Parents and Stewardship

[Fether]

Growing up, parents have stewardship over you and receive revelation specifically for your life. When you are an adult, do they still?? If not, does it end when you leave the house? Turn 18?

[Guest]

I will always follow my parents counsel and I'm 31.

[Guest MormonGator]

I love my parents to death, and I'm very close to my dad. We talk all the time, texting each other every few days.  I disagree with him on several issues regarding faith (he's Catholic), politics, and lifestyle. Neither one of us care. In fact, I remember saying "Jeez Dad, do you care that I think differently on so many issues?" His response, "I'm actually very glad I didn't raise a clone. I raised someone who can think for himself."

 Do I ask for his advice on certain things? Of course. Can I still think for myself and make my own decisions? Of course. 

It doesn't end, but it turns into something different. Eventually, you need to act like an adult and learn to figure things out like one. You can seek their advice, but you don't have to do what they say. 

It's sort of sad when a person over 25-ish can't do anything without asking mommy and daddy first. 

Edited April 30, 2017 by MormonGator

[NeuroTypical]

A parent's stewardship does indeed not last forever. This information is of great help for grown children with abusive controlling parents who justify their manipulative nonsense by citing their supposed stewardship over their children.

[The Folk Prophet]

10 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

A parent's stewardship does indeed not last forever. 

That depends on what you mean by stewardship. I don't think abusive and manipulative is ever a part of stewardship.

[NeuroTypical]

Well, of course, the manipulative parent doesn't see it that way.  The adult children learning that you are correct, is often of great help to them.  

[zil]

I don't believe a parent's stewardship ends except through violation of covenant (i.e. if my parent and I are all in the celestial kingdom, they will still have stewardship; but if we were no longer sealed, the stewardship would also end).

That said, the ways in which one exercises their stewardship would of course change, and like priesthood authority, it can be temporarily lost due to unrighteousness.

(My opinion.)

Edited May 2, 2017 by zil

[The Folk Prophet]

1 hour ago, zil said:

if my parent and I are all in the celestial kingdom, they will still have srewardship;

How does that work? You are a perfect all-knowing, all-powerful god, but someone else is responsible for you?

[zil]

23 minutes ago, The Folk Prophet said:

How does that work? You are a perfect all-knowing, all-powerful god, but someone else is responsible for you?

Will not God still be my father?  Will not Jesus Christ still be my Savior?  Will not my earthly parents still be my parents?  Stewardship is not necessarily equal to responsibility - depending on how you define "responsibility" - when a child is young, you're responsible for their actions; with an adult, you are not responsible for their choices, but you still have a duty to teach / counsel them, and you have the right to receive revelation related to their welfare.

In other words, I don't believe anyone is ever released from the calling of "parent" (unless, in the eternities, your sealing is broken).  And if you are not released from your calling, how are you released from its stewardship?

In other other words, I don't think it's like man-made legal culpability or obligation.

And, repeating what I already said, how you act within your stewardship will change as those in your stewardship change; and your right / ability to exercise your right is controlled on the principles of righteousness, just like the priesthood is.

[yjacket]

Well the ultimate goal of a parent is to emancipate their children from them; i.e. train and teach them how to be self-sufficient, reliable, hard-working, civics minded individuals that can work independently and think on their own two feet. Until a child emancipates themselves (or you do it for them at age 18), the parent has much more stewardship.  But the stewardship at 18 is much less than at age 3. As a child grows, the amount of direction and control that a parent has over a child's life should gradually lessen and more and more responsibility for individual actions and decisions given to the child. The goal being to teach the child to be responsible for their own actions.

Once an adult the stewardship really takes a backseat, to more counsel and advice.  I love getting counsel and advice from my parents, b/c I have learned to rely upon their wisdom as they have experienced more of life than me-but that is all it really is-counsel and advice. They do not have stewardship over my life, they do not control it, I make my own decisions of what is best for me and my family. They have taught me that the One who does have authority over my life is God and that is where I should get the majority of my decision making from.

