Goodness, Gracious, Great Ball(ard)s of Fire!!!!

[Ironhold]

I've mentioned Get Religion before, a website where veteran reporters with experience covering religious topics examine how the mainstream media handles their reporting as a lesson for those who might be reading and wanting advice on improvement.

Well... they got to Vice's coverage of Ballard:

https://www.getreligion.org/getreligion/2023/9/25/a-mormon-psychic-involved-with-the-very-successful-sound-of-freedom-thats-just-the-beginning

[LDSGator]

2 hours ago, Ironhold said:

I've mentioned Get Religion before, a website where veteran reporters with experience covering religious topics examine how the mainstream media handles their reporting as a lesson for those who might be reading and wanting advice on improvement.

Well... they got to Vice's coverage of Ballard:

https://www.getreligion.org/getreligion/2023/9/25/a-mormon-psychic-involved-with-the-very-successful-sound-of-freedom-thats-just-the-beginning

I’ve had non member friends ask me what’s going on in regards to this. It’s a major story. 

[Phoenix_person]

This story has a very unfortunate update.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/2023/10/09/breaking-five-women-have-filed/

I know how y'all feel about the Tribune, but this is being reported by multiple outlets.

[LDSGator]

12 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

This story has a very unfortunate update.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/2023/10/09/breaking-five-women-have-filed/

I know how y'all feel about the Tribune, but this is being reported by multiple outlets.

Vice was proven right. Fascinating 

[Carborendum]

30 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

This story has a very unfortunate update.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/2023/10/09/breaking-five-women-have-filed/

I know how y'all feel about the Tribune, but this is being reported by multiple outlets.

I don't see anything new here.  So, what's the update?

[Phoenix_person]

6 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

I don't see anything new here.  So, what's the update?

The sexual assault allegations/lawsuits are new to me. Maybe that was covered elsewhere in this thread and I missed it.

[NeuroTypical]

I had heard things were brewing, but the Trib does the service of posting the actual complaint.  So, sorting through this thing, I'm learning more ways dudes will go to weird extremes to rub themselves on women. 

The Couple's Ruse - "Hey random woman who supports the cause - I'm going undercover and need someone to pretend to be my wife.  No kissing on the lips, no touching or exposing private parts.  Bad guys will be suspicious, so we'll need to practice our tantric massages on each other to make sure we have chemistry and can fool them!  And when we're alone in our hotels, we still need to pretend because the bad guys may be spying on us.  And you're doing it to save children - whaddaya say?"

And this little gem:

Aaaand, I stopped reading at item 90, because there's more and more and more.  The women allege that all of this constitutes grooming, coercion, and therefore assault.  

 

Grooming primer every human who wants to think of themselves as a good informed human should read: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/head-games/202209/the-5-stages-predatory-sexual-grooming

Up until now, when I thought of grooming, I thought of predators and minors under the age of consent.  This is the first time I've seen it applied to consenting adults.  I mean, I get it, it's just new.  They used to call it 'gaslighting' or 'manipulation' or 'sleezy tactics from sleezy men', but ok.

Tell you what @Phoenix_person, I'm happy to think of what TB did as grooming, even potentially qualifying as assault or rape, if you're willing to read this article and think some long, hard thoughts about the endless instances of LGBTQ activists pushing drag shows and explicit books and transitioning-behind-parents'-backs to minors, in and out of school settings.   

If it's wrong when Ballard does it to adult women, is it also wrong when LGBTQ folks do it to minors?
 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/head-games/202209/the-5-stages-predatory-sexual-grooming

Bolding, underlining, and editing mine:

Quote

Stage 1: Selecting the Victim. Offenders may ... seek out a victim for emotional or psychological characteristics, such as being low on self-esteem, neglected, or trusting. 

Stage 2: Gaining Access and Isolation. ... Once an offender has successfully gained access, they often try to isolate the child physically and emotionally from both family and peers, often creating situations in which they are alone with victims, and with no other adults present. This includes activities like overnight sleepovers, babysitting, or giving the child a ride home.

Stage 3: The Development of Trust. The offender may also make the child feel loved, use bribes, exploit vulnerabilities, befriend the child, and engage in youth-oriented activities. 

Stage 4: Desensitizing the Child to Sexual Content and Physical Contact. ... Desensitization to touch may begin with physical contact, such as hugging and tickling, that then shifts to wrestling or massages.

Stage 5: Post-Abuse Maintenance. 

