Youtube Apologetics

[prisonchaplain]

I am with you in believing that following Jesus is something that must be seen before it can be heard. I am greedy though. I crave to love and believe correctly. Sadly, sometimes folk are so intent on right teaching that the delivery becomes less than stellar. 

[Blossom76]

2 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

I am with you in believing that following Jesus is something that must be seen before it can be heard. I am greedy though. I crave to love and believe correctly. Sadly, sometimes folk are so intent on right teaching that the delivery becomes less than stellar. 

I totally agree with you, I heard a quote once that always stuck with me.  "asking what Church is the true and right Church to belong to is like asking what kind of cheese the moon is made of.  Jack, Cheddar or Swiss?"  I think the important thing is to have faith, not what church you think it is right to have faith in.

[Guest]

Wow.  I guess I missed some fireworks last night.  I take it he got banned.  And he was so inspiring too.

[estradling75]

7 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Wow.  I guess I missed some fireworks last night.  I take it he got banned.  And he was so inspiring too.

Always use the right tool for the Job... and sometimes that tool is the

[prisonchaplain]

It took very few posts to for me to realize this poster was not going to end well. I tried to engage him a bit, but off he flew, with his promise of not getting into trouble blowing like dust in the wind.  :::sigh:::

Meanwhile, back to YouTube apologetics--does it work? (Sorry, I haven't really followed this thread). I've seen some testimonials of people opposing certain groups, or having come out of certain groups, but they always seem to be viewed/liked by people who already agree with them.

[Jane_Doe]

8 minutes ago, prisonchaplain said:

It took very few posts to for me to realize this poster was not going to end well. I tried to engage him a bit, but off he flew, with his promise of not getting into trouble blowing like dust in the wind.  :::sigh:::

Meanwhile, back to YouTube apologetics--does it work? (Sorry, I haven't really followed this thread). I've seen some testimonials of people opposing certain groups, or having come out of certain groups, but they always seem to be viewed/liked by people who already agree with them.

I can't speak to apologetics on YouTube specifically, but I do actually find explaining my faith does clear up things on a regular basis, and everyone leaves with a smile and better understanding.  Obviously that's not all cases, but it is the majority (when you count by the number of people talked with).   

How about you guys?  @prisonchaplain?  @cdowis?

Edited December 29, 2017 by Jane_Doe

[prisonchaplain]

To give a different setting and context, professors from our church's graduate school of theology meet about once a year with scholars from the Catholic church. They grill each other on criticisms of Catholic theology and history, as well as Pentecostal distinctive teachings (speaking in tongues, divine healing, exorcism, etc.). I heard about this in the 90s, so I would not be surprised if the problems of prosperity teachings and televangelism, as well as the difficulties with child abuse and past failures to discipline offenders comes up as well. Our professors reported that they and their Catholic counterparts enjoyed the dialogues greatly. The Catholics said that they had much more tense conversations with Lutheran scholars. When asked why, they said that their beliefs and practices are much closer, so every discussion of difference became one of who was more needing to give ground. Since Pentecostalism and Catholicism are so different, both sides could relax and engage. 

[the Ogre]

On 12/28/2017 at 6:57 PM, Jane_Doe said:

. . . to stand alone- like a letter from a dead dude.  Rather . . .

The dude abides, but is not dead yet.

[cdowis]

CRITIC -- Book of Mormon archaeology, population, hidden cities 

RESPONSE

National Geographic has this article https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/maya-laser-lidar-guatemala-pacunam/  that uses new laser technology to see things through the dense vegetation and are finding interesting stuff.  Among the things

"In what’s being hailed as a “major breakthrough” in Maya archaeology, researchers have identified the ruins of more than 60,000 houses, palaces, elevated highways, and other human-made features that have been hidden for centuries under the jungles of northern Guatemala."

