Countdown to presidential election begins

[LDSGator]

10 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

In a word: Palestine. A lot of leftists (and maybe even some liberals) who reluctantly voted for Biden 4 years ago now have a very concrete reason to not do so again, barring a radical change in the US approach to the Gaza conflict in the coming months.

I see it totally differently. People like us (strong opinions, passionate) are always more likely to vote against than for. You won’t vote for Biden, you’ll vote strictly against Trump. The right does the same thing.

 

What does your side fear more? Israel or Trump 2.0?

Edited January 22, 2024 by LDSGator

[NeuroTypical]

I'm also seeing an awful lot of anti-Biden stuff from the left.  Some of it is downright antisemitic, but most of it is plain old anger at Biden for siding with Israel, not doing enough to pressure them to stop operations in Gaza, and not doing enough to get help to the Palestinians. 

Biden criticism seems to be occurring at every pro-Palestinian protest.  These folks ain't exactly MAGA Trumpers: https://uscpr.org/oct-2023-protests/

[LDSGator]

@Phoenix_person & @NeuroTypical-I absolutely do think there are never Biden democrats but they remind me of the NFL boycotters from a few years back. Vocal? You bet. Too small to make a difference in anything? You bet.  

[Phoenix_person]

16 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

Too small to make a difference in anything? You bet.  

You sure about that? 😬

[LDSGator]

7 minutes ago, Phoenix_person said:

You sure about that? 😬

Lol! That’s awesome. 
 

But this isn’t 2016. I’m convinced that Trumps capital riot, whining about stolen elections and criminal indictments will energize your base and they’ll come out in droves. It’ll also push the last few moderates out there (both of them) to Bidens side. 

Edited January 22, 2024 by LDSGator

[NeuroTypical]

@LDSGator talkin' like he ain't got this inspirational poster hanging in his bedroom.

 

 

[LDSGator]

2 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

@LDSGator talkin' like he ain't got this inspirational poster hanging in his bedroom.

 

 

@Phoenix_person talked me into getting this one. 

[Vort]

On 1/16/2024 at 12:07 PM, NeuroTypical said:

He gonna do more things I like and less things I don't like than Biden would

A reasonable summary of my feelings.

[Vort]

On 1/16/2024 at 12:52 PM, LDSGator said:

What’s the best definition of insanity? Doing the same thing again and again and expecting different results.

If people believed this, we would have no pianists.

[LDSGator]

3 minutes ago, Vort said:

If people believed this, we would have no pianists.

Yeah, I don’t see it that way. I practice the “same” kicks every day obsessively, and each individual kick is different. Maybe higher, maybe lower, maybe weaker, maybe stronger. Also, even the best pianist makes mistakes, so it’s actually not doing the same thing again and again. 

Edited January 22, 2024 by LDSGator

[Vort]

On 1/16/2024 at 1:52 PM, LDSGator said:

The issue the right has is that, even if I’m dead wrong, millions of Americans agree with me. So if the right was a little wiser, they’d drop the stolen election rants and focus on winning issues.

Do you hear yourself? "Even if the election actually was stolen, it's a losing issue for Republicans, so they should quit bringing it up."

Are we as a nation truly so cynical and jaded that we would accept such a thing? "The issue of our fundamental freedoms doesn't poll well, so let's change the message."

I am sure there was widespread fraud in the election, as there probably has been for at least twenty years, likely longer. I am absolutely sure that absentee and mail-in ballots are insecure, and have little doubt that's why the Democrats push for them so hard. I do not know if such fraud actually changed the election outcome. I choose to believe it did not, because if it did, we're screwed. But to say that we shouldn't talk about the issue because it doesn't poll well is breathtaking, and not in a good way.

[Vort]

7 minutes ago, LDSGator said:

Yeah, I don’t see it that way. I practice the “same” kicks every day obsessively, and each individual kick is different. Maybe higher, maybe lower, maybe weaker, maybe stronger. Also, even the best pianist makes mistakes, so it’s actually not doing the same thing again and again. 

If that's the case, then how can you think that Trump vs. Biden 2024 is "the same thing" as Trump vs. Biden 2020?

(I didn't see that TFP had already made the same observation immediately after your post. If I had seen that, I would not have made the comment. Another lesson to me about how I should read the whole thread before responding. But it's not my fault that I don't learn. If the list gods wanted me to learn, they wouldn't keep giving me the same ineffectual lesson. They must be insane.)

Edited January 22, 2024 by Vort

[LDSGator]

1 minute ago, Vort said:

Do you hear yourself? "Even if the election actually was stolen, it's a losing issue for Republicans, so they should quit bringing it up."

Are we as a nation truly so cynical and jaded that we would accept such a thing? "The issue of our fundamental freedoms doesn't poll well, so let's change the message."

I am sure there was widespread fraud in the election, as there probably has been for at least twenty years, likely longer. I am absolutely sure that absentee and mail-in ballots are insecure, and have little doubt that's why the Democrats push for them so hard. I do not know if such fraud actually changed the election outcome. I choose to believe it did not, because if it did, we're screwed. But to say that we shouldn't talk about the issue because it doesn't poll well is breathtaking, and not in a good way.

I hear myself just fine. Frankly I think I make great points.
 

You keep beating the “They stole the election” horse. It’s absolutely what voters want to hear  

[Vort]

1 minute ago, LDSGator said:

You keep beating the “They stole the election” horse.

Where have I ever even mentioned the issue before? I mean ever, in any thread? Maybe I have, but I don't remember ever having done so.

[The Folk Prophet]

4 hours ago, Vort said:

we're screwed

This sums up reality quite nicely.

