the realm of possibility that this ability might be present in others, even if very very rare. It was conceivable that Joseph did what Mozart did - put it all together in his head, and say it out loud. Perhaps he even believed what he was doing. Placebo effects could explain the results of blessings I'd witnessed. Tradition and a desire to belong, to be a part of something greater than yourself, could explain the church and why it was working. I hadn't really sought out criticisms of the LDS claims in my early 20's - I didn't need to. I came up with enough of them myself.

On the other hand, I didn't really have any firm basis from which to deny the existence of God. Joseph could have been telling the truth. He, the BoM, the church, it fell in the realm of possibility that they all were exactly what they claimed to be. Is a miraculous healing any less miraculous, just because we know a thing or two about how endorphines work, and how the body can be "tricked" into healing itself?

Well again, it was a crossroads. Both had good points and bad. I wanted what my LDS friends had - their temple marriages, their firm beliefs in God and His plan for them. The difference was, one path was true, one was false. I decided it didn't matter to me which one I wanted more, the important issue was, which one was the true path, and which was false. I would not lie to myself or others, in order to follow a false path, just because I wanted it more.

So, I started with the "Old Joe is a fraud" path first. I came within a few credit hours of a minor in philosophy. I came to realize that, as far as human knowledge went, we were still struggling with what the proper questions were. As far as laying the groundwork for discovering truth, humanity never really got much further than "I think, therefore I am." Well, actually humanity did get further than that, but by adding on assumptions that weren't really warranted. That was one key to my understanding - there is almost no such thing as truth without assumptions. People without testimonies assume there are no real testimonies to be had. People with testimonies assume that they are not just brains inside jars, having fake sensory inputs fed to them, having endorphin-based emotional experiences imposed on them by a grand deciever.

Well, the "God doesn't exist" path didn't really offer up much in the form of truth claims to be tested, so I moved to the other path. It was time to figure out for myself if the church was true or not. It had specific truth claims. These could be evaluated, and found groundless or grounded.

Alma 32:27 But behold, if ye will awake and arouse your faculties, even to an experiment upon my words, and exercise a particle of faith, yea, even if ye can no more than desire to believe, let this desire work in you, even until ye believe in a manner that ye can give place for a portion of my words.

Moroni 10:4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

Ok - so there you go. The scriptures identified me, and gave me a path to follow, through which I could undeniably verify the truth. I had only to make one assumption - that my senses would not lie to me under controlled conditions. A tough assumption for a minor in philosophy to make. What if life is a dream? Ok - set it aside. If my life is a dream, then so be it. I'll work with what I've got. I'll work towards truth. I know there is a bunch of stuff that I don't know, and I have been given a series of hoops to jump through, and promised a rather important promise, should I jump through them correctly.

So I had Alma 32:27, and Moroni 10:4. The first promised a slowly evolving process from faith to knowledge, through the assumption that if it looks good, and acts good, and produces good fruit, then it is good. Not really enough to base a testimony on, in my opinion. But Moroni promised something else - "he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.". That sounded a little more like it. So, when I looked at the verse, it laid out my side of the bargain:

1- "And when ye shall receive these things" - Before it would work, I had to read the Book of Mormon. But more than read it, to "receive" it. I had to internalize it - deeply reading for meaning, more than just a cursory glance. Not a critical reading, looking for faults. I had to read it, with the notion that it very well might be exactly what it claimes to be - scripture. True. The word of God. A literal history of people who literally lived.

2- "I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true"

So, I had to pray. Not just pray, but pray in the name of Christ. That means, I had to be worthy of his name. The guy who owns The Simsons brand, will let any amount of stupid garbage bear the name - Bart Simpson toothpaste, cheap flimsy Homer travel mugs, stupid T-shirts make out of inferior materials, whatever. But Jesus is more choosy. If you are going to bear his name, you need to be following his teachings.

This is possible to do, without actually believing in him. After all, I follow some of Sun-Tzu's "art of war" notions, but I don't believe he is a god, and I also don't share his faith. The best advice for a happy marriage, the notion that I've used as a foundation for mine, came from a drunk Tongan I met in an alleyway one night. I follow that advice daily, yet I'm not a big fan of the guy who gave it to me.

So, to take upon myself the name of Christ, I had to do and be a couple of main things:

* Not sinning

* Loving my neighbor

* Desiring to know a God I could love

I did not have to be perfect, I figured it was a matter of heart. It wasn't how close to my destination I was, it mattered only that my compass was pointed in the right direction, and I was following it. Yes, there was some doubt about what the compass was pointing to - was it true north, or just wishful thinking. But that didn't matter - I was just trying to satisfy this part of the scripture - and be able to pray in the name of Christ.