" At its peak in the Maya classic period (approximately A.D. 250–900), the civilization covered an area about twice the size of medieval England, but it was far more densely populated.  Most people had been comfortable with population estimates of around 5 million,” said Estrada-Belli, who directs a multi-disciplinary archaeological project at Holmul, Guatemala. “With this new data it’s no longer unreasonable to think that there were 10 to 15 million people there—including many living in low-lying, swampy areas that many of us had thought uninhabitable.”

[cdowis]

>Mormonism is from Satan

Which of these doctrines are from Satan?
1 We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
2 We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.
3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
4 We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
5. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Edited June 11, 2018 by cdowis

[Blossom76]

On 03/02/2018 at 5:35 AM, cdowis said:

CRITIC -- Book of Mormon archaeology, population, hidden cities 

RESPONSE

National Geographic has this article https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/02/maya-laser-lidar-guatemala-pacunam/  that uses new laser technology to see things through the dense vegetation and are finding interesting stuff.  Among the things

"In what’s being hailed as a “major breakthrough” in Maya archaeology, researchers have identified the ruins of more than 60,000 houses, palaces, elevated highways, and other human-made features that have been hidden for centuries under the jungles of northern Guatemala."

" At its peak in the Maya classic period (approximately A.D. 250–900), the civilization covered an area about twice the size of medieval England, but it was far more densely populated.  Most people had been comfortable with population estimates of around 5 million,” said Estrada-Belli, who directs a multi-disciplinary archaeological project at Holmul, Guatemala. “With this new data it’s no longer unreasonable to think that there were 10 to 15 million people there—including many living in low-lying, swampy areas that many of us had thought uninhabitable.”

I'm no expert at all, but as interesting as this is (and honestly it is interesting and very cool) I like the other side of the argument, what if it WAS in North America, I'm addicted to watching Wayne May at the moment, he presents the theory that the Book of Mormon did take place in North America, his videos are super cool to watch and very well presented,  worth a look if you have the time.

 

[cdowis]

6 hours ago, Blossom76 said:

I'm no expert at all, but as interesting as this is (and honestly it is interesting and very cool) I like the other side of the argument, what if it WAS in North America, I'm addicted to watching Wayne May at the moment, he presents the theory that the Book of Mormon did take place in North America, his videos are super cool to watch and very well presented,  worth a look if you have the time.

 

Of course the Nephites and Lamanites lived in North America.  In the Book of Mormon it was called "the land northward", but we currently do not have the records for this area.

Edited February 9, 2018 by cdowis

[mordorbund]

2 hours ago, cdowis said:

Of course the Nephites and Lamanites lived in North America.  In the Book of Mormon it was called "the land northward", but we currently do not have the records for this area.

There's nothing "of course" about that.

[cdowis]

"BOM written in King James English."

Actually, except for the quotes from the KJV, extensive analysis has shown that  it was written in the language of early modern English -- about 100 years earlier than the KJV, using archaic words and phrases not found in the Bible.

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865609214/The-very-surprising-language-of-the-Book-of-Mormon.html
https://youtu.be/6j-8nh3ctxk?t=31m15s
see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Modern_English

[cdowis]

Copy of youtube post

 

I have born-again Christian friends who say to me, “You Mormons are trying to earn your way to heaven.” I say, “No, we are not earning heaven. We are learning heaven. We are preparing for it (see D&C 78:7). We are practicing for it.”

They ask me, “Have you been saved by grace?” I answer, “Yes. Absolutely, totally, completely, thankfully—yes!” Then I ask them a question that perhaps they have not fully considered: “Have you been changed by grace?” They are so excited about being saved that maybe they are not thinking enough about what comes next. They are so happy the debt is paid that they may not have considered why the debt existed in the first place.