Now, I personally severely dislike the modern day mantra that is spouted by parents "I want my child to think for themselves"-when it comes to politics, religion, etc.  No, it is completely backwards thinking.

I carry out a very specific plan of indoctrination, yes I indoctrinate my children in how they should behave, in how they should act, in what religion they should be and how they should think politically. I live my life the way I do, b/c I believe it is the best way to live a life and as such I want my children to live a happy life, which comes from the concepts, principles and precepts that I have learned in my life.  I want to pass that knowledge and actions down to the next generation. I will know whether or not I have failed in my job as a parent when my children have children and they begin to raise them.  If they continue to pass down the same principles, I have succeeded, if not I have failed.

Indoctrination does not make children robots-they have the God-given gift of free agency so they will not, can not be robots.  But this much I can promise you, if I don't indoctrinate my children, someone will-and since God gave me charge over them-I'd rather do it than let the world do it.

[The Folk Prophet]

20 minutes ago, zil said:

...but you still have a duty to teach / counsel them, and you have the right to receive revelation related to their welfare.

As an all-etc. god, would one have need of these things?

21 minutes ago, zil said:

Stewardship is not necessarily equal to responsibility - 

Perhaps this is the core of where our views differ.

[CV75]

5 hours ago, Fether said:

Growing up, parents have stewardship over you and receive revelation specifically for your life. When you are an adult, do they still?? If not, does it end when you leave the house? Turn 18?

While D&C 83:4 is temporal, I think it has a spiritual application: “All children have claim upon their parents for their maintenance until they are of age.” I think “of age” can be flexible depending on culture, but generally speaking, the going age of receiving the Melichizedek Priesthood or marriage. But no sooner than the age of eight (D&C 68:25).

[person0]

Quote

Stewardship:

Responsibility to administer or attend to the assignments one receives in a Church calling, or to take care of those things with which we are blessed from God, including families, neighbors, and even temporal blessings.  (lds.org - Stewardship) (emphasis added)

Quote

HUSBAND AND WIFE have a solemn responsibility to love and care for each other and for their children. “Children are an heritage of the Lord” (Psalm 127:3). Parents have a sacred duty to rear their children in love and righteousness, to provide for their physical and spiritual needs, and to teach them to love and serve one another, observe the commandments of God, and be law-abiding citizens wherever they live. Husbands and wives—mothers and fathers—will be held accountable before God for the discharge of these obligations.

. . . Children are entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony, and to be reared by a father and a mother who honor marital vows with complete fidelity. . . By divine design, fathers are to preside over their families in love and righteousness and are responsible to provide the necessities of life and protection for their families. Mothers are primarily responsible for the nurture of their children. In these sacred responsibilities, fathers and mothers are obligated to help one another as equal partners. Disability, death, or other circumstances may necessitate individual adaptation. Extended families should lend support when needed.

WE WARN that individuals who violate covenants of chastity, who abuse spouse or offspring, or who fail to fulfill family responsibilities will one day stand accountable before God. . .

(The Family: A Proclamation to the World) (emphasis added)

The above is the revealed and proclaimed parental stewardship.  Until you are of appropriate age/mind to have these responsibilities for yourself and/or your family, your parents maintain these responsibilities, however, once you maintain these responsibilities for yourself, their stewardship in that specific area ends.  Anything beyond what is included in the responsibilities of a parent is also outside the realm of their stewardship as a parent and inside the realm of personal agency.

Edit:  I would like to add that the fact that a child is outside of their parents stewardship in a particular area does not mean they can automatically dismiss every word of counsel.  Everyone can speak truth and wise words of counsel.  Just as a parent or leader might abuse their stewardship, a child or individual can just as easily reject true or applicable counsel from their steward or from a random stranger.  Truth is truth regardless of who speaks it.

Edited April 30, 2017 by person0
clarification

[The Folk Prophet]

53 minutes ago, person0 said:

Anything beyond what is included in the responsibilities of a parent is also outside the realm of their stewardship and inside the realm of your personal agency.