So, I prayed. I prayed nightly, starting about halfway through the book. I prayed fervently. My prayers were short and simple: "Dear Heavenly Father, if thou exist, thou knowest my heart. Thou knowest I am sincere. I desire to know of the truthfulness of this work. Please show it to me. In the name of thy son, Jesus Christ, amen". Simple, plain, sincere, honest, and pretty much daily.

3- "and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ,"

Ok - 3 requirements - and I had to have all 3 of them. In years past, I had read the BoM and prayed in the name of Christ, and got nothing. I was missing real intent - I figured I wouldn't get an answer, and praying was a way of proving my guess true.

It's about where my heart is. It needs to be sincere, not with an ulterior motive, burdened by sin, or trying to get something else out of the experience. My intent had to be true. No faith, no promise.

I can't impress enough on everyone, the importance of these 3 items. They're related, but if you are missing one, don't be expecting anything. If you are having a hard time figuring out where you are on these 3, you're probably not there.

Throughout the process, I was comfortable with my part of the bargain. It was like showing up for a test being very, very well prepared - there's a confidence based on the fact that you know what you're doing. I wasn't lying to myself, or bending any rules, or figuring out the least I could do to satisfy the bare minimum - I was there, and there solidly.

I did not believe in God - but I didn't have to. I just had to want to. I was not setting aside doubts - they held the center stage.

4- "He will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost."

So, what can I say - it happened.

It happened at work, where I was a candy maker, with an arm covered with chocolate. (If you've ever been to a fancy hotel, or taken a fancy cruise, and there's a chocolate mint on your pillow - that's what I used to make by hand.)

The details? Here is where I need to be a bit vague, in order to avoid embarassing stuff about someone who is not me. I was working away quietly, thinking about reality, wondering if I'd ever know what it was, and thinking about an unresolved situation in my life. I was at a crossroads, only tangentially related to my quest to discover the truth about the Book of Mormon. As I thought about this crossroads, trying to discern what to make out of the facts before me, I thought something along the lines of "Well, this pattern indicates that things are moving in the right direction..."

And it happened.

Words can't really explain it - they can only approximate it.

It was unmistakable, not a warm fuzzy, not an emotional reaction.

I had my answer. It was "yes".

It was a strong, internal sensation. Not a feeling - I wasn't happy or sad. The best word is "confirmation". And what was it confirming? Many things. It was confirming that yes, I had just said something true - the pattern I was looking at was indeed moving in the right direction. It confirmed that there WAS a right direction. It confirmed that this notion of reality that I had looked at - this bizarre tale of prophets and plates and revelations and restorations, had the added benefit of being true.

A few side details:

* The first thing that dawned on me was, "My gosh, this is the Holy Ghost communicating to me!" The second thought that came a few minutes later was "My gosh, I've felt this before!" In one or two of the most stressful times of my life, I had felt that sensation before. I had written off the experience at the time, but realization flooded me - the Lord had stood by me, even while I was inactive.

* Other people tell me their conversion stories, and they are often different. My Bishop, as a young man, was watching a sunset, and said a brief prayer "thank you, God", and heard the words as clear as day "You'll be all right - I'll always take care of you". My experience was different. Another guy from my ward had been desiring to feel the Love of Christ - and felt it unexpectedly when he stood up to shake hands with a brother from another ward. They stood there with clasped hands, with tears flowing down both their faces. My experience was different - there was not a lot of emotion (although I pretty soon felt exhilleration, as it sank in what was happening). My wife's grandfather was on a bar stool 40 years ago, having left the church, and was almost knocked to the floor by the words "Wayne, why hast thou forsaken me?" I heard no words. The energy and the impact was internal to me, not external like it was to him.

* I have since felt this impression, this confirmation, quite often. As I returned to church in full force, keeping my baptismal covenant, the Holy Ghost has been, at points in my life, my constant companion.

One last interesting part of the story:

Our scriptures state that faith preceeds the miracle, and that knowledge comes after the act. After I had recieved this answer, I was able to test this "answer", this influence of the spirit, this burning in the bosom, fairly scientifically.

I had an issue that I needed guidance on, and took it to the Lord. What I needed to do in the situation was fairly evident, but I desired that confirmation. To my surprise, the confirmation was to NOT do what I figured was correct. The expirement took about 30 seconds, and went like this:

"Lord, should I do this?" (speaking the words internally)

(nothing for 5 seconds)

"Lord, should I not do this?"

(confirmation - burning in the bosom for 5 seconds)

"Should I do this?"

(confirmation off - like someone had thrown a switch)

"Should I not do this?"

