Engaging Brain before Speaking

[Jezebel2011]

A number of times over the last few months the Teacher in RS, usually the RS President has made a comment about having to repent every night when she says her prayers because of words she has spoken through the day.

Someone else, an RS Teacher always agrees with her saying the same thing happens to her. I was at the receiving end of one of her unkind sentences on Sunday, as I have been before. Just giving a reminder about a rota and that it was her family's turn and all I got was a sharp retort.

Perhaps, if they engaged their brain before putting their mouths into operation they might find that they don't need to repent on a nightly basis for the unkind words they have spoken during the day.

Both have been converts for 40+ years, surely they should have learned by now?

[pam]

I think sometimes things like this become so ingrained in a personality that the person doesn't even realize they are doing it.

It's interesting because I had a conversation with a girl that works for me just this morning.

Someone walked by and she made a rude comment about that person. I finally called her on it because it happens ALL the time with her.

She asked "Do I really do that?" Everyone sitting around us immediately responded, "YES." She didn't even realize that she does it. I had to give her examples of times that she had done that. One was when she said something rude about a fellow coworker who happens to be a good friend of mine. She didn't even remember saying it but I sure did. We are hoping that us finally bringing it out might get her to stop and think about her comments before making them.

[applepansy]

True repentence means not repeating the behavior. The RS president and her counselor aren't really repenting.

Pam, if they are aware enough to realize they need to repent every night then they are aware enough to truly change their behavior. Hopefully your coworker will now be more aware and change her behavior.

[Matthew0059]

They may be hypocrites, doing their "alms" (in this case, repentance) before men to be praised of them.

Then again, they could be honestly trying to do better. Yes, if they took extra steps they could avoid sin- but the same can be said of every man, woman, and child who walked the earth (except, of course, for the Savior).

Try to remember the immortal words of J. Golden Kimball. When asked if he could be cut off from the Church for his cussing, he replied "I can't be cut off the Church; I repent too **** fast!"

[prisonchaplain]

I remember going through a different, but similar type of "retraining." After marriage, my wife told me she really could not stand my griping while I was driving. You know...trying to instruct everyone else on how they should be driving...or repeatedly saying, "Did you see that???? I can't believe they just..." You get the idea.

She was right, and I realized I was only stressing myself out (as well as her). However, it took intentionality, and many reminders in the beginning.

In this case, most adults here someone who is critical and they raise an eyebrow, and try to avoid the person. Very few are kind enough to confront someone with the problem. So, it is even harder to break the bad habit of being critical.

[john doe]

There is another side to this coin. What about the admonition to be quick to forgive and not hold grudges for things people say thoughtlessly? At least they admit they are not perfect and state a desire to change, but are we any more perfect if we remember every time we have been offended and hold that against them?

The point is, nobody is perfect and sometimes we want to pluck the mote out of the other person's eye when we can't see the beam in our own.

[jayanna]

Jezebel, what is a rota?

I know that comments can sting, especially when you are trying to help and when you don't expect it from your sister in Christ. At what point does it become a sin to allow it to continue? I asked this question of priesthood authorities recently....my SP counseled me to let those with authority handle this, (once I had spoken up) and for me to move on. He said that anytime something very wrong is said, I should make a note of it and go home and study everything there is to study about it. That way when it is my turn I will know better and will be able to see before I make the same mistakes.

You should make this a growing experience for you, so that good comes of it somehow...that way when it comes your turn to teach or be in a leadership calling you will know how other sisters feel when they don't feel welcome or cared for, or are afraid to speak or approach others because of comments like those. These things will give you experience and depth, and will be to your good. That is what I have learned very very recently.

[Traveler]

A number of times over the last few months the Teacher in RS, usually the RS President has made a comment about having to repent every night when she says her prayers because of words she has spoken through the day.

Someone else, an RS Teacher always agrees with her saying the same thing happens to her. I was at the receiving end of one of her unkind sentences on Sunday, as I have been before. Just giving a reminder about a rota and that it was her family's turn and all I got was a sharp retort.

Perhaps, if they engaged their brain before putting their mouths into operation they might find that they don't need to repent on a nightly basis for the unkind words they have spoken during the day.

Both have been converts for 40+ years, surely they should have learned by now?

Hmmmmmm: It is not repentance unless we make an effort to make amends. However, the lesson here is not that their repentance is not complete but that you remember - and when the day comes that your tongue had caused pain that you remember how you would have felt if someone who had spoken hurtful words to you apologized. If you remember then it will make it easier for you when you see someone that would be helped by your apology.

