A question about the NFL and Sabbath Keeping

[LadyGunnar]

On 5/4/2020 at 10:00 AM, dprh said:

Don't forget ladies wearing pants to church!  

Pants would be so nice when you have little kids. Shorter skirts can ride up. Longer skirts make me trip. Pants don't ride up and are not overly long. I am short and most skirts don't fit right and I need heels to keep them from dragging.  Guys have it easier. Pants and button up shirt. Change the tie and you have a new outfit.  

[mordorbund]

4 minutes ago, LadyGunnar said:

Shorter skirts can ride up. Longer skirts make me trip. ...  Guys have it easier.

Not so. It's just the reverse. Shorter skirts make guys trip.

[LadyGunnar]

1 minute ago, mordorbund said:

Not so. It's just the reverse. Shorter skirts make guys trip.

Maybe the skirts you think of are shorter than what I am thinking of. Like knee length. Not short enough to make a guy's eyes pop out, but short enough to make it awkward as a mom trying not to show too much.

[Just_A_Guy]

For me, watching competitive sports doesn’t really foster the atmosphere I want in my home on a Sunday.  Not sure I’d call it “sinful”; but it’s perhaps merely a “good” amongst the triad of “good, better, best”.  But I recognize there’s a lot of subjectivity in terms of what might constitute good/better/best Sabbath activities.  For example, I spend my workdays cooped up in an office and/or a courtroom; being outside on the Sabbath in God’s creation doing a little gardening—or in my garage gluing up a woodworking project—can be a restful and sacred experience for me.  But I imagine I’d feel differently if I were a farmer or a carpenter.

As far as looking to the example of other Church members who are involved in those sports:  The data we’re going to get from LDS athletes on this topic is confused at best.  It’s probably worth noting that:

—a) For a long time (not sure if it’s still true), Church institutions made a point of avoiding any kind of competitive sports play on Sundays.

—b)  Church literature is rife with stories of kids who opted out of The Big Game to keep the Sabbath holy.

—c)  I remember hearing lots of people point to Steve Young an example of how a good Mormon could play pro sports on Sunday.  Well, I’ve never once seen Young bear public testimony of the restored Gospel; but I’ve heard him throw the Church under the bus on behalf of his LGBTQ libertine buddies numerous times. When someone argues to me that so-and-so does such-and-such and therefore such-and-such must be OK because so-and-so is still a “good Mormon”, my (probably unfair in many cases) gut response is a two-word reply: “for now”.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Just_A_Guy

[mirkwood]

1 hour ago, Just_A_Guy said:

For me, watching competitive sports doesn’t really foster the atmosphere I want in my home on a Sunday.  Not sure I’d call it “sinful”; but it’s perhaps merely a “good” amongst the triad of “good, better, best”.  But I recognize there’s a lot of subjectivity in terms of what might constitute good/better/best Sabbath activities.  For example, I spend my workdays cooped up in an office and/or a courtroom; being outside on the Sabbath in God’s creation doing a little gardening—or in my garage gluing up a woodworking project—can be a restful and sacred experience for me.  But I imagine I’d feel differently if I were a farmer or a carpenter.

As far as looking to the example of other Church members who are involved in those sports:  The data we’re going to get from LDS athletes on this topic is confused at best.  It’s probably worth noting that:

—a) For a long time (not sure if it’s still true), Church institutions made a point of avoiding any kind of competitive sports play on Sundays.

—b)  Church literature is rife with stories of kids who opted out of The Big Game to keep the Sabbath holy.

—c)  I remember hearing lots of people point to Steve Young an example of how a good Mormon could play pro sports on Sunday.  Well, I’ve never once seen Young bear public testimony of the restored Gospel; but I’ve heard him throw the Church under the bus on behalf of his LGBTQ libertine buddies numerous times. When someone argues to me that so-and-so does such-and-such and therefore such-and-such must be OK because so-and-so is still a “good Mormon”, my (probably unfair in many cases) gut response is a two-word reply: “for now”.

 

d) I don't recall Dale Murphy saying anything against the church in public.

[Just_A_Guy]

1 hour ago, mirkwood said:

 

d) I don't recall Dale Murphy saying anything against the church in public.

. . . for now . . .  

[Jonah]

On 5/5/2020 at 4:55 PM, Just_A_Guy said:

Well, I’ve never once seen Young bear public testimony of the restored Gospel;

I never saw Steve Young bear any kind of testimony about Jesus Christ on national tv
but he may have done so in a less public setting.