(confirmation on - again like an internal switch was thrown)

I did this a few more times. Throughout the rest of the day and week, I was able to "feel the spirit" every time I thought about what had happened.

So, I acted on what the confirmation directed - and I did NOT do what I thought was the correct thing. Within two days, an event occured that set things to right, that would not have occurred if I had acted as I thought I should. My initial estimation of what to do, turned out to be less desirable than what actually happened.

I've never heard of anyone who claimed to be able to turn an emotional reaction on and off several times in a minute. I'm familiar with how our brains and psyche's work, and I'm aware of various ways we humans convince ourselves of what we want to be convinced of, true or false. I'm aware of the phenomenons of self- and group-hypnosis. I understand 'groupthink', "brainwashing", and manipulation of reality by people in authority. This wasn't like any of those.

So the point of this last part is, this very convincing scientific test (it was to me, anyway), did not occur until AFTER I had exercised my faith, and spent a year on my knees asking to know if God existed or not. I figure if you demand something similar up front, you'll probably go away empty handed.

[Igoras]

As a teenager I had been brought up in the Church of England. Not really knowing where I was heading in life, I read a "born-again" leaflet of no particular denomination which said if you want to know which church to join you should pray about it. I already had had a strong witness of the Holy Spirit when I was reading the Bible (first book of St John's Gospel), and I knew this was something I had to do. And so I prayed and investigated a number of different Christian denominations. No great revelation came at that time, but it was a number of years later that I finally got my answer.

I met missionaries from the LDS Church proselyting on the street. They taught me and as they told the Joseph Smith story the same Spiritual feeling overwhelmed me. I then knew that this was the true Church of Jesus Christ on the Earth today.

And why didn't I get my answer sooner? Well, my father was strongly anti-mormon and it wasn't until he passed away that I came across the missionaries. I strongly believe I would have been so discouraged by his negative view that I might never have joined the Church. The Lord knew when it was appropriate for me to hear the gospel.

[Swiper]

When did you know without a doubt that the church was true? Was it some spiritual experience? When you had a prayer answered? When you read some history?

I had an epiphany in regard to this issue after reading the biography "Mormon Enigma: Emma Hale Smith".

[Traveler]

I still have a lot of reservations about this sect. When did you know without a doubt that the church was true? Was it some spiritual experience? When you had a prayer answered? When you read some history?

I find the question both interesting and exciting. I would compare my knowing the church is true to many things I know and believe to be true. As a mathematician, engineer and scientist I have long investigated that art of knowing anything. Knowing the LDS church is true, is much the same for me as knowing that mathematics is viable and accurate or that I know I love my wife.

I can say that at age 13 during intense study and investigating I learned of the truthfulness of the LDS church through revelation. Over the years I have increased my understanding of the Church and come to better understand its truthfulness just as I have learned to apply and use mathematics and as I have grown in love of my wife. I also find that all things I have learned and found true also produce a great deal of compatibility in my understanding of all things that I believe or have come to understand to be true.

This is not to say that I have never had doubt, considered other things or pursued other possibilities. I would like to say that in all honesty if I could find anything better I would accept such possibilities. The concepts of liberty and applied within the LDS church I find to be both unique and refreshing. Though many, even on this forum think my beliefs to be somewhat in the realm of heresy and vice versa - We are still able to add our ideas freely.

I like that the LDS church trains and teaches each and every member to be more than just mindful or understanding of the attributes of G-d but even expert at emulating and becoming a being of all divine attributes (one with and as G-d). As far as I have experienced and understand the LDS is the only source of such truth and the only institution or environment to even make such an attempt. I do not understand why anyone would not be interested in being invested in such knowledge by whatever means they find possible.

The Traveler

Edited July 11, 2013 by Traveler

[nightcrawler1977]

hmmm im 36 and i still dont know ... i was raised in the church

[Traveler]

hmmm im 36 and i still dont know ... i was raised in the church

In your personal quest for truth - what have you found, that you are willing to dedicate your life and proclaim as true; even if there is opposition?

The Traveler

[TalkativeIntrovert]

As a teenager I had been brought up in the Church of England. Not really knowing where I was heading in life, I read a "born-again" leaflet of no particular denomination which said if you want to know which church to join you should pray about it. I already had had a strong witness of the Holy Spirit when I was reading the Bible (first book of St John's Gospel), and I knew this was something I had to do. And so I prayed and investigated a number of different Christian denominations. No great revelation came at that time, but it was a number of years later that I finally got my answer.

I met missionaries from the LDS Church proselyting on the street. They taught me and as they told the Joseph Smith story the same Spiritual feeling overwhelmed me. I then knew that this was the true Church of Jesus Christ on the Earth today.