In marriage it seems like us testosterone based units have a much harder time learning to say, "I'm sorry" - and mean it.

The Traveler

[Guest]

In marriage it seems like us testosterone based units have a much harder time learning to say, "I'm sorry" - and mean it.

The Traveler

I've heard of it being the opposite! Have you seen Blind Side movie? Yeah, the husband even says the same thing about his wife.

[Vort]

In marriage it seems like us testosterone based units have a much harder time learning to say, "I'm sorry" - and mean it.

That is certainly not my experience.

[Blocky]

There are some areas in my life where I seem to learn VERY slowly. Often times repentance is part of the process but that doesn't mean 'OK, repented of that little mishap, done with that issue forever!' Maybe she's like me. Sometimes I think something is a little off when it comes to my brains social wiring. Maybe her admitting out-loud how often she has to deal with this repeat issue is just an other tiny baby step in the right direction for her.

[Jezebel2011]

There is another side to this coin. What about the admonition to be quick to forgive and not hold grudges for things people say thoughtlessly? At least they admit they are not perfect and state a desire to change, but are we any more perfect if we remember every time we have been offended and hold that against them?

The point is, nobody is perfect and sometimes we want to pluck the mote out of the other person's eye when we can't see the beam in our own.

In my experience, with these two ladies, they say something totally out of order to me. I let it go and forgive them, then they do it all over again!

I was brought up - not lds - to not say things that I wouldn't want said to me, to treat others the way I would want to be treated and that is what I have always done.

[Dravin]

In my experience, with these two ladies, they say something totally out of order to me. I let it go and forgive them, then they do it all over again!

70 times 70 (and no, that doesn't mean 4900 times). It isn't easy, and repeat offenders aren't excused from needing to change because you need to forgive them, but that they do it over and over again is independent of our need to forgive them that John is pointing out.

I was brought up - not lds - to not say things that I wouldn't want said to me, to treat others the way I would want to be treated and that is what I have always done.

You'd want it said of you that you need to engage your brain before speaking?

Edited January 10, 2012 by Dravin

[Jezebel2011]

And? 70 times 70 (and no, that doesn't mean 4900 times). It isn't easy, and repeat offenders aren't excused from needing to change because you need to forgive them, but that they do it over and over again is independent of our need to forgive them that John is pointing out.

You'd want it said of you that you need to engage your brain before speaking?

The issue is two ladies from RS Presidency.

The issue is that they repeatedly - on a daily basis, to their own admission - have to repent for things that they have said that day.

The issue is that they don't think before they speak.

I don't need to 'engage brain before speaking' because I have always done that and nobody has ever had to say that to me or about me.

[Dravin]

I don't need to 'engage brain before speaking' because I have always done that and nobody has ever had to say that to me or about me.

It's besides the point if it's actually applicable . You said you didn't say things you wouldn't want others to say about you. There are other ways to have made your point without making a 'zing', and yet you decided to make a zing. This is at odds with your statements unless you'd want other people to say you need to engage your brain before speaking. Would you have wanted me to have said this of you when you incorrectly identified the time between the giving of the Word of Wisdom and the clarification about hot drinks? Or your assertions about A&W root beer and Marriott?

I no you may have some things to ponder on, if yes then I commend you in your consistency.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Dravin

[Blackmarch]

A number of times over the last few months the Teacher in RS, usually the RS President has made a comment about having to repent every night when she says her prayers because of words she has spoken through the day.

Someone else, an RS Teacher always agrees with her saying the same thing happens to her. I was at the receiving end of one of her unkind sentences on Sunday, as I have been before. Just giving a reminder about a rota and that it was her family's turn and all I got was a sharp retort.

Perhaps, if they engaged their brain before putting their mouths into operation they might find that they don't need to repent on a nightly basis for the unkind words they have spoken during the day.

Both have been converts for 40+ years, surely they should have learned by now?

THey're humans. Theres a reason the same thing gets repeated over and over and over and over throughout all the scriptures. ENgaging our brains at the right time in the right way sometimes takes us a long time to develop

[john doe]

The issue is two ladies from RS Presidency.

The issue is that they repeatedly - on a daily basis, to their own admission - have to repent for things that they have said that day.

The issue is that they don't think before they speak.

I don't need to 'engage brain before speaking' because I have always done that and nobody has ever had to say that to me or about me.

I think you missed the point. The fact is, they realize that they sometimes say or do things that they need to repent of daily. They acknowledge that they are not perfect. I have heard Apostles and Prophets acknowledge the same things. Don't we all have things that we need to repent of daily?