 

 

[LDSGator]

21 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

Tell you what @Phoenix_person, I'm happy to think of what TB did as grooming, even potentially qualifying as assault or rape, if you're willing to read this article and think some long, hard thoughts about the endless instances of LGBTQ activists pushing drag shows and explicit books and transitioning-behind-parents'-backs to minors, in and out of school settings.   

If it's wrong when Ballard does it to adult women, is it also wrong when LGBTQ folks do it to minors?
 

 

This is part of four stages of grief. Bargaining. Where we’ll admit that Tim Ballard did something wrong as long as we can point to things that others did wrong. It’s like getting a DUI and trying to downplay it by telling the cop your neighbor got one too, so arrest him. 
 

Acceptance will be coming soon. 

Edited October 11, 2023 by LDSGator

[NeuroTypical]

Oh, maybe for some who have idolized him, but not me.  I'm protected by such things by not-having human heroes.  I thought dude's movie was ok enough for a sensationalized loosely-based-on-a-true-story movie.  I've used the controversy it caused to push a real look into real child sex trafficking as hard as I can: https://www.5280.com/girls-next-door/ .   Its a hard subject to deal with, but one that requires good humans to understand.  

But yeah, the church gave him a smackdown, and now 5 unrelated mostly LDS women have joined up to file a lawsuit against the guy.  Screw that guy.  

No really, everyone should understand how grooming works.  Everyone should be on the lookout for it in their back yard, from people on 'their side'.   I used dude's movie to push awareness of child sex trafficking, now I'm using dude's bad press to push awareness of grooming.  

Phoenix_Person should be aware.  LDSgator should be aware.  Everyone should be aware.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/head-games/202209/the-5-stages-predatory-sexual-grooming

 

[LDSGator]

13 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

LDSgator should be aware.  Everyone should be aware.

I’m aware of it, I just refuse to believe the urban legends surrounding it. Thanks to Ballard and his gang of merry men (and their media co conspirators) we now have suburban moms scared to go to Target because they think they’ll get human trafficked. If you think logically, the odds of a car accident are astronomically higher. But they aren’t afraid of that. 

It’s disgusting. 

Edited October 11, 2023 by LDSGator

[NeuroTypical]

Part of the good fight, is the fight against ignorance.   Y'all ok in my book, LDSG.

You don't need to worry about getting human trafficked at Target.   You do need to worry if your daughter goes from a straight-A student to barely hitting Ds, seems withdrawn, and you find a cell phone in her room you didn't know she had.

Edited October 11, 2023 by NeuroTypical

[LDSGator]

Just now, NeuroTypical said:

Part of the good fight, is the fight against ignorance.   Y'all ok in my book, LDSG

Oh samE my brother.  Nothing but love. 

[Carborendum]

1 hour ago, Phoenix_person said:

The sexual assault allegations/lawsuits are new to me. Maybe that was covered elsewhere in this thread and I missed it.

That may be new.  But for some reason, I thought it was already underway.  I guess I extrapolated.

[LDSGator]

29 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

You don't need to worry about getting human trafficked at Target.   You do need to worry if your daughter goes from a straight-A student to barely hitting Ds, seems withdrawn, and you find a cell phone in her room you didn't know she had.

Missed this part. Agree verbatim. 

[mirkwood]

7 hours ago, Phoenix_person said:

This story has a very unfortunate update.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politics/2023/10/09/breaking-five-women-have-filed/

I know how y'all feel about the Tribune, but this is being reported by multiple outlets.

The Tribune is not VICE.  I think originally with the story coming from them people had questions (I certainly did.)

[mirkwood]

5 hours ago, LDSGator said:

 we now have suburban moms scared to go to Target because they think they’ll get human trafficked.

 

Very few people actually believe this and Tim Ballard had nothing to do with that thought process.

 

Oh and trafficking is FAR more prevalent than people want to believe.  FAR more.  

[LDSGator]

16 minutes ago, mirkwood said:

 

Very few people actually believe this and Tim Ballard had nothing to do with that thought process.

 

 

No. People post stupid things like this all the time:

https://www.wilx.com/content/news/State-police-warn-about-sex-trafficking-misinformation-online--561364401.html

We are scaring people to death. 

16 minutes ago, mirkwood said:

Oh and trafficking is FAR more prevalent than people want to believe.  FAR more.  

Nope. It all depends how you define it. How many non custodial abductions have you been called on in your career?

 

Satanic Panic/Day Care scare 2.0. Future generations will look back at this and cringe. 