I'm not sure anyone we interact with is outside the realm of our stewardship.

[estradling75]

Lets not confuse stewardship with dependency.  Stewardship is subject to the rules of priesthood found in section 121 (Even if the Steward is not a priesthood holder)  It broken with unrighteousness and resumes with repentance.

Dependency lasts until the person becomes independent.  The person fulfilling that dependency might or might not change, until independence is reached.

For example an abusive parent loses the God given stewardship, although remain the one the kid depends on until others act to change the situation.

Non abusive parents raise the kids until they become independent.  The stewardship remains it just becomes more and more like God's is.  Namely the kids make their own choices, but the parents are still their to support and advise as much as the kid wants to listen and heed.

 

[Guest]

Quote

And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?

Matt 19:5

Sounds like once they're married.

Edited May 1, 2017 by Guest

[The Folk Prophet]

23 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

Sounds like once they're married.

If stewardship fully ends once I leave the nest and marry, then why, would you say, if I get into financial trouble, am I meant to go to my parents first for assistance?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, The Folk Prophet said:

If stewardship fully ends once I leave the nest and marry, then why, would you say, if I get into financial trouble, am I meant to go to my parents first for assistance?

1. Financial assistance has nothing to do with stewardship in the gospel sense.  It is entirely based on relationships and our own desire to help our children.  Even so, I don't know of anyone that says you're "meant to go to" your parents for assistance.  Societally, that is what we do.  But is that written in scriptures somewhere?  I can imagine that perhaps (I haven't looked) that the handbook of instruction says something like that.  But that is more of a relationship and social order kind of thing rather than a principle of the gospel (IMO).
2. The OP specifically talked about stewardship in the context of receiving revelation for those under your stewardship.  As parents, we may receive revelation for our children even after they are grown up and moved out.  But married children are not held under the same requirement to follow as they would if they were still children under the same roof any more than we would be if a friend were to tell us they received revelation for us (which I think happens sometimes).

[zil]

40 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

I don't know of anyone that says you're "meant to go to" your parents for assistance.

It doesn't specifically say parents, but parents certainly are among the most applicable...  Handbook 2, chapter 6, 6.1.1

Quote

When Church members are doing all they can to provide for themselves but cannot meet their basic needs, generally they should first turn to their families for help. When this is not sufficient or feasible, the Church stands ready to help.

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, zil said:

It doesn't specifically say parents, but parents certainly are among the most applicable...  Handbook 2, chapter 6, 6.1.1

Hence:

49 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

I can imagine... that the handbook of instruction says something like that.  But that is more of a relationship and social order kind of thing rather than a principle of the gospel (IMO).

In other words, many times HB1 and HB2 provide guidance based on how systems are set up currently and work within that existing system for efficiency purposes.  I do not believe this instruction is a declaration of that being the God-Inspired means for us to do things based on eternal principles.  And I do not believe it to be about stewardship.

Edited May 1, 2017 by Guest

[NeuroTypical]

23 hours ago, zil said:

In other words, I don't believe anyone is ever released from the calling of "parent" (unless, in the eternities, your sealing is broken).  And if you are not released from your calling, how are you released from its stewardship?

I'm wondering how this plays out in real life.  Using the definition person0 snagged from lds.org:

Stewardship:Responsibility ... to take care of those things with which we are blessed from God, including families, neighbors, and even temporal blessings.

So, there's an 80 yr old mom and dad.  They live in Pocatello.  There's a 60 yr old son, living in New York with his wife, kids, and grandkids.  Son left home at 18 and joined the military, and has been self-sustaining ever since.  60 yr old son gets cancer, loses his job and health insurance, they forclose on his mortgage, his wife leaves him, and his children sue him.  What power/responsibility/stewardship exactly does his 80 yr old parents have?

Do they have responsibility over his medical bills?  Do they need to buy him a place to live?  Do they need to pay for his legal fees?  Do they foot the bill for his ex-wife's alimony?  If they do not do all these things, are they neglecting their stewardship, and held accountable by God?