Latter-day Saints know not only what Jesus has saved us from but also what He has saved us for. As my friend Brett Sanders puts it, “A life impacted by grace eventually begins to look like Christ’s life.” As my friend Omar Canals puts it, “While many Christians view Christ’s suffering as only a huge favor He did for us, Latter-day Saints also recognize it as a huge investment He made in us.” As Moroni puts it, grace isn’t just about being saved. It is also about becoming like the Savior (see Moroni 7:48). The miracle of the Atonement is not just that we can live after we die but that we can live more abundantly (see John 10:10). The miracle of the Atonement is not just that we can be cleansed and consoled but that we can be transformed (see Romans 8). Scriptures make it clear that no unclean thing can dwell with God (see Alma 40:26), but, brothers and sisters, no unchanged thing will even want to.

[cdowis]

thief on the cross -- baptism

And where does it say he was NOT baptized? Clearly he immediately recognized Christ, and had been taught and baptized by John the Baptist earlier in his life. Now, what did Christ teach about salvation and baptism? Do you worship the Christ of the Bible or the Christ of the modern day Pharasees -- a false Christ.

[JohnsonJones]

7 hours ago, cdowis said:

thief on the cross -- baptism

And where does it say he was NOT baptized? Clearly he immediately recognized Christ, and had been taught and baptized by John the Baptist earlier in his life. Now, what did Christ teach about salvation and baptism? Do you worship the Christ of the Bible or the Christ of the modern day Pharasees -- a false Christ.

This is a very old debate.  You clearly take the Catholic take upon the entire thing.

I on the otherhand would say this is NOT an LDS doctrine or a Mormon doctrine.  There is no slant on whether the thief on the cross was baptized or not.

My personal opinion is that he was NOT baptized.

The thing to remember is that the Lord is the judge, and the final judge.  Whoever he decides gets paradise...gets paradise.

We...on the otherhand cannot judge, we can only try to save ourselves by following that which he has commanded.

[cdowis]

Destruction in Third Nephi

See also https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/04/110414-maya-volcanoes-eruptions-ash-tikal-science-volcanic/

Edited February 11, 2018 by cdowis

[cdowis]

Here is historical evidence for the Book of Mormon ==  Lehi's journey in Saudi Arabia Peninsula following  the Frankincense Trail
1. NHM   https://youtu.be/e6MVOV92cuA
2.  VALLEY OF LEMUEL https://youtu.be/EyA3j_Ajqrw
3. JEWISH TEMPLES OUTSIDE JERUSALEM https://youtu.be/fjc6I9Fe0nk
4. THE "EASTWARD TURN" https://youtu.be/UI2As25Pz7w
5. LAND OF BOUNTIFUL https://youtu.be/Yemx2inwkHk  
https://youtu.be/PlqlZhot4iw     
6. Metals and gold plates in mesoamerica https://youtu.be/z1sjlWgyG4M

[cdowis]

del

Edited February 11, 2018 by cdowis

[cdowis]

>Mormons believe Christ was a created being.

STOP telling us what we believe. Let me ask YOU -- was He "created" when he was born to an earthly mother?  Of course not because He existed for eternity before His birth.  And that is precisely what we believe.  He has existed or eternity.

[Jane_Doe]

22 minutes ago, cdowis said:

>Mormons believe Christ was a created being.

STOP telling us what we believe. Let me ask YOU -- was He "created" when he was born to an earthly mother?  Of course not because He existed for eternity before His birth.  And that is precisely what we believe.  He has existed or eternity.

And then they say "Well you believe that He was born to Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother".  And then I try REALLY hard not to roll my eyes.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

And then they say "Well you believe that He was born to Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother".  And then I try REALLY hard not to roll my eyes.

My response: And the difference would be?

[Guest MormonGator]

32 minutes ago, cdowis said:

STOP telling us what we believe. 

This is a major, major problem with LDS critics. 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

This is a major, major problem with LDS critics. 

I'd also say:

STOP TELLING US WHAT WE "DON'T KNOW" ABOUT OUR OWN FAITH!!!

Is it insulting to anyone else when people try to tell us that we've been duped simply because we "don't know" XYZ?  I've found that 99.9% of the time, I already did know it and I learned it through official Church channels.  

Yup.  They're doing a great job at hiding things from us.

Edited February 12, 2018 by Guest