Edited October 12, 2023 by LDSGator

[mirkwood]

10 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

No. People post stupid things like this all the time:

https://www.wilx.com/content/news/State-police-warn-about-sex-trafficking-misinformation-online--561364401.html

 

 

 

Uncommon occurrence.  Yes it happens, not often.

 

Quote

Nope. It all depends how you define it. How many non custodial abductions have you been called on in your career?

 

A few, never had a custodial abduction.  Trafficking is not just about abductions either.  Or children.

Edited October 12, 2023 by mirkwood

[LDSGator]

3 minutes ago, mirkwood said:

 

Uncommon occurrence.  Yes it happens, not often.

 

 

A few, never had a custodial abduction.  Trafficking is not just about abductions either.  Or children.

This is a tight rope for religious people to walk on.
 

If we want to say human trafficking/grooming is all over the place…well okay, but since that door has been opened, by us,  a reasonable person has the right to say “You know, I’ve heard churches have this problem too. Perhaps I should stay home with the kids this Sunday.” It’s a totally fair point on their part. 

 

[mirkwood]

Just now, LDSGator said:

This is a tight rope for religious people to walk on.
 

If we want to say human trafficking/grooming is all over the place…well okay, but since that door has been opened, by us,  a reasonable person has the right to say “You know, I’ve heard churches have this problem too. Perhaps I should stay home with the kids this Sunday.” It’s a totally fair point on their part. 

 

Ok

[Backroads]

On 10/11/2023 at 11:58 AM, NeuroTypical said:

Part of the good fight, is the fight against ignorance.   Y'all ok in my book, LDSG.

You don't need to worry about getting human trafficked at Target.   You do need to worry if your daughter goes from a straight-A student to barely hitting Ds, seems withdrawn, and you find a cell phone in her room you didn't know she had.

My biggest issue with Target sex traffiking is that the stories were so sensational, make for such a great social media post with such drama and how-lucky-you-escaped, that they blind people to the real dangers. I forget the term, but the average person can only fear and worry over so many things.

When suburban warrior mommies start panicking over relatively minor things, it leaves me wondering if they have the bandwidth to worry about more important things: suck as the example daughter here. 

[Backroads]

22 hours ago, mirkwood said:

 

Very few people actually believe this and Tim Ballard had nothing to do with that thought process.

 

Oh and trafficking is FAR more prevalent than people want to believe.  FAR more.  

I think I saw it on the cesspool that is Reddit in one of the LDS subs, where this woman was talking about her YW leader, pillar-of-the-ward mother was trafficking her (woman sharing story is still happily active in the church). I'm quite sure it happens more than we dare think.

I've seen mixed responses to Target Traffiking. I've seen a sample of people that are very much believing it, but I don't know how big that sample is. Most of them honestly seem to be of the boomer age, so I doubt many are active parents. 

Edited October 12, 2023 by Backroads

[Vort]

18 hours ago, Backroads said:

I think I saw it on the cesspool that is Reddit in one of the LDS subs, where this woman was talking about her YW leader, pillar-of-the-ward mother was trafficking her (woman sharing story is still happily active in the church). I'm quite sure it happens more than we dare think.

I don't believe anything I read on Reddit. Partially, this is because I don't read Reddit (which is because I prefer not to bathe in raw sewage). But any time I see a Reddit story, it immediately goes into my "very likely false and ridiculously sensationalized" bin. Redditers just make stuff up out of whole cloth, and people swallow it and come back asking for more.

Edited October 13, 2023 by Vort

[LDSGator]

16 hours ago, Backroads said:

. I forget the term, but the average person can only fear and worry over so many things.

Exactly. And if we scare people over every mouse, they won’t listen to us when the actual wolves show up. 

[NeuroTypical]

15 hours ago, Vort said:

I don't believe anything I read on Reddit. Partially, this is because I don't read Reddit (which is because I prefer not to bathe in raw sewage). But any time I see a Reddit story, it immediately goes into my "very likely false and ridiculously sensationalized" bin.

Reddit threads have two uses:

1- A look into the thought processes and beliefs of Reddit users.
2- An occasional link to a relevant video or source document that you just can't get anywhere else.

I would estimate perhaps .002% of stuff that happens in Reddit qualify as use #2.    However, search tools are pretty good, so if you're good at searching, you can occasionally find something there.  

In practice, I do duckduckgo searches to learn about things, because it seems to cast a wide net across the internet.  Sometimes reddit threads will be in the search results.  And I might give 10-30 seconds of my time to one, just to see if anything has anything to say that isn't raw sewage.

Edited October 13, 2023 by NeuroTypical