While their sins may not be the same ones you struggle with, I'm willing to bet that there are some that are just as irritating to others as theirs are to you. It seems to me that not being able to let go of other peoples' sins and judging them harshly for their failings is sometimes just as sinful in the eyes of the Lord as what they do. Instead of focusing on what they are doing that hurts others, are you helping or hindering the problem by not being able to forgive them?

[Vort]

A number of times over the last few months the Teacher in RS, usually the RS President has made a comment about having to repent every night when she says her prayers because of words she has spoken through the day.

Someone else, an RS Teacher always agrees with her saying the same thing happens to her. I was at the receiving end of one of her unkind sentences on Sunday, as I have been before. Just giving a reminder about a rota and that it was her family's turn and all I got was a sharp retort.

Perhaps, if they engaged their brain before putting their mouths into operation they might find that they don't need to repent on a nightly basis for the unkind words they have spoken during the day.

Both have been converts for 40+ years, surely they should have learned by now?

This post is a bit chilling to me. Whenever I have taught adult classes at the ward level, I have been (and am) willing to share personal insights and struggles. I try never to reveal specific sins, which I think would be inappropriate, but I am willing to discuss weaknesses and imperfections with my brothers and sisters under the theory that they might have perspective on my trials that could give them insight into their own.

It's a vulnerable position to put oneself in, but I do it because I trust the members of the class and think it might be of some use to them. If I knew their response was, "Brother Vort is pretty pathetic; he's been a member of the Church all his life, and here he's almost 50 and still can't get that thing right," I might be a lot less willing to expose myself to their view.

[pam]

I don't need to 'engage brain before speaking' because I have always done that and nobody has ever had to say that to me or about me.

I'm not sure how you could know with 100% certainty that no one has ever said that about you. I will never know all things that people have said about me. And I'm equally thankful that I don't. :)

[beefche]

The issue is two ladies from RS Presidency.

The issue is that they repeatedly - on a daily basis, to their own admission - have to repent for things that they have said that day.

The issue is that they don't think before they speak.

I don't need to 'engage brain before speaking' because I have always done that and nobody has ever had to say that to me or about me.

No, the issue is that people sin--and keep repeating the sin even though they try to stop. Once everyone realizes that there is no one, NO ONE, in the church who is perfect, things seem to go much better. Just accept the fact that you WILL get offended by people, even people in leadership positions. It is going to happen for several reasons, but 2 of which are that people are not perfect and you must be tested and tried in all things. I've said over and over as I've taught many classes at church--what is the ONE thing that will drive you from the church? Once you know, prepare how to react when that one thing happens, but it's probably going to happen, and likely more than once.

True repentence means leaving that sin behind never to pick it up again. But, unfortunately, there are so many ways to sin that many sins will plague us until we have become perfected in Christ. While we live in a fallen world with our mortal bodies and finite minds, we will never be able to leave sin completely behind. But, the Lord expects us to continue to try our best--even if that means repeating the sin, praying for forgiveness and trying to not do it again, then repeat those steps if necessary. And forgiving others for their sins which don't plague you.

[mnn727]

Jezebel, what is a rota?

.

Wondering the same thing myself.

[JudoMinja]

I know we all sometimes struggle with thinking before we speak. I, for one, tend to put a lot of thought into what I say or write, but even still I sometimes let things come out that I wish I could take back. Or, I may say or do something that I don't even realize is rude or offensive in somebody else's eyes, and I surely hope that they can either brush it off as a simple weakness or come to me and let me know that I have hurt their feelings so that I can correct it.

The biggest problem with focusing on what other people do wrong is that you can't really do much of anything about it, if anything at all. All you can really change is yourself. So, having the strength of character to let things go can be very important. Unless things are getting out of hand, as seems to be the case in this thread, your best course of action would be to just let things go and move on. If it is out of hand, and your situation is causing serious disruptions in your ward, you can report it to your stake president. Other than that, there isn't really anything you can do. Just continue to "bear one another's burdens" and do not be "weary in well-doing".

No matter how rude another person is, you are the one in control of whether or not you become offended. So the ball is in your park.

[Vort]

Wondering the same thing myself.

Wikipedia suggests it's a synonym for a roster or schedule.

[Bini]

Well I've been known to have a sharp tongue and use colour words. I've offended plenty too. I know what I say can be hurtful to others and yet I found myself spewing it out anyway, perhaps, just to make my point. I think we have more control than we want to admit. I was diagnosed bipolar and I used that as an excuse for my behaviour many times over. As I've matured I've learned to manage my temper and think through my actions much better than previously but it's still not easy.