Again, if they have stewardship over their 60 yr old son, and 60 yr old son owes someone a million bucks, that means those bucks stop with the person holding the stewardship.  Right?

[my two cents]

2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

1. Financial assistance has nothing to do with stewardship in the gospel sense.  It is entirely based on relationships and our own desire to help our children.  Even so, I don't know of anyone that says you're "meant to go to" your parents for assistance.  Societally, that is what we do.  But is that written in scriptures somewhere?  I can imagine that perhaps (I haven't looked) that the handbook of instruction says something like that.  But that is more of a relationship and social order kind of thing rather than a principle of the gospel (IMO).

See 1 Timothy chapter 5

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, my two cents said:

See 1 Timothy chapter 5

Believe it or not, that actually makes my point quite nicely.

If the OP was just about money or caring, then we're all stewards of each other.  But when he interjected revelation into it, that's a different kind of stewardship.

We have a general commandment to care for the poor.  And grown children are supposed to support their aging parents. That is the commandment we're given.  But to say this is our "stewardship" in the sense the OP was using it would mean that we can receive revelation for our parents and they are to obey us.  That doesn't make sense.

Thus, we have to conclude that, while we still have a commandment to help those in need and especially to "requite our parents", we do not have stewardship OVER them in the manner I've just described (which I believe was the intent of the OP).

 

[Anddenex]

On 4/30/2017 at 8:31 AM, Fether said:

Growing up, parents have stewardship over you and receive revelation specifically for your life. When you are an adult, do they still?? If not, does it end when you leave the house? Turn 18?

The scriptures highlight a parents relationship, stewardship, doesn't end when our children are older. Adam will still preside at a general assembly before Christ comes. This is evidence of his stewardship in life and even after death/resurrection. 

Joseph in Egypt still sought out his father's blessings for his children, Jacob's grandchildren (potentially highlighting extending stewardships of grandparents). Why didn't Joseph bless his own children, and provide the blessings Jacob did? Lehi pulled in all his posterity before he died, pronouncing blessings and counsel upon his children -- who were adults. Did Lehi receive revelation regarding his children, who were adults, in the Book of Mormon? Yes. Did he continue to counsel Laman and Lemuel; although they were adults with children? Yes. So, it appears, aspects of stewardship and revelation still are in play, exist, even with adult children.

Stewardship remains, for sure until we die, for some even after death their stewardship still remains (as with Adam) and are called back for presiding reasons. I would state the concept of the patriarchal order also highlights stewardship and and enduring one. The scriptures are intriguing regarding the age of people receiving the priesthood, and by whom they received the priesthood from, "Enos was ordained at the age of one hundred and thirty-four years and four months, by the hand of Adam," and "Mahalaleel was four hundred and ninety-six years and seven days old when he was ordained by the hand of Adam, who also blessed him." (D&C 107) Mahalaleel was the son of Cainan, and yet Cainan -- who held the priesthood -- did not pass the priesthood to his son, Adam did. Notice the age of these sons and grandsons. 

Certain aspects of responsibility may change, stewardship remains. I can't remember, and can't find it either, where in this past General Conference a talk spoke of a son who was disciplining his child, and the son's mother said something to the nature, "Son, you are being to harsh in disciplining your child," and the son's retort was, "I will discipline my child as I see fit," and her response back was, "Yes, so am I." Does anyone else remember this?

Edited May 2, 2017 by Anddenex

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

On Ask Gramps a similar question came up once.  https://askgramps.org/parents-stewardship-change-kids-grow-get-married/

Gramps quoted this from the Ensign:  Richard B. Miller, a Professor of Family Life at BYU explains it this way:

“Marrying and leaving the parents’ home requires a fundamental shift in the relationship between children and parents. While parents of young children have a divine mandate to supervise and discipline their children, it is not appropriate for parents to control their adult children. Instead, the hierarchy of supervision and control dissolves so that parents and their adult children are on equal footing. This shift allows parents and adult children to develop relationships that are built on mutual respect and friendship.”  For Newlyweds and Their Parents