[The Folk Prophet]

4 hours ago, Vort said:

4 hours ago, LDSGator said:

You keep beating the “They stole the election” horse.

Where have I ever even mentioned the issue before? I mean ever, in any thread? Maybe I have, but I don't remember ever having done so.

To be fair, it's just a rhetorical device @LDSGator's employing. Not a particularly good one one. But it's not that he's literally saying "you" have been beating that horse. But that it, generally, has been beaten repeatedly. As I pointed out earlier, for people running for office, perhaps, this is a political strategy, but to imply that those suggesting it's an issue on this forum are using it as a political strategy to gather more voters to their cause is pretty off-based.

[Just_A_Guy]

Looks like I’ll be writing in President Nelson again in November (assuming he’s still alive, of course . . .)

[mordorbund]

9 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

assuming he’s still alive, of course . . .

If he can vote he can be POTUS

Edited January 25, 2024 by mordorbund

[LDSGator]

7 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

Looks like I’ll be writing in President Nelson again in November (assuming he’s still alive, of course . . .)

I always thought writing in a vote or going third party was an ego trip. It still is-but I’ll probably do the same.  

[NeuroTypical]

New hobby: Posting stuff like this on social media in order to draw out the worst and most ignorant folks from many different sides of different fences. 

[LDSGator]

3 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

New hobby: Posting stuff like this on social media in order to draw out the worst and most ignorant folks from many different sides of different fences. 

This is actually very sweet and wholesome.  

[Just_A_Guy]

14 hours ago, LDSGator said:

I always thought writing in a vote or going third party was an ego trip. It still is-but I’ll probably do the same.  

To some degree it probably is; but I believe God will send us better candidates when we show we want them and refuse to embrace the openly-amoral, proudly visionless libertines that the abortionists or the “beer, babes, burps ‘n’ brawls” wing of the GOP serve up to us.  Naive, I know . . .

A certain forum member back in 2016-ish got really mad when I cited 1 Kings 19:18 and likened it to Trump; but that’s still pretty much where I am.  If the GOP thinks they need my vote, they know where to find me.  

Edited January 25, 2024 by Just_A_Guy

[LDSGator]

50 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

To some degree it probably is; but I believe God will send us better candidates when we show we want them and refuse to embrace the openly-amoral libertines that the abortionists or the “beer, babes, burps ‘n’ brawls” wing of the GOP serve up to us.  Naive, I know . . .

A certain forum member back in 2016-ish got really mad when I cited 1 Kings 19:18 and likened it to Trump; but that’s still pretty much where I am.  If the GOP thinks they need my vote, they know where to find me.  

In junior high we had a mock election for Clinton vs Bush. A mom of the one of the students wrote a four page rant about she could never vote for Bush because he wasn’t 100% pro life. I remember asking the teacher how voting for someone who had no chance of winning would further the pro life cause. He agreed with me. I was such a snotty little kid, but I was right about that one. Since then, I’ve always thought that going third party was done for your own pleasure. To show off how you don’t get your hands dirty like the scumbag peasants.  And to feed a superiority complex.
 

I should know, I have a massive superiority complex!   

Edited January 25, 2024 by LDSGator

[LDSGator]

48 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:

the GOP thinks they need my vote, they know where to find me.  

Missed this part. The Trumpers need every single GOP vote they can get, but I’m not sure they understand that. They don’t seem to want to build bridges, even in their own party. 

[The Folk Prophet]

1 hour ago, LDSGator said:

In junior high we had a mock election for Clinton vs Bush. A mom of the one of the students wrote a four page rant about she could never vote for Bush because he wasn’t 100% pro life. I remember asking the teacher how voting for someone who had no chance of winning would further the pro life cause. He agreed with me. I was such a snotty little kid, but I was right about that one. Since then, I’ve always thought that going third party was done for your own pleasure. To show off how you don’t get your hands dirty like the scumbag peasants.  And to feed a superiority complex.

I don't agree with the cynicism. But.... I used to think more like @Just_A_Guy re not voting for someone who wasn't legitimately "good" (as if that exists in politics) even if it meant throwing away my vote. Since I've gotten more into politics and whatnot I've changed my tune quite a bit. I now see it as a very simple equation. There's a good-ish side (with bad, flawed people running), and a truly evil and awful side (with bad, flawed people running), and it's as simple as that. And that's not to say there are mistaken approaches/policies on the good-ish side or that all the approaches/policies on the truly evil and awful side are straight up evil. But in broad strokes, it's pretty plain. One side's going to destroy freedom, promote sexual corruption, tax it's citizenry to oblivion, destroy the economy, and murder babies gleefully. The other side stands against those things, on the whole.

I would, in a heartbeat, have voted for DeSantos or Ramaswamy instead of Trump. And if there were a truly, legitimately, righteous man/woman running... I'd happily vote for them. But that's not an option.  It's (likely) Trump or Biden. That's the choice. "Neither" isn't an option.

I'm reminded of when we give our kids a choice on something. "You can pick up your toys or you can go to your room," and they try and choose neither. Nope. Sorry. That's not the option. You pick up you toys or you go to your room. By choosing neither, you choose your room because that's the alternate for not picking up your toys.

Obviously it's not really the same thing. And for someone in Utah voting.... well your vote's pretty meaningless (at this point) anyhow because Trump will win Utah. So I'm not really against people choosing to vote otherwise on "principle", per se, unless they live in a so-called "swing state". But as for myself.... I simply see the reality of it. You can pick up your toys or go to your room. So I'll pick up my toys.

Edited January 25, 2024 by The Folk Prophet