And why didn't I get my answer sooner? Well, my father was strongly anti-mormon and it wasn't until he passed away that I came across the missionaries. I strongly believe I would have been so discouraged by his negative view that I might never have joined the Church. The Lord knew when it was appropriate for me to hear the gospel.

That sums me up! I grew up attending the closest church - whatever that denomination may have been. I had many experiences of answered prayers and I felt the spirit on many occasions, but it was never strong enough for me to join any particular church as an adult - until I met with the missionaries in my early 30's and I was overwhelmed with the knowledge that this is the true church.

I still have things in the church that I do not have a testimony of, and I struggle with those. I was given a very strong answer whilst I was in the temple about something - and it goes against church doctrine. As I have been told that the temple is ground that the devil can't dwell it makes it very hard to ignore! Whilst this is unnerving, I still believe the rest - and I wont throw away all the good over this.

Alma 32:26 and onwards is my favourite scripture(s). It is what convinced me to get baptised.

[diane9986]

When did I know the church was true.....

I know it sounds funny but when I was 18 my parents were getting divorced, I had just rolled a car and shattered my skull (i was going 20 mph and hit black ice I now have 7 plates and 28 screws in my head) and it was my last Youth conference.

I am from Nauvoo so for youth conference Everyone Comes to my home town but once every 4 years the Nauvoo stake get to leave for youth conference and go down to Far West, Adamondiomin, and Liberty jail.

I knew the church was true when I was standing in the RLDS (now community of Christ) Temple. It is open to the public and they give tours.....

If you have never seen what it looks like it is kinda like an ice cream cone or a snails shell on the out side and it comes to a point at the top. On the inside they have a dot on the floor that is the exact center of the point.

Our tour guide was telling us about there beliefs in the Book of Mormon and asked if anyone had any questions. I asked if when they got married it was for time and all eternity or until death due them part. The woman answered me with "just like every church until death due us part" I asked even if they are married in the temple and she said yes.

At that moment I knew the church was true, it had to be. My parents were getting divorced and I still knew that we have the knowledge about life beyond this life. I knew that my grandparents will be together forever and I wanted to never have to worry about finding someone new. Mathew 16-- What so ever is bound on earth shall be bound in heaven what so ever is loosed on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

It was so simple at that one moment in time. Families can be together forever threw heavenly fathers plan I always want to be with my own family and the lord has shown me how I can.......

Now I have never read the Book of Mormon fully threw (I usually get lost in Mosiah) But because of that one moment when my life was falling apart I know that the church is true.

I hope this helps a little bit.

[Quin]

As a scientist... I ask myself... COULD xyz be true?

COULD JC have gotten the heck outta dodge? Yup.

COULD people from the Middle East travelled by water (or land bridge for that matter) to the Americas? Yup.

COULD xyz... ?

In every case where there is a practical premise, I not only cannot disprove the negative (not on a philosophical basis, but on the very real ... There are clear historical precedents & or parallels)... But every case I've ever pondered or examined... We've got those precedents & parallels.

On a spiritual basis? Outside of science?

I know many things without proof or parallel, quantity or repetition. I know certain things are so true for myself that they are unlikely true for any other person (in the idea that some truths are so individual they simply don't or cannot translate. They simply ARE.). I know my own mind. I know my own heart... Regardless of how well I express them, or even if I choose to. Knowing my OWN truths, I resonate with others. That click that equals a bone deep "this is right" feeling.

Doesn't make anyone else wrong.

True for me.

Right for me.

Simply, or synergistically.

My first bone deep understanding of the divine? 12. Long before I fell face first into the church (read decades).

My first "No way! There aren't other people who understand the divine like I do!!* Nope. Sorry. I'm perfectly content being a congregation of 1. And here's why. Whaddyamean all my truths which rabidly disagree with everyone agree to every point???" Cripes. Now I'm going to have to seriously do this thing. " 30-mumble.

_______

* Not a better/worse comparison. I was just content to believe differently than "everyone". Finding out there were those who believed as I did had something of a coyote/roadrunner the ground lurched out from under me.

[M_T_E]

After about two months spent with online missionaries and several trips to visit the Portland Temple I knew that the church was true. I quickly found out that alot of my beliefs were already in line with that of the church.

After growing up Baptist and not really feeling that the faith was right in my heart I guess you can say I wandered without direction for many years before finally coming across the Temple by accident one day and having my first actual in depth conversation with two missionaries in the visitors center.

I am not baptized nor a member of the church, but I agree wholeheartedly with the beliefs and that it is God's true church.