[anatess2]

On 5/5/2020 at 4:55 PM, Just_A_Guy said:

—c)  I remember hearing lots of people point to Steve Young an example of how a good Mormon could play pro sports on Sunday.  Well, I’ve never once seen Young bear public testimony of the restored Gospel; but I’ve heard him throw the Church under the bus on behalf of his LGBTQ libertine buddies numerous times. When someone argues to me that so-and-so does such-and-such and therefore such-and-such must be OK because so-and-so is still a “good Mormon”, my (probably unfair in many cases) gut response is a two-word reply: “for now”.

This is very disingenuous to Steve Young.  The guy wore his religion on his sleeve much like Tim Tebow but without the public prayer displays on the field (which we LDS are not wont to do)... for example - NFL fans know Steve Young doesn't drink because he's "Mormon", he doesn't curse (he lets Jerry Rice do the cursing for him) because he's "Mormon", he ran all these charity fundraisers even when he was still in that other league - not the NFL, USFL or something.  Even his dating habits (temple-worthy "Mormon") was fodder for news even making it into Sports Illustrated.  His ancestry to Brigham Young was well known in the secular sports world including the reasons he didn't serve a mission - he fields a lot of interview questions about his Mormon faith without shying away from honest faith answers but not claiming he's an ideal Mormon either.  He spoke at worldwide church events and BYU devotionals, etc. etc.

His LGBTQ stance should not erase all those years of representing the values of the Church especially since it comes from a personal commitment to his gay brother-in-law who desires to remain in the Church.  He may be misguided on the issue and it may be a "faithful for now" situation as these LGBTQ issues tend to become... even so - we should not diminish his public representation as a member of the Church for his entire football career because of it.

[Guest MormonGator]

On 5/5/2020 at 6:46 PM, mirkwood said:

 

d) I don't recall Dale Murphy saying anything against the church in public.

You know how much I love baseball @mirkwood, it's perhaps the only thing I like as much as heavy metal. Dale Murphy is underrated. Even before I ever became a member, I always thought he belonged in the Hall of Fame. 

Edited May 27, 2020 by MormonGator

[JohnsonJones]

45 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

You know how much I love baseball @mirkwood, it's perhaps the only thing I like as much as heavy metal. Dale Murphy is underrated. Even before I ever became a member, I always thought he belonged in the Hall of Fame. 

I'm a braves fan, ironically I think the exact opposite.

I think he' far overrated.  He became the big name on the Braves because the rest of the team was so abysmal at the time that any average player would have looked great!!!

I saw many games with him in them (used to go to Braves Games all the time, sometimes there were less than 4000 of the fans in the stands!), and he was a superstar for a while, but once the Braves got good, his time period was quickly forgotten in the multiple run ups to try to win the world series.

(Talking about those runs...that was perhaps some of the most exciting times to be Braves Fan.  The excitement was overwhelming (and occasionally the disappointment when they didn't win it all as well) as the series went on and they continued to advance.  Never a better time than those years in the 90s to be a Braves Fan.

Edited May 27, 2020 by JohnsonJones

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, JohnsonJones said:

I'm a braves fan, ironically I think the exact opposite.

LOL! I'm a Braves fan too, ironically enough. Some of my happiest memories are watching Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Avery, Chipper Jones on TBS. I'd go out of my way to watch Braves games in the 90's. 

If you look at his similarity scores from Baseball Reference you'll notice he can hang with Ron Santo and Duke Snider-two hall of famers. What kills him is his .264 batting average and the fact that he played for some lousy teams. 

If you look at the "advanced stats" for about three years in the 80's he led the league in runs created and was in the top 10 seven times. He was very ahead of his time in those categories. 

 

[mrmarklin]

On 5/27/2020 at 7:05 AM, Jonah said:

I never saw Steve Young bear any kind of testimony about Jesus Christ on national tv
but he may have done so in a less public setting.

Steve Young used to be a common fireside speaker here in the SF Bay Area in his playing days. 

[JohnsonJones]

22 hours ago, MormonGator said:

LOL! I'm a Braves fan too, ironically enough. Some of my happiest memories are watching Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Avery, Chipper Jones on TBS. I'd go out of my way to watch Braves games in the 90's. 

If you look at his similarity scores from Baseball Reference you'll notice he can hang with Ron Santo and Duke Snider-two hall of famers. What kills him is his .264 batting average and the fact that he played for some lousy teams. 

If you look at the "advanced stats" for about three years in the 80's he led the league in runs created and was in the top 10 seven times. He was very ahead of his time in those categories. 

 

One interesting thing about Dale Murphy was that the Saints were VERY proud of him in Georgia (and possibly the rest of the South).  At the time there was a 'LDS' store near the Atlanta Temple that you could buy LDS materials and such at.  They had one very secular area where you could buy Dale Murphy items (for example, they always had a poster of